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View Full Version : LW sloooows to a craaaawl with expressions!?



Cman
12-21-2004, 10:26 PM
Hi.
I am running through a tutorial for rigging an animated character that uses expressions to handle the scale of bones. There's nothing in the scene but one character with 1,300 or so total polys.
Well, after applying the expressions to the character my system immediately slows to an unusable crawl.

Any ideas on how to speed it up?

I can't really imagine it would be my display card because the scene works fine until I turn on the expressions.
Also, by turning down the character's subd level from 2 to 0 speeds it up a very very little bit, like from 2fps to 4fps, but that's about it...

Without expressions it's probably 60+fps.

Thanks!

edit - forgot to add I'm using LW v.8 (not v8.0.1)

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specs:

Operating System: Windows XP Professional (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2
Language: English
System Manufacturer: ASUSTek Computer Inc.
System Model: K8N-E-Deluxe
BIOS: Ver: 08.00.09
Processor: AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3400+, MMX, 3DNow, ~2.2GHz
Memory: 1024MB RAM
Page File: 212MB used, 2249MB available
DirectX Version: DirectX 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)

Graphics:
RADEON 9800 PRO
Manufacturer: ATI Technologies Inc.
Chip type: RADEON 9800 AGP
DAC type: Internal DAC(400MHz)
Display Memory: 128.0 MB
Driver Name: ati2dvag.dll
Driver Version: 6.14.0010.6497 (English)

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Mylenium
12-22-2004, 12:01 AM
Yepp, that's quite normal. LW isn't very good at this. The only thing you might do is change the order in which your expressions are evaluated and a bit of cleanup. If a expression is referencing other expressions, try ot get rid of such dependencies. Also check for unnecessary stuff. There is no sense in having an expression for something that never even gets used.

Mylenium

Cman
12-22-2004, 10:51 AM
Yepp, that's quite normal. LW isn't very good at this. The only thing you might do is change the order in which your expressions are evaluated and a bit of cleanup. If a expression is referencing other expressions, try ot get rid of such dependencies. Also check for unnecessary stuff. There is no sense in having an expression for something that never even gets used.

Mylenium


With all due respect sir (or Ma'am :) ), this really can't be normal.

I mean it is literally impossible to animate and it's just TWO expressions!!
When I select a null on the character, that has nothing to do with the expressions, and try to move it the screen doesn't update for a 1/2 second to 1-second and then I find the null has moved 2 meters when I tried to move it 2 cm!!

It's completely unworkable.

I guess, now that I think about it, maybe I could just turn the expressions completely off and guess at what they would do, then animate everything else and finally go back and animate just the stuff attached to the expressions...
how annoying.

Is that how you would do it?

liquidpope
12-22-2004, 11:35 AM
I use expressions all the time, but not with sizing bones.
I've never encountered any slow-downs at all.
(that doesn't help you though, does it? not really...)
Who's tutorial is this from, and are they experiencing the same problem? That's where I would start.
After that, I'd try setting up a test rig on a smaller scale, from a blank scene, and see if you get the same slow-down.
If all else fails, point us to the tutorial and we'll see if we can figure it out.
Good luck...


James

Cman
12-22-2004, 01:33 PM
I use expressions all the time, but not with sizing bones.
I've never encountered any slow-downs at all.
(that doesn't help you though, does it? not really...)
Who's tutorial is this from, and are they experiencing the same problem? That's where I would start.
After that, I'd try setting up a test rig on a smaller scale, from a blank scene, and see if you get the same slow-down.
If all else fails, point us to the tutorial and we'll see if we can figure it out.
Good luck...


James

The tutorial is actually a book. "Cartoon Character Creation" by Jonny Gorden.
My scene and object is attached.

My problem is with the "eye stretch" null.

The expressions are in the MotionPanel of bones "Eye_Stretch_RT" and "Eye_Stretch_LT". Both are tied to the null "Morfi_EyeStretch".

The expressions work but slow everything to a crawl.


The oddest thing is if you go in and "Remove from Scene" the "Morfi_Hand_LT" null the right eye stretch bone goes to full scaling and no longer reacts to the expression it's tied to.
Deleting "Morfi_Hand_RT" does the same to the left eye stretch bone.

I'm thinking something is maybe going on with this and that that is causing the slowdown but I can't figure out what it might be.

btw, I've asked about this in the forums for this book, but this seems a LW issue so that's why I'm also asking here. I've gotten no response, as yet, on that forum.

Thanks for any help.

Cman
12-23-2004, 11:26 PM
Those that might be interested, the author of the book this came from found the problem - LW, and the scene were set to do a FullSceneParamEval - which slowed the system to a crawl.

With that turned off it runs great. ^_^


Yay, you'll be happy I found the problem. You have Full Scene Parameter Evaluation turned on the scene. This is killing your framerate when expressions are added.

FSPE is a nasty little bugger to remove...

1. You need to load the scene, open the Options (o) and hit Alt-f, and save the scene.

2. Now if you're not sure when it got turned on, you need to check through all your scenes in a text editor for the line:

FullSceneParamEval 1

Remove that line, and save the scene.

Because scenes only include reference for FSPE when it's turned on, not when it's turned off, when it's turned on by one scene, then every scene after that inherits it. If you load a scene with it in there it'll turn it on again and start the visious cycle again.

You can also double check when you load a scene by hitting Alt-f in the Options and see if it's turned on or off. If doing that turned it on then hit Alt-f again to turn it off.

liquidpope
12-24-2004, 11:22 AM
Cool, good stuff to know.