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View Full Version : Give it up for Chuck and crew!!!!



PeteS
01-18-2005, 08:49 PM
i know things are still works in progress, but hey, we all ***** when things are fubar'd, sooo...it's only fair to tip our hats when you guys stepped up to the plate!!

well done guys. much appriciated. you guys did a super job on the updates and it give me that much more confidence in investing in newtek and thier 3rd party plugins!


THANKS AGAIN for your hard work, and for listening to us MAC guys

Ryhnio
01-18-2005, 08:53 PM
I second that!


-Ryhnio

firstsingle
01-18-2005, 10:05 PM
I 3rd that.

Boy, This is a pretty stable release. Very happy and grateful for these updates.

MacDoggie
01-20-2005, 09:24 AM
Same here, Well done Chuck and the Newtek Crew

Zarathustra
01-20-2005, 10:12 AM
geez, what an embarrassing display of sychophancy. Have you fellas read about the bonesplit and bonefuse bugs?
Have you read over any of the discussions about the new renderer?

You know how many people are taking 8.0 plugs and using them to replace 8.2 plugs because of instability or just broken usability?

I haven't heard any peeps about the new UVs, so I'm still holding out that that's at least one major plus of this release but overall, 8.2 is pretty underwhelming.

monovich
01-20-2005, 10:18 AM
there's that good ol' fashioned squeaky wheel!

haven't used it yet myself. But I DO appreciate their efforts and responsiveness.

-s

hunter
01-20-2005, 03:26 PM
I appreciate the efforts too, but if ain't broke... well it is now.

Zarathustra
01-20-2005, 03:43 PM
Doh!










The message you have entered is too short. Please lengthen your message to at least 10 characters.

PeteS
01-20-2005, 09:20 PM
hmmm....let me see. i got bone twist working, which was a major need of mine. i have subpatched uv's plus other great uv options. plus a slew of other bug fixes and some extras. but i need to drop in one pluging from my old 8.0 cd.
from what i see, we only went forward. maybe not as much as you wanted, but we went forward. havn't tried the render, but i didn't even know we were getting one! plus it was free!!! nothing lost here.


i'm stickin' with my big thanks comment to newtek. :rolleyes:

Matt
01-21-2005, 12:34 AM
The gang did good! :) Keep it coming! :)

Darth Mole
01-21-2005, 01:33 AM
What new renderer? You mean the new antialiasing functions? Aren't these just on top of the old renderer?

Beaker
01-21-2005, 04:15 AM
I don't understand something.

When someone is unhappy with something in LightWave, they're just being honest with NewTek and trying to help the program and company by saying it, no matter how offensive a manner they say it in.

When someone is happy with something in LightWave, they're mindless sycophants and fanboys to be immediately dismissed and condescended to.

How does this make sense?

colkai
01-21-2005, 05:43 AM
I don't understand something.

When someone is unhappy with something in LightWave, they're just being honest with NewTek and trying to help the program and company by saying it, no matter how offensive a manner they say it in.

With all due respect, and suffering from being a fanboy as I do ;)

Certain people see mto think offensiveness and insults are level-headed objective statements. stating problems and reporting them, asking for requests, well and good, but constant slagging off for the massaing of ones ego is quite another.
Hey lookit me - I'm an angry young man - well whoop de doo!

Darth Mole
01-21-2005, 07:36 AM
I thnk the major difference here is that we've PAID for the luxury of using LightWave. When I laid down my original investment (plus numerous costly upgrades), I'm paying for an application that - I hope - does what it says on the box. And when it doesn't (and it often doesn't), I'm being jipped. NewTek is actually taking my money under false pretences.

If it was a car, and it didn't work properly, I'd expect the garage that sold it to me to sort out the problems quickly and free of charge. NewTek are doing this but slowly, and I'm having to pay for it - or at least fund part of it - by which I mean I paid for the upgrade to 8.0, and all I got was some third-party plug-ins, a few new bugs and an interface I don't really like (not strictly accurate, but that's how it felt to me. I suspect NT needed cashflow at the time and 8.0 was far enough finished for them to ship.)

Remember: we, the customer, is always right. It is NewTek's duty to honour their part of the deal by making LightWave as stable and as usable as possible, because that's what we're paying for. I didn't ask for the new antialiasing options; I do ask for stability and for existing features – the features in LW8.0 that I PAID for - to work.

I will join in the celebration when Lightwave is rock solid. Other 3D developers do it (Alias, Maxxon, Luxology - ironcally, since the team there was mostly responsible for the clusterf*ck that was LW 6.0), I don't see why it's too much to ask of NewTek.

kfinla
01-21-2005, 07:57 AM
all i can say is im glad im still on 8.0.1. I've held off upgrading to 8.2. even though ive wanted the new UV tools since version 6 cuz, im in the middle of a production and didnt wanna risk somthin breaking the pipeline.

So hopefully NT possibly pulls the upgrade and can stomp out some bugs quickly. I'm just hope'n there isnt a delay now from Worley, since well need LW 8.2+ im sure for all his plugins and updates from this day forward. oyy the potental headaches

pat-lek
01-21-2005, 08:10 AM
I agree whith Darth Mole. Me, i have the "sélected points bug", i can understand that Lightwave is a sophisticad app, and can have somes bugs. But, here; it' s a bug on one of the most basic basic fonction , just sélect somes points, and see them on the screen, in shaded mode. So , since 7 months, the only thing i do with LW 8; is open the modeler, made a sphere, sélect some points, look at the screen, ask to me " where are my selected points??", close the modeler... And when i open the modeler of LW 7,5c , a part of me is a little bit disgusted, i try to forgot that i have LW8, but i can' t... And slowly, this kill me my pleasure of working on Lightwave. Sorry, but i can't forgot that, on my hard disk, i have a LW8 folder.
Now, i am on the way to change my graphic card, and i hope that i retreive my pleasure to use LW 8 (I think i' ll got the card wednesday)

Bass
01-21-2005, 08:15 AM
If it were a car....,

Hmmm, when did Ford last send out a free upgrade with added features, like a DVD player, a new interface for the GPS, plus the ability to drive the vehicle in places we couldn't in the last release? Oh, plus they threw in high compression head rests and dual floor mats from a third party developer.

GRIN - just trying to lighten the mood here. :)

Bass

Beaker
01-21-2005, 08:22 AM
Don't get me wrong pat-lek. I'm not saying that people don't have a right to be upset if something doesn't work properly or that they shouldn't have a right to have their problems voiced and looked into.

What I am saying is that I don't understand how those that do have problems have the right to personally attack the people at NewTek or ridicule other users that are happy, and don't tell me that calling them sycophants isn't ridiculing them.

colkai
01-21-2005, 08:33 AM
I thnk the major difference here is that we've PAID for the luxury of using LightWave. When I laid down my original investment (plus numerous costly upgrades), I'm paying for an application that - I hope - does what it says on the box. And when it doesn't (and it often doesn't), I'm being jipped. NewTek is actually taking my money under false pretences.
Yes, of course we've paid for it, and given that you have updated several times, presumably you felt justified in doing so? Else, surely after one upgrade that didn't work, you would have decided it was not worth the cost.
You cannot say Newtek are taking your money under false pretenses, they offer an upgrade, that's what you get, so far, I have not seen them provide an upgrade that didn't have some new feature.


If it was a car, and it didn't work properly, I'd expect the garage that sold it to me to sort out the problems quickly and free of charge. NewTek are doing this but slowly, and I'm having to pay for it - or at least fund part of it
Newtek is a company, selling upgrades, so yes indeed, you are funding their development. When you paid for LW8, unlike other companies, you also had the knowledge that the 'point' releases would be free, which have already added some features many have been crying out for for a long time, I'd bet a fair chunk of my monthly salary that we are only just seeing the rewards of their work and that there is plenty more to follow.


I didn't ask for the new antialiasing options; I do ask for stability and for existing features – the features in LW8.0 that I PAID for - to work.
So am I correct in thinking you'd happily part with the upgrade fee for just bug fixes, with no new features at all? Simply because YOU didn't ask for them specifically?

Yes - there are bugs, and yes, here's hoping they are squashed in short order, but come on, we all knew that this re-write was gonna be a huge task and sure, if by LW8.9 all the bugs are still there, I'd say there is a problem, but i'm doubting that will be the case.
There has been enough feedback from people (including developers) at Newtek, to suggest they are aware of the issues and are looking into them. How they got "out there" with such seeming show stoppers is a puzzle, but that fault lies with the beta-testers as much as the coders, who are (speaking for myself), not so hot at testing for bugs. We tend to know how the code should work and have a terrible habit of tesing accordingly.

When all is said and done, Newtek are not creating a product tailored to a single individual or indeed a Studio, to produce a package that you found wholly acceptable and wonderful, would, I am quite sure, mean someone else would hate it and demand it be written for their needs. I personally am still waiting for my favourite wishes to be included, but it doesn't preclude me from acknowledging the work arlready done.

You liken the product to a car, saying you shouldn't have to pay for the changes, ok, then surely, after buying several cars from the same company, and not being happy with them, shouldn't you maybe question your choice?

If after the bug fixes, and all the new features, finish making their way to us, you think LW is no good because it doesn't do what YOU want, maybe it's time to put the money to one of those other packages that have everything and are rock soild and bug free.

I'm guessing you haven't so far because for the most part LW does actually DO what you want, otherwise you'd be losing money (assuming you use it commercially of course). Unless of coure you made the mistake of trying to switch versions part way through a project, which is a dangerous thing to do.

Let's not forget, LW8.2 has only been out a day or two, to go ballistic over the faults and proclaim, (as usual), the large and inherent failings of Newtek and Lightwave is, at best, somewhat melodramatic.

Who knows, it may be that some of the very core changes the team have made will allow them to get out bug fixes quicker now, maybe, (and this is pure guesswork), even to the point of just releasing DLL's where the offending code resides.
Either way, I think we have to give them some time to track the bugs and sort them, which I'd wager, isn't as easy as it probably sounds.

Zarathustra
01-21-2005, 08:42 AM
Well if my automaker said they were "upgrading" my car and I got in and looked at the shiny new dvd player, gps, etc. and then, I don't know, maybe tried to dirve and shift into 3rd gear and I couldn't, or mysteriously I had to re-adjust my mirrors EVERY TIME I started the car, well, I'd have some mixed feelings about my newly "upgraded" car.

Also in light of the ongoing bugs and stability issues with 8, I've still been relying on 7.5 for all my professional work. How long have I had 8 now? When was the last time you bought a new car, but still had to keep your old one around for the bulk of the driving because the new one wasn't always safe?

What annoys me is praising an update that appears to have holes in it. Now it's one thing if the newly added features have bugs, but when things that worked before now don't, that's hardly what I would call an "upgrade". Praising this kind of performance is not only not helping, but I feel it hurts because NT has to know things aren't quite right and that we, the owners and users of the product, expect things to work, NEED things to work (as in I pay my bills largely with the money I make from my work created in LW) and in a timely fashion.

Chuck
01-21-2005, 08:51 AM
Zarathustra, you will cease the name-calling and the personal attacks or you will be banned. However much you may dislike it, the fact is that people have different points of view than you do, and you are not entitled to attack their character and call them names because they have a different point of view.

The rules of this board are for civil discourse, and name-calling such as "fanboys" and "sycophants" is not civil discourse.

It is also completely mistaken to think that because there are people who like what we've given them in this update that NewTek will ignore those who are reporting issues and are trying to understand the new elements. That point of view completely ignores the long list of fixes that make this update, regardless af the relatively small number of new issues introduced, a worthwhile update for users. We are already at work on the next round, and as we have both stated and demonstrated so far with our first two free updates to 8.0, we will keep updates coming on a more frequent schedule than in the past.