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Videonut
12-29-2005, 10:31 PM
So what is the trick with 4.6 CG? In 4.5, I light up the DSK button, check the VT-Vision box and preview out with the video clip showing under the CG screen. Is there something different now!!!!!

Cineman
12-31-2005, 01:43 PM
Unfortunately, what you describe will not work in 4.6. With 4.6 the only way to compose your CG to a video background, or see black print, or black shadow and/or border with any color of font; is to put the whole thing on the air (Program Out).

What you will need to do from CG Designer is to back out to the switcher. Put your background video on Main. Select CG in DSK, and activate DSK as you mention above. Then you can return to CG Designer where, with VT-Vision selected, you can see what you are composing over the video.

Of course, to DSK, you will have to use another version of the switcher than "Slim". And of course, you can't work this way during a live switch.

Nes Gurley

John Perkins
12-31-2005, 02:17 PM
Yeah, that's a pain.

I've got a template saved with a pale green box that covers the whole screen, set to "do not render". This lets me use black or white (but not pale green, yuk) and still see the text.

It doesn't help to place text around video, but you can see your text.

Ivan
01-24-2006, 02:01 PM
Also noticed in 4.6 that when selecting VT Vision the text disappears and all you get is the box. This is not how it used to work and is causing some problems for people as they had always displayed the video in CG to confirm placement and color.

Ivan

tmon
01-31-2006, 02:44 PM
RE: 4.6c CG.

OK, so what's the improvement here? I don't understand how this is an improvement from the previous way the software worked. Can someone educate me?

tmon
01-31-2006, 07:16 PM
was the "d" key (to select DSK) done away with in 4.6c?

Cineman
01-31-2006, 08:10 PM
Ivan,

I apologize for not replying to your post above. At the time you posted I was so positively thinking that this big bug would be fixed in the update to 4.6. Evidently, I was wrong, eh?

See my reply to taiji below.

Nes Gurley

Cineman
01-31-2006, 08:13 PM
taija,

I don't know of anyone having said that this was an improvement in this thread or the other where mentioned. John Perkins did offer a work around for part of the problem above. The only person that I know of who said that this bug was a good thing was Andrew Cross in a private E-mail to me.

Of course I totally disagree as it has basically ended any chance of my doing a CG composition during a live switch.

Nes Gurley

tmon
02-01-2006, 01:37 AM
Nes,

I agree, I don't think anyone has said anything good about this new "feature." I just thought perhaps there was some mysterious advantage to the new "method" that I didn't know about. I think it was in Build 4909 that we had to manually start the DSK (I usually did it with the "D" key in small switcher mode myself) in order for VT-Vision to allow CG composing over video. I understood this as a safeguard against things defaulting to CG overlay on program output in a live context, so I was cool with the extra step.

I wasn't sure if it was a bug or not. I guess it isn't, if Andrew thinks it's a good thing (?) I had posted a question on the VT 4.6c released thread with no response before I found this one. Glad to see others have raised issue with it.

I was wondering if it was done on purpose for CG and other DSK work during live shoots or something? ....just speculation....

I just have to get used to the slightly different method...

Cineman
02-01-2006, 09:25 PM
I wasn't sure if it was a bug or not. I guess it isn't, if Andrew thinks it's a good thing (?) I had posted a question on the VT 4.6c released thread with no response before I found this one. Glad to see others have raised issue with it.Andrew defended it by saying that this is a good thing because it means that you are unlikely to mess up a live show by pressing a button in the CG. I totally don't buy that as the only way to do that ever, that I recall, was to click on "Out to Switcher", not "VT Vision", when DSK was on. (My recall is that even that had already been fixed.) Now with 4.6 it is absolutely necessary to have the CG being composed showing on "Program Out" before it can be viewed over its background. That is just the opposite of what is needed.

Yes, there is a problem with the labels for doing this, but that is a skin label, and easily changed. My suggestion was something like: "Input" over "Preview" (or better yet, "Key/Aux") and "Output" over "DSK". Andrew disagrees, and is proceeding to implement the following for future versions.

I think that what we need to do is the "correct" fix to this problem, which would be to bring up a dialog box when you select that and let you know that "The CG is not currently visible on the DSK, would you like select it ?".To me that is just an attempt to justify a bug that came in after the first public beta build of 4.6.

Nes Gurley

tmon
02-01-2006, 09:52 PM
Thanks for the "insider info," Nes.

Too bad more live switch people don't chime in here. Maybe they have done so elsewhere or by other means?

This is the only thing that I've run into with 4.6c that has thrown me for a loop so far....

Cineman
02-01-2006, 10:08 PM
was the "d" key (to select DSK) done away with in 4.6c?No. Are you by chance finding this when trying to key from CG Designer? In that case you will first have to click "Out To Switcher" on the View tab in DG Designer (and, of course, have CG selected in DSK.

Prior to the bug in the release version of 4.6, that was the protection for having a CG Page not pop up on air while it was being composed.

Nes

nevmoor
02-01-2006, 10:10 PM
I will put my 2 cents in on this too. Please allow us to use the VT vision correctly. On VT3 you could kind of use this as a preview for the CG module. Now that you can't see the program in the background while doing a CG you are forced to do your CG ahead of time. Although you should do this, I thought the whole point of making the CG more stable was to allow you to create stuff during a live shoot. Without this functioning the point is moot.

Cineman
02-02-2006, 12:28 AM
was the "d" key (to select DSK) done away with in 4.6c?No. Are you by chance finding this when trying to key from CG Designer? In that case you will first have to click "Out To Switcher" on the View tab in CG Designer (and, of course, have CG selected in DSK.)

Prior to the bug in the release version of 4.6, that was the protection for having a CG Page not pop up on air while it was being composed.

Nes