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View Full Version : Any chance of LW9 having UV Unwrap Tools?



spec24
10-27-2005, 09:18 AM
[ Edited by the moderators to remove links to competing product sites. Title edited to clarify topic. ]

The UV Unwrap tools showing up now in modo and other applications and as independent utilities such as Unfold 3D look very nice. Any chance that LW9 Modeler has something similar?

spec24
10-27-2005, 08:21 PM
I guess not

Karmacop
10-27-2005, 10:28 PM
Just reference it without posting directly competing products ;)

Fausto
10-27-2005, 11:26 PM
the fascist approach to moderating conversation on this forum borders on the ridiculous. It's a wonder anyone posts anything here. Not mentioning the competition isn't going to make them go away Newtek, grasp some reality here. The question is a legitimate one, is something similar to this functionality going to make it to LW? All that was needed was a yes or no, or perhaps. Better yet, let's pretend for a second that the customer does come first and they aren't treated with disdain and hostility, let's pretend for a second that the approach to take sounds something like this; that's a great idea, thanks for bringing that to the forefront, we'll submit that for consideration to our development team. Again thanks for assisting us in making LW a better product. Please keep bringing us those great ideas!

Thank you,

Newtek customer service.

On a positive note, at least your post wasn't automatically removed like several of mine have been in the past. At least you were given an opportunity to rewrite it so the forum police could unravel their twisted panties.

BazC
10-28-2005, 03:02 AM
My guess is Lightwave will get these kind kind of tools soon though maybe not in LW9. Just about every other app is adding some kind of automatic unwrapping or pelting, LW pretty much has to add it too. Meanwhile you can use Wings or Blender for free, both have pretty good automatic distortion free unwrapping. Both take a bit of work but they do a good job. Silo 2.0 (very cheap!) will also have UV tools which I expect to be excellent. - Baz

spec24
10-28-2005, 07:02 AM
Jeez - I didn't even realize my link was ripped out. Well - it's Newtek's forums and they can do as they please. I certainly wasn't trying to promote another software package. I thought it was easier to post the link than to go into a long dissertation about the process. To me it shows a lack of confidence in LW itself. NT shouldn't be threatened by this type of thing if they believe in LW. It's not like we all don't know competing software exists. Any way - I was not trying to promote a competing product, just being hopeful.

spec24
10-28-2005, 07:06 AM
Well - the thread was edited and the link removed but no answer was given to the quesiton. Do the moderators not know? Does anyone know for sure?

mattclary
10-28-2005, 07:10 AM
I don't think they are threatened, I think they are just trying to have a little consistency in enforcing a long standing policy.

I think we all know what UV unwrapping is and understand LW could use some improvements. Is a link all that important? The message your post conveys is quite clear, even after being edited. I assure you Newtek knows what is available in other products.

A LOT of other companies have a much more draconian approach to forum moderation. They not only delete messages, they ban people who post any critical content.

IMO, Newtek is pretty fair about balancing user freedom with the welfare of the company.

edit:
They are also tight lipped about future developments. ;)

Nemoid
10-28-2005, 07:31 AM
i think Lw developing is at first to address more important things, like better modelling tools, workflow, the new sub ds, open gl enhancements and such. also core and base structure of the app is worked out, while minor things like UV unwrap would come afterwards. i know how important uv unwrap is and how much time people will gain having such a feature. still, it seems minor to me so far.

another thing is that it seems like unfold 3d is way better than tools included into other general apps, so far.

Meaty
10-28-2005, 07:40 AM
the facist approach to moderating conversation on this forum borders on the ridiculous.
Not as rediculous as your hyperbole... you do realize that there are people down there in San Antonio who might be a little offended at your statement that they behave like fascists, commonly equated with Nazi's and Mussolini.

But, back to the topic! I would love this type of tool!!!! I requested something like this quite a while ago... on the old forum! UV mapping, to be quite honest, bites!!! I would much rather be modeling than massaging uv coords to minimize stretching all day. It would be a huge time saver for those of us who do a lot of uv mapping.

http://forums.newtek.com/discus/messages/2/15923.html?

spec24
10-28-2005, 07:53 AM
well, there was nothing critical in my post towards LW.

And Nemoid I don't think that a tool such as this is less important than anything else being addressed in LW. In fact I'd say it was more important. How much time is spent tweaking UV maps? I don't typically pull out my hair when modeling but do when working with UV's. Unfold3D answered a lot of my prayers. Unfortunately it isn't as integrated with LW as I'd like. Hoping that LW will have this ability.

Fausto
10-28-2005, 08:00 AM
Not as rediculous as your hyperbole... you do realize that there are people down there in San Antonio who might be a little offended at your statement that they behave like fascists, commonly equated with Nazi's and Mussolini.



Well firstly I didn't call them fascists, so stress less over it. I said their approach was fascist, or fascist like for the simple minded. If you don't think it's appropriate argue with Webster: Fascism
Oppressive, dictatorial control.

Did I intend for them to be offended, no, I did not, but one can only hope that when one is attempting to stress a point that the impact is forcefully adequate.

I totally agree that individuals shouldn't be insulted or called names or be exposed to offending material, this is after all a public gathering. But censoring the name of competing products out of posts because of some blind, STUPID rule that all names of all competing products can not be mentioned on this forum is ridiculous. And the underlying motivation for doing so is very fascistic like.

spec24
10-28-2005, 08:26 AM
I think we all know what UV unwrapping is and understand LW could use some improvements. Is a link all that important? The message your post conveys is quite clear, even after being edited. I assure you Newtek knows what is available in other products.

Well - we have UV unwrapping in LW now, we just refer to it as UV projecting (i.e. planar, cylindrical, spherical). It "unwraps" but doesn't come anywhere near to producing what we'd like. That's why the link.

hrgiger
10-28-2005, 08:43 AM
Well - it's Newtek's forums and they can do as they please.

That's pretty much the key right there. Fausto, if you wish to use the forums, anyone's forums, you pretty much have to abide by whatever rules they set up ahead of time. Sometimes it sucks, but that's the way it is.
As far as removing links to competing products, I doubt it has much to do with being threatened or keeping people in the dark about what else is out there. I would venture to say it has more to do with the fact that everytime someone mentions another product on the forums, a lot of times, it breaks out into argument about which product is better. It's sometimes easier to just cut if off at the pass.

CB_3D
10-28-2005, 08:50 AM
I suppose the cloth fx technique could be packed into a script.

Chuck
10-28-2005, 09:00 AM
Forum moderation policies are not subject to public discussion, as is posted in the Moderation Notice at the top of each forum:


The NewTek Forums are not a free speech zone, they are for professional and civil discourse regarding NewTek products by NewTek users. Those who are unable to stick to topic or unable to maintain civil conversation with others will have their accounts removed.

Moderation decisions are not subject to public discussion. If you have comments, send an email or private message to the moderators.


>>>> Link to Moderation Notice <<<< (http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?t=9444)

There is plenty of discussion in place that's explicitly comparative of competing products, so asserting that we aren't allowing mention of competitors is simply mistaken. It happens and in the proper context it's allowed, although direct links to competitor sites are generally removed. It's also the case that these days we don't strictly adhere to moving such things to the General Discussion section any more - they are usually far more topical in the feature request forum, which is where this thread will likely be moved to.

This particular instance had some debateable aspects and the moderation team discussed it before finally deciding to edit the message to topic and removing the link and mention of one competing application (that mention has been reinstated in a later edit, and mentions of other products for comparative purposes also have been let stand). Those who disagree are free to private message any of the moderation staff and tell us our behavior is fascist, but no such offensive performance will be repeated in public.

The intent of moderation is certainly not to treat the customers with disdain or hostility, but rather to keep the forums both civil and on topic on the products that NewTek creates. Most company sites fully forbid any mention of other products and any public critical commentary whatsoever. We're freer than most in both regards.

Chuck
10-28-2005, 09:08 AM
The UV Unwrap tools showing up now in other applications and as independent utilities such as Unfold 3D look very nice. Any chance that LW9 Modeler has something similar?

First, just to remind folks, we do have a list of the features planned for v9.0 that's been posted since SIGGRAPH, back in August:

>>>> LightWave v9.0 Preliminary Feature List <<<< (http://www.newtek.com/lightwave/lw9featureprelim.php)

The list is of course subject to change and not exhaustive. A UV Unwrap Tool is not on the preliminary list, but that and other major improvements to UV tools are in consideration for future development. The team is looking closely at how to make LightWave's UV capabilities and workflow among the fastest and most powerful available. Unwrap tools have most certainly been part of the discussion.

krimpr
10-28-2005, 10:13 AM
To me that would be one of the most outstanding new features if it were added. I never could get my head around this UV mapping process and if a new "improved" utility were added to LW it would rank up with the top features. That and, uh, painting ala' Bodypaint. O.K.; now I'm being greedy so I'll shut the **** up.

spec24
10-28-2005, 11:00 AM
here's to hoping we get something like it sometime soon :thumbsup: (and my appologies for the link, wasn't meant to cause a problem)

Chuck
10-28-2005, 12:13 PM
No apologies needed, and we do appreciate that you took some time to let us know of your interest in seeing such a tool added to LightWave 3D! :thumbsup:

lardbros
10-28-2005, 04:13 PM
To be honest... i reckon with LW9 coming out with edge tools etc, someone else will write a pelting UV tool before Newtek provide one. Not knocking Newtek in any way, but it seems to work this way. Maybe when they get past the restructuring of everything, they will get onto Luxology's case and give us some 3d painting features etc. But this will surely only arrive when they go over to Direct3d over opengl? (sorry, kind got off topic)

wacom
10-29-2005, 01:33 AM
To be honest... i reckon with LW9 coming out with edge tools etc, someone else will write a pelting UV tool before Newtek provide one. Not knocking Newtek in any way, but it seems to work this way. Maybe when they get past the restructuring of everything, they will get onto Luxology's case and give us some 3d painting features etc. But this will surely only arrive when they go over to Direct3d over opengl? (sorry, kind got off topic)

Using another brand of 3D pixel maker I've witnessed two FREE plugins come out in just a week. They are getting better and better too. I agree that the edges will help too...

Wouldn't hurt if NT included this in v9 though...

hstewarth
11-02-2005, 01:06 PM
I am curious how this Unwrapping topic is related to the Atlas UV maps in Lightwave. Should the Atlas UV Maps be used or not.

Also I am not sure how this related to, but it would be nice to support the Poser style mapping in Lightwave.

BazC
11-02-2005, 01:48 PM
I am curious how this Unwrapping topic is related to the Atlas UV maps in Lightwave. Should the Atlas UV Maps be used or not.

Also I am not sure how this related to, but it would be nice to support the Poser style mapping in Lightwave.


The kind of unwrapping being discussed here, often called pelting keeps the texture in one piece (presumably unless you manually split it?) Atlas mapping splits the mesh up into many parts so they're not alike at all really.

I'm only guessing here but since much of Poser content has been created in Lightwave (Daz models anyway) chances are it was mapped in Lightwave too!? - Baz

kfinla
11-02-2005, 02:17 PM
A UVunwrap tool like alot of other packages have, or are coming out with would be a great addition to LW9! :agree: . Now just update the ancient OBJ importer/exporter in LW so all the current apps out there can actually see our new "pelted" UV's!

Ramon
12-23-2005, 08:32 PM
Boy oh boy, I agree with the rest of the guys here - whole heartedly. I have been asking Newtek about auto unwrapping for just about a year now. Lightwavers would benefit so greatly by this feature (if it would rival the accuracy of a pelter like Unfold3d).
Think of the massive amount of time saved in this most tedious and least fun aspect of appling textures. It would be huge!
I mean, modo has it, silo at around $100 will have it in it's ver2 scheduled for this spring (and btw, it's a great modeler). Maya and I believe XSI and Max have it.

Personally, I love lightwave's modeler and the "new" (to LW anyway) features coming out in 9 are great(though better interactivity would be very nice, especially with spline modeling - like Hurley's PatchIT plugin which unfortunately has yet to come out and from the looks of it may not ever - Newtek should take it off his hands and implement it into LW) and render quality (and endomorphs) but, I'm not going to wait around until (if) an auto UV unwrapper becomes available in 9.5 /10, if that. Chuck said in his previous post: "A UV Unwrap Tool is not on the preliminary list, but that and other major improvements to UV tools are in consideration for future development. So as I said, maybe, if we are lucky, in 9.5, 10 or beyond. Who knows.
Either way, Newtek is behind the curve on this one. Looks like Silo is going to be a purchase I will make when there 2.0 comes out.