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zed1000
05-24-2005, 08:41 PM
Hi there ,I'm following digiwonks rigging tutorial and all went well until in layout my right leg bones move both legs ?! :confused: The left leg bones don't move the mesh at all ! :mad: (I have tried weightmaps as well)
I just can't work it out...plz someone help me.

Surrealist.
05-24-2005, 09:26 PM
Not knwoing exactly what your set up is here's an off the top checklist.

In modeler:

Make sure your weightmaps are assigned properly to the right and left sides.

In Layout, make sure your weightmaps are assigned properly to the bones (bones/properties) on the right and left side.

It's not too hard getting these things mixed up.

Check to see if use weightmaps only is checked on all bones too.

Give us some more info on your set up and that'l help with more deatailed sulutions.

EDIT: Also looking at it it might be that the left leg has no map and/or is somehow following the right under an infulence of those bones for any of the above reasons.

While I am at it a quick plug for Tmothy Ablee's Character Animation. His rigging concepts are reliable and tutorials solid.

Worddware publishes it

http://www.wordware.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=wwpub&Product_Code=1556220995

t4d
05-24-2005, 11:22 PM
looks to me tho you have weight maps assigned for the legs in a improper way

Turn ALL the leg weight map OFF and see what happens

it looks like you have the right leg bones with Left leg weight maps

First try the rig with out weight maps and slowly add them as needed.

SplineGod
05-25-2005, 02:40 AM
Its easy sometimes to misassign weight maps. You may have one weight map on both legs or you may have multiple bones assigned to the wrong weight maps.
Typically once I add the bones Ill rest them, set the falloff to ^128 and start testing.

zed1000
05-25-2005, 03:27 PM
Thanks for the replies.
This problem happened before applying weightmaps.The upper body bones work without applying weight maps.The left leg bones don't move the mesh at all.I tried adjusting weightmaps from 16-128 no change.I can't believe how much time I have wasted on this guy just to get a basic rig to pose him! :mad:
This is my 4 th try at rigging him .I feel like a complete moron am I the only one who is having a hard time rigging a character???:( Wheres the instant Biped 4 fingers rig Button?!
I can see the bones I can move/rotate bones but mesh wants nothing to do with the Left leg bones ..the right leg bones are sooo much cooler to hangout with? :o

SplineGod
05-25-2005, 03:39 PM
Are ALL the bones rested and activated?

zed1000
05-25-2005, 03:52 PM
As far as I know yes.I clicked on rest pos and rotation again,now only the left toe moves with the right leg bones but the left leg bones still don't move the mesh.But now his head shape has changed squashed outwards :confused:

SplineGod
05-25-2005, 04:50 PM
Go to your rest pose, select all your bones and hit the r key.
Make sure IK is disabled as well as match goal and any expressions or motion modifiers on any bones.

zed1000
05-25-2005, 05:40 PM
O.K will try that thankyou :)

zed1000
05-25-2005, 09:30 PM
Yet another try.O.k .Now the right doesn't work! arghhhh!
I will have to start from scratch yet again.
Thanks for your help SplineGod .

t4d
05-25-2005, 09:57 PM
man it's something real simple
Send it over to me I'll have a look at it for you
[email protected]

it'll only a afew seconds to find the problem
better then redoing it ;)

zed1000
05-25-2005, 10:11 PM
That would be very good of you! :D
Sending it now.

t4d
05-25-2005, 10:52 PM
I just load up the model into Layout Converted the skelegons
parented the bones and it worked ?

that else did you do beside color the bones ??

Some weights were setup on yours but your right it was working in a odd way

So when i loaded up I didn't touch that panel setting when i setup mine rig ??

Anyway Next thing you need to do is test the rigs I sent you
find the errors around the hips you need more and better placed bones in that area.

the upper body is pretty cool but you have some odd over lapping bone in the antenna

Check out one of my demo rigs see how i do it

http://www.thomas4d.com/Mrgrey_T4DV3.zip
( theres ALOT of different ways people setup they bones, this is just a exsample of what works for me ;)

http://www.thomas4d.com/mrG_Pic.jpg

hope it helps you out
and if you need any else just
email me ;)

zed1000
05-25-2005, 11:02 PM
Holy cow that was fast!!
I followed the digiwonk.com rigging tutorial .The colours was for the schematic view to parent bones etc.I dunno how it worked first go?

zed1000
05-25-2005, 11:03 PM
Holy cow that was fast!!
I followed the digiwonk.com rigging tutorial .The colours was for the schematic view to parent bones etc.I dunno how it worked first go? Was that the Object that worked or my scene file?

t4d
05-25-2005, 11:29 PM
I loaded your Scene file first

got confussed :confused:

cleared scene
load your object converted the bones
reparented the bones
tested
saved the file


i spent more time searching your file for anwsers
then it took me the make a new FK rig :o

zed1000
05-25-2005, 11:33 PM
lol that makes me feel even ...better? :rolleyes:
This is 3rd tutorial on rigging I have tried.....so must be me.

3Daemon
06-02-2005, 08:12 PM
Deform after Bones or last?

chrisnwms
06-09-2005, 02:27 PM
Hi. Sorry I don't have an answer for you rigging problem but I do have a related problem. I've also followed the video tutorial by Digiwonk on rigging a character for IK in Lightwave 3D. I've hit a problem when I use the Record Pivot Points tool to zero out the bone rotations in Layout. When I use the tool everything seems :confused: fine until I save and reload the scene upon which the mesh distorts and looks a total mess. The problem is corrected when I select the Disable Deform option but as soon as I re-enable it the mesh collapses again. This is driving me mad. PLEASE HELP BEFORE I LOSE IT AND START EATING MY HANDS IN FRUSTRATION!!!! :confused:

SplineGod
06-09-2005, 02:36 PM
Select all your bones and hit the r key (rest bones).
BEFORE you do this:
1. Make sure that you have a rest pose to go back to.
2. Temporarily turn off IK, motion modifiers, expressions, match goal, etc.
that might be controlling any bones.

You also dont need to zero out any bone rotations unless you are experiencing gimbal lock or you need to reorient the pitch. I typically use 2D IK instead of 3D IK on any universal joints like the shoulders or hips.
2D IK is when you have IK applied to a single channel.
3D IK is when you have IK applied to 2 or more channels.

2D IK is more stable. So Instead of having IK applied to two channels on a thigh bone I break the hip joint into 2 bones, each bone getting IK in a single channel.
It also has the added benefit of eliminating gimbal lock as well as giving you some additional FK channels to tweak on those bones. :)

chrisnwms
06-09-2005, 03:34 PM
Thanks Larry, I'll give that a try.

Chris

SplineGod
06-09-2005, 04:08 PM
No problem. :) Let us know how it turns out ;)

chrisnwms
06-10-2005, 04:51 AM
Hi Larry. I tried your tip out without zeroing out the bones except for the upper thigh bones as I needed to reorient them, the legs would move off at an angle rather than straight forwards and backwards. I though the problem had been sorted out as the IK chain worked quite nicely. But upon reloading the scene the thight bones had screwed up the lower part of the mesh again. I didn't try splitting the thigh bones, do you think that would solve it?

Regards

Chris :)

SplineGod
06-10-2005, 05:49 PM
Use the bone twist tool to make sure your bones are properly oriented. You can
split the bone or just draw in a new one for the hip (pointing down the z axis) and then reparent the thigh to it. The hip bone would get IK in the bank channel and the thigh would get IK in the pitch channel. :)

Darksuit
06-11-2005, 12:43 PM
Here is yet another rigging tutorial. Found this one via flay. It does have some holes in it, however it also hits on one of the points that Larry points out is to rest the bones.

http://www.puffandlarkin.com/lightwave/tutorials/character_rigging/index.html

chrisnwms
06-12-2005, 05:16 AM
Thanks guys, I'll try that. I've not had a chance to check all of Lightwave 8.3 out yet so I didn't even know about the bone twist tool (funky). I've only recently upgraded.

Regards

Chris :)

Surrealist.
06-15-2005, 03:46 PM
Use the bone twist tool to make sure your bones are properly oriented. You can
split the bone or just draw in a new one for the hip (pointing down the z axis) and then reparent the thigh to it. The hip bone would get IK in the bank channel and the thigh would get IK in the pitch channel. :)


Hey Larry,

Posted this in the bug fix section.

Let me know what you think. To my knowelge there are no expressions or modifiers in this scene:

I think I have it right but I could be wrong, if anyone would, you'd be abe to tell.


Ok Well I don't have time to grab pics on this one and give all of the details but... Bone twist is returning many unpredictable and undesireable results.

1) Load the Girraff scene from content/Scenes/Rigs

2) With the Giraffe object selected click on Bone twist

3) Hit space bar.

Nothing happens.


Good

Now notice what happened.

If you play with enable IK enable deform and truning bones on and off without envoking the bone twist tool you will notice the configuration that Bone Twist defaults to when envoked:

IK Off
Bones On

You notice this by comparing the position of the legs of the Girraffe with the state it invokes under the tool to playing with these settings.

So if you know anything about bones you will know that you don't want to be twisting things around with bones active.

See what happens when you do.

Select bone twist and rotate a bone, hit the space bar.

Enable IK and bones.

Select a single bone, Enable Bone Twist tool for more fun results.

And it won't let you turn off the bones once with the tool is active.

Now this is under Joint Move and Tip Move which are both able to allow you to manipulate the bone and not affect the mesh (Within reason in so far as influednce is concerned). So I assume this in the purpose, though it did not say so in the manual and I have heard of this tool used as a fix for bone rotations and such which is usually due to creating skellegons and having their bank rotations at -/+ 90 rotation creating problems in animation.

The point is as far as I understand this is supposed to fix bone roations at the sub rest level.

I even tried hitting r after the fact, but that is- as one would expect - redundant because that is what this tool is supposed to do.

I also tried this in Bone Edit mode.

One thing I did check is that the bone I twisted did actualy rotate the bone below it. It states in the manual that this is NOT supposed to rotate the child bone.

Of course not. That is the point, right?

If so this tool simply does not work.

Surrealist.
06-15-2005, 04:30 PM
As I had come to understand it.