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MBeck
05-21-2006, 08:27 AM
So, I don't want to carry around a bunch of monitors for my cameras when I do live switching.. is there a way for me to have a software monitor for each of my cameras?

BobF
05-21-2006, 11:45 AM
Well there is this solution (on pages 22 and 23) http://www.lcdracks.com/lcdcatal.pdf. Kind of expensive at $2,700 and $3,700 respectively, but they do only take up one rack unit of space.

jsanfilippo
05-21-2006, 12:27 PM
Someone recently posted a VERY COOL idea that I have yet to try, but I certainly plan on it for my next show on the road.

Get a quad-splitter. Feed all your camera previews to that, and then feed the output of the quad splitter into the VT, and drop it onto your Key/Aux Bus, and use a VT Vision to preview it!

You'll probably want a dedicated LCD monitor and fill it with the VT Vision, otherwise it will be too small to accurately see a quad-split of 4 cameras and compose shots on it.

If you don't want to feed it into the VT or can't spare a VGA output to dedicate an LCD monitor, then just use a single 13" studio monitor. It's easier to schlep 1 monitor than 3 or 4. :)

MBeck
05-21-2006, 07:05 PM
This is crazy! How is it that the tricaster can do this... but the VT cannot? :devil:

MBeck
05-21-2006, 07:30 PM
What will I loose using the key/aux buss? will I still be able to do fades and use my DSK?

kltv
05-21-2006, 11:35 PM
This is crazy! How is it that the tricaster can do this... but the VT cannot? :devil:

Because the VT has 24 potential inputs and the Tricaster only has 3. Since the VT and Tricaster both have only 3 digitizers it makes it impossible to use on the VT. You'll need those digitizers to grab other analog sources.

Kris

rbartlett
05-22-2006, 02:35 AM
Or if the PiP is big enough, use an LCD monitor with VGA/DVI input on it that also provides for a component/Y-C/composite video signal, full screen or PiP. If this isn't an option, a VGA-passthrough TV-VGA box might also be readily available to you with a scalable/positionable PiP. Firewire preview could work too but the cascade of boxes could be a nuisance to manage. Any of these would save loading up the valuable inputs of a VTPro/Tricaster box or the risks of adding a USB2/PCI capture card into the foray.

Bobt
05-22-2006, 11:38 AM
?? What is it you need a feed to view all three sources in one VT monitor?
You will have to have a VT4/Pro card. Thats what is in the Tricaster.
The VTPro card has 3 inputs.

Bob

Bobt
05-22-2006, 11:39 AM
Let me be more descriptive the
VT4/Pro card has three live inputs.
Then you can stack em into one view.

MBeck
05-22-2006, 05:04 PM
Ok... I have a VT3 card, so I cannot do this. However, if I had a VT4 card, I could?

ScorpioProd
05-22-2006, 07:18 PM
You could, in the sense of getting all three inputs in at once and look at them on VT-Visions at once, on the Program, Preview and Key/Aux busses.

BUT, realize, VT[4] is only a ONE M/E (Mix/Effect) bus switcher. So if you wanted to do a transition from the camera on your Key/Aux bus, you would first have to move that input to your Preview bus, before doing a transition. AFAIK, the DSK would just be on whatever gets switched to Program.

Of course, if you're just doing cuts, you could instantly take to any of the buses by clicking that input on Program.

MBeck
05-23-2006, 01:07 AM
ok.. so getting back to my other question.. if I use a quad splitter and place that input into the aux/key bus just to put it into a vt vision.. what do I lose?

jsanfilippo
05-23-2006, 05:39 AM
AFAIK.... you loose nothing.... unless you were already using your Aux/Key bus for something else (which it doesn't sound like you were).

wvp
05-23-2006, 07:17 AM
ok.. so getting back to my other question.. if I use a quad splitter and place that input into the aux/key bus just to put it into a vt vision.. what do I lose?
You lose space on your monitor for VT.
DO yourself a favor -- Get a quad splitter, use "T" connectors and loop your video through these and send the quad to a separate monitor

Jim Capillo
05-23-2006, 07:27 AM
I would think it would also be pretty small to cram 4 inputs in there.... hard to see.

jsanfilippo
05-23-2006, 08:01 AM
Unless you are like me.... I have 4 VGA outs from my VT, and I only use 3 of them. So I could dedicate one to a full screen VT Vision.

But now that I think about it - why tax the VT anymore than necessary. Just as easy to bring a separate studio monitor as it is another large computer monitor.

:)

Jim Capillo
05-23-2006, 11:09 AM
.... Just as easy to bring a separate studio monitor as it is another large computer monitor.


Yup ! :D

MBeck
05-24-2006, 03:01 PM
a studio monitor is the same as an lcd? The LCD can fit in a rack laying down and is much much lighter!

The problem with the quad splitter we have seen is that we are getting some delay, and we use the sony remote control cameras.. and they have a tad in them too.. so... I dunno.

Chrysolithos
05-30-2006, 09:53 PM
I haven't noticed much delay with my system.
But I have an old B&W only quad splitter that has horrible delay and slow frame rate. I only tried it once on a live switch.
I use a consumer grade quad splitter Model Magic Guard III made by Grandtec. ($150.00 or so) It has four composite RCA video inputs and two Comp RCA video out. But it also has VGA out. When I edit on my VT4, I use 2 19' lcd, and when I do a live switch, I plug one LCD into the quad splitter. One drawback is if you use any Y/C feeds. Marshal Electronics (who makes a killer LCD slide out rack mount display for mucho $$$) make a 4 input Active Y/C loop-through to Composite converter box Model #MC-0201-4. Steel case, BNC Comp Vid out, Standard 4 pin miniDin Y/C in/out, nice tiny wallwort that is only one standard plug size tall, and a wall mount. Definitely pro grade but not too expensive. ($180 or so) Marshal also makes a 1 RU tall mounting kit for two of the units if you need more than 4 Y/C inputs.

I have used this setup for two years now, and it works great. One of the features of the Quad splitter is on screen labels for each of the quadrants, which I use to name each camera operator. This helps a lot when the switching gets hectic. And it all fits in the carrying box with the LCD monitor (19" Viewsonic). I plan to make a road case for my VT4 with room for everything to be all connected and ready to go. Too bad it's in a tower case as rack mount road cases are easy to find.

PIZAZZ
05-31-2006, 07:39 AM
I haven't noticed much delay with my system.
But I have an old B&W only quad splitter that has horrible delay and slow frame rate. I only tried it once on a live switch.
I use a consumer grade quad splitter Model Magic Guard III made by Grandtec. ($150.00 or so) It has four composite RCA video inputs and two Comp RCA video out. But it also has VGA out. When I edit on my VT4, I use 2 19' lcd, and when I do a live switch, I plug one LCD into the quad splitter. One drawback is if you use any Y/C feeds. Marshal Electronics (who makes a killer LCD slide out rack mount display for mucho $$$) make a 4 input Active Y/C loop-through to Composite converter box Model #MC-0201-4. Steel case, BNC Comp Vid out, Standard 4 pin miniDin Y/C in/out, nice tiny wallwort that is only one standard plug size tall, and a wall mount. Definitely pro grade but not too expensive. ($180 or so) Marshal also makes a 1 RU tall mounting kit for two of the units if you need more than 4 Y/C inputs.

I have used this setup for two years now, and it works great. One of the features of the Quad splitter is on screen labels for each of the quadrants, which I use to name each camera operator. This helps a lot when the switching gets hectic. And it all fits in the carrying box with the LCD monitor (19" Viewsonic). I plan to make a road case for my VT4 with room for everything to be all connected and ready to go. Too bad it's in a tower case as rack mount road cases are easy to find.

We have converted several Tower VT Systems to rackmount versions. Give me a shout if you are interested in us morphing yours.

MBeck
05-31-2006, 12:53 PM
I use a consumer grade quad splitter Model Magic Guard III made by Grandtec. ($150.00 or so) It has four composite RCA video inputs and two Comp RCA video out. But it also has VGA out.


Nice!!! That is just what I am looking for. Composit is fine because we have a cable loom that has S and composit and we will just use both outputs on the camera to feed S to the VT and Composit to the splitter.

Awesome.

mbloor
06-05-2006, 05:57 PM
I have used quad splits for years..the Grandtec unit is great but a couple of warnings, there is a little cut off..minimal and quite liveable with:thumbsup:
However IF you are a PAL user the VGA output its potentially problematic as the vert refresh rate is 50hz this may be OK for CRT VGA monitors but if probably wont work with an LCD monitor.
Mark

Nomalz
09-28-2006, 06:02 AM
Hey everybody :newhere:

I'm working on a VT solution for event show (nothing bought yet but planned in about 2 weeks if everything gets ok).

Has anyone tested the Grand Magic Guard III in PAL mode with an LCD monitor ? This 50Hz feature scares me a little. As I'm working only with PAL (from France :)), I don't want to bring a CRT monitor with me instead of an LCD !

What happens if I use the Magic Guard III in NTSC mode (to get the 60Hz refresh rate) feeded with PAL composite video sources ? Do I get black & white video or flickering ? Can someone make a test for me ? :bowdown:

mtruss
09-28-2006, 08:24 AM
This is a great product for previewing cameras in a live setting. It is a 2.5" TFT monitor. Sells on eBay for about $50.00 a piece. I have 5 installed in my production van and for the price and size, I could not do without them. Works in NTFS or PAL

Here is a link with more information and to show how I use them.

http://www.tmvc.net/toasterstuff_Preview.htm

jedbarish
09-28-2006, 09:11 AM
I noticed that Mini TFT Monitor is using av components from the camera. How do you handle it between your production van to the cameras? Wireless or long cables in between? I want to see if there is a way to reduce the mess with cables from the cameras. Is there a splitter to split two inputs at the end of the cable itself ?

Jed

mtruss
09-28-2006, 09:32 AM
I currently use a very long multi pin cable assembly. It has 3 mini coax and 8 additional pairs that carry camera audio, tally, intercom to and from each camera. I use a T-splitter directly on the input bus on BOB. Input to the T and output to the monitor and the input on BOB. I am working on a wireless solution using information posted in this forum however it will not reduce the cabling only allow the camera operator to move freely in a radius around the "pod" receiver. From the pod to the truck would be the wiring.

There is another wiring solution mentioned in this forum about using cat 5 cable with a multiplex box at either end. I will post a link to the thread if I can find it.

Mark

Jim_C
09-28-2006, 09:56 AM
Be careful about using an unpowered hardware T splitter to split a video signal.

Video must be 1volt peak to peak and using a powered DA amp is the only way to insure no loss in video signal if sending to multiple sources.

Use the former below not the latter....

mtruss
09-28-2006, 09:59 AM
Thanks for that info. I have not had an issue yet. I am only using a single T splitter in line at this point however I am adding instant replay and I will need to add a line amp much like this one on every input I send out to replay.

Jim_C
09-28-2006, 10:10 AM
With one split you might not visually notice, but if you were to look at your split signal vs the raw on the scopes you would probably see a drop in voltage.

I love the Van! You have REALLY got the gear crammed in there nicely.
And really nice wood work, fit and finish.

I could tell it was small from the inside pic, but said 'whoa' when I saw it was just a cargo van.
We modified a 25 foot flat roof horse trailer for our production trailer.
But we use the exact same chair. :)

Markertek has a similar version of those little monitors also. Although I think they are about 80 bucks.

jedbarish
09-28-2006, 10:31 AM
I'm not sure to look for the right product at http://www.vac-brick.com. I would say if I have 4 or 5 cams then I need 5 units of video distribution or look for 4 inputs then 8 outputs bec 4 outputs need to go on SX-8 and another 4 outputs go to 4 mini tft monitors, right?

Jim_C
09-28-2006, 10:39 AM
Count on 1 brick(DA) per camera.

Each brick has 1 input, then get one with as many ouputs as you need then add maybe one or 2 for future use.
If the brick has 1 input, 4 outputs AND a loop thru count on that as another output.
But you do need to terminate the loopthru if not using it. You would not need to terminate the other outputs as for they are self terminated.

Some equipment has a loop thru built in that allows you to plug a line into it then loop thru the circuitry and go output from that piece of equipment to another.

So if you have four cameras and just need to split the signal:
http://www.vac-brick.com/CompositeVideoDADetail.asp?PartID=11-131-102&ProductFamily=ProSeries
4 of these would work and you would have an extra output in the loopthru.

mbloor
09-28-2006, 10:48 AM
Hey everybody :newhere:

I'm working on a VT solution for event show (nothing bought yet but planned in about 2 weeks if everything gets ok).

Has anyone tested the Grand Magic Guard III in PAL mode with an LCD monitor ? This 50Hz feature scares me a little. As I'm working only with PAL (from France :)), I don't want to bring a CRT monitor with me instead of an LCD !

What happens if I use the Magic Guard III in NTSC mode (to get the 60Hz refresh rate) feeded with PAL composite video sources ? Do I get black & white video or flickering ? Can someone make a test for me ? :bowdown:

Hi, I use the GM guard but its the II, but I believe the III is the same in terms of functionality.
If you set the unit to NTSC and feed a PAL signal into it it doesnt lock..frame rolls.
If you set it to PAL the VGA refresh rate out is 50 vert. Most LCD monitors will only lock down to about 56 hz vert,unless its a TV too. eg Samsung make a VGA monitor/TV, but you would have to use it in TV mode. The GM Guard, in addition to the VGA out also outputs a quad split on S Video and Composite video so if your VGA is also a TV you could use that.
There may be some LCD VGA monitors that will lock up to a 50 vert refresh (eg the 15" digimate widescreen, HOWEVER you will loose about 1/3 to a 1/2 of the bottom two pictures in the quad split.
Hope that helps
Mark