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ackees
05-07-2003, 04:39 AM
The proposed plan for the LW tour is too exclusive. NT should concentrate on getting as many people to attend as possible and that means either free or a greatly reduced price. College students should certainly be invited for free with free education bundles.

kevman3d
05-07-2003, 05:57 AM
What you have to appreciate is the extent that the LearnLightWave dudes are going to bring their knowledge to you! I mean, you get experts for 2 *entire* days, and you get a series of CD's with video tutes to take away at the end.

The shear cost of travelling the USA, then the world, sourcing accomodation, sourcing presentation facilities and the time that people have to put into the tour, as well as printed materials and CD's really couldn't be done for 'free'.

However - LearnLightwave DO offer group discounts, so if you think you're class really needs some cheap/free training, organise with your school to make a large group booking and see what kind of deal LearnLightWave can offer...

That's what I did for my LWUG here in NZ - We got a great deal, however now I'm finding it hard to get all those excited people to actually book and pay. (its easy to say 'Yes, me, me!!!!' and harder to say 'Yes, me! And here's my money!') ;)

ackees
05-07-2003, 06:41 AM
Maybe NT could have a two tier event, day one, open and free in theatre with a few goodies to wet the appetite and follow with a pay session the following day for the ‘hardcore users’, this way NT get good value for the effort and they expand the user base. It would be a ‘come and see what we can do and get some free goodies’ (aimed at expanding user base), and then follow the next day with ‘if you use LW you cannot afford to miss this’ this second session would be a pay session and more exclusive and ‘hardcore’. Naturally the resources on offer on the second day would be extensive.

mattclary
05-07-2003, 07:10 AM
:rolleyes:

hrgiger
05-07-2003, 07:24 AM
I second that.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Rei
05-07-2003, 01:51 PM
Motion passed.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

kevman3d
05-08-2003, 06:53 AM
Originally posted by ackees
Maybe NT could have a two tier event, day one, open and free in theatre with a few goodies to wet the appetite and follow with a pay session the following day for the ‘hardcore users’

That's not such a bad idea - Though is Newtek sponsoring all the costs for the guys at the LearningStop? (Remembering these things are run by these guys, not directly by Newtek as far as I can tell?)

I can just see Lee Stranahan just being all happy that people want him to pay to travel around the world, pay to book presentation facilities, pay for accomodation, and spend more of his money to create a tonne of CD's and material for a free day, in hopes that a few of you might pay him for a second day and possibly cover some of the expenses... NOT! :) Narf! Narf!

However, If you REALLY feel that you want free info, tips and tricks or an intro to LightWave to wet that Appetite, I say go check out a local LightWave User Group and get someone to show you all the cool things LW can do... Its what we run them for! You may even find some give you free stuff if you're lucky...

LWUG attitude all the way, baby!

:) :) :) :) to that one!

ackees
05-08-2003, 08:10 AM
K. The whole idea is about attracting new users, not the people who are already committed. What is the cost of mass duplicating CD’s or DVD’s $2 each? The benefit NT would get from new users would be way beyond the initial costs. Good planning will keep costs down.

Jimzip
05-08-2003, 11:22 PM
Yeah yeah.. That's all a good idea.. But I've already paid...:rolleyes:

Maybe next time.;)

Jimzip:D

(heh, I wrote Jimziopop.. I'm getting tired..)

ackees
05-09-2003, 03:51 AM
If it happens maybe you could get a refund J.
I was invited to an Adobe event and it was amazing, very professional. It was a completely open invitation (limited by first come) and held in a small cinema so they could accommodate lots of people (between two and three hundred). After registration there was coffee and biscuits and a pay bar, in this area were a number of 3rd party developers showing off their products, you got the chance to have hands on with the various add-ons you could buy (imagine being able to preview all the LW add-ons in one place). They had jugglers and other performers mingling with the crowd, which at first seemed OTT but, you know, it gave the whole thing a friendly carnival atmosphere, I’ve never seen attendees to an event like this so relaxed). You then went into the cinema for the main presentation, there were movies of people using the software in different situations and testimonials (from the man in the log cabin to the large studio), there was a complete demo, questions and answers and live problem solving sessions on stage. Afterwards there was training CD’s discounts etc. The most interesting thing however was the number of people who obviously did not have or use the product , I could tell because there was a long queue of people lining up to take advantage of the special show discount purchase, Adobe easily recovered their costs with these new users and the users who were upgrading.
Interestingly I also went to a Maya launch and their approach was very similar (not a cinema but a trendy club), very slick (a very large number of young students invited).
So NT needs to start thinking like a major store on the high street not a hard to find one in the back alleys, there is still a feeling of LW as a great secret to be discovered and those who know are members of some secret society with magic (rendering) powers.

Stranahan
05-09-2003, 08:04 AM
I'm kind of suprised nobody from NewTek jumped in to mention this, but they don't cover any of my expenses. I drove (literally) about 6000 miles in the past 2 weeks, and as you can imagine there are all kinds of expenses from gas to food to hotel and meeting expenese to disc duplication and postage to send people from the last tour their stuff. When you add it up, I don't have a high paying job and I'm away from most of my kids all the time.

We're offering two full days of training, plus 3 CDs with 20 plus hours of training material for under $200. We offer group discounts, too. The events are a great way to meet other LightWave users, and a number of user groups have formed from such events. We don't offer a specific student discount, because we don't have the staff to make sure students are students. There is no staff, really - it's me and my family. Instead, we've kept the price really low for everyone

We're about to shift the schedule, so check the dates in your area. We have a great event coming to San Francisco's DV Garage, and that event will also have LW8 product manager Art Howe teaching at it.

Hervé
05-09-2003, 08:09 AM
More to come in Europe Lee ??

Stranahan
05-09-2003, 08:12 AM
Actually, yes...

Hervé
05-09-2003, 09:55 AM
Cool, dont forget to post a little note here when it's ready...

Thanks
Hope to CU later

John Fornasar
05-09-2003, 10:19 PM
I've attended Lee's seminars twice, and they are, if anything, underpriced.

I didn't take a survey, but I think most of us in New York were fairly experienced LW users. However, Lee's style of delivery leaves room to address questions from new users at the same time.

Lee starts most modules with a "ever have this problem, or try to do this in LW", encourages involvement, and most importantly, some thought. As he demonstrates solutions, he addresses the way LW works and the reasons "things happen". In the end the solutions provided, and the thought processes behind them can be applied to more than just the subject covered.

As far as Adobe, I check them out about every two years when they come to NYC. It is Adobe sponsored. The "show" I attended was by invite to registered users, with registration for the event a must. It was held at the St. Regis hotel and about 500 people were there (the place was packed). With a show of hands the vast majority were users of several Adobe products (Photoshop, Premiere, After Effects, Illustrator) and it was definitely aimed not at new users, but went straight into the new version features. If you weren't familiar with their products, you would see an interesting show, but it's not a "Learn Adobe" tour. Even with the features they demo, you now know that the product can "do it", but you have to work it out yourself.

I don't know if they had any other "open" sessions in the city to attract new users, or went around to the colleges.

mattclary
05-12-2003, 07:14 AM
Man 6000 miles in two weeks, that SUCKS! Whatever you're making, Lee, it ain't enough. I used to drive between Tallahassee and ABilene, Tx. when I was in the Air Force. Not too bad at first, but now if I have to drive for more than 40 minutes at a time, I become very unhappy.

colkai
05-12-2003, 08:19 AM
Heh,
You'd hate my job.
I live 25 miles from work (yep just 25). An average day, I spend 1 hour coming home and 1hr 10minutes travelling to work. When its busy, I can expect it to take upto 2 hours for me to get there.
I am one of the lowest paid members of staff, (think sub 23k). I actually put in more miles going to and from work than the guy with the company car clocks up going on-site each year.

Costs me about 200 quid a month to keep the car running, that's just "normal" costs, (excluding any repairs etc.). :(

Let's here it for the concept of tele-working!

Hervé
05-13-2003, 12:25 AM
.... when I work, I am on first floor, so not too far.... but.... I drive my wife every morning to work (1/2 hour)....

kevman3d
05-13-2003, 06:02 AM
Originally posted by ackees
K. The whole idea is about attracting new users, not the people who are already committed. What is the cost of mass duplicating CD’s or DVD’s $2 each? The benefit NT would get from new users would be way beyond the initial costs. Good planning will keep costs down.

I see what you are trying to indicate, Ackees, but really you are talking not about the LightWave World tour, but a large marketing campaign to push a product... Probably the confusion comes from the naming of the event (Maybe it should be called the 'LightWave Training World Tour') - It does sound much like a Marketing event, similiar to Alias' "3 Dec" that they've been pushing over the last few years.

So I do see where you are coming from...

I do find it funny though that there are so may other costs involved that have been pointed out to you, and all you can concentrate on is the measly cost of CD duplication? lol! ;)

Lee - 6000 miles in 2 weeks?! Geesh, whats that cost just in gas alone? It must be astronomical!? :confused:

gjjackson
05-13-2003, 07:02 AM
I'm just anxiously waiting for July when the tour is here in Kansas City.

ackees
05-13-2003, 08:34 AM
I bet there are enough LW3D experts in each location to help out with this tour, I think it’s a problem of organisational structure in NT. NT have to move forward or slide back.

colkai
05-14-2003, 03:07 AM
Originally posted by ackees
I think it’s a problem of organisational structure in NT. NT have to move forward or slide back.

Having an expert in a city does not necessarily mean Newtek is aware of them, so why this should be turned around to be a Newtek organization problem beats me. Once again there is the old, "Newtek is not keeping up" tirade. Come on guys, just how many threads to you feel the need to put this is. It's getting really old, really fast! :mad:

Around NW UK, (my area), there are no doubt some talented wavers, but how does anyone know who is talented? Do you expect Newtek to call everyone and say "hello, are you super-skilled in LW?" - even if the answer is YES, I'll bet the truth would fall short of that!

Why everything now must be perceived as a failure of Lightwave or Newtek is beyond me. :rolleyes:

pauland
05-14-2003, 03:17 AM
I'd just like to say that $200 for the two days is a bargain, regardless of any extras.

I attended Lee/Grahams two days when they were in Europe and would recommend it. I worry that Lee is just working too much.

The last two European tours were cancelled at very short notice (actually, no notice, if you didn't try and confirm the venue shortly beforehand).

Paul

kevman3d
05-14-2003, 06:04 AM
Interesting all this talk about worldwide talent...

I had this cool idea last year (or was it the year before?) to have a 'LightWave Community World Tour' utilising some of the talented people in User Groups to provide a community based training event, around the world...

There's a user group in every country (well, quite a few) and since many have talented folks, imagine using that resource to push LightWave in one large united event.

I even started to build a 'training plan' as well for a 2-day weekend thing... The idea was to plan a training structure, then collect and share tutorials from between groups globally, and put something outstanding together through global cooperation.

It went in a few ears, then nothing came back - I thought is was a good idea... I sorta gave it up since I really felt there was like nobody keen on the idea in the LWUG arena... :(

Stranahan
05-14-2003, 07:27 AM
There's a saying I heard somewhere...

An Expert is someone from 100 miles away...

And this addresses a couple of the points made earlier...

My experience is that it's hard to get people to come for local experts. This applies when that local expert is me, too - otherwise I'd travel less. Part of what happens on the tour, though, is that I learn stuff as I travel...

About Europe - after the first tour, there was a political row of some kind between NewTek and NewTek Europe. I was told not to go. That's not going to happen this time - I am going to Europe.

I do work too hard, though. The current problem is sending out CDs and DVDs to last year's attendees. We've solved this problem on the current tour by making darn sure we have all the material the day of the seminar - but we still have hundreds of people to send stuff to.

colkai
05-14-2003, 07:51 AM
Lee,
I think you've pretty much nailed it there.
I think sometimes people really DO think that expertise isn't home-grown. My wife is a wildlife artist, she very rarely sells in our county, but when she exhibits elsewhere, in her words, "it's rare I don't sell anything there".

Of course, the bonus to NOT being local is folks won't keep nagging you because they don't know where you are :D :D :D

Kevman..
I know at least one other local waver (Hi Kevin!) but I think it's amazingly difficult to organise a time suitable for everyone to come together. Be it painting, music or 3D, getting folks together is never simple. If I recall Kevin Stubbs once offered an 'open house' but I think only 1 person turned up. Shame, but there you are.

kevman3d
05-15-2003, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by Stranahan

An Expert is someone from 100 miles away...

My experience is that it's hard to get people to come for local experts. This applies when that local expert is me, too - otherwise I'd travel less.


Agreed on all those notes - When I started the LWUG 3-4 years ago, first I had 1, 2, maybe up to 5 people come along. Most the time it was closer to 3-4. Very sad... And at times, I almost pulled the plug on the idea...

...Then Larry Shultz came to NZ and popped in for a visit and talk - Suddenly 35 people appeared out of nowhere! :)

After perservering for so many years, on average I now get around 10-15 people per meeting, most come cause I offer lots of free tutorials that I create myself. Also, many are students and come just because its a teaching resource that extends on their current school course (and not cause its a User Group). Dunno if I should feel used and abused, but I'm just happy people are keen to come...

Interestingly, If I have no cool tutorials, meetings get a lot smaller! :)

I also get annoyed because a lot of commercial or 'professional' users tend to shun the UG out of mostly professional 'pride' and a little snobbiness. I've heard a few stupid reasons from 'professionals' like that I don't give away enough free stuff like T-shirts and door prizes, or not enough 'other' professionals come, so there's like noone to talk to (cause students, hobbiests and newbie LW animators can't talk english, or something?)

However, you'd be amazed how many 'professionals' actually don't really know that much more then a few of the newbie students I have met! Narf! Narf! :)

lone
05-18-2003, 08:26 AM
i've got no problem with the price (not that i'm rolling in dough, but i think it would be worth it), but it would be nice if they could have the show a little closer to where i live. i can afford the tour, but i can't afford the travel expenses on top of it.

colkai
05-18-2003, 10:00 AM
For sure, that does play a part in it.
In the UK, 90 percent of the time, things like this are in London, that means travel expenses, finding a hotel, boarding and food to pay for, so for a Ł200 course, I have to ear-mark Ł400.
Now that Ł400 could be put ready to my next upgrade, ot replacing the carpet in the bedroom and stairs, or having the garage roof repaired. So it becomes doubly difficult to justify the expense for a couple of days training on my hobby. :(
If it was just the cost of the course, I could probably justify it to the missus. ;)

Of course, things would be *so* much easier if my boss just paid me a decent salary!:p

lone
05-18-2003, 10:26 AM
COLKAI brings up another good point, that being that a lot of us are not working in 3D, but hobbyists, which means we have to pay for this sort of thing out of our own pockets. if i could bill it to an employer, or write it off on taxes, i'd be there yesterday.

ackees
05-18-2003, 11:31 AM
I wonder if NT could combine events, you know, launch of a new product plus training, plus whatever else in each area, they are going to have to have some marketing presence with a launch of LW8 anyway. The focus would be great because you would get a ‘NT in town’ effect, it would be a happening event . It all seems a little unfocused at the moment, lots of people running around trying their best under difficult conditions.

Stranahan
05-18-2003, 04:52 PM
This is kind I note I get that makes the whole thing worthwhile..

"Hope the Tour is going well! I must say that it was definitely the best $200 I've spent in some time (I was in the DC seminar). BTW, the CD's are super, very effective and nicely put
together tutorial material! The seminar was super, and the
information was great. You're doing a good thing, man! The effort and energy is appreciated, both personally, and for the LW community at large! When you get to the foundation, it's the community that makes the product sing."

kevman3d
05-19-2003, 03:01 PM
Lee

I reckon that this is what its all about in the end - Sure, you're sharing knowledge and inspiring people but its great feedback that really keeps you going, knowing people really appreciate your efforts...

I know the feeling well (I can't tell you how many times I really felt running a LWUG was a waste of time) - Spending all my time creating tutorials and collecting material to present for *free* to users who sometimes really didn't seem to care can be hard - But one small 'thanks' or comment of appreciation does a lot to make all that effort just seem worthwhile! :)

Keep it up - And hope to see you down this way soon!


Kev.

SplineGod
05-26-2003, 02:02 AM
Originally posted by Stranahan
I'm kind of suprised nobody from NewTek jumped in to mention this, but they don't cover any of my expenses. I drove (literally) about 6000 miles in the past 2 weeks, and as you can imagine there are all kinds of expenses from gas to food to hotel and meeting expenese to disc duplication and postage to send people from the last tour their stuff. When you add it up, I don't have a high paying job and I'm away from most of my kids all the time.

We're offering two full days of training, plus 3 CDs with 20 plus hours of training material for under $200. We offer group discounts, too. The events are a great way to meet other LightWave users, and a number of user groups have formed from such events. We don't offer a specific student discount, because we don't have the staff to make sure students are students. There is no staff, really - it's me and my family. Instead, we've kept the price really low for everyone

We're about to shift the schedule, so check the dates in your area. We have a great event coming to San Francisco's DV Garage, and that event will also have LW8 product manager Art Howe teaching at it.

Not to mention that the training CDs are created by me. Ive spent time with Lee and its a very grueling schedule. I think its fine that end users would want stuff like this for free...I would too. The reality is that what you get for the price makes the event a real bargain and somebody needs to get paid for their efforts. :)

SplineGod
05-26-2003, 02:07 AM
Originally posted by colkai
Having an expert in a city does not necessarily mean Newtek is aware of them, so why this should be turned around to be a Newtek organization problem beats me. Once again there is the old, "Newtek is not keeping up" tirade. Come on guys, just how many threads to you feel the need to put this is. It's getting really old, really fast! :mad:

Around NW UK, (my area), there are no doubt some talented wavers, but how does anyone know who is talented? Do you expect Newtek to call everyone and say "hello, are you super-skilled in LW?" - even if the answer is YES, I'll bet the truth would fall short of that!

Why everything now must be perceived as a failure of Lightwave or Newtek is beyond me. :rolleyes:
I agree. Part of the problem is finding people who are very well rounded in Lightwave - in fact enough so to be able to present many completely different aspects of Lightwave. On top of that you need people who really have a great deal of experience teaching and can do it effectively. Then you have to locate these people and hope they can take time off to do it and then they have to be paid. Finding people even under the best of conditions is not easy.

SplineGod
05-26-2003, 02:14 AM
Originally posted by kevman3d
Agreed on all those notes - When I started the LWUG 3-4 years ago, first I had 1, 2, maybe up to 5 people come along. Most the time it was closer to 3-4. Very sad... And at times, I almost pulled the plug on the idea...

...Then Larry Shultz came to NZ and popped in for a visit and talk - Suddenly 35 people appeared out of nowhere! :)

After perservering for so many years, on average I now get around 10-15 people per meeting, most come cause I offer lots of free tutorials that I create myself. Also, many are students and come just because its a teaching resource that extends on their current school course (and not cause its a User Group). Dunno if I should feel used and abused, but I'm just happy people are keen to come...

Interestingly, If I have no cool tutorials, meetings get a lot smaller! :)

I also get annoyed because a lot of commercial or 'professional' users tend to shun the UG out of mostly professional 'pride' and a little snobbiness. I've heard a few stupid reasons from 'professionals' like that I don't give away enough free stuff like T-shirts and door prizes, or not enough 'other' professionals come, so there's like noone to talk to (cause students, hobbiests and newbie LW animators can't talk english, or something?)

However, you'd be amazed how many 'professionals' actually don't really know that much more then a few of the newbie students I have met! Narf! Narf! :)
That meeting was one of the best ones Ive attended in a long time. You guys definately have the best setup Ive seen for UG meetings and the most incredible view Ive seen. I hope we can use that same place for the seminar. :)

Hervé
05-26-2003, 02:24 AM
[QUOTE] I agree. Part of the problem is finding people who are very well rounded in Lightwave - in fact enough so to be able to present many completely different aspects of Lightwave. On top of that you need people who really have a great deal of experience teaching and can do it effectively. Then you have to locate these people and hope they can take time off to do it and then they have to be paid. Finding people even under the best of conditions is not easy.



This is why we love you Spline, .... aaaaahhhh, if money was not an issue.... one day...!

cheers, Hervé
I have to admit, Spline, you did a lot for the community Of LW'ers,a nd most of time you answered for free !!

SplineGod
05-26-2003, 02:56 AM
Thanks Herve! :)

ackees
05-26-2003, 03:35 AM
So we are really talking about connection between NT and the advanced users of LW, and how they can be taken on board to assist in a more corporate campaign (and be paid). It looks like a lack of central support (or planning) from NT.

SplineGod
05-26-2003, 05:28 AM
Originally posted by ackees
So we are really talking about connection between NT and the advanced users of LW, and how they can be taken on board to assist in a more corporate campaign (and be paid). It looks like a lack of central support (or planning) from NT.

I think its a matter of Newtek and others outside of Newtek recognizing a common need which is to provide training and educational content at a reasonable cost. Quality is quality whether it comes directly from Newtek or is endorsed by Newtek.
In the end people still have to produce the material and have to be paid. The vast majority of the seminar attendees feel that the amount of training received AND the 20+ hours more on 3 CDs is a bargain. Lee has been doing seminars for years and definately knows what hes doing. Hes also been quite active in the LW community for years. He has used Lightwave in production and knows the product. Ive used LW for years and I know the product pretty well. Ive also taught LW at several schools and have developed my own materials. Ive done training with Lee for quite awhile as well as classes for Newtek. Newtek also has William putting up tutorials and pointing people to additional content. There has never been a time that I remember when the good quality LW training has been available and at a very affordable price. Its only getting better. :)

kevman3d
05-26-2003, 05:59 AM
Originally posted by SplineGod
That meeting was one of the best ones Ive attended in a long time. You guys definately have the best setup Ive seen for UG meetings and the most incredible view Ive seen. I hope we can use that same place for the seminar. :)

Thanks Larry! Yeh, AUT have been great in letting us use their SGI Lab for meetings for the last 3 years - And that meeting was great (and the biggest we've ever had!)

Lots of people, and you got to talk to us for almost 3+ hours straight! :D

SplineGod
05-26-2003, 06:18 AM
Originally posted by kevman3d
Thanks Larry! Yeh, AUT have been great in letting us use their SGI Lab for meetings for the last 3 years - And that meeting was great (and the biggest we've ever had!)

Lots of people, and you got to talk to us for almost 3+ hours straight! :D
Yea, I know, I was holding back too. I can go on for MUCH longer believe me.;)

electroNIX
05-26-2003, 07:25 AM
I'd just like to say that $200 for the two days is a bargain, regardless of any extras.

I second that...
I second that too...

Unfortunately there arent too many gigs in Europe and this continent is so freaking big... :)

But I will be there in KL Malaysia!! for sure... (hoping to still get a place)

or is this gig being cancelled?

ackees
05-26-2003, 07:36 AM
I have this vision of every registered LW user being invited to a promotion/training event in each major location , and it should be free ( or almost free – the price of a cinema ticket), perhaps cost could be recovered with sales of training material software etc. The only way I can see this working is with NT support and planning , NT would definitely gain from this. I like the idea of a theatre release.

kevman3d
05-27-2003, 06:23 AM
Originally posted by ackees
I have this vision of every registered LW user being invited to a promotion/training event in each major location

I think Alias already bet you to that and called it '3Dec - A world wide day for 3D artists everywhere' (but they forgot to leave the rest of the sentence on that phrase '...to come and hear a few hours of sales promotions and more for our Flagship product Maya' :) )

Was it worth it? Well, I didn't go out and buy it... I didn't even think it was that much fun, listening to 'local studios' who simply plugged Maya here and there (and quite unconvincly at that - Almost sounded like it was forced out of them :) )

While your idea is cool, here's a few 'quicker' fixes you can get:

(a) Buy [email protected] from Sharbor.com and sit back and enjoy!
(b) Get the "Newtek Sampler Paq" DVD from sharbor - its got demos you'd probably expect from such an event on it...
(c) Find a local LWUG and get them to demo LW to you and your friends.
(d) Contact a local reseller for a Newtek Showreel

ackees
05-27-2003, 07:05 AM
I see it like this K, you can buy a DVD of the latest movie and watch it at home (with your TV dinner) but that doesn’t compare with the buzz of going to the first showing at the cinema and spotting the stars in the audience. The whole thing needs to move up a gear.

Stranahan
05-29-2003, 11:44 AM
Thanks to everyone who posted here for their feedback...

Guess what? We listened...

In addition to our affordable training, we're adding a couple of events as a proof of concept test...

Chuck Baker just posted the details under 'Events' but the basics....


Free Event

LightWave Demo

3rd Party Plug In Demo

Digital Fusion DFX+ Demo

Buy LightWave or upgrade to LightWave 8 and get DFX+ for free

And more....go check it out...

SLAYER
05-29-2003, 01:22 PM
Another big improvement for those who have taken this class would be to receive what was promised them!

I took the $199 seminar in Seattle in December and have still not received my DVD that was promised. I got the c.d that was handed out after class was also promised a DVD with even more tutorials and training. THis was one of the big factors in me deciding to take this class was the DVD.

I have inquired about this three times now.

LEE where is my DVD?

The last time I inquired about this was with Larry about two months ago. He said that you were wrapping up another batch of DVD's and that I should recive mine soon.

I am still waiting. 5 months now....

Stranahan
05-29-2003, 01:31 PM
This has been talked about elsewhere - but, sorry - I'm a one person company and my travel schedule is brutal and we had an entire tour of CDs / DVDs to mail...

I'm in Seattle this weekend - if you want to come by. I'll give them to you. Otherwise I'll mail them. Any other questions, email me right away.

SLAYER
05-29-2003, 01:55 PM
Thanks Lee.

I shot you a PM. Is this what you meant when you asked me to e-mail you?
I hope so, since I do not know your real e-mail address.

3danim8d
05-29-2003, 02:21 PM
Lee,

Do you know when you are going to be back in Albuquerque to have the Seminar from the 17th and 18th that was 'rescheduled'?


thanks,


Jeff

Stranahan
05-29-2003, 02:23 PM
Not right this second, but I will next week at the latest,...

This new event thing could have (positive) consequences..

ackees
05-29-2003, 05:26 PM
Thanks Stranahan, the new event sounds great. I hope it goes global. One thing though I do believe students should receive a free LW (restrictions of course), this way the user base will expand rapidly with an upgrade to full licence option. An expanding user base will give NT the resources to make those bleeding edge developments everyone wants.

Stranahan
05-29-2003, 06:51 PM
I don't believe in free...not for this kind of application.

It's not just a money / profit issue. People treat free products like they are...well, free. There are plenty of free 3D apps; they haven't set the world on fire. Additionally, I'm not even convinced the 'free' version of 3D software like Maya or XSI work, at all, in terms of generating sales. I have a free XSI disc in my briefcase. Haven't installed it. I paid for Rise of Nations - THAT is installed.

$300 is the price of an Xbox and a couple of games. If someone can't work up that, somehow....well...

ackees
05-30-2003, 04:02 AM
Point taken, student freebees can be unfocused. Perhaps strategic partnerships with educational establishments is the way forward, I do know that if students use a particular product in college they swear by it in the profession. This is an area that the competition is gunning for.

SplineGod
05-30-2003, 04:16 AM
I think the arguement that giving away software to students for free because theyll use it later in life is more likely one of those urban legends. I agree that giving away freebies doesnt lead to sales. Its similar to other myths that discreet secretly encourages people to pirate Max so everyone gets hooked on it. If someone could show me some hard marketing numbers gained through research I might believe it. Too many people subcribe to some arguements simply because they sound like reasonable arguments on the surface. My experience is that people tend to appreciate things that require some form of sacrifice on their part to get it. On the other hand I wouldnt care if Newtek gave away free copies to only people over 65 yrs old if marketing research proved that this somehow would generate hard sales. :)

Hervé
05-30-2003, 07:35 AM
Yesterday, I have found a small gold ring on the floor in the supermarket.... cool. Naa , that ring has no real value for me... I gave it to an old (and poor) lady outside on the parking lot... but I'll never buy a gold ring to give it away...

this is real, no fiction.

ackees
05-30-2003, 07:36 AM
It’s a difficult one this, I can only talk from what I have seen personally. The ‘viral network like’ usage patterns of students are hard to predict, but if there is a package which a lot of students can get hold of then a kind of momentum builds up with that product. Essentially it is the students that recommend a product not college staff, often college staff haven’t got a clue (they bring in specialist after the demand has surfaced). Also many colleges are too cheap, they won’t buy (or at the most one or two). Max has done well in this area - you can tell a college what you want about quality and professionalism, but if the students ask for Max because that’s what they have been exposed to then that’s what they get – same goes for a lot of employers.

3danim8d
06-06-2003, 11:34 AM
Lee,

Have you got any updates about the rescheduled seminar in Albuquerque?


Thanks,


Jeff

pauland
06-06-2003, 12:13 PM
Originally posted by Hervé
Yesterday, I have found a small gold ring on the floor in the supermarket.... cool. Naa , that ring has no real value for me... I gave it to an old (and poor) lady outside on the parking lot... but I'll never buy a gold ring to give it away...

this is real, no fiction.

Well, it sounds like a very caring story, but what about the original owner, you didn't care if they came looking for it? It might have been very important to them.

Paul

Hervé
06-07-2003, 02:31 AM
I know, it's unfair (unjust) but life is unfair (unjust)....

3danim8d
06-09-2003, 04:34 PM
Hi Lee,

Here I go again... Do you have any updated info for the Albuquerque Seminar yet?

Also, I was asked by some folks that were at the last Albuquerque Seminar last December if the DVDs are going to be going out soon?

Thanks,


Jeff

JETKWON
06-13-2003, 07:46 PM
Why is it that every time there is a tour set-up for BOSTON,MA they are always cancelled? There hasent been one tour that I know of, that has happened? Why is that? And I have signed up for several of them hoping maybe this time it may happen. Why is Boston always on the chopping block???



[email protected]
:confused:

Stranahan
06-13-2003, 07:47 PM
We've never cancelled a stop in Boston. I was there 2 months ago, and I was there about 6 months (or less) before that...

We have a stop near Springfield coming up - just 70 minutes or so down the Pike.

JETKWON
06-13-2003, 09:21 PM
I spoke to the "REP" that I thought was in charge of the event several times and all the way up till the 16th she told me that there still wasn't a confermed time or location, and there wasn't any other information at this time.

- the event was for the 16th-17th. I know alot of people had posted they got the same intel, and it had been cancelled. So what you are telling me is that infact this took place in Boston?


JETKWON. :confused:

Stranahan
06-13-2003, 09:41 PM
I don't know what you're talking about. We had training there. Maybe you mean something else. I was in Boston 2 months ago, did the training tour, and so on.

3danim8d
06-17-2003, 12:45 AM
Hi Lee,

Do you have any info on the Albuquerque seminar?


Thanks,



Jeff

JETKWON
06-17-2003, 12:48 PM
you said theres a Springfield tour comming up, do you have any info on it yet, if you do,can you e-mail me, I would like to attend, since I missed the Boston tour.



Thanks, JETKWON :D

B. Schuster
06-17-2003, 03:15 PM
Lee,

What happened to the Salt Lake City, Utah training that was to be June 5-6?

I was signed up and clearing my workload for those days and then a week before... It was canceled! :confused:

Brian S.
Action West Video
www.actionwest.com