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LeeDavis
08-21-2005, 11:05 PM
My BG: Non-owner yet...just have to figure out how to make it pay for itself.

That particular problem had a solution jump in front of me this weekend, which brought up some questions I'd like to pose to you experienced Tri-Caster users.

My company was doing a wedding. Sadly, the father of the groom is in end stage cancer and couldn't be there. Somebody thought fast and hired a guy with a steerable webcam to burp the feed onto the web via the DSL at the church. This is where it gets sticky. He told me after the service that the picture was fine, but on the other end, no audio (?) due to upload bandwidth. (Sounded fishy, but I confess I don't know what he was using for a file format, etc.)

So, if I had a Tri-Caster, would I have been in the same situation using the church's DSL? Is there a viable solution to this problem using the Tri-Caster? Based on "typical" (yeah, I know...just let that one slide) "typical" DSL, could I expect 15-30 fps? It looked to me like the CCTV guy was probably getting closer to 7 fps.

Secondarily, running 3 cams via firewire...for you who are experienced and knowledgeable, is there a practical max distance for firewire in a situation like this? I know you can insert amps to extend the line, but would 100 feet be reasonable?

Thanks for your input!

LD

Ivan
08-22-2005, 03:40 AM
I guess anything is possible but when I first got VT2 I tried streaming some video and I was able to get 3 or 4 computers to veiw the stream at once from my upload. My DSL was only 256 which is slow for DSL. I think it may have been 192 at the time but they no longer offer that service and I don't recall when they switched. It may have been the codec he was using, it may have been the software, it may have been the connection, computer or software at the other end. Ultimately I guess it would be pick a reason your comfortable with and go with it unless you are determined to find the cause because you will be doing this again in which case you need to dig further. It sounds like the other end may have had dial-up service but that does not explain the audio because that takes almost no bandwidth compared to video.

If he was using a service, it could also have to do with the service he was using. I have IChat and my daughter has AOL IM and we can do live video web chats. Pretty cool but AOL IM is not as good as having IChat on both ends.

I'll leave the firewire question for someone with more experience with that type of configuration.

Ivan

StephenW
08-22-2005, 06:26 AM
Yes, it would be possible to stream to the net including audio directly from the TriCaster. That is a feature of the TriCaster. I have not actually tried it yet and I think you need a third party vendor if you want more than one person to be able to view it at any given time.

The TriCaster inputs are analog (RCA & S Video) not firewire. Utilizing a custom 10 pin cable built by Markertek and some home-made breakout boxes - we carry video, audio, camera power and voice communications over a 167 foot cable (our longest one). It works perfectly.

JumboCast
08-22-2005, 08:29 AM
The TriCaster inputs are analog (RCA & S Video) not firewire.
The TriCaster specifications (at least in the glossy marketing piece I have) say "2 FireWire(R) video inputs". The web specs say "1 Firewire video input".

Paul? Philip?

Steve Clay
(who can't tell you until tomorrow, or maybe Wednesday, when he joins the club!!)

Ivan
08-22-2005, 09:06 AM
StephenW,

Would you mind sharing the vendor name? I have tried the Grizzly system and they are running it over Cat5 but the video quality takes a dive.

Ivan

Paul Lara
08-22-2005, 09:30 AM
The TriCaster specifications say "2 FireWire(R) video inputs". The web specs say "1 Firewire video input".

That is for ingesting video files, not for pulling in live camera streams.

JumboCast
08-22-2005, 09:50 AM
That is for ingesting video files, not for pulling in live camera streams.That's what I kinda thought, but thanks for clarifying, Paul.

StephenW
08-22-2005, 11:23 AM
StephenW,

Would you mind sharing the vendor name? I have tried the Grizzly system and they are running it over Cat5 but the video quality takes a dive.

Ivan


Hi Ivan-

You can order all kinds of cable from Markertek, we have 10 and 14 pin cables (on 14 pin we add camera remote pan/tilt/zoom). The trick is you need to have someone that knows how to put it together with breakout boxes, etc. We had such a person until he moved away. I have just adapted it to our new Tricaster.

We just finished a 4 day event with the TriCaster. We were live for 6 hours each of those days and ran an mpeg-2 file on the overnight. The TriCaster was on the entire time - about 96 hours. Flawless performance on TriCaster's part.

In the next few days I will probably write an article about our experience and some of the technical aspects of it including some photos.

StephenW
08-22-2005, 12:08 PM
[QUOTE=JumboCast]The TriCaster specifications (at least in the glossy marketing piece I have) say "2 FireWire(R) video inputs". The web specs say "1 Firewire video input".

There are in fact 2 firewire ports, a 6 pin on the back and a 4 pin on the front of the TriCaster. As Paul says the ports are for ingesting, not switching.

BTW that is not all bad since all cameras on their digital output have a 4 to 6 frame delay which is most annoying if you can see/hear the live set as well. There is no delay on the analog output.

Tarheel Cougar
08-22-2005, 12:59 PM
StephenW,

Would you mind sharing the vendor name? I have tried the Grizzly system and they are running it over Cat5 but the video quality takes a dive.

Ivan

These reels (http://www.markertek.com/Product.asp?baseItem=RAVR%2D1&cat=CABLESCONN&subcat=VIDEOCAB&prodClass=VSNAKE&mfg=&search=0&off=) work good for us. The don't have power however. We also are re-using some old CCU cables that we owned, and had Markertek build breakout boxes for power, video, genlock, intercom and they aren't bad either, just heavy!

Ivan
08-22-2005, 01:38 PM
Thanks, those look really heavy. I certainly can't lift that kind of weight but I will keep that info.

Ivan

PIZAZZ
08-26-2005, 10:07 AM
These reels (http://www.markertek.com/Product.asp?baseItem=RAVR%2D1&cat=CABLESCONN&subcat=VIDEOCAB&prodClass=VSNAKE&mfg=&search=0&off=) work good for us. The don't have power however. We also are re-using some old CCU cables that we owned, and had Markertek build breakout boxes for power, video, genlock, intercom and they aren't bad either, just heavy!


We built and assembled some very similar cables to those you mentioned. The reels we used stack on top of each other for storage and have wheels to move them around. The Cable snakes we used were 3 coax, 2 audio, 1 clear-com, 1 tally send, and 1 power cable. All of this in one nice easy to roll jacket. Each cable reel had 150' of cable on it and was designed to get the best quality possible from the Sony Z1U cameras the client is using.

This design was for a VT based system but it could work well for a TriCaster system also.

Pic attached could be used for TriCaster Applications:
It has 2 Coax for running either Composite and 1 return video to a confidence monitor or running Y/C with appropriate adapters.
The cable has Audio send and receive and also the ability for a Com line.
The yellow cable is for Power. We have even ran 110volts down the line with NO problems.

kmnetterville
09-07-2005, 04:29 PM
Can't believe you guys are in Beaumont, Texas. I was raised on Suzanne Court. Off Calder I think...down the street from the old Zummo place....went to school with Jolene Zummo and Libby Hobbs!! Use to ride my bike to Fertitta's store all the time. My dads side of the family is all from Beaumont. My grand parents lived at 1075 Goliad! And ran teh old lumber mill that use to be in town. Dad worked for Trotti & Thompson Const Co.

Shopped at "The White House" store in that old strip center by the old circle drive, by I guess Methodist hospital back in the late 60's early 70's. Enough time warping. Don't know if your "Old Beaumont" that all may be way past you. Don't wanna bore you.

I am thinking about purchasing a Tricaster for small local productions. I'l be using Canon XL-1's and 2's. And Sony PD-150/170's.

Any suggestions....all productions will be live to tape/hd. No streaming or feeding to IMAG. 3 cam programs, gardening show, small cooking shows, talking head type local issue programs. Simple interstitials, underwriter type opens and closes. Is the Tricaster what I want?

What have you found to be the best comm system? What about a/v snakes? I will also periodically utilize a Sony betacam, BVV-5/7 config and an HDW-730 downconverted if the need warrants it.

Thanks for any help you can steer my way.

Kyle M. Netterville
BCS-tv & Multimedia

PIZAZZ
09-07-2005, 04:43 PM
Can't believe you guys are in Beaumont, Texas. I was raised on Suzanne Court. Off Calder I think...down the street from the old Zummo place....went to school with Jolene Zummo and Libby Hobbs!! Use to ride my bike to Fertitta's store all the time. My dads side of the family is all from Beaumont. My grand parents lived at 1075 Goliad! And ran teh old lumber mill that use to be in town. Dad worked for Trotti & Thompson Const Co.

Shopped at "The White House" store in that old strip center by the old circle drive, by I guess Methodist hospital back in the late 60's early 70's. Enough time warping. Don't know if your "Old Beaumont" that all may be way past you. Don't wanna bore you.

I am thinking about purchasing a Tricaster for small local productions. I'l be using Canon XL-1's and 2's. And Sony PD-150/170's.

Any suggestions....all productions will be live to tape/hd. No streaming or feeding to IMAG. 3 cam programs, gardening show, small cooking shows, talking head type local issue programs. Simple interstitials, underwriter type opens and closes. Is the Tricaster what I want?

What have you found to be the best comm system? What about a/v snakes? I will also periodically utilize a Sony betacam, BVV-5/7 config and an HDW-730 downconverted if the need warrants it.

Thanks for any help you can steer my way.

Kyle M. Netterville
BCS-tv & Multimedia

Well hello past neighbor... :)

Been here all my life but grew up out in da country. Labelle - Fannett area. This is our 20th year in business. Let me know what I can do help you.


My opinions on your questions are:

Best comm system for the dollar spent and quality given -- Production Intercom - They have several different design options so give me a shout and we can figure out the best fit.

Best cable snake system -- Our custom cables using Canare or Clark cablen with Neutrik connectors. Let me know what kind of configuration you want and it can be built. We use some 150' snakes ourselves along with the appropriate cable reel from Hannay.


TriCaster is a great little unit that will serve you well as long as you never want to switch more than 3 cameras and are happy with y/c or composite quality.

VT4.5 allows you to use component video input if your cameras can output it and you can switch up to 8 component cameras.

There are many more differences but from what you described the TriCaster should be a good choice.

Let me know if you have any other questions either here or on my email at jef at pizazzme dot com