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View Full Version : Bug: Modeler 8.2 with dual monitor



Zarathustra
01-21-2005, 08:27 AM
Ok, so I have 2 monitors.
I stretch Modeler across both monitors.
To the right of the main Modeler window, I have the Layers panel.
To the left, I have the Statistics panel and underneath, the Numeric Panel.

Now everytime I open Modeler 8.2, the main Modeler window is resized and placed solely on the left monitor. The other 3 panels stay where they're supposed to be.

This is how it should look....
http://magicanimation.com/Modeler.jpg

And how it opens now EVERY time...
http://magicanimation.com/ModelerWrong.jpg

Any PC dual monitor people out there? If so, can you verify?

Lito
01-21-2005, 10:34 AM
I am not sure how it is suppose to work on a MAC but on the PC with an nvidia card that is how it is suppose to work when running in "Dual View mode". If you wanted modeler streched over both monitors I can do that but I need to use "Horizontal Span" mode.

nemac4
01-21-2005, 10:37 AM
I'm on a PC with an nividia geforce card and it works fine here on dual 19"s

umstitch
01-21-2005, 12:52 PM
using dual crts on a geforce 6800gt

xp3200

works fine here

if you ve got a recent nvidia card make sure you have desktop management enabled so that you get the single display maximize icon on your windows title bars, without doing this i find that modeler and layout can revert to various default window sizes/locations, when using spanning across both monitors.

Zarathustra
01-21-2005, 02:11 PM
Sorry, I'm not sure what you fellas are refering to. There's no nvidia window, that I know of, that i can open and change any settings.
The driver, also, comes from Apple or more specificaly, is in each OS update.

I don't understand how this is an nvidia issue because it wasn't true before 8.2, in 8.0 or in 7.5.

Lito
01-21-2005, 03:22 PM
Is your Mac running a nvidia card? If so then you might want to see if you can access the driver options. I can try to explain how it works on the PC but I have no idea how this relates to the Mac.

Nvidia (at least on Windows machines) have a nview utility. It is basically a configuration utility and it supports various types of dual monitor settings. The one I use is called Dual View. It looks kind of similar to what your running on your Mac. It basically has one "main" monitor that has the windows task and menu bar while the other one is basically empty but I can place other windows there. The other mode is called Span mode. In Span mode the windows task/menu bar will go all the way across both monitors. In this mode both monitors are basically part of one huge desktop unlike Dual view where there is clearly a distinction between the 2 monitors.

I haven't used a mac since college quite a while ago so I really don't know anything about OSX etc... but at least on windows, the driver issue has something to do with the way dual view handles the desktop. So if I open a window that goes across both monitors LW will remember the size, but when I restart, when lightwave asks windows what the size of the desktop is it will return back the size of my primary monitor not the size of both monitors desktops combined. So when lightwave draws the application interface it will limit the size of the application to the size of the primary desktop. In span mode the size of the desktop is equivalent to the total size of both monitors so LW will open the application to the size it was when it was spanning both monitors.

If I were to guess, I bet in pre Lightwave 8.2 for the Mac, Newtek was not checking the desktop size with the OS before starting up and now they are so technically they are doing it correctly now and weren't then. Assuming you have the various options for your display driver like dual view and spanned view, dual view won't work the way it use to, you need to go to a spanned view like setting for it to correctly redraw it on your screen the way you liked it before.

Hope that helps.

Zarathustra
01-21-2005, 03:30 PM
Yes, nvidia card. 6800 Ultra

The driver updates come from Apple via their OS updates. I don't believe I have any utility app for the card and there's nothing in the OS's Preferences.

Thing is, this didn't happen with 8.0.1, 8.0 and still doesn't with 7.5 on this machine so that's why I didn't think it was a card issue.

Bigboy
01-22-2005, 09:32 AM
You have to use the NView thing. Normal windows treats them as 2 seprate graphics cards and hence to seprate desktops. This means things (like requesters etc.) wont span.

NView lets you decide how it appears. You can select (somewhere) to have 1 large desktop, this means your app (and requesters) would span monitors.


I dont like this setting I must say, I hate having requesters and windows sitting on both monitors, but a friend loved this and uses it all the time.

Zarathustra
01-22-2005, 09:58 AM
Bigboy, when you say "windows" are you refering to Windows, as in PC?

I'm on a Mac, and I don't have any NView app.

mattclary
01-22-2005, 11:37 AM
I don't believe I have any utility app for the card and there's nothing in the OS's Preferences.

Ahhh, lack of user configurability... That's a downside of Macs. ;)

Zarathustra
01-22-2005, 11:50 AM
The joy of Apple's OS is that you don't have to have individual apps for every piece of hardware attached and of course, no worries of this driver fights with this other driver, etc.

Rather then having an nvidia panel, there is the display panel where each display has options for resolution, desktop image, where to put the toolbar, which is primary, etc.
If NView is a MS OS app, then it's comparable to this.

btw Matt, according to this thread (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=204012) at CGTalk, my issue was verified as a bug on another Mac as well as PC.
You can have your fun jabbing at Mac, but the bottomline is this is another obvious thing that slipped by in beta-testing and is another annoyance of this 8.2 update.

Nice try to distract the thread into a poop-on-Mac fight, you little LW loyalist you. You've earned an extra hotdog at Chuck's next BBQ.

nemac4
01-23-2005, 02:04 AM
You are being a bit rude. I undertand that you are upset but your response is over the top. If you truly need held you should post the specs of your Mac and post in the Mac forum.

Dodgy
01-23-2005, 06:58 AM
Most of the problems I've had with dual monitor setups have come from the drivers, not the apps, a lot of the time I've turned off desktop management to get Nview to do what I want. I haven't tried this, as I am loathe to touch the settings now I have ones I'm satisfied with because of this problem, but on the PC you can have One spanned desktop and Dual view, which is one desktop built from two, a kind of odd setup, but the only one which really gives me what I want. it could be those people are using their cards in dual view mode which won't allow window spanning, not horizontal span, which might give them this spreadability.

So, given this, it might be a driver issue, if you don't have the option to change between dual view and single spanning desktops.

Zarathustra
01-23-2005, 07:08 AM
nemac4: I'm rude? I post to see if this is in fact a bug and whether it crosses platform lines and I get a cheap shot at Mac. If you read more then just that post or the post at CGTalk you'd see that this was not intended to be a Mac only question.
The responses I got at CGTalk were both helpful and professional, which I had hoped would be the same here.

Dodgy: I just don't see why changing the settings for the card in the system would change anything. As I've said, it works fine running 7.5 and it worked fine in 8 and 8.0.1, so how could it be a system problem? If it were some control panel option, then why does it work fine in 7.5 still? Why does it work fine currently in other apps where I'm dragging across both monitors?

Dodgy
01-23-2005, 07:49 AM
Well it works okay when I switch to on desktop spanning mode. So where does that leave us? It remembers the windows positions and everything.... But I have to turn NView display management off... As I said, I only get problems with Nview display management. This is all on a pc with a 5600 geforce card...

Zarathustra
01-23-2005, 08:48 AM
Ok, well, do you still have an older version of LW on your system?
Can you test if the older version is dependent upon the NView settings?

We can at least narrow down if...
1) This is unique to 8.2
2) If so, then you have a PC workaround
3) Whether this is only a bug that you can't workaround on only Mac

It's these kind of things that will help the programmers isolate and eliminate bugs.
It's also this kind of commitment by users that will go a lot farther to helping LW then wasting time cheerleading and suppressing what some feel is dissention.
The latter shows that there are users out there with time on their hands, so why not put it to better use?

To everyone who professes love and loyalty to this app, I think it's the least you can do to properly invest your time in testing this update out and reporting your findings for both the other users as well as the development team.
What I described for this Modeler window thing takes less time then getting a tattoo;)

Chuck
01-23-2005, 09:14 AM
The place for this and other support related threads is in the support forums, so the thread has been moved.

I'm querying the development team regarding this issue, but I would suggest that the current behavior was related to fixing user complaints that certain windows and panels popped up split across the monitors on dual monitor systems and that this behavior was not desirable. Changes were made with a number of panels so that they now remember last placement (they did not do so before) and pop up there; it looks like the dev team also needs to account for situations where a user wants a window to split across displays.

Chuck
01-23-2005, 11:19 AM
Nice try to distract the thread into a poop-on-Mac fight, you little LW loyalist you. You've earned an extra hotdog at Chuck's next BBQ.

That's enough. You're done here. You just can't keep from making it personal.

acocq
02-25-2005, 04:37 PM
Hi,

did a search on Dual Monitor, to see if I could find anything on this ... no success, so here's my issue:

Setup: Dual Monitor (Nvidia GeForce) NOT SPAN MODE, Win XP Home, 768 MB RAM, LW 8.2

1. I like the fact that LWM now remembers that I put some of my windows on the second monitor (thanks Newtek !).

2. when I have LW open (scene loaded) and then move it to the second monitor, the scene is no longer displayed. All pop-up windows & menus work fine, but it just doesn't display the scene. When I move it back, the scene "reappears".

Since I haven't found any reference to this problem, I am guessing that I'm doing something wrong. HELP :o

Thanks in advance,
Andreas

BeeVee
02-26-2005, 02:08 AM
You don't tell us what sort of NVidia graphics card you have, so perhaps you don't have enough memory on the card for two OpenGL displays?

B

acocq
02-26-2005, 04:49 AM
Oops .. mea culpa

I have a Ti4200 with 128 MB RAM on it.

One thing I noticed is that if I move LW to the second monitor and then exit LW from there, on the next start LW shows up on the second monitor (which is expected and good).

I changed my NView setup from "dual display" to a horizontal (s)pan mode. This eliviated most of the issues I have seen with using two monitors. The only issue that remains is that when I have Layout open on the second monitor the menus (e.g. "Edit") show up smack in the middle of the monitor instead of where they normally are. Any ideas on how to fix that ?
Weird.

Cheers,
Andreas

acocq
03-13-2005, 03:39 PM
Well, I verified that I had the latest NVidia drivers installed ...

If it wasn't so annoying, it would be funny. :rolleyes:

Once the menu shows up in the middle of the screen, any submenus appear closer to the menu-button area (where they should be). This leads to a lot of exercise for my mouse ... it does improve my "mouse-aim" quite nicely, but that's not really why I wanted to have LW work with two monitors.

Has ANYONE seen anything even remotely similar ?

Any help would be genuinely appreciated.

Cheers,
Andreas

ercaxus
03-13-2005, 09:48 PM
acocq:
i had all of those problems before. it might sound silly but try using microsoft's drivers from windows. when i did so it started working for me but then after some time it stop doing so for no apparent reason.

right now i'm using the latest nvidia drivers and everything works (almost) fine.

btw turn that nv desktop management thing off.

Dodgy
03-14-2005, 03:20 AM
Yup, with my experience, NV desktop management is more trouble than it's worth.

You might want to try monitor spanning (one desktop across two monitors) rather than dual view (two linked desktops on two monitors) if you haven't already.

acocq
03-14-2005, 05:50 AM
Yup, with my experience, NV desktop management is more trouble than it's worth.

You might want to try monitor spanning (one desktop across two monitors) rather than dual view (two linked desktops on two monitors) if you haven't already.

Hi,
thanks for the response ...

BTW, I am using monitor spanning. This at least allowed me to see Layout scenes on both monitors. Now the ONLY problem (with the display) is that LW8 menus pop up in the middle of my (second) monitor - when I have the app on my second monitor. Everything works fine on the first monitor.

I'll give it a try without NV desktop mgmt (once I figure out how to turn it off ! :rolleyes: )...

Cheers,
Andreas

Lottmedia
03-14-2005, 03:01 PM
Just checking nd Nvidia has new drivers with fixes to multi-monitor support released friday, maby this'll help people, maby not, personally I haven't experienced any problems.

Hope this hepls someone


J-Rod

acocq
03-16-2005, 01:54 AM
Just checking nd Nvidia has new drivers with fixes to multi-monitor support released friday, maby this'll help people, maby not, personally I haven't experienced any problems.

Hope this hepls someone


J-Rod

J-Rod,
thanks for the tip ... I downloaded & installed the drivers ... and lo' and behold ... everything works the way I expected it (and had hoped for). :)

Cheers,
Andreas