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View Full Version : possibility of more Binary Arts plugins!!



archiea
07-25-2006, 05:41 PM
I spoke to Jon Tindall from Binary Arts regarding tools like DAB2 that they had previously...

http://www.creativemac.com/HTM/News/08_00/dab2.htm

it sounds like he's excited to get back into things, however hearing from us as to what we want would really help. Pleae goto http://www.binaryartsinc.com/ and voice what youw ant. In the shrinking LW community it would be great to see developers like Jon step up to the plate.

Folks who want to add to my voice regarding DAB2, below are some sample images. its really a unique product. Mac users, lets here from you especially. :thumbsup:

some samples here..
http://www.creativemac.com/Images/News/08_00/dab24.jpg

http://www.creativemac.com/Images/News/08_00/dab25.jpg

Speedmonk42
07-25-2006, 06:21 PM
Is the LW community shrinking?

hrgiger
07-25-2006, 07:46 PM
Yes, what shrinking community? I for one would like to see some numbers on that....

UnCommonGrafx
07-25-2006, 08:28 PM
It's amazing how we've lost so much IP from the LW community. That's the loss I feel seeing the ad posted at the top. Seems LW's lost as much as the other apps have gained.

Yes, I'd like to see this come back to being.

archiea
07-25-2006, 08:42 PM
I post about a plugin, and the replies are so concerned about statistics as to who is #1. More LW evangelists.. oh brother. You need statistics, look at how many schools teach LW compared to even just Maya. One area of growth? Hobbyist leaving cinema 4D's for LW almost exclusively because of C4D's price increase. But this post isn't about statistics or who is #1. its about a developer returning to the LW community and voicing what you would like as far as plugins..

Exception
07-26-2006, 02:36 AM
I think I'm mostly in for modeler plugins... There's some neat stuff in Sketchup that I wouldn't mind having... like the push-pull tool... yum! Dodgy is making a lot of headway with smart tools such as an interactive julienne and his Individual split tool. We can use more of that, tools that work properly over multiple layers, that include snaps and so on.
I posted a plugin idea in the thrid party section two weeks ago, with images and all, perhaps that's a suggestion, but I don't know if dodgy's looking into that now.

How about a proper replace object command? One that really replaces an object and all its layers with another object and all its layers, including layers that wern;t in the original one, or make it an option or something...

How about a really smart file requester, which remembers three or four last used directories, and has a quick-button for images, objects, scenes, and perhaps some customs programmable buttons like library, my documents and so on... I spend half my day browsing for files...

Also, a quick and fool proof way of doing animated booleans... the only way we have now is through some weird raytracing clipmap thing that has to be added to this and that and then there needs to be a matte object and... o brother... Something fast and intuitive, for sections and cuts.

But that DAB shader, thingemabob, looks awesome, and its great that fiberfactory is returning as well.

hrgiger
07-26-2006, 03:19 AM
I post about a plugin, and the replies are so concerned about statistics as to who is #1.

Perhaps if you're actually interested in being helpful, you could just do that instead of adding in a speculative comment that you know will draw fire, especially when it is something that you know nothing about.

theo
07-26-2006, 12:05 PM
Hey! Idea....how 'bout a crowd shrinking plugin?

Like, one where Joe Jazz can just type in some stolen Newtek client data and apply this messy mass to a crowd scene (could be just jellybeans or anything) via a super duper interface, click the whizbang make-it-happen button for a real life study in a shrinking community of somethings.

[punches around under couch cushions] "Crap, I've only got 16 shekels....but hey it's a start".

[fade scene to house being crushed by a giant mass of shrunken heads]

archiea
07-26-2006, 12:41 PM
Perhaps if you're actually interested in being helpful, you could just do that instead of adding in a speculative comment that you know will draw fire, especially when it is something that you know nothing about.

Posting a pulg-in manufactuer and trying to reinvigorate interest in their products and expanding their products isn't being helpful? Its very clear from my original post that I was not trying to draw fire, but I was trying to motivate folks to be proactive with the development community... because that community ihasen't been as fruitful as it used to be.

In fact, its yourself, dwelling on points outside the emphasis of my post, and exhagerating them, that draws fire and adds to the deterioration of the community here. In a nutshell, fanboys criticising anyone who says anything remotely unflattering about LW. :thumbsdow

bitshift
07-26-2006, 12:46 PM
Hi All,
Its great to find people who like to speak up about their favorite program or plugin or whatever. My hope is the base of Lightwave users will expand now that people see Newtek is serious about making Lightwave what it can be.

Perhaps IP was lost, but if companies are not making money on their LW development it wont go on forever before they leave for greener pastures. Thats just a business decision. Like leaving a job you like for one thats harder but makes you more money.

FWIW: DAB was not a simple image filter but a raytraced sprite brushstroke pixelfilter.

-Jon

theo
07-26-2006, 01:00 PM
DAB was not a simple image filter but a raytraced sprite brushstroke pixelfilter.

-Jon

In any case, sounds pretty cool.

paulhart
07-26-2006, 02:39 PM
I would love any developer to tackle Non-Photographic Renders, particularly in the vein of Sketch & Toon from C4D. I was greatly disappointed at the integration and release of Sketch plugin for Lightwave, in that I was hoping that as it was brought in-house, with the developer, it would mature somewhat, but the results are less than stunning. I am enraptured by the style of Chomet (Les Triplettes de Belleville) and Miyazaki (Spirited Away, Howl's Moving Castle) a combination of watercolor and drawn elements. Control of the edge effects to be more "drawn" as I haven't gotten what I want from UnReal and CelShading. Shading with hatching like effects? I know the animation community and the arch-viz group would eat this up. I have posted repeatedly about this and have even sent notes to developers to port their programs..... so, someone??
Paul

bitshift
07-26-2006, 04:52 PM
Amen paulhart,
Sketch was a bust. I am very interested in NPR. I have a decent arch vis business I have developed since... NPR is what sells to this crowd. Too real sometimes frightens them. A sparse conveyence of concept is better recieved. It allows for them to insert their own ideas into the mix.

-Jon

hrgiger
07-26-2006, 05:06 PM
In fact, its yourself, dwelling on points outside the emphasis of my post, and exhagerating them, that draws fire and adds to the deterioration of the community here. In a nutshell, fanboys criticising anyone who says anything remotely unflattering about LW. :thumbsdow

I'm fine with anyone saying anything unflattering about Lightwave. And if it were based on any sort of fact rather then wild speculation or perhaps a personal grudge, I wouldn't have argued it.

And what a shock you falling back on the fanboy comment when someone doesn't have quite the doom and gloom issue with Lightwave that you do.

Speedmonk42
07-26-2006, 06:57 PM
I post about a plugin, and the replies are so concerned about statistics as to who is #1. More LW evangelists.. oh brother. You need statistics, look at how many schools teach LW compared to even just Maya. One area of growth? Hobbyist leaving cinema 4D's for LW almost exclusively because of C4D's price increase. But this post isn't about statistics or who is #1. its about a developer returning to the LW community and voicing what you would like as far as plugins..


I understand about the schools. I just saw your comment and thought it seemed odd.

With LW Mac and the release of 9 and other Newtek products it just seemed like an odd thing and I was curious.

Nothing about being #1 in what I wrote, just curious because I thought it was growing.

archiea
07-26-2006, 07:17 PM
Agreed.

On the topic of plug-ins, I'm really more interested in GI rendering and modeler tools than some silly, blobby, wobbly image thingamagic that seems only to destroy any image it touches. It looks more like a toy than a useful plug-in. I find stuff like that about as useful as Alien Skin photoshop filters. Some people love 'em, but my stomach churns whenever I see these filtered images.


I can understand you opinion on filters, especiially "push button" filters. However, the combination of the right tool along with the right artist for the job can give you amazingly subtle results. Also, specific applications can be seen in films like "What Dreams May Come" and Disney's Deep Canvas technology used in Tarzan and in Treasure Planet. There they creaed a procedure to have brushtrokes that would typically exist in a 2D background painting exist in a 3D texture map. That is far from being a toy or just a filtered image.

My personal taste stray from a purist 3D and I prefer a more impressionistic look. To each their own. :thumbsup:

archiea
07-26-2006, 07:32 PM
Hi All,
Its great to find people who like to speak up about their favorite program or plugin or whatever. My hope is the base of Lightwave users will expand now that people see Newtek is serious about making Lightwave what it can be.

Perhaps IP was lost, but if companies are not making money on their LW development it wont go on forever before they leave for greener pastures. Thats just a business decision. Like leaving a job you like for one thats harder but makes you more money.

FWIW: DAB was not a simple image filter but a raytraced sprite brushstroke pixelfilter.

-Jon

Thanks Jon.

Also of note was plug-in price. LW's new sub $1000 price has also brought discussions regarding plug in prices. Its hard to not judge a plug in price in relation to LW's price. people have gone so far as to accuse Worley of over charging for Fprime now that its been in the market for a few years.. meanwhile Fprime, at least in LW 8.5, has no competition in the LW market for the time being, or even across platforms if you think about it. So why would worley lower his prices.

I don't want to propagate the OT argument here, but I'd hate to see a plug-in crippled, or even not produced, because the a portion of the LW community, usually hobbyist, will protest its price. Its not bashing on anybody, its just stating a fact. So lets just focus on supporting our developers with feedback. :thumbsup:

theo
07-26-2006, 07:41 PM
My personal taste stray from a purist 3D and I prefer a more impressionistic look. To each their own. :thumbsup:

Count me in on this general thinking as well. I, though, lean towards an overall hand-created interpretation of the 3D CG in whatever fashion or style rather than soley an impressionistic look, though I am an adherent to impressionistic principles in some fashion.

Though I invest energies into it with results that please clients I really am not spiritually into this hyper-realism that gets the gasps on forums all over the net. With one exception, if the subject matter is intensely creative and has a superb individuality to it that separates the 3D CG image from the herd. In this case I have a deep sense of respect for the art.

But, the 3D forums of the world are littered with so many bottles, faces and metal chains that one wonders if there is any hope for the more subtle and intellectual pursuit of meaning and message within the image window.

archiea
07-26-2006, 09:13 PM
I understand about the schools. I just saw your comment and thought it seemed odd.

With LW Mac and the release of 9 and other Newtek products it just seemed like an odd thing and I was curious.

Nothing about being #1 in what I wrote, just curious because I thought it was growing.


I was regarding mainly hrGiger's post.

it all depends on which data you want to listen to. The important thing is that LW 9 seems to represent NT's building momemtum for LW considering what has been going on for the past few years.

I think I posted this in another thread.. in the past decade, 3D has changed alot.. from the domain of generalist to specialist, to oversimplify things. Look at Davey Jones in Pirates, the amount of sophistication, computer science and simulation that that entails. 3D has shot up to a high profile status with big studios, and as a result, its created organizations from schools like Gnomen to groups like the Visual effects Society.

So whats changes was the popularity of apps like LW's trailblazing to the convention of multi app (commercial and proprietary) based pipelines. As a result, the conventions of what is conisdered growth or popularity isn't so simple.

I still think LW is great for many application but in the scope of visual effects one can't deny how Maya has taken center stage. The reason for that are, well, very un-lightwavey... :D

Getting back OT, I hope that those reason don't interfere with LW development. While ther landscape has changed, I think that in the area like indie CG films, artist stand to benefit greatly from any development power that LW can get. :thumbsup: