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Paul_Boland
07-03-2005, 01:29 PM
Hi.

I know that Photo Shop is the standard tool for 2D image manipulation but which is best, Photo Shop or Photo Shop Elements? Is there really much of a difference between the two to justify the price difference?

Dodgy
07-03-2005, 03:08 PM
To be honest, the only features I miss from PS in elements is the pressure sensitivity being applied to the opacity/flow of the brush and layer folders. For some reason they made pressure sensitivity control the size of the brush (which I never use), not the opacity (which I always use). I'm going off El2, I don't know if they've changed this in PS el CS or whatever they're calling it. Layer folders are just nice for organising things.

tischbein3
07-03-2005, 03:10 PM
at first sight everythings there, but they've restricted it quite effective,
There is a comparison pdf on adobes webpage wich you should take a look at.


things I miss in pe2 (there may be others, but these are the main things)

select color range (a better workaround possible)
no amiga iff import / export
(some) restrictions in brush creation
restrictions in layer effects (mostly preset choice based)
no rgb color correction by slider
no color slider picker panel
no batch processing
no masking layer (although there is also a "workaround" wich I don't like)
no color channel layer based editing
no 16 bit and cmyk support (wich I don't really miss)

in pe3 you have 16 bit bit support, and brush preset editing
but they've almost trippled the size of the color picker :mad: wich makes it very unconfortable for me.

I recomend checking the aviable demos. and compare for yourself.

Maybe it is also a good idea to check other programs wich could be used as a complementary side-product.

Paul_Boland
07-03-2005, 07:35 PM
Thanks for the advice. I am currently using Paint Shop Pro 6 and am looking for a tool to replace it. I've been looking at Paint Shop Pro 9 but with PSP now owned by Coral, I'm a bit concerned about its future.

Thats when I started to look at Photoshop. The full version is very expensive but Elements 3 is only Euro99.00 here, quite good. But since I have no experience what so ever with PS, I'm kind of lost of to how it stands up to PSP. I've messed with the demo of PS and liked the interface but where as I know PSP inside and out, I'm totally lost on PS.

Elements 3 is more in my price range, but is it too restrictive to make it a good replacement for PSP?

tischbein3
07-04-2005, 01:07 PM
well its difficult to judge this, because it hugely depends on your own workflow. I do know psp 8 and pse, and use both extensively, but I really cannot tell you wich is supperior.

Both do have advantages / disadvantages on certain aspects and each time I start them I clearly see the design philosophy behind them:

PSE is a down-featured version of a good and well designed professional product for the lower price market.

PSP is a product wich evolved from formerly low featured shareware to a good low price market product.


What features are missing / is implemented better in one of them is really a personal question / usage condition:
PSP has a zillion of file formats wich pse hasn't ?, well not an argument if you does only need the three or four common used.

PSE has a better interface / smoother brush support? well, if you are experienced in using psp this thing won't care you.

and such a list can be really long......

So try the demos and check for yourself.

And to make it more difficult for you:
Its seems possible to you to sidegrade to other corel products, but because I don't know them I cannot judge / give you suggestions to them.

...but there also ..

..... demos. :)


PS: just for my personal interrest: when you made your decission, could you just write a pm for wich, and why ?

droodawg127
07-05-2005, 09:46 AM
Has anyone had any experience using Corel Photopaint vs. Adobe products? It seems to be a pretty good product for a much more reasonable price than photoshop.

Paul_Boland
07-05-2005, 12:05 PM
well its difficult to judge this, because it hugely depends on your own workflow. I do know psp 8 and pse, and use both extensively, but I really cannot tell you wich is supperior.

Both do have advantages / disadvantages on certain aspects and each time I start them I clearly see the design philosophy behind them:

PSE is a down-featured version of a good and well designed professional product for the lower price market.

PSP is a product wich evolved from formerly low featured shareware to a good low price market product.


What features are missing / is implemented better in one of them is really a personal question / usage condition:
PSP has a zillion of file formats wich pse hasn't ?, well not an argument if you does only need the three or four common used.

PSE has a better interface / smoother brush support? well, if you are experienced in using psp this thing won't care you.

and such a list can be really long......

So try the demos and check for yourself.

And to make it more difficult for you:
Its seems possible to you to sidegrade to other corel products, but because I don't know them I cannot judge / give you suggestions to them.

...but there also ..

..... demos. :)


PS: just for my personal interrest: when you made your decission, could you just write a pm for wich, and why ?

Thanks for your input. I'm still tossing between packages. You see, I really liked Paint Shop Pro but shortly after PSP 9 hit the shelves, Jasc was bought by Coral. From past expeiences, software that goes this way usually falls to the wayside so as much as I would like to choose PSP 9, I'm worried it may be an unwise move.

I have no expeience what so ever with Adobe digital imaging tools. I've used the demo version of PhotoShop and I like the interface and the power (it does seem to be more powerful then PSP, but its **** expensive.

That then takes me to PS Elements 3. I really like the Cookie Cutter tool in this package but after reading the differences between it and PS, I've wondering if its too much of a loss of power (tools) to risk investing. Sure, it's only €99 but it's €99 out of my pocket ;) .

I'm currently using PSP 6 and I know my way around it well, but I like the new interfaces and tools that todays digital imaging software has to offer. Once I settle on one, I'll let you know what and why.

Oh, as to what I'll be using it for, I am currently researching what is involved in starting my own printing company. I'm looking at doing invitations (parties, weddings, etc). So far everything seems to a 'Go' :) . What I am looking for is a photo imaging tool that will allow me to jazz up photos, do effects on them, etc. I will also be using the software for my 3D work, texture creation, etc.

Paul_Boland
07-08-2005, 11:58 AM
PS: just for my personal interrest: when you made your decission, could you just write a pm for wich, and why ?

I've made my choice. I went with Adobe Photoshop Elements 3. The main reason was that I got a great deal on it. Adobe Photoshop Elements 3 & Adobe Premiere Elements for €150. It is a big pushing factor in its favour. I'm currently learning the package, it's totally new to me, but I like what I see. It has a lot of power on offer, I particulary like the Cookie Cutter tool. The interface is nice and while a full manual would have been prefered over the getting started guide and in-app help, I have to say I'm pleased overall.

WizCraker
07-08-2005, 12:06 PM
You can use PSE for the simple stuff and once your business gets off the ground a you start pulling in the cash you can upgrade to PSP.

Snosrap
07-09-2005, 09:27 AM
Has anyone had any experience using Corel Photopaint vs. Adobe products? It seems to be a pretty good product for a much more reasonable price than photoshop.


Yes, I use them both at work. I've used Corel Photopaint for the last 7 years, and just in the last 2 years or so started using Photoshop. I prefer Corel Photopaint and if I had to pick between the two (or should I say, buy one with my own money) I'd go with Corel Photopaint. It's kinda like LW, it gets no respect. It's a better value then Adobe Photoshop, it's available on Corel's site as CorelDRAW® Graphics Suite 12 for $399.00 and includes CorelDRAW 12 for illustration and page layout, Corel PHOTO-PAINT® 12 for digital imaging and Corel R.A.V.E.™ 3 for motion graphics creation. The only two complaints I have with Corel Photopaint is---1: Once you save you can't undo past the save point. (No history) and 2: Not as stable as Photoshop. But otherwise a very good application with superior painting and masking tools, and IMO a lot better for creating art from scratch. And also has all, and then some, of the photo retouching capabilities of Photoshop, with tons of effects and a great path tool for making interesting shapes.


Cheers Snos

Jirapong
07-09-2005, 09:53 AM
I used to use Corel Draw and Photopaint before moving to Adobe five years ago. For me, I feel Photoshop is the first software you got to get if you are working in graphic.
It's expensive, but once it's worth money. Five years ago, I compare PS andPSE(version 1) and went for the full feature because of so many reason.
1. CMYK, there is no CMYK in PSE, and I mostly hand sketch and scan and color in PS. Color accuracy at putput is far accurate in CMYK (at that time).
2. NO save selection in Element. ??????? no expaination just the work flow and time saving.
3. I got the deal, 50% off for all software from the computer store in my town.
After getting PS, I upgrade once, $159 to version 7 and still use this version until now. Thinking to go CS2 next year no this year, just to keep my upgrade price valid, because PS7 is enough for me. $300 for full photoshop6 + $159 for upgrade (a year later), I got promotion price for Illustrator 10 at $200 somthing. NOw I'm done with Corel, CorelDraw and Photopaint is just on the shelf not even installed in my machine.

tischbein3
07-14-2005, 10:22 AM
I have to say I'm pleased overall.

nice to hear !



Snosrap and Jirapong, thanks for the insight on corel photopaint

WizCraker
07-14-2005, 11:40 AM
Yes, I use them both at work. I've used Corel Photopaint for the last 7 years, and just in the last 2 years or so started using Photoshop. I prefer Corel Photopaint and if I had to pick between the two (or should I say, buy one with my own money) I'd go with Corel Photopaint. It's kinda like LW, it gets no respect. It's a better value then Adobe Photoshop, it's available on Corel's site as CorelDRAW® Graphics Suite 12 for $399.00 and includes CorelDRAW 12 for illustration and page layout, Corel PHOTO-PAINT® 12 for digital imaging and Corel R.A.V.E.™ 3 for motion graphics creation. The only two complaints I have with Corel Photopaint is---1: Once you save you can't undo past the save point. (No history) and 2: Not as stable as Photoshop. But otherwise a very good application with superior painting and masking tools, and IMO a lot better for creating art from scratch. And also has all, and then some, of the photo retouching capabilities of Photoshop, with tons of effects and a great path tool for making interesting shapes.

Cheers Snos

And usually Corel has a special going where they through in the latest version of knockout for free.

starbase1
07-18-2005, 04:37 AM
Adobe Premiere Elements completely did my head in - use friendly as a cornered rat. :bangwall: And that's after getting an extra book to try and understand it... Shame as the quality of the encoding is notably better.

I too went the elements route on PS, and was very happy. Course they have to remove some features or no-one would buy the full prog, but I think they have done a good shop in where they put the split. :thumbsup:

And as we are all on a finite budget, the great value counts for a lot - you can always spend some of the money you saved on a few plugins!
:dance:

Nick

Paul_Boland
07-18-2005, 12:28 PM
I'm pretty good with Paint Shop Pro, but have to admit I'm lost on Photoshop Elements 3. I've order a book from Amazon about it, one of the Missing Manual books. It got good reviews over all the others. I've been messing around with PSE and really like it. The Cookie Cutter tool is really cool. I also love the way it can automatically correct colours in photos. There was a big event here in Waterford, The Tall Ships Race, and I took some photos both at night and day. The night photos were a bit dark and I loaded them in PSE and clicked the auto correct colours button. I couldn't believe the differnce!!

Haven't gone near Premiere Elements yet. Have to read the manual. But I really like the interface and the fact that it has DVD creation software intergrated is nice.