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WilliamVaughan
04-15-2003, 09:52 AM
Calling all LW users:

This is a great opportunity and it seems not alot of 3D art is being submitted.....I think it would be very cool if we could get alot of LW art in this book......so what are you waiting for?


http://www.cgtalk.com/expose/

CAClark
04-15-2003, 10:35 AM
Shame, they are just a bit too character orientated (and LEET! ;) ) for my skills! :o

Cheers

Craig

WilliamVaughan
04-15-2003, 10:52 AM
post your work and let them be the judge!

Lewis
04-15-2003, 10:39 PM
Yeh it looks cool and i would like to send image or two but i have one problem with rules :).

It says :

"- Image dimensions should be: 2657 wide and/or 3636 high
- You do not need to force your image to the aspect ratio of 2657 x 3636. However your image should be at least 2657 wide and/or 3636 high."

And since i'am using LW's radiosity i would need to wait next gen of LWs radioisty 'coz with this speed i could endup rendering one image for weeks at that resolution 6*18 rays (lowes what could look good at this resolution with shading noise reduction).

C'mon NewTek give us radiosity boost by 1000 % at least :)

any LW entryes so far Proton ? I see you are on jury list also :).

WilliamVaughan
04-16-2003, 08:59 AM
Joe Zeff creates super Hi Rez images every week for Time Magazine without a problem :)

Lewis
04-16-2003, 10:08 AM
Originally posted by proton
Joe Zeff creates super Hi Rez images every week for Time Magazine without a problem :)

Yes but IIRC from looking oh his pictures (wich are great BTW) Joe Zeff don't render shiny and fully reflective cars in his images :). If you don't belive me try to set GLAS and metal surfaces with radiosity :).

OK here is an idea. Use LW's raytrace benchmark scene (that's easy ;)) and turn on radiosty + boost up resolution to3600*2600 and set 6*18 rays.

OK i expect to hear you after 5 days that you got half of image rendered ;) ;) ;).

Glass, metal with raytrace reflection, refraction and transparency are killer for rendering times in LW.

Bytehawk
04-16-2003, 10:36 AM
you could bake in the radiousity at a lower setting
(even smooth out the maps in photoshop if you like)
the render super fast at a higher rez.

I 'm sure noone would notice the difference a lot

Lewis
04-16-2003, 11:01 AM
Originally posted by Bytehawk
you could bake in the radiousity at a lower setting
(even smooth out the maps in photoshop if you like)
the render super fast at a higher rez.

I 'm sure noone would notice the difference a lot

Baking won't work if you use incience angle gradient on reflective channel wich is standard car for geting good car paint :). At least that's what says in manuals :(.

It's one thing to spak about that in technical terms but other thing to acctualy TRY that :) Sorry to say but that's not working either :(. Plain and simple it's slow and needs' time :(. No doubt that results are great but is't a FACT that needs very big performance boost.

I used all tricks what i could (smaller rays + shading noise reduction, ehnaced medium AA, lower ray recursion limit .... and that helps to save 30% of enormus rendring time but it's STILL to slow. For instance 1600*1200 image of my maserati was renderd on older machine (celerom 1GHz clocket to 1.3GHz with 512 MB ram) wiht these settings :

Ray recursion limit 6, raytrace transp, reflection, refraction, 4*12 rays, shading noise reduction, and one image was rendered for 26 hours :). Now i have faster machine (3-3,5 times faster in testing - p4 2.53 GHz) but that's also not too fast 'coz resolution is quite BIG. And to avoid aliasing you need 9 pases of enhanced medium AA (if not even high AA at that resolution :))

So i belive that it's too long to wait untill we get 10GHz CPUs :).

trentonia
04-16-2003, 02:24 PM
Well, you could go to Flay, download the plugin that will split your image into multiple pieces, and go to http://www.respower.com . You don't need a 10GHz cpu because using ResPower is like getting a 500+GHz machine. WWWeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

mattclary
04-16-2003, 02:46 PM
Or, here's a thought, get off the internet and start rendering NOW . ;)

cavalos
04-16-2003, 05:36 PM
Letīs face it, LW is too slow for that kind of work...Lewis has the problem and I have it all the time too. So we need better algothithms/code inside LW rendering engine.

Imaine what happen if Lewis want to make a movie of one of his cars at high resolution, NO WAY!

I have tested Brazil and Final render in GI and let me tell you something, we are a world behind :( (sadly)

Lewis
04-16-2003, 09:14 PM
trentonia - it's nto problem in memory for rendering (you always can set smaller segment and it will be ok) nor is the problem in computer being used too long. I have divide scene plugin wich works fine but since i have rendering machine separate from e-mail computer i have no problem to left computer work for many hours but MAN let's be real who want to wait 50 or more hours for ONE image at 2.53GHz CPU ????

mattclary - yeh i'am rendering now on my render machine , this one is just for typing and surfing :).

cavlaos , you get my point right :). It's not problem on smaller resolutions 'coz you can "cheat" with few tricks but on so BIG resolution where every single detial is visible there is no room for low rays quality or shading noise reduction and similar stuff what works on everyday monitor screens :).

so i also belive that readiosty needs BIG boost in speed.

cgolchert
04-16-2003, 10:43 PM
Originally posted by Lewis
Baking won't work if you use incience angle gradient on reflective channel wich is standard car for geting good car paint :). At least that's what says in manuals :(.


Reflection channels has nothing to do with radiosity. If you are using a gradient in the diffuse channel, that is something different.

Radiosity should be taking the longest...you could even run a single radiosity pass and composite it in a 2d comp or bake off layers and rebuild them in the texture editor.

Lewis
04-17-2003, 11:06 AM
Originally posted by cgolchert
Reflection channels has nothing to do with radiosity. If you are using a gradient in the diffuse channel, that is something different.

Radiosity should be taking the longest...you could even run a single radiosity pass and composite it in a 2d comp or bake off layers and rebuild them in the texture editor.

I set incidence angle gradients on Reflection channel to get real fresnel effect (difierent reflection angles) what every car paint includes (trust me i know much about cars and car paints it's my everyday life ;)). Also few other channels have gradients (sometime difuse and sometime even color channel). So baking that is out of picture . Try for yourself and see.

Also if all that' can be baked that still doesn't proves that LW radiosity is FAST. It's pretty slow (results are very good) and nobody can covnince me in other 'coz i'am using it on daily basis :).

So read my point carefuly - LW radiosity is too slow for print resolutions , period !

I thing that this dicscusion needs to be moved to other place 'coz its' out of control :).

Lightwolf
04-17-2003, 11:15 AM
Originally posted by cavalos
Letīs face it, LW is too slow for that kind of work...Lewis has the problem and I have it all the time too. So we need better algothithms/code inside LW rendering engine.
Oh yes, please, and give me distributed single frame rendering like Finalrender does, even for previews :-))

Rei
04-17-2003, 12:58 PM
Is there any limit on how mentaly ****ed up pictures are allowed to be. If so i will never be able to enter anything.

get back on topic

Rei

Lamont
04-19-2003, 10:49 PM
Sounds nice...

dzogchen
04-21-2003, 10:32 AM
You don't have to send in pics that high if you can't render it. 2000+ by 3000+ is only a guideline for a full page printout in case they really like your pics. Submit the pic as large as you possibly can render. I will be happy if they print my pic one quarter of a page :D