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kml12
07-25-2005, 08:04 PM
From Worley's Site:

www.worley.com

7/27/05 Signs of FPrime 2

SIGGRAPH begins in less than a week. Soon after SIGGRAPH ends, we'll be releasing a free update to FPrime, version 2! We'll post more on this site this week about the new FPrime features, but perhaps the most important is native FPrime support for the entire G2 lighting and shading system. Scenes using G2 will now show all of their effects in FPrime, even in FPrime's interactive render window. This includes over 50 tools, including subsurface scattering, edge texturing, light groups, skin shading, nonlinear reflection, multiple specularities, image post processing, and film grain. All of them show interactively in FPrime 2!

The FPrime update will be free, but of course you'll need G2 to use G2's effects. We're planning a special three day sale for G2 when we launch FPrime, so wait for then if you want to add the power of G2 to your toolbox.

Later this week, we'll show examples of how G2 and FPrime now work seamlessly together, as well as some of FPrime 2's other new features.

harlan
07-25-2005, 09:03 PM
Muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch better news than the lame 8.5 feature set announcement. ;)

Great news for the FPrime & G2 users.

badllarma
07-25-2005, 10:22 PM
The only thing I need from FPrime is it to render Hypervoxels :confused:

riki
07-26-2005, 12:42 AM
The only thing I need from FPrime is it to render Hypervoxels :confused:

How about Volumentric Lights and LW Shaders :)

operation
07-26-2005, 01:10 AM
yes .... Need more improvement and other features than only G2 support ...

"We'll post more on this site this week about the new FPrime features, but perhaps the most important"

Hope to see more at the Siggraph ( own routines to speed-up render, shader support, step render limit in main window, viewport render, color picker, region render, manual refresh, limit region support, volumetric shader, bugs fixes, etc.... ). :help:

Or a Sasquach support ... (would be more interesting for him to support his plugins in a first step) ;)

And a better price ( a bit to high) : for the same price you can get XSI foundations. No offense to you Steeve (I bought Fprime , but the market is competitive), hope to see a good offer or more update during the year(I know you can't add features due to the SDK limitations. (1.0 to 1.5= multi processor support....1 year between 2 updates...).

Cheers !

Operation

3DBob
07-26-2005, 02:56 AM
Here's what I think.

Worley has said that FPrime will not be released until AFTER Siggraph.
LW8.5 is being released AT Siggraph.
G2 is a Shader

Now this could mean FPrime 2 needs LW8.5 to release all its features - but Worley typically does not like to close out part of his market - although he is making it a free update. It could mean that SDK changes in 8.5 enable shaders to work - but the fact that he says NATIVELY suggests he has done a hard-coded link which is really dissapointing. But worley typically holds some features back in his announcements so maybe NT & WL have got shaders up and running.

Let's hope so.

3DBob

ColinCohen
07-26-2005, 05:21 AM
Very nice of him to release v2 as a free upgrade. Never would've expected it.

Who knows, if the G2 sale price is good, . . .

Panikos
07-26-2005, 05:59 AM
The only thing I need from FPrime is it to render Hypervoxels :confused:

Japanese page says it does :D

kml12
07-26-2005, 06:20 AM
Pakinos, are you kidding :eek:

Man I need to learn Japanese now ;)

ufo3d
07-26-2005, 08:03 AM
Here's what I think.
Now this could mean FPrime 2 needs LW8.5 to release all its features
3DBob

Fprime 2 requires LW8.3 (from japanese page)

nthused
07-26-2005, 09:01 AM
All great news but I just need it to work with Win64...

operation
07-26-2005, 09:07 AM
I am sure it will be a shader support (not to much to change in SDK to make shaders working in Fprime) : Visual texture was supported as a procedural shader.

The power of G2+Fprime could be :
use the channel mode (diffuse,specular,etc.. ),G2 post effect (sounds that image filter plugins will be supported ), control over radiosity ( gamma, exposition,etc..), and volumetric ( Viper render support volumetric... Nt gave this option to him in SDK)....


"FPrime update will be free, but of course you'll need G2..." :cool:

For me the real upgrade is not free:it sounds like we need to buy G2 to add new features to Fprime.
I wish to read the features excluding the use of G2 (Fprime 1.5 versus Fprime 2.0).

Cheers !

KillMe
07-26-2005, 10:19 AM
All great news but I just need it to work with Win64...

fprime doesn't work in windows 64???????????? i was jstua bout to install win64 - but if that measn no fprime then i'll jsut wait

Panikos
07-26-2005, 12:01 PM
I doubt about ImageFilter or PixelFilter Support. I wish I am mistaken :tongue:

toby
07-26-2005, 12:45 PM
"Where's Worley? Why nothing new?"

"Here's FPrime 2!!"

..... "Is that all?"

You guys are worse than kids at Christmas!

hrgiger
07-26-2005, 03:58 PM
Japanese page says it does :D

Yes, here is a badly translated excerpt from the Japanese page from babelfish:

In addition, not only increasing power largely by the fact that two products join,
As for FPrime 2. Version Up it does in 0. In other words, it is evolution full load into in addition to.
Among these, everyone it is unable to wait and hyper voxelsupport enters!
As for < here, LW8.3B which release is done becomes necessary in May. >

operation
07-26-2005, 04:31 PM
I doubt about ImageFilter or PixelFilter Support. I wish I am mistaken :tongue:


"image post processing, and film grain. All of them show interactively in FPrime 2!"

that's why I think that 'image post process' may work.... but maybe it's only supported in G2 plugin :thumbsdow

Rich
07-26-2005, 04:47 PM
This is great news. :beerchug: I have'nt used G2 much since I got Fprime. I can't wait to get my hands on this update. I hope Worley is also working on getting Sasquatch to render in Fprime.

IgnusFast
07-26-2005, 05:39 PM
fprime doesn't work in windows 64???????????? i was jstua bout to install win64 - but if that measn no fprime then i'll jsut wait

Nope. Problem with it using the dongle. Man, I hate that word. Dongle. Just sounds like something I shouldn't say with my son around... :)

LightWuv
07-26-2005, 06:03 PM
Here's a quick translation of the Japanese on Worley's site, the text from Monday. It might be wrong in places, and all snide comments in hard brackets are mine. Still, the SDK comment was interesting, and the PS was cute in the original at least. I posted half on cgtalk earlier, but had some more time to type in the rest. I posted on SpinQuad as well.

I wonder if the Japanese and English news are so different because some English speaking customers have been more troublesome, say, when FPrime was released and they were lagging behind in processing orders? Let's keep it nice when we swamp them next week, people!

----
25.07.2005 (Monday)

G2 discount sale and FPrime version update

Thanks for all your email. The discount sale will not be this week.
The reason for that is that this week, starting Saturday evening, Steve Worley is going to be at SIGGRAPH, and while that's going on he says he'd like to concentrate on that.

At the time of FPrime's release, we received strong reactions from many impatient people and fell behind in responding to requests.

This time, if the same thing occurs we fear we won't be able to cope quickly.

Since SIGGRAPH is a very important convention for engineers, Steve Worley's plans are to attend lots of seminars and workshops rather than view exhibitions.

SIGGRAPH comes along once a year, every year, and we apologize for not taking that into account [when they first announced the sale to be this week, I guess].

SIGGRAPH ends August 8th. Until then, please give Steve a breather. The discount sale will begin the week after SIGGRAPH.

You've had many questions about the nature of a possible G2 - FPrime connection. FPrime can now display all of G2's effects. Since FPrime can display all of them, SSS is included.

(Because the programs have not been made into one, they can be used both seperately and together.)

"Unimaginably convenient," the beta-testers loudly proclaim.

Instead of waiting for an opening of the Lightwave SDK the link to G2 was coded in-house.

Furthermore, it's not just that the two programs now work together and have become more powerful as a result, FPrime also receives a 2.0 update. In short, that means lots of other progress has been made too.

Part of that progress is the Hypervoxel support everyone's been waiting for!

For Hypervoxel support you'll need LW8.3

In addition, people have asked about discounts on other products, especially FPrime. Because of the initial discount when FPrime was first released, there will not be another now.

In the same way, if you buy G2 (FPrime), then FPrime (G2) won't be attached. Please buy them seperately.

This time around, only G2 will be discounted.

We plan a three-day only sale. After the sale we will go back to the regular price on G2, so please make sure you take advantage [of these three days of pure bliss].

Thank you all of you for your warm support. All of us at Worley Labs extend our heartfelt gratitude.

(PS) To Japanese attendees at SIGGRAPH, if you happen upon us say hi to make our day.

SW will surely be running around the place like mad, teleporting to seminar rooms (that's what everyone always says), but he says that meeting many Japanese [customers] would be cool. Just yell "Steve!". Worley is actually very difficult to pronounce, and I too still mess it up sometimes...
---

mgreenway
07-26-2005, 06:46 PM
My mother always said "If you can't say something nice, don't say any thing at all. so..
About the Worley crew,
I think they are amazing :thumbsup: Superior surfacing, rendering and work flow, they really do a great job in what is a difficult situation. The only thing they don't do is let us model and animate. (I wonder why?)

About the LW SDK, " "

We all have an opinion.
Mike Greenway

JML
07-26-2005, 08:08 PM
just wondering, why japanese, is the owner of worley japanese ?

it's nice it's a free update again, we will soon see if hypervoxel works, hopefully it will..

riki
07-26-2005, 08:29 PM
Great news, also really glad to hear about the G2 sale.

3DBob
07-27-2005, 04:37 AM
Ok, so it says it can do hypervoxels, fantastic - Now hypervoxel surfaces can have shaders applied to them - so does this mean that it can handle shaders?

3DBob

Lightwolf
07-27-2005, 04:48 AM
Ok, so it says it can do hypervoxels, fantastic - Now hypervoxel surfaces can have shaders applied to them - so does this mean that it can handle shaders?

From what the SDK seems to expose, I assume so. Shaders on HVs that is, not shaders in general though!

Cheers,
Mike

3DBob
07-27-2005, 04:58 AM
So lightwolf is that something to do with the order in which HVs present their output over normal geometry in the SDK?

I bought the original HV as a plugin and whilst 'integrated' now this history may have allowed access where normal geometry does not.

3DBob

Lightwolf
07-27-2005, 06:28 AM
So lightwolf is that something to do with the order in which HVs present their output over normal geometry in the SDK?

No. there are now special hooks to specifically evaluate HVs outside of a rendering context... This does include the shaders within the HV context, but not shaders in general.

Cheers,
Mike
P.S. Even though a similar approach could be used to evaluate shaders, things are a bit more complex there though. On a surface, LW shaders can expect more data.

TSpyrison
07-27-2005, 07:30 AM
Just curious..

Because it seems to good to be true..

I've already got G2 and F-Prime..

Am I going to have to buy a NEW version of G2 or will the new FPrime work with my current version of G2 ?

mav3rick
07-27-2005, 07:52 AM
why do u think we can answer that?
mail steve

operation
07-27-2005, 09:23 AM
of what I have read ....

you can keep your G2 as is .... ( need to update Frpime) I wish to be right. :cool:

Cheers !

Operation
Mourad K.

TSpyrison
07-27-2005, 11:12 AM
I just got a reply to my e-mail..


Hi Tom,

You'll need an updated G2 to work with the new FPrime, but it will be a free update.

-Worley Labs

Exper
07-27-2005, 11:37 AM
This is quite obvoius looking at Worley's words: "Instead of waiting for an opening of the Lightwave SDK the link to G2 was coded in-house."

T-Light
07-27-2005, 12:55 PM
Anyone like to hazard a guess at what may be available in the 8.5 SDK? Worley only states that G2 needs 8.3, there's no mention of what may be available to users of 8.5.

It's a longshot but one can but hope :thumbsup:

TSpyrison
07-27-2005, 03:55 PM
This is quite obvoius looking at Worley's words: "Instead of waiting for an opening of the Lightwave SDK the link to G2 was coded in-house."
Iím not a programmer.
To me, its not THAT obvious.
For all I know there are other ways to do that besides updating G2

Mylenium
07-27-2005, 11:59 PM
P.S. Even though a similar approach could be used to evaluate shaders, things are a bit more complex there though. On a surface, LW shaders can expect more data.

... and I expect it would slow down FPrime quite drastically. Most people around here expect to be able to render their shaders as fast as everything else, which is a naive presumption, I think. Shaders are sometimes complete little rendering algorithms (e.g. OGO Hikari) that don't use LW much at all and I doubt that you could accelerate them in FPrime without knowing their internal structure except for general speed optimisations in the shader handler.

Mylenium

Exper
07-28-2005, 02:24 AM
Iím not a programmer.
To me, its not THAT obvious.
For all I know there are other ways to do that besides updating G2Sorry... my reply was not directly aimed as a rude comment to your one. :o

Note: he stated that he dosn't use LW's SDK, the connection is direct FPrime->G2->FPrime (as far as we can understand) and imply some new code on both sides that provides this ability. ;)

riki
07-28-2005, 02:36 AM
Just as a bit of a whinge, I wish Worely would use audio in his videos, from a usability stand point it would help big time to understand what's going on.

Lightwolf
07-28-2005, 03:18 AM
... I doubt that you could accelerate them in FPrime without knowing their internal structure except for general speed optimisations in the shader handler.

For internals that is quite correct. However, since shaders can also call raytracing functions etc... and these would have to be replaced by FPrime (or whatever), as is the case with the new volumetric hooks, you could expect a slight speed increase. For shaders that make heavy use of such functions (SSS, ambient occlusion come to mind) the speed up could be quite drastic.

Cheers,
Mike

Mylenium
07-28-2005, 04:51 AM
For internals that is quite correct. However, since shaders can also call raytracing functions etc... and these would have to be replaced by FPrime (or whatever), as is the case with the new volumetric hooks, you could expect a slight speed increase. For shaders that make heavy use of such functions (SSS, ambient occlusion come to mind) the speed up could be quite drastic.

Cheers,
Mike

Yeah, I have to presume that would be the case since you definitely have more insights into the matter than I will ever have. I'm not too sure, though, if it really would yield such great efficiency improvement. But hey, we'll see. No need to wind ourselves up over such intricacies.

Mylenium

hrgiger
07-28-2005, 11:29 AM
It's too bad that Hypervoxels won't be visible in preview mode but at least it's a big step in the right direction.

Red_Oddity
08-01-2005, 05:22 AM
Movies look good though on the Worley site...

trang
12-25-2006, 08:29 AM
cant seem to find how g2 and fprime 2.1 work in tandem. worley's g2 tuts are by themselves.

and does g2 support other shaders LW 8.5 supports other than the procedurals fprime2.1 does support?

-EsHrA-
12-25-2006, 02:22 PM
ah exciting news...

***

ahem... not..
this thread is almost 2 years old..

lol

mlon

alvin_cgi
12-26-2006, 02:47 PM
I think Worley already stop developing its tools for LW, but still supporting current tools for customers, which is sad...

tyrot
12-26-2006, 04:25 PM
dear alvin

take a look to Worley's japanese website before you write your posts. I think it is sad.....you didnt ...

(nothing personal..... just it was your unlucky day when we finally read there is an FPRIME 3 due to january...)

best

romrom74
12-26-2006, 04:40 PM
too bad i can't read japenese then...

Lito
12-26-2006, 05:19 PM
OMG I translated that page with one of the translator websites... Why wasn't that posted on the english page I wonder? FPrime 3 after LW 9.2 release. OMG that is huge news :)

toby
12-26-2006, 09:42 PM
Anybody see anything about new features?

alvin_cgi
12-27-2006, 01:02 AM
dear alvin

take a look to Worley's japanese website before you write your posts. I think it is sad.....you didnt ...

(nothing personal..... just it was your unlucky day when we finally read there is an FPRIME 3 due to january...)

best


you are right, I just saw it from CGtalk... well, I dont normally go to Worley's japanese website, do you? I did miss that one, oops!:D

Why wasn't that posted on the english page!!!

hrgiger
12-27-2006, 01:19 AM
Anybody see anything about new features?


Well, I would hope it would be pretty significant since it's a complete point release. Does the page say anything about working with Nodes?

toby
12-27-2006, 02:11 AM
Doesn't sound so good - (? - anyone here read babelfish?)

"You inquire from everyone, it is many, it is one of the sale of LW9,
Concerning NodeEditor texturing system,
Is necessary for FPrime SDK which because of not yet released,
Inside FPrime regrettable, it is ignored."

hrgiger
12-27-2006, 02:15 AM
Hmmm. All I have to say that is if it doesn't yet render node textures, it better be 20X faster then it is now if it's a paid upgrade.

-EsHrA-
12-27-2006, 03:10 AM
whats the link for this japanese worley site?!..

mlon

Extent
12-27-2006, 03:20 AM
Doesn't sound so good - (snip)

Nope, that quote is from the previous news item which was the release when 9 first came out.

The only thing of note I can make out from the babblefish is that it's going to be released right after 9.2 and "For the first time in Worley history, we may charge for this upgrade" or something like that. Or maybe "compensatory rise" means temporary discount for new purchases, but I'm betting more on the former.

cagey5
12-27-2006, 03:54 AM
EsHrA .. It's on Worleys own site
http://www.worley.com/japanese/japanese.html

riki
12-27-2006, 04:03 AM
Hey I'm glad to see they're looking after Japan :)

pooby
12-27-2006, 05:58 AM
Hmmmm... best case scenario-

G2 is integrated into F-prime3- It works with nodes- can playback user-defined rendered animation previews from layout. works with Sasquatch and can render over a network.

More realistic scenario

Its a bit faster

It's good news anyway.
If it's a paid upgrade as HRGIGER implied, its got to have something special in it... Personally, I'd be happiest with network rendering.

cresshead
12-27-2006, 10:05 AM
here's a thought...

lightwave upgrade/bundle pack ends on 31dec for the vizcad offer...
jan..fprime 3...

new bundle??.....could it be fprime 3 with lightwave 9?

now THAT would get my attention esp as my other lghtwave seat is stuck on ha 8.5 currently...

Hmm!

interesting!...of course it's just a 'thought' not a fact!:thumbsup:

hrgiger
12-27-2006, 12:30 PM
Perhaps it previews hypervoxels finally (as opposed to merely rendering them) and it does it super fast...

Sorry, I was daydreaming there...

Chris S. (Fez)
12-27-2006, 02:02 PM
Nice. Networking would be awesome, but I am guessing it is just gonna be node-support, in addition to some dramatic performance boosts. HV and Sasquatch previews would of course be welcome but I doubt it.

Still, a full point release means Worley might surprise us with some totally new toys :).