View Full Version : VT4 Crashes or Freezes up during CG

01-03-2005, 04:03 PM
I am working on a clients VT4 (on a cruise ship in the middle of the Atlantic) and we are experienceing a lot of crashes and freeze ups when using the CG Generator. About 2 to 4 a day, or in one sitting.

Since I haven't upgraded my Toaster at home to 4 yet, I don't know if this is a software problem with 4.0 and 4.0 SP1 or if they have a hardware conflict with their system. We have tried upgrading to SP1 but it didn't seem to help.

Is anyone out there having crashing problems with the CG Generator in VT4 and VT4 w/ SP1?

The system seems basically ok when not using CG. Any thoughts?

Dual Xeon
1 Gig Ram
Win XP
Nvidea Graphics GeForce FX 5700LE
3 Striped SATA Video Drives

Rich Deustachio
01-04-2005, 12:12 AM
Yes I am having a problem with the CG gen on the timeline, if you delete a CG still from the timeline with text already typed in it will crash VT4. This has NOT been fixed with SP1.

01-05-2005, 12:30 PM
I'm having the same issue, I was hoping SP1 would fix it... no such luck. Toaster CG has always been very touchy and unreliable, I've done everything humanly possible to optimize my PC's performance, again, no luck... hopefully someday soon this issue will be resolved... until then we'll keep chugin' along, not much of a choice.

Roger Mal
01-17-2005, 05:53 PM
I too, have experienced crashes while useing the CG. I seems more likley when I try to delete a page from the page list. Also, and this ones for sure, if I try to select the bottom template, "symbols", will lock things up in a heartbeat.

These same things happened today when I was doing on site training for a customer. That was awkward!


01-17-2005, 07:15 PM
me also, plenty....
Same system

Paul Lara
01-18-2005, 07:01 AM
with the CG Post on the timeline, if you delete a CG still from the timeline with text already typed in it will crash VT4.

Strangely enough, the crash will only occur if the timeline is in the [i]top]/i] pane.
Changing to any other view configuration or deleting it from Storyboard will allow you to delete that clip, Rich.

John Perkins
01-18-2005, 01:28 PM
I never edit with the timeline on the top and the CG is unusable.
I reported bugs in 4.0 that are still there with SP1.

Once again I ask, can we get the features working before adding anything?

What percent of the new VT4 features are working? Maybe 30%?

It is frustrating to see how stable VT3 was in it's last build and then get VT4.

01-22-2005, 05:24 PM
Imagine trying to do a live production with VT[4] when lower 1/3's are requested by the client. Having to give the client the choice between lower 1/3's or no production at all due to a craching VT[4].....this is no fun at all. I certainly think that VT[4] and all the previous version have been around long enough to solve this rather basic need. Granted the solution might be complicated, but the need is rather basic. This is suppose to be a production suite in a box not a desaster in a box. I love my VT but can not continue to make excuses for continual crashing problems.

01-24-2005, 10:04 AM
VT[4] SP1 is problematic. I sure don't like saying that.

I have the problem that it is now taking me 2 or 3 kill/restarts to get it up and running. Kinda like crankin' on one of those radio control engines.

Just a freeze, like it REALLY had to think about something. And became distracted while doing it. Like that commercial...

Intermittent freezes are much more prevalent with this build; annoying.

Rich Deustachio
01-24-2005, 10:29 AM
Strangely enough, the crash will only occur if the timeline is in the [i]top]/i] pane.
Changing to any other view configuration or deleting it from Storyboard will allow you to delete that clip, Rich.

Paul, I have my DVEs in the top pane and the timeline in the bottom pane. When I add the Still CG to the timeline then go to compose, type in some text, then delete the CGstill from the bottom pane timeline it shutsdown VT4 SP1. It use to come up with a crash error but now it just shuts it down. One strange way to get it not to crash, if I slide the CGstill so that it not under any other clip and then delete it it won't crash.

01-24-2005, 09:01 PM
I'm working with a church in SC and today I heard about their regular crashing the VT4SP1 while using CG. Just clicking on a template will do it. No useful work can be done in the CG before it bombs. The error is somethiong about visualC++ not finding something... I am not on site to trouble shoot unforunately. (3 hrs distant !) Should they reinstall the VT4SP1.

Its on a single PIV3.2 running WinXP, 1GB ram, and an onboard raid0(not scsi) video drive, (70 mb/s). These are the folks who tried to live switch DV and capture two cameras over two firewires (2 firewire cards too, one a TI and the other a VIA- I already told them VIA is poison). Since the capture would always terminate too early, Now they record tape in the two cameras and run in the tapes into VT Capture then edit. No SX-8 either. Whoever sold them the system didn't know what the problems were likely to be with their application, and now they are struggling to correct it. They said who it was and its not an authorized dealer, so, again... sigh... there seems to be a grey market of some sort doing this, and making life difficult for real dealers when trouble strikes.

Has NewTek got any fixes for a still unstable CG,
and even worse, is CGPost in my experience. They have not ventured into CGPost.

I create most of my CGs with Aura which is totally reliable. :)

Paul Lara
01-25-2005, 06:50 AM
Yes, I'd have them at least re-install SP1.

01-25-2005, 10:12 AM
Installing SP1 is a suggested solution, but is it the true answer? What is NewTek's position on the problem? I keep reading how unstable SP1 seems to be. Will adding it just add more problems?

01-25-2005, 09:08 PM
I am also having problems with the CG. Add to the problems, if you try backspaceing a line of text off the page it more often than not will lockup when you get to the final letter of the sentence then lock-up the drive light comes on as if it has to think about something then That box comes up saying VT4 will be shut down. The cg is almost unusable as if it had a virus but I cant find one, unless it is embedded in the code somewhere. Paul, tell us if NewTek is experiencing the same thing. We really need to know. If not you need to find someone with this problem near you and look at their CG. We need these VT4 & SP1 problems fixed. I am imbarassed to even use my Toaster in front of a client all these crashes in both CG and ToasterEdit make editing almost unbearable.

01-25-2005, 10:13 PM
Backsapcing text off a line will definately lock up my VT[4] in a heartbeat. It is that last letter in the line that is the killer. After a reboot, I can get one or two new lower 1/3's made before the fatal error message and shut down! I was using a template and cloning it. Then I would attempt to backspace off the old text and replace it with new. Then the fatal error message would come up again at the last letter and it was time to reboot and try again...and again...and again...and again............... This is obviously not something that can be tolerated.

PS: I still find that VT Edit crashes at rather odd times. Usually when doing something with the control tree.

02-02-2005, 09:31 PM
Something I found really odd is when I was using VT3 I had all of these crashing problems especially with backspacing a line of text off the screen crashing the VT3. After a few trecherous months of grumbling at NewTek I found that I had a virus (Pinfi32 virus) that seemed to only affect my toaster. I have checked for viruses in my VT4 and have found none. But, it is strange that the same symptoms are happening. Could NewTek have had a virus when compiling the VT4 program? Just a thought. I can't even let a client watch me edit their show anymore because of all the crashes in VT4. Could the core update have had a virus. Can this be checked?

Dennis O'Neal
02-04-2005, 11:08 AM
We use the VT4 system to broadcast live every Sunday. Because of the lockups, I installed a vertical interval switcher in parallel with the VT 4 so I could reboot the VT4 without loosing my live feed to the network. Unfortunately, it gets used at least once a month. We know not to edit anything on the fly inorder to minimize the risk of the CG locking up the VT4. However, it still happens without warning when using CG.

02-11-2005, 02:46 PM
We just got our VT4 (latest version with bug fixes according to our vendor)installed yesturday along with a new video card.
I've run into the same freeze, stuttering and crash problems that everyone else has with the cg.

Michael Hamilton
Falls Church Community Television

02-14-2005, 03:41 PM
I don't get it. I tried to make it crash today (four layers of crawls) and everything worked fine, although when I dragged a rtv still from the capture panel onto the timeline it froze.
Our vendor came in today to look at it and suspects that there might be something arwy with the cg in the editor.

02-14-2005, 07:54 PM
I certainly would love to get some information directly from Newtek about this problem. I wonder if they are aware of it? For me it has become a MAJOR problem and pretty much of a deal breaker. Newtek's not mentioning an audio cable issue that hangs up the RS-8 and the continued CG crashes are making life with the VT[4] very difficult.

Has anyone discovered a solution to the CG crashing problem?

02-15-2005, 01:15 AM
Hi All,

I know that many of you are having CG issues but some of you are having issues that are not from the CG your VT is freezing due to another UI bug...especially when you drag and drop...(THIS BUG has been corrected from what I understand)...I hope that it will be in the next patch. So there are several things happening causing your freeze ups...

TO those that can directly relate this ONLY to CG...

It would be very helpful to be able to have reproducable steps.

DO NOT do any drag and drop operations...add or copy / paste.

The more info we can give to NT the better chance of getting this corrected..

BTW, If I was able to get reproducable steps to the VT team...they were normally able to squash it within a few days...

I know that this is one of those bugs that NT has NOT been able to reproduce but is high on their needs to be squashed list...so the more reproducable steps the better to get it dealt with.


03-02-2005, 01:30 PM
It seems everyone is having these issues...I can tell you that my system became extremely more reliable with CGs when I made sure they were all .PNG files. .JPEGS, .PSDs and other more normal files cause some really wierd things to happen including desktop crashes. I hope this helps...
Jason C.

03-02-2005, 01:55 PM

03-02-2005, 01:56 PM
Here's a new one found this morning:

Just by simply moving the mouse around in VT-edit:
Two complete crashes (VT just disappears/shutsdown entirely, in a flash).

New test drivers were installed yesterday.

03-21-2005, 02:11 AM
I created, or attempted to create a template, and now just clicking on it freezes up the machine. I click on it and it shows up in the window. If I then click on another template or work area, instant lock up. Help.

03-21-2005, 09:16 PM
this may be a new fix for the T4 lockups and freezes. I just replaced my old P4 2.8 ghz processor with a new 3.0 ghz (the one designated as 'E'). I had to upgrade my bios on my Abit IT7 motherboard to get the new processor to work, but when it was all done instead of T4 locking up it now freezes for a few seconds then recovers. It actually now recovers instead of locking up. No more XP window of death. Even when the control panel locks up it now recovers in sometimes 5 to 10 seconds (a long time) but it does recover. Anyone else using the type 'E' P4 processor that is seeing the same thing? Does anyone else have a type 'E' P4 processor that is still locking up and causing T4 to shut down? If this is the answer I might even be able to edit in front of a client again without being imbarassed any more. Someone let me know if this works for you.

03-26-2005, 11:14 AM
The bottom line is the CG has always been problematic. I've experienced the crashes and freezes several times myself. I don't think I've ever had a customer that hasn't had the same problems. Even recently, when trying to load some of the new CG templates (PEG or Ministry), I cross my fingers hoping that it doesn't freeze up while loading them (it has frozen on numerous occasions).

This is totally unacceptable! For a professional broadcast-quality system to have a CG plagued with continued problems from version to version is absolutely ridiculous. Newtek, either fix the problem or dump that module and replace it with a reliable CG program.

I've been a dealer for Newtek for over 12 years and one its biggest fans and evangelists. As a videoographer and editor myself, I use the VT almost everyday. I firmly believe there is no better system out there. However, I expect a professional tool to operate as intended. I don't want to doubt the performance of my equipment, especially when my back is up against the wall in a live production or in an edit session with a customer paying big bucks.

The complaint of the unreliable CG has been going on from version to version. It's not a new complaint. With almost everyone having experienced the problem, you would think a major overhaul would be neccessitated.

As stated before, Newtek! fix the problem and make it a reliable module or dump it and replace it with something that is reliable!!!

Paul Lara
03-28-2005, 12:12 PM
Noted, Wayne. :(