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The Tin Man
04-06-2005, 03:05 PM
Hi

This subject has probably been discussed to death, although I can't find anything.

However, I am just about to take advantage of the competitive upgrade and wondered if anyone thinks it is worth going for the printed manual option?

I think I have read it is around 1500 pages long, but is it in colour or has anyone just printed it out themselves and actually saved any money, especially if it just black and white?

It is roughly around 50-60 in the UK, so just wanted to know if it is worth the extra outlay, I suppose it depends on how good it is?

Thanks in advance.

-NG-
04-06-2005, 03:12 PM
Hi

This subject has probably been discussed to death, although I can't find anything.

However, I am just about to take advantage of the competitive upgrade and wondered if anyone thinks it is worth going for the printed manual option?

I think I have read it is around 1500 pages long, but is it in colour or has anyone just printed it out themselves and actually saved any money, especially if it just black and white?

It is roughly around 50-60 in the UK, so just wanted to know if it is worth the extra outlay, I suppose it depends on how good it is?

Thanks in advance.

It's not in colored version i geuss, but it's way handy. I have the printed one(B&W) and i find it to be much better then the pdf manual, it's quite big yes but then again alot is explained in it. :)

You could print it out although i geuss that in the end buying the manual would be cheaper then buying a bunch of paper to print it.

Mdust
04-06-2005, 03:20 PM
Personally I think it is nice to have a printed manual.

I tried printing the manual in BW and I can tell it is a hassle. It's massive even printed on both sides. The rements of the attempt is still in my drawer unfinihed. It was burning though way too much laser toner with all of those pictures. The cost of the toners is around $60 US and it would take about one to finish the job by my estimation. So instead I have been using the PDF version.

I have often thought about getting ahold of the printed version.

If I were buying now I'd opt for the printed version. Keep in mind though the PDF adendems with each new update. Those might be worth printing in color and sticking in a folder.

With all of that said I have been getting used to the PDF version as a handy tool on my "desktop" It's easy to search for info - actually a little faster than leafing though pages or an index.

There is also another freeware PDF reader out there that apparently does not steal so many sys rescources. When I find it I'll let you know.

Mdust

WilliamVaughan
04-06-2005, 05:46 PM
My prinnted manual hasn't even made it out of the shrink wrap....help file is the path I take..

T-Light
04-06-2005, 07:48 PM
My prinnted manual hasn't even made it out of the shrink wrap

Ah, send that sucker over here old man, I'll have the shrink wrap off in seconds :D

On a more serious note though, Doesn't the "full box version" with printed manuals also come with a tutorial manual that couldn't be given away in pdf form due to copyright issues with the publishers?

bcicio
04-06-2005, 08:00 PM
I have printed out much of the .pdf manual and I can tell you that the resolution of most of the screen grabs is terrible. You can't even read the settings in the input boxes. I'm really surprised a cg company like Newtek would consider this acceptable. My advice is don't bother printing it -- except maybe for an occasional chapter that you need to read up on while away from the computer.

MiniFireDragon
04-06-2005, 09:11 PM
Proton:

You need a... manual?? Heck, I thought you WERE the manual.

Hehehe.

Does that mean u are shrink wrapped?

Signal to Noise
04-06-2005, 09:15 PM
If you do decide to order the hardcopy manuals then I suggest one of two things:

1. Order a second binder. The manuals come with a single binder but with 1500 pages the manual barely fits.

-or-

2. Use a nifty binding method such as described here (http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?t=25545&page=1&pp=15). Jevin's original pic seems to be MIA but you'll get the idea. This is a good way of protecting your investment.

I rarely refer to the hardcopy but it's still nice to have around, especially if I'm working on my laptop and don't want to cramp desktop space with the on-line reference.

Silkrooster
04-06-2005, 11:20 PM
I heard the later manuals have been rebound, I saw a post someplace and the manual had a glued cover on it.
Silk

Avebeno
04-06-2005, 11:32 PM
Personally, I would hope to be able to buy one at NAB.

Celshader
04-07-2005, 12:02 AM
Most of my printed LightWave manuals take up too much space on my bookshelves. The nicest thing about a PDF file is being able to hit CTRL-F and search for a specific word.

The manual's usually my last resort for learning LightWave, though. If I want to learn something, I'll stubbornly experiment with it, first. If I can't figure it out, I'll ask the nearest LightWaver. Failing that, I'll search the Web and forums. Or I'll wait until the next LightWave User's Group meeting to ask others in the group. If I still haven't found the answer to my question, I meekly crack open the PDF file and search for the answer in there.

I have learned a few things from the manual. I'm just too impatient to sit down and actually use it. :D

BeeVee
04-07-2005, 02:17 AM
Hi,

It's important to note that there are several differences between the US and European manuals:

1. The US manual comes in a binder, the Euro one is printed and perfect bound into a book
2. The US one comes in at 1500 pages roughly, the Euro one is less than 1100, although it contains the same info.
3. The Euro one is written in British English, where possible... :)

B

The Tin Man
04-07-2005, 03:43 AM
Thanks for everyones input.

Certainly differing opinions on this one. I am glad though the European One is a bound manual and not the binder, although I can see the advantage of the binder method for replacing and adding pages.

Still 1100 pages is still a hefty manual, and I suppose which each new update will be more new content to which the pdf manual would have the advantage, would have been nice at the price to have it in colour a well! Somebody also mentioned screenshots and the quality of them, is this in reference to the PDF or printed manual?

Guess I will have to think about whether I am comfortable enough referring to a screen for reading or a printed edition, although saving the money by not buying the printed manual could go towards the next upgrade :)

Thanks

BeeVee
04-07-2005, 04:23 AM
The quality of the screenshots in the European manual is very good. They are a lot clearer that those in the 7 manual and probably exceed the quality of those in the 6 manual - not that you will have seen either! :)

B

lardbros
04-07-2005, 07:29 AM
I got the electronic manual... and when i got my lightwave package i was shocked to find the manual on a CD for me. I expected the electronic version of the manual would have to be downloaded! :D

The piccies in it are clear as day, compared to version 7 they are perfect.

Mdust: i would love to know of that PDF reader that doesn't use so many resources... Adobe Acrobat is unbelievable with the amount it hogs!!

Whit
04-07-2005, 07:38 AM
There is (at least there was) a print resolution version of the manual available on CD ($29.95). I called and ordered a copy.

See the discussion at:

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?t=28213&highlight=High+quality+manual

I get a lot of software that has a PDF version of the manual. I like a printed manual, so I print them out and take them to Kinko's for binding. I like their Velo binding, but they also do coil binding, comb binding, etc. Depending on the thickness of the manual, some options work better than others. It helps to divide the manual into more than one part to be bound.

--Whit

BeeVee
04-07-2005, 07:54 AM
Just to avoid confusion, that is for the US version of the manual. The European version of LightWave 3D 8 comes with a print-resolution PDF included.

B

Chuck
04-07-2005, 08:35 AM
I have printed out much of the .pdf manual and I can tell you that the resolution of most of the screen grabs is terrible. You can't even read the settings in the input boxes. I'm really surprised a cg company like Newtek would consider this acceptable. My advice is don't bother printing it -- except maybe for an occasional chapter that you need to read up on while away from the computer.

Sounds like you've been printing the lo-res PDF, which is the version available by download. The currently shipping Program CD contains both the lo-res (best for using while you are running LightWave and need ready-reference) and a print-res PDF. If your program CD does not contain these files, then you can order a new one from NewTek sales.

lardbros
04-07-2005, 09:42 AM
Cool, cheers Beevee! I was just thinking, "if this PDF isn't okay for print, then how bloody big would the file have to be???" Glad you cleared that up. Hmmm, maybe i'll get mine printed out?

BeeVee
04-07-2005, 09:45 AM
Personally I either use the online help, which is superb, or the printed manual, for looking stuff up since the PDF is somewhat large to have running in addition to all the other stuff my computer has to do...

B

Chuck
04-07-2005, 11:48 AM
Just to avoid confusion, that is for the US version of the manual. The European version of LightWave 3D 8 comes with a print-resolution PDF included.

B

Actually the US version does as well, as I described above. However, that commenced when LightWave [8] officially shipped last June; the folks who received the Electronic Update version based on an eligible purchase in advance of the official June shipment would have Program Disks without the PDFs. If they want to replace those with the new Program Disk, they may do so at $29.95. It's the new Program Disk we are offering, not simply a print-res PDF on CD.

Paul_Boland
04-07-2005, 12:22 PM
The printed manual is a must have. You can take it to bed, put notes into it, keep it beside you when you are working/learning Lightwave. The European manual is a book (I was hoping to get the folder, but I'm happy anyway). It is jam packed with stuff and will definately get you up and running.

Anyway, it is safer to hold this book in bed then trying to balance a 21inch monitor!! LOL!!

Mr_Bester
04-07-2005, 01:26 PM
Actually the US version does as well, as I described above. However, that commenced when LightWave [8] officially shipped last June; the folks who received the Electronic Update version based on an eligible purchase in advance of the official June shipment would have Program Disks without the PDFs. If they want to replace those with the new Program Disk, they may do so at $29.95. It's the new Program Disk we are offering, not simply a print-res PDF on CD.
Does that disk also include an e version of the Quick start guide? Or is that only in printed form?
Thanks
Dug

Chuck
04-07-2005, 04:38 PM
Does that disk also include an e version of the Quick start guide? Or is that only in printed form?
Thanks
Dug

The Quick Start guide is only available in hardcopy; you can purchase an extended version from Wordware - "LightWave [8] Essentials".

Mr_Bester
04-07-2005, 09:28 PM
Thanks, I already have that book on order. :)