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P Jespersen
11-17-2004, 06:27 PM
To all you dedicated LightWavers:

When I accepted the job as 3D Project Manager at NewTek a couple of months ago, I made a couple of forum posts and told you I was going to do my best to implement changes. Among these would be:

· LightWave development would have a more open line of communication with you, our users.
· We would listen and do everything in our power to provide you with the tools you need to do your jobs better and faster.
· We would look at all aspects of the code for improvement, including deep core changes.
· Advances and fixes to LightWave would be steady and made available to you more often.

I said it then and I’ll say it now: good, solid development and putting the processes in place that make it possible take time. With that in mind, I am very happy to report that we are nearing completion on the first new Feature Update public release of LightWave [8], version 8.2. This new version of LightWave includes some fundamental changes in how things are handled within the code; some of these are issues that have existed in LightWave for years and have now been resolved.

In this upcoming build of LightWave you will find:

Significant Changes to Render Engine!

Powerful new anti-aliasing methods have been added to the renderer, which produce high quality images much faster. Extensive new filter options available in the renderer provide much greater flexibility to control the look and feel of an image/animation based upon the type of scene you’re rendering.

New UV Texture Options!

Major changes have been made to the UV tools, including Subpatch-Interpolation options. Using these new interpolation options remedy texture distortion when using subpatches with UV maps. These interpolation settings are user selectable, and may be changed at any time with interactive feedback.

Editing Discontinuous UV's is now possible without the need to unweld. All vertices may be selected and edited. Additionally, UV Texture display now supports Sketch Color, which makes for greater visibility of UV maps over images. The UV display colors are also a benefit when displaying and editing several UV maps at one time.

SDK Changes!

In our quest to make the life of third party LightWave developers a bit easier, there have been approximately 22 additions/changes made to LightWave’s SDK. This is the start of a general re-work of the SDK that will give developers the ability to provide better and more powerful plugins to the LightWave community.

As always with NewTek and LightWave, these interim builds are free to our customers. As a registered owner of LightWave [8], all you have to do is go online and download the update when it’s posted. The update is still a few weeks away, it’s currently in extensive beta testing, but with the holidays coming we thought you all might like to know that there is a gift coming from the new LightWave development team.

Watch for William “Proton” Vaughan to be posting videos throughout the coming days and weeks to illustrate some of these advancements. I am honored to be a part of the new LightWave development team and this amazing community.

Best wishes to you all.

Peter Jespersen
3D Project Manager

mrunion
11-17-2004, 07:12 PM
A very non-negative, non-condesending, extremely complementive "HOORAH!!!"

:)

HowardM
11-17-2004, 07:24 PM
THANKS PETER! :D To you and the rest of the team at Newtek for all the hard work!

WilliamVaughan
11-17-2004, 07:28 PM
This is great news! Here is a quick test on a UV map that used to give me problems. All I had to do was choose Subpatch as teh interpolation setting :) Easy peasy!

I know this one will be a big hit with many of you character guys

GruvSyco
11-17-2004, 07:42 PM
Great work guys... keep the progress going!

LFGabel
11-17-2004, 07:43 PM
Back Flips! Applause! Way to go!!! :) No more baking UVs and workarounds!!!

Carm3D
11-17-2004, 07:43 PM
Will 8.2 have edge weighting?

kurv
11-17-2004, 07:48 PM
Peter, this is amazing news!!!

Thanks for the information and when can I get my grubby hands on it :) I know a lot of people who will just eat this up!!!

Thanks NewTek, looks like an update that should have the few waiting to update... updating!!

WilliamVaughan
11-17-2004, 07:57 PM
As promised, here is a sneak peek at some of the new updates.

Adding the Interpolation Options to the Interface (ftp://ftp.newtek.com/pub/LightWave/Tutorials/Vidz/UV001.mov)

and...

Vertex Maps Panel Updates (ftp://ftp.newtek.com/pub/LightWave/Tutorials/Vidz/UV002.mov)


Be sure to note thinsg like Real time feedback, Color UV's (oh yeah!), and being able to display and edit multiple UV's at one time :)

More to come! This is so awesome my character's UV maps thank the entire Dev team :)

ufo3d
11-17-2004, 08:01 PM
how about subsurface scattering?

anieves
11-17-2004, 08:13 PM
that's super sweet! Thank you guys!

hrgiger
11-17-2004, 08:19 PM
This is really great news.
Fixing the subpatch distortion factor has taken up many pages of forum discussion and I'm finally glad to see it be resolved. The colored UV's are an added bonus on that.
I'm sure that many people who were waiting for some changes to the render engine will also be happy.
But most of all, I'd like to think that the changes to the SDK are perhaps the best news. This could open up all new kinds of possibilities to plug-in developers as well as future updates to Lightwave in general.Perhaps what a plug-in writer couldn't do before, they now can. Hopefully this will help Worley bring FPrime a little closer to integration with Layout information.

Certainly my thanks goes to Newtek.

Fardak
11-17-2004, 08:43 PM
*Dances around the room*

Chris S. (Fez)
11-17-2004, 08:56 PM
Really really exciting stuff. Doing away with unweld and distortion...awesome stuff. "Extensive filter options" eh? Maybe that means the PSD export got some lovin...

Hopefully Mr. Worley has been working on and with the SDK all along. I wonder if they managed to open Shaders up to Fprime? Integrated G2/Fprime would be um...really cool. Thanks for the update!

Silkrooster
11-17-2004, 09:17 PM
Peter and Proton,
Thanks for keeping us in the loop. It means a lot to know you guys are right behind us. Keep up the excellent work.
Silk

Bobt
11-17-2004, 09:24 PM
I have some very small things that would help with LWConnect
such as settings that dont stick.
Can that be included into 8.2?
Oh and YAHOO!! Also if I pop for a 8.0 upgrade will I get 8.2
or is that going to cost some bucks? :)

Thanks,
Bob

ColinCohen
11-17-2004, 09:29 PM
SDK Changes!

In our quest to make the life of third party LightWave developers a bit easier, there have been approximately 22 additions/changes made to LightWave’s SDK. This is the start of a general re-work of the SDK that will give developers the ability to provide better and more powerful plugins to the LightWave community.


Very much looking forward to the new SDK.

MooseDog
11-17-2004, 09:35 PM
Peter, I believe, deserves all the credit for keeping his finger on the pulse of newtek's user community, taking newtek's customers so seriously, and responding so quickly. witness the fix! to a long-standing weakness/problem with UV's, their distortion and unwelding hacks.

thx as well to the programmers for coding this and getting it out so fast. can't wait to see proton's video of creating a UV map without unwelding :D .

the future, near and long term, is quite bright indeed. THUMBS UP!

koots
11-17-2004, 09:39 PM
Some of the best NEWS I had all day, and I had a really good day!! I do not know how anyone else feels, but I really think Newtek is doing a GREAT job as of late. Thanks again!

hrgiger
11-17-2004, 09:41 PM
Also if I pop for a 8.0 upgrade will I get 8.2
or is that going to cost some bucks? :)

Thanks,
Bob

No, 8.2 is free to Lightwave 8 owners.

JVitale
11-17-2004, 09:44 PM
YOU ARE THE MAN!!!....thanks Peter

Now if I can just get you down to Los Angeles someday so you can demo at one of our meetings ... :D

Big Jay
11-17-2004, 09:46 PM
The update sounds great. Glad to see that some major problems have finally been taken care of.

WilliamVaughan
11-17-2004, 09:51 PM
I couldn't resist created this short but super cool video showing a simple task that used to drive me crazy.

Discon..UVs (ftp://ftp.newtek.com/pub/LightWave/Tutorials/Vidz/discuv01.mov)

Gotta love that....ok maybe you dont but apply it to a complex head uv map and then you gotta love it :)

WilliamVaughan
11-17-2004, 09:52 PM
This demo shows the location and basic introduction to teh new AA methods peter mentioned above. Render comparisons will tell it all tho.

PLD AA (ftp://ftp.newtek.com/pub/LightWave/Tutorials/Vidz/PLD001.mov)

archiea
11-17-2004, 10:06 PM
This offers great reassurances to us users that there is progress in the software, and that features that perhaps didn;t make 8.0 don't have to wait for 8.5 to be released.

NanoGator
11-17-2004, 10:11 PM
This demo shows the location and basic introduction to teh new AA methods peter mentioned above. Render comparisons will tell it all tho.

PLD AA (ftp://ftp.newtek.com/pub/LightWave/Tutorials/Vidz/PLD001.mov)

Argh! Hit F9 already!

:D

WilliamVaughan
11-17-2004, 10:16 PM
I have some very small things that would help with LWConnect
such as settings that dont stick.
Can that be included into 8.2?
Oh and YAHOO!! Also if I pop for a 8.0 upgrade will I get 8.2
or is that going to cost some bucks? :)

Thanks,
Bob


8.2 is free to 8.0 customers :)

if you dont own LW you can get this great deal as well:
http://www.newtek.com/products/lightwave/partners/realviz/index.php

SplineGod
11-17-2004, 10:21 PM
Great news Pete! And all this time I thought you were on vacation. ;)

Muad'dib
11-17-2004, 10:36 PM
Talk is cheap - give us the number comparisons already :) ;) :D

Fantastic news - been waiting for this type of flexibility for eons - thank you for listening NT

thekho
11-17-2004, 11:02 PM
Excellent news!!! Thanks to Peter and his dev team!!!

I watched the UV tools demo movie and i'm also very impressed with this new UV tools which i need it for longtime.

Karmacop
11-17-2004, 11:02 PM
I'm very happy to see the new Dev team listening to users and implementing changes that have been asked for by uses for years :)

jin choung
11-17-2004, 11:04 PM
thank you peter,

kudos to you and the team for - on all accounts - a rapid logistical transition and a truly impressive list of achievements for 8.2!

but most especially thanks for being willing to open up the lines of communication between features, fixes, and development with the community at large.

for a long time, the hermeneutically sealed lips of newtek development, under the banner of 'competitive advantage', has frustrated savvy software consumers (i mean us) who are used to seeing lists:

- new features
- bugs fixed
- issues addressed
- known bugs
- outstanding issues pending

from vendors like graphics card manufacturers (their drivers), computer games developers and OS providers (both commercial and open source).

i don't intend to recommend that newtek give up any advantage whatsoever but as someone who has seen it done without it undermining a company, i am glad that things seem to be turning around and am grateful to you in help spurring it on.

thanks for the info and i hope that you engage the community in a manner so that you don't burn yourself out and we never hear from you again. look forward to more updates at your leisure.

thanks and continued luck.

jin

hrgiger
11-17-2004, 11:10 PM
I almost fired you off an email Jin to let you know about the update but I see you're already there. I know that the subpatch distortion was a big issue for you.

Steve

animotion
11-17-2004, 11:24 PM
These look very good, The most helpful thing to me would be actual deformation manipulation (smart skinning) inside of layout. Think of it this way, I am a musician, the way this is implement now kinda feels like trying to play music with a qwerty keyboard, I would much rather have the real guitar, it just feels right.

Other high-end aps and yes LW is definately high-end, get the important fact that minute deformation wrinkles, bulges, sags etc. are best done at the animation stage where this type of 1 to 1 feedback is most apreciated. doing fine detail deformations with bones is like using a club to do fine work. Tweeking in modeler is like working with the trial and error system which breaks the artistic flow.

I will stick with LW even if this never, ever, ever gets implemented but it sure would bring LW to a higher level for me at least.

Animotion :)

Hervé
11-17-2004, 11:40 PM
These are grat news.... thanks a lot....

Ok, can you post a new render.... compare to an old one.... :)

Hervé
11-17-2004, 11:41 PM
Did you fix the broken Size button in FX_linker....?

Karmacop
11-18-2004, 12:20 AM
I almost fired you off an email Jin to let you know about the update but I see you're already there. I know that the subpatch distortion was a big issue for you.

Yeah, I bet Jin's happy to see how they fixed something he's had such a big issue with. Would I also be correct in saying that no other software handles uvs like this? Anyway, it's not the way I would have solved the problem, but I think it's the best way to do it.

I'm with Jin too, having a company like Newtek communicate with the customers is great. I like knowing what bugs have been fixed, and having inputs in features etc. I think the future is bright for Newtek, despite what some people think.

Tesselator
11-18-2004, 12:21 AM
Sweet!!!



22 SDK changes!

Render Engine Enhancements!

New anti-aliasing!

New Filter options!

New UV Mapping Methods!

NO More Unweld!!!

Sketch Color UV Display!

Free Free Free!

And More Proton Videos!!!




Additionally it looks like we get a new Kick-*** 3D Project Manager with the deal!

Mr. Peter Jespersen, Welcome in! I absolutely love your four-point improvement
policy!

:cool:

jin choung
11-18-2004, 12:56 AM
:)

thanks hr for the kind consideration and thanks karmacop for so generously euphemizing my attitude about the matter which is probably more closer to "really had a stick up his *** about" than "had such a big issue with".

(karmacop, it looks from the video like 'across uv borders' is the thing most akin to what you've been wanting - it seems like the catchall setting that will address 99% of situations for most models. at first, i was afraid because one of the settings [subpatch i believe] showed the corners at the edges of the uv boundaries curving [not desirable in most situations] but 'aub' seems to address it nicely )

yah, i wanted to refrain from absolutely gushing (geeking out) but yes, i am officially both damp and moist with anticipation for the uv interpolation and FINALLY not having to unweld anymore!

i always felt that lw's sds was three features away from being 'done':

1. edge/poly curvature weighting (in addition to our vert)
2. render time tesselation/dicing as a function of render resolution (which has the fringe benefit of 'micropoly/subpixel displacement')
3. uv mappable as robustly and artifact free as with polys.

all three are (i can imagine) big issues that involve a lot of interrelated complexity.

a big one has been checked off the list! wow....

to be honest, i never imagined that - 8 starting where it did - such really big features would have been added short of 9!!!! i am really freaked out now.

this is 8 POINT TWO! TWO!!!

but now i fear that version 8.9 will include a button that will sound a trumpet and trigger armageddon.

oh dear....

jin

p.s. goldern these newfangled quicktimey video doohickeys! you younguns don't know the meanin' of dialup?! all fancy with yer movin' pitchers n' sound and all... why, in my day, i used to have to walk 2 miles in the snow with a 1200 baud external modem.....

Hervé
11-18-2004, 01:01 AM
I'll add this while we're at it....

If you could fix this gradient problem.... it would be wonder...

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?p=228620&posted=1#post228620

:D

hazmat777
11-18-2004, 01:44 AM
:)

but now i fear that version 8.9 will include a button that will sound a trumpet and trigger armageddon.

oh dear....



Good one... :D

flashover
11-18-2004, 01:57 AM
8.2 It's a dream!!!!!!!!!!!!!! YEAH!!!! TNX Peter!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

colkai
11-18-2004, 02:24 AM
A very non-negative, non-condesending, extremely complementive "HOORAH!!!"
:)

I concour, I agree, right there with ya bud, rock on .. etc...etc..etc..

In other words, bravo Newtek, dontcha just know it, Newtek are the bomb!
:D

colkai
11-18-2004, 02:31 AM
probably more closer to "really had a stick up his *** about" than "had such a big issue with".

SPLUTTER .. CHOKE ... Jin ,don't do dat guy, I was drinking me coffeee ;) :D

LW3D
11-18-2004, 02:35 AM
very good new features..congrulations..

But I want to see Subpixel Displacement feature in LightWave render engine. When do you think, you can add this feature in render engine?

Bog
11-18-2004, 03:00 AM
Peter, that's superb.

I have a stinking, filthy cold - and suddenly I don't care :D

riki
11-18-2004, 03:02 AM
aaah sweet, great news

Jure
11-18-2004, 05:29 AM
Thanks guys! The future looks bright!

Exper
11-18-2004, 05:32 AM
Yeah!

Hey... you... NT... GOD bless you! :D

Panikos
11-18-2004, 05:37 AM
Exper, I wonder why usually our messages are next to each other :confused:

Great news, I am collecting my coins to upgrade to LW8 ;)

mattclary
11-18-2004, 05:39 AM
Wow! Didn't expect a point release this soon! Awesome work guys!

Ztreem
11-18-2004, 05:42 AM
:eek: Is it true? I'm in heaven! :D

ackees
11-18-2004, 05:44 AM
Oxygen, oxygen. Great news. How much faster is it?

Nemoid
11-18-2004, 05:46 AM
Congrats guys !
Dev team is running really fast. didn't expect such an announcement so soon. and with good features that solve annoying probs.

Thanx Peter, Proton , Deuce and all team members. :)

Bytehawk
11-18-2004, 05:47 AM
lookin' bright.

indeed.

congrats to the dev team for fixing these long standing problems.

Pavlov
11-18-2004, 06:02 AM
Hi,
good work, this new Dev_team looks very promising.
There're lot of things which had never been adressed in past years, i also stopped giving my feedback for frustration.
now, i've a very extensive list of small changes, new tools, fixes and so on; i already posted them around the forums online, but not here.
I think i'll post something to the feat.request area.

Regards
Paolo Zambrini

caesar
11-18-2004, 06:04 AM
in a superb move, turn the game to his side....

retinajoy
11-18-2004, 06:20 AM
EXCELLENT!!!!! :cool:

Maybe a worley announcement too in a few weeks ;)

Netvudu
11-18-2004, 06:22 AM
I can´t believe this. Not only we got some really cool improvements...we also get reported about them!!! Newtek is certainly turning things in the right direction.


My über-respect to Peter Jespersen for an amazing work, as well as the dev team for being such an smart group of guys, and as usual thanks to Proton for his cool videos...


...and his warm voice :D

3DBob
11-18-2004, 06:46 AM
This is great news - The UV map stuff is really cool - thanks guys.

I'd like to see how the new AA looks - a speed up here would just be amazing - I'd given up hope of this ever being updated.

I am really hoping that the new SDK will allow at least these 3 things:-

1. FPrime has new update and can see shaders and be more feature rich - mmmmm HVs and Fprime......

2. HD instancing to gain full access so that HVs and reflections are enables.

3. Sasquatch can be seen in reflections

Keep up the good work guys.

3Bob

-EsHrA-
11-18-2004, 06:54 AM
great news, thanks all ! :)

im now using lw 8.9 beta and i just found that trumpet armagedon button !!! ;)
holy cow !!!


hehe...

mlon

Karmacop
11-18-2004, 07:27 AM
:)
yah, i wanted to refrain from absolutely gushing (geeking out) but yes, i am officially both damp and moist with anticipation for the uv interpolation and FINALLY not having to unweld anymore!

I know, it's as if the dev team said "geez this Jin guy is annoying, lets just fix his problems so he'll shut up" :p This doesn't mean you can continue being noisy though ;)

But yes, sounds like a great update. I also hear one of the SDK changes is the ray casting that people trying to do SSS have been annoyed with ... good times :)

Hervé
11-18-2004, 07:33 AM
..... now there's also a real hope for our F-prime toy..... :D

SDK :eek: = Worley :D

Tesselator
11-18-2004, 07:34 AM
I'll add this while we're at it....

If you could fix this gradient problem.... it would be wonder...

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?p=228620&posted=1#post228620

:D

I'm sure there's an enormous amount of bug fixes in this release!!! I know
Deuce was so busy tracking, doccumenting, and seeing to thier demise that
he hardly had time for else in his life!

Let's let the announcement ride on a positive note. That said, I agree with you
that it would be nice at sometime in the future to see a list of fixes that have
been applied in the 8.2 release! I'm sure it will be in the readme but... ;)

BTW, the fact that an 8.2 point release was whipped up so fast does not come
as a surprise to me. Both Proton (William) and Chuck Baker told us that the
development team was finely tuned and the resulting release schedual would
be in high-gear. I believed them!

Considering such, if this pace continues WOW! We're going to be very happy
wavers and our jobs are gonna be soooooo much smoother!!!

:D

Avalon111
11-18-2004, 07:42 AM
realy great news

bloontz
11-18-2004, 07:47 AM
What a great announcement! Made my day! Thank you Peter, thank you Newtek!

T-Light
11-18-2004, 07:48 AM
Fantastic, thanks guys :D

Karmacop, where did you hear about the raycasting change in the sdk?

Exper
11-18-2004, 07:58 AM
I also hear one of the SDK changes is the ray casting that people trying to do SSS have been annoyed with ... good times :)Are you sure?
Is this true?
I must reserve some time for emails and phone... just informing some developers out there (around the world)... then I'll personally travel to NT's headquarters... and P. Jespersen... watch yourself... you'll deserve a big kiss... ehehe! :D

Tesselator
11-18-2004, 08:02 AM
Oh, and peeps, It might be a good idea to bookmark this URL:

:cool: ftp://ftp.newtek.com/pub/LightWave/Tutorials/Vidz/

for awhile cuz if I know Proton this will fill very quickly with all kinds
of cool video tuts and explainations about the 8.2 release and etc.!

Be sure to sort by file date so you'll know if you got the newest ones!

dalecampbelljr
11-18-2004, 08:07 AM
Wow!...all I can say is AWESOME!

Exper
11-18-2004, 08:08 AM
Exper, I wonder why usually our messages are next to each other :confused:MFM: Magnetic Forum Mystery! :D

Karmacop
11-18-2004, 08:12 AM
Karmacop, where did you hear about the raycasting change in the sdk?

I heard it from someone on one of the lightwave mailing lists ... I know, not very credible, so please don't kill me if this information is incorrect. :( However, if it is correct, I accept cash donations ;)

theo
11-18-2004, 08:14 AM
Here's to news that is simply the inverse of discouraging, depressing, lackadaisical, insipid, and penological. Oh, and the inverse of :eek: !

EternalAnimator
11-18-2004, 08:26 AM
I am rather curious but, will LW 8.2 be able to create and render Normal Maps out of the box, and also have newer Rigid/Cloth Body options, such as advanced object collision detection, such as an oil drum being knocked over?

Firestar3D
11-18-2004, 08:33 AM
With everything that's been listed here, I think that would be enough for me to work with as it is! The UV Mapping and PDS AA options alone will make it easier to work with characters and increase rendering throughput respectively.

I'm pretty sure Proton and the others are working on things like collision and particles for the next update that follows! :D

EDIT: Wow! I didn't realise this was the one forum I hadn't posted to until today! :eek: :rolleyes:

Yamatomaru
11-18-2004, 08:33 AM
Hi Everyone,

I use lightwave since V3.5 and I can't live without it, sadly the studio where I work is planning to move the pipeline over XSI :( for its superior rigging capabilities (mainly the boss is tired of continuosly switching between layout and modeler to test point weighting, and the fact that the results you get in Vertex Paint tests, do no not match in layout when you are using hi-polycount models).
New point weighting capabilities (tools similar to vertex paint that work directly in lay-out on the final subpatch models, smart bones etc.)would be much apreciated!!
Anything on the horizon?

Tesselator
11-18-2004, 08:35 AM
I am rather curious but, will LW 8.2 be able to create and render Normal Maps out of the box, and also have newer Rigid/Cloth Body options, such as advanced object collision detection, such as an oil drum being knocked over?

It didn't say so in the release info Peter posted but there is a FREE set of tools
you can use to accomplist this in Lightwave!

Go directly to Marvin's site for the docs and download
here: http://amber.rc.arizona.edu/lw/normalmaps.html

deg
11-18-2004, 08:52 AM
That's AWEsome! Thanks Peter! :)

Julez4001
11-18-2004, 08:52 AM
Proton
post more videos
me luv videos

policarpo
11-18-2004, 09:06 AM
Coolness.

Do you guys know if this will fix the nasty bug of a problem on the OSX version of LW, where at certain times when it crashes, it would convert your files to Zero K and make them unusable and render them useless (I've lost quite a bit of work because of this, so much so that I only use 7.5c on my Mac because of it)?

Thanks for the sneak peak.

Cheers.

Cman
11-18-2004, 09:10 AM
Proton
post more videos
me luv videos

Please! :D

DoF
11-18-2004, 09:12 AM
Excellent.
Did anyone mention micropoly/subpixel displacement; ability to import 16bit greyscale TIFFs; and an integrated DoF solution?
I know, we are a greedy lot!

theo
11-18-2004, 09:14 AM
With everything that's been listed here, I think that would be enough for me to work with as it is!

NEVER!!!!!!!!! I shall never be happy until Lightwave comes with a fully-featured particle accelerating atom-smasher.....hhoooohhahhhhaaa!!!! :D

colkai
11-18-2004, 09:21 AM
I'll take the sexy massuer who eases my tired muscles and supplies me with whatever beverage I choose. Of course. ... I think the wife may have summat to say about that! :p

antwik-2
11-18-2004, 10:06 AM
Thank god for does updates!

Jörg
11-18-2004, 10:44 AM
great news.... thanks Peter!!


JJ

Big Jay
11-18-2004, 10:54 AM
8.01 came with a rather extensive list of bug fixes so a .2 update should have one two. with luck it will be gigantic :D

Lewis
11-18-2004, 10:59 AM
Excellent News guys :)

Thanks and congrats to whole NT team.

marinello2003
11-18-2004, 11:08 AM
This is wonderful news. :)

robpowers3d
11-18-2004, 11:10 AM
Pete,

Great news! And proof positive of Newtek's ongoing commitment to Lightwave development. Updates to the renderer and UV Subpatch-Interpolation!!! Now, I'm really getting excited!

Rob Powers :D

silverlw
11-18-2004, 11:50 AM
What does that mean, Any hints?
My wishlist in no particular order but they are all really important:
Rewrite the renderengine and surface editor so it supports,
Fprime in all views even modeller, Fprime should be able to communicate and render most other shaders and be able to do baking. Instancing, Subsurfacescattering, subpixeldisplacement microbumps, lightdispersion and more advanced caustics, fix the (bug) of additive reflections, faster multibounce radiosity with better options and controll, both bruteforce Montecarlo-photonmaps and irradiancemaps. Ability to save the precalculated photomaps/irradiancemaps. Photometric lights, Adaptive more controllable noisereduction, Fix the arealightbugs such as edge shadows and also make them renderable/viewable in cameraview/reflections. Better glow/translucent/luminosity materials. Better exposure/gammacontroll in preview/rendermode and not as a posteffect that you see effect of after render.

ok i better shutup before you people start to wonder if i like Lightwave at all ;)

Yes i luve it and i want it to have the best renderengine in the world as it used to be! :D

Intuition
11-18-2004, 12:17 PM
Awesome work.

But here is a simple request.

Can you make the glow, in the advanced surface panel, have an option for texture mapping?

I have many times wanted to show a fluid getting absorbed by skin. I either have to have the whole surface glow or not...or cut out specific polygons. I would love to have the glow follow areas like an alpha channel.
Then I could use a black and white image to discern where the glow shows up on a single suface setting.

shandaman
11-18-2004, 12:18 PM
Sweet i cant wait.

Igu4n4
11-18-2004, 12:25 PM
excellent news... keep em coming! .. looking forward to digging into this.

Keep em coming! (is there an echo in here?)

Steve
www.iguana-den.com

Doran
11-18-2004, 12:42 PM
Christmas fun!

Lamont
11-18-2004, 12:47 PM
Very, very sweet.

Matt
11-18-2004, 01:20 PM
This is awesome news Peter, way to go NewTek!

:D

Noclar7
11-18-2004, 02:01 PM
wow, I havent been to these forums in ages, I just caught the link off of Flay though. Sweet news all around. Im still actually taking in LW8.1. after a while of actually using it and its new tools I'm completely hooked on the Dopesheet. So this is just icing on the cake :)

Phil
11-18-2004, 02:18 PM
I have asked about this before, but if you really need it now, you might want to look at SuperGlow 2 from Pontari. It hasn't been updated in years, but it does work here and the texture control of glows, etc. isn't matched by any other product around for doing the job within LW. The caveats are that it is PC only and the aforementioned disinterest of the developer in moving the product forwards. I'm hoping NT will sooner or later begin to look at the glow feature and decide it needs serious updating.


Awesome work.

But here is a simple request.

Can you make the glow, in the advanced surface panel, have an option for texture mapping?

I have many times wanted to show a fluid getting absorbed by skin. I either have to have the whole surface glow or not...or cut out specific polygons. I would love to have the glow follow areas like an alpha channel.
Then I could use a black and white image to discern where the glow shows up on a single suface setting.

cagey5
11-18-2004, 02:23 PM
Just adding a big thumbs up to the lengthy list. Way to go guys. :D

nerdyguy227
11-18-2004, 03:57 PM
COOLEIO

:D :cool: :D :cool: :D

hunter
11-18-2004, 04:50 PM
Sub-D UV's :eek: uh oh... :o I need to change my pants. ;)

riki
11-18-2004, 05:13 PM
I really hope this opens things up for third party developers.

AVT
11-18-2004, 05:44 PM
Well, I hope that bug with "Atlas" UV will be fixed at last. Looks like that Newtek programmers uses simplified Normal calculation method (by last-first-second point or so), instead of interpolation between all polygon points. Thats why Atlas produces horrible overlapping results when used on twisted subpatch surfaces.
I hope, they could fix raytracing too (noise bug in glass surfaces since LW6.0), bug with no self shadows in Hypervoxels, and bug with wrong opacity calculation in volumetric lights.
After all, it would be nice to remember "Show rendering in progress" settings and set VIPER to Mosaic mode by default, bring up properties windows (shaders list, displacement, everywhere) when I call for it (even if window already open and buried under others), show Subpatch UVs and Lens Flare in VIPER, add more quality levels to volumetric light and smooth it rendering results (just the way 3DSmax does), enable shadowmaps for point lights and add N-side subpatches to Modeler (I know, they may look ugly, but I NEED them often, especially when using Bevel or MagicBevel). After all, when I right-click on Vmap name in the VertexMaps panel in modeler and choose "Delete", it kills last selected vmap, not right-clicked one :(
Subpixel displacement - just a dream, I think...

gaushell
11-18-2004, 06:57 PM
Awesome news! I had put off upgrading to 8 since it was geared more towards character anim.

But with at least a few ot these itemes, those of us in the architectural visualization realm will be especially happy.

This is great news for fprime too which has kept my hopes alive for the past several months.

I have been waiting for improved AA for years! Could have just used it on a long animation this week.

Keep it up NT!

theo
11-18-2004, 08:17 PM
The ONLY problem with the LW 8.2 thingy is that I live in an LW 12.3 world. :D

Signal to Noise
11-18-2004, 10:16 PM
Excellent news!

Now, will Cycler be finally fixed?

badllarma
11-19-2004, 12:10 AM
Cool a big thanks to the guys and girls at Newtek :D
Proton thanks for the vids ;)

Original1
11-19-2004, 12:34 AM
I'll take the sexy massuer who eases my tired muscles and supplies me with whatever beverage I choose. Of course. ... I think the wife may have summat to say about that! :p


I thought you were talking abpout your wife ;)

Roland
11-19-2004, 12:39 AM
Great News, ...and how about Directx ??? ...and RealTimeShader by DX9 ???

Original1
11-19-2004, 12:50 AM
First impression looks awesome guys,

One request, I know that there have now been two point updates and 8.2 looks to be quite a big one. One thing that would help would be a detailed technical disscusion (or documentation) of the changes to the renderer and how to get the best out of its new settings

zapper1998
11-19-2004, 08:37 AM
Totally Awesome...ya

Chuck
11-19-2004, 08:38 AM
Demo videos, tutorials and thorough documentation are all in the works. :)

brap
11-19-2004, 09:07 AM
Great to hear about the new AA! My only 2c worth is to say test this baby till it bleeds, then test it some more! :)

Karmacop
11-19-2004, 09:19 AM
Great News, ...and how about Directx ??? ...and RealTimeShader by DX9 ???

Or why not work with the current open gl system we have and implement open gl shaders? ;)

colkai
11-19-2004, 09:44 AM
I thought you were talking abpout your wife ;)

heh .. in my dreams - though to be fair, she does make the coffee of a weekend. :)

Steve McRae
11-19-2004, 09:44 AM
this is really great . . .

i am really happy about the UV and render improvements . . .

very good news . . .

thanks Newtek . . .

P Jespersen
11-19-2004, 10:47 AM
Thanks everyone for the positive response on the post!
We are commited to getting these updates out to you as fast as we can.
You have all been very patient and deserve everything we can get you as fast as we can get it to you. :)
Even before this gets out to you we will already be working on another. I can not commit to a time or to the content but I will say we have more than a few of these planned.

Thanks again everyone for your support, dedication and making this the best 3D community on the planet!

Onward and upward!


Peter

Peter Jespersen
3D Project Manager
Newtek

lasco
11-19-2004, 11:01 AM
mmm… that's all good news.
Now updating from LW 7.5 to 8 is something
I can consider seriously…

I can't wait to see the new AA.
I'm particularly curious to see what are these "Reconstruction Filters".

PICS ! PICS ! PICS !

Emmanuel
11-19-2004, 11:36 AM
Hm, now we can check the "more frequent updates" item on the wishlist.
NewTek said, NewTek did.

Djamu
11-19-2004, 11:48 AM
K, that UV thing looks good.... for all those texturers...

I might even start UV'ing in LW :)

Render AA even better. I quess the multithreaded network capable Fprime implementation, is for the next update.

I was about changing the 3D package in our studio, mainly because of the poor feedback...... I'll reconsider, if this new breeze continues ( I'll try getting a reply from the tech department one more time ... )

What about implementing a decent realtime dynamics engine ( ODE ) other 3D packages have it already, it's free ( opensoure ) ..... - or is this to hard / not good enough ? -..

Anyway keep up the good work ;)

Exper
11-19-2004, 11:55 AM
Great... Holy... Peter! :cool:

What about implementing a decent realtime dynamics engine ( ODE ) other 3D packages have it already, it's free ( opensoure ) ..... - or is this to hard / not good enough ? -..NT's Dev Team can implement ODE (if they want)... take a look here:
XSI 4 has ODE rigid body dynamics, why not LW ?
http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?t=24732

TheGreatRaja
11-19-2004, 11:55 AM
yeah, but can you use the knife tool to slice splines :D

*runs

Panikos
11-19-2004, 11:59 AM
Hm, now we can check the "more frequent updates" item on the wishlist.
NewTek said, NewTek did.

Oink ! Oink! :D

hrgiger
11-19-2004, 12:12 PM
Even before this gets out to you we will already be working on another. I can not commit to a time or to the content but I will say we have more than a few of these planned.



Being that I like to read into these statements...

"Even before this gets out to you...." That means now right? Or does it mean 5 minutes before you post this update you say get to work guys on the next update.

"we have more than a few of these planned." More then a few? Well, I consider 2 or 3 to be a few, but now we know it's more then that. A lot more? A little more? 4 would be more then a few but then so would 8. Although, 8 is kind of like more than several which you didn't say. So my guess is there will be from 4 -7 more of these through my severe deductive reasoning.

Exper
11-19-2004, 12:29 PM
A perceptive thought! :p

byte_fx
11-19-2004, 12:40 PM
All this is really great news! To say the least.

Really looking forward to checking out the new render engine. Man o man - wish I could try out the beta.

Even better is that it hints at a paradigm shift at NT. If so that's even better.

It appears that 8.2 will have the type of changes we look for in a .5 or full rev releae.

Not to mention the 64 bit port.

All sorts of goodies coming out of NT lately. LW's future once again looks all bright and shiny.

Congrats to both the development team and NT for making this happen.

byte_fx

Tesselator
11-19-2004, 01:18 PM
Being that I like to read into these statements...

"Even before this gets out to you...." That means now right? Or does it mean 5 minutes before you post this update you say get to work guys on the next update.

"we have more than a few of these planned." More then a few? Well, I consider 2 or 3 to be a few, but now we know it's more then that. A lot more? A little more? 4 would be more then a few but then so would 8. Although, 8 is kind of like more than several which you didn't say. So my guess is there will be from 4 -7 more of these through my severe deducting reasoning.

Developing for a living software product (like Lightwave3D) in an active industry
(like CGI/VFXI) requires dynamic planning, vision, and eficient use of resources!
I would venture to guess that some parts of LW 9.0 (and beyond!) are already
mapped and being worked on whether in code or on the drawing table.

If revision releases by the current team are an indication; Let's see there was:


8.0,
8.01,
8.2

And if my highly educated and astoundingly perceptive guess is correct "more
than a few of these planned" would look like this when expanded:


8.21
8.4
8.41
8.6
8.61
8.8
8.81
9.0
9.01

which totals at lease but probably more than, nine releases into the future
comprised of at least but probably more than five revisions and at least but
probably more than four point releases.

"Deducting reasoning", heh! Junk science! Hehehe j/k :D

:cool:

ColinCohen
11-19-2004, 01:27 PM
I think it'll be more like a Fibonacci series: 8.01, 8.2, 8.21, 8.41, 8.62, 9.03 :)

adrencg
11-19-2004, 02:08 PM
All these little changes are nice...especially the UV stuff.

But how about making LW more stable when using ClothFX? It crashes when you breathe on it. It needs to able to handle more polys without crashing, like SoftFX.

Mike

WilliamVaughan
11-19-2004, 02:16 PM
Can you post some examplesin another thread....I have been using clothfx recently on a project with no problem...

Emmanuel
11-19-2004, 02:22 PM
Oink !

"Significant Changes to Render Engine!

Powerful new anti-aliasing methods have been added to the renderer, which produce high quality images much faster. Extensive new filter options available in the renderer provide much greater flexibility to control the look and feel of an image/animation based upon the type of scene you’re rendering."

I think some users might be misreading that as two separate things, improved AA and improved renderer.
I read it as "changes made to the render engine consist of improved AA
algorithms" not actual changes to the way LW renders or even additional rendering features.
"Just" improved anti-aliasing....

adrencg
11-19-2004, 02:37 PM
Can you post some examplesin another thread....I have been using clothfx recently on a project with no problem...

It depends on what your're using it for I guess. I eventually get something out of it, and I like the results, but I have crashed LW literally 20 times in an hour while trying to use it. It seems that it gets really shaky if you make a modification to the Cloth (hair) object in modeler, then try to calc it again. Most times when I make model change, I save and reload the scene, then calc it. I also have to "wake up" the collision object by making a small modification to the collision distance. (take notes you guys)

It also doesn't seem to like it if you go over a certain number of polys. I'm definitely getting used to all of it's little idiosyncrosies, but it's a very nerve wracking process to get anything done with it.

It also doesn't truly "tun off" when you unclick it in the object panel. So lets say you have two objects with ClothFX and you want to do a calc...if you forget to completely remove it from one of the objects --- CRASH. Just turning it off isn't enough.

It loves cages (for FX_metalink) made by Cohen's FastCloth plug or ShmDeRez. I tend to always take that route instead of using the original object.

Mike

harlan
11-19-2004, 02:39 PM
Those are my thoughts as well Emannuel. I do look forward to the new anti-aliasing & filtering methods however. They may result in better looking LW native DOF (at least they should logically speaking).

Para
11-19-2004, 03:08 PM
Or why not work with the current open gl system we have and implement open gl shaders? ;)

Including shaders would be a direct feature needed by the game industry and I know only one OpenGL game which uses OGL shaders (Doom 3) - most of the games are nowadays Direct3D anyway and all the amazing shader work can be seen in those. It's not a matter of which one is better, it's just a matter of which one has more potential users.

hesido
11-19-2004, 07:19 PM
Will the spinning light tricks or interpolated radiosity tricks work with the new AA's? :D

Subsurface scattering is absolutely needed!

Also, a gradient based on the diffuse lighting of a pixel with respect to all lights or a specific light would really help people adjust their skin shading easily, without the use of any fancy rendering technique!

Pleasee :D

Someone put this in the wish list :)

Karmacop
11-19-2004, 08:09 PM
Including shaders would be a direct feature needed by the game industry and I know only one OpenGL game which uses OGL shaders (Doom 3) - most of the games are nowadays Direct3D anyway and all the amazing shader work can be seen in those. It's not a matter of which one is better, it's just a matter of which one has more potential users.

Hmm, that's a good point I didn't think of. I only said open gl because it's what lightwave uses, and it carries across to the mac users, but I can unserstand that game devs would use it.

crusaderx
11-19-2004, 08:14 PM
perhpas im out in left field...
as an addition to the current options for antialiasing...
a nice simple option for antialiasing might be to have the same selection options as "edges" on the property menu of the object... ie: silouette, surface edges etc...
this would allow each object to be antialiased independantly (if wanted) and could also be put on the camera properties panel as a global effect (that overrides all individual object based settings, if one does not wish to set custom antialiasing on each object).
just an idea.
Daniel

Awesome to hear that updates are int he works!!!!

ali
11-19-2004, 09:25 PM
Before Version 9 , I hope Newtek will think of architectural visualisation, because it is still very far from some other 3d packages. LW8 is a gift to character animators. But there are many missing points that have to be fixed. I and some other friends had mentioned before and I here define again some of them:
-Instances in Modeler.
-Block / External Reference (in Autocad, Viz, Max) have to be considered and have to be put in LW anyway.
-Aligning and translate controls in Layout should be improved.
-Snap tools should be added. (Midpoint, Perpendicular, etc.)
-Working with edges must be easy, etc.......
Newtek have to hire someone to check CAD softwares and understand what point they are today, and add LW new features.
I wish Newtek considers architectural visualisation, not only movie and tv industry.

At least, Newtek should announce that LW will be specified on character animation. And we shouldn't wait for improvements in our branch, and start looking for another package. Sorry, but I have to define that, I still think the upgrade of LW8 is disappointing, and will leave using LW unless satisfactory upgrades are not made until LW9.

Newtek should work hard to make these improvements, because i know it isn't so easy to do.

I like to use LW, but only in small projects. I still use Autodesk Viz for big projects, because of instances, blocks, external references.

webhead
11-19-2004, 10:24 PM
LW 8.2 sounds good! Anything happening with the open GL problem?

EternalAnimator
11-20-2004, 08:22 AM
It didn't say so in the release info Peter posted but there is a FREE set of tools
you can use to accomplist this in Lightwave!

See this thread for details: http://www.spinquad.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3893

Or go directly to Marvin's site for the docs and download
here: http://amber.rc.arizona.edu/lw/normalmaps.html


Oh, I have the normal mapper plugin already...I guess my request for a future update would be for advanced collision FX on complex objects such as an oil drum. Or perhaps an option that would allow me to bend something like a pipe or making the door bend when some guy ripping through it, a la Doom 3..

---ZENO---
11-20-2004, 08:57 AM
Fantastic news!

What a team!




Cheers

Signal to Noise
11-20-2004, 09:01 AM
And let's not forget about fixing things that's been "broke" since the ver. 7.5 updates. Namely Cycler.

And there's been lot's of other reported bugs that need resolve as well, especially in Motion Mixer and Scene Editor panels. There's numerous specific threads on these elsewhere on the forums. Hopefully NT are paying attention to everything. :)

P Jespersen
11-20-2004, 10:28 AM
Ali,
We are trying to get improvements out as we finish them and sometimes what we get to first is not dictated by market pressure or personal preference. ;)
There are dependencies we have to be aware of as we re-write and do our best to avoid the design mistakes made before.

With that said, there are many tool/feature "commonalities" between architectural visualisation, tv/movie, games.....ect.
Any of the items on your list would serve ALL of our users in one way or another.
Many of our customers use LightWave for different types of technical, industrial or artistic visualisation not just character animation.
A lot of their great work ends up in print , intructional videos, interactive media....... things other than movies or tv.

We are working VERY hard to make improvements, but these improvements are not just feature based. Many are core to LightWave's functionality and it's extensibility.
These improvements will not only allow NewTek to provide new tools and features faster but also 3rd parties who's interests and future lay in more specialized areas.

I hope you keep LightWave in your production pipeline as one of the tools that helps you stand out in your corner of the graphics world.

Peter

Peter Jespersen
3D Project Manager
NewTek

sadkkf
11-20-2004, 10:53 AM
The Most Bang for the Buck award still goes to LightWave.

It can do more with less investment than most packages. For us basement animator types, that counts for a lot. As for us developer types, we know it's simply not possible to please everyone all of the time. Offering a streamlined method for third parties to offer the newest, shiniest feature is a great alternative.

Party on, NewTek! :D

Roque
11-20-2004, 11:04 AM
Hi Proton!, we fix this problem in 8.2?
Really is a serious problem in productions with many characters.
Maybe hidden feature "IK step size"?

more details about this big problem in:
http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=161655&highlight=parkinson
http://www.spinquad.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=33328#post33328

Sorry, upgrade its great!, new features are welcome, but i think that some problems need attention.

Roque.

harlan
11-20-2004, 11:07 AM
Gee... I must have misread the title of this thread. I was under the impression that it was a product announcement, not a call for Feature Requests. Come on people, use your friggin noggins, that's why you've got them - place your feature requests where they belong, not here!

ciao

PS - I know, I need to update my signature, but I'm busy

Exper
11-20-2004, 11:40 AM
We are working VERY hard to make improvements, but these improvements are not just feature based. Many are core to LightWave's functionality and it's extensibility.
These improvements will not only allow NewTek to provide new tools and features faster but also 3rd parties who's interests and future lay in more specialized areas.Hey... Peter... more jelly beans please! :cool:

#lwrs_web
11-20-2004, 12:47 PM
[list]
...
8.21
8.4
8.41
....


BTW:
Versions are denoted using a standard triplet of integers: MAJOR.MINOR.PATCH

8.2.1
8.4.0
8.4.1

There could also be a 8.21.0, so don't forget to add that extra dot ;)

jkushwara
11-20-2004, 08:07 PM
Great effort and news Peter ! The UV sub patch "fix" alone is just awesome - there's nothing I love more than a software company (or 3d proj. manager) that has the vision to address old "core" issues instead of going for the "more features quick buck".

Librarian
11-20-2004, 09:33 PM
Good news.
I like the new 'give the users what they want'-attitude.
That´s the way to go.

AVT
11-20-2004, 11:43 PM
There is a thing in Modeler that I absolutely hate since I started LW first time. "Clear-all-carefully-selected-points\polys-just-because-You-have-clicked-in-the-wrong-section-of-LW-interface".
There is no Undo for "clear selection" operation, so .... maybe this is what I really hate in that feature LW. I know, this is really old classic feature, clearing selection when clicking on gray section of LW interface, but I always doing this using special assigned button. PLEASE, NEWTEK, MAKE IT OPTIONAL!!! I think it will be an easy task.
After all, it will be really nice to have ability to select wireframe color for background objects or see them as solid polygons. Also it will be nice to have an option to select anything on the other side of object, even if there is a polygons that doesnt allow me to do that. I`m speaking of special optional mode, that allows to select points\polygons in any of solid OpenGL modes (textured, sketch, flat shade) just like wireframe mode.
And it will be a good idea to add History window to Modeler, just like one in Photoshop, because many scripts or plugins requires many Undo`s in order to Undo them completely and sometimes it is uneasy task to fugure out, how many times I have to press Undo, 8 or 9.

jalaska
11-21-2004, 01:24 AM
The UV Update will be great!
UV subpatch options will really make Lightwave more user friendly :) And the added UV color options will really be good for fast editing. I think UV mapping was one of the most neglected things in the past, but I am really impressed with the way Newtek is coding options and additions to the UV code in Lightwave.

Thanks.

Matt
11-21-2004, 07:43 AM
Gee... I must have misread the title of this thread. I was under the impression that it was a product announcement, not a call for Feature Requests. Come on people, use your friggin noggins, that's why you've got them - place your feature requests where they belong, not here!


Totally agree!

janoverust
11-21-2004, 01:04 PM
For LW 8.5 I want a free Guinness every time I start modeler... ;)

Give me a N.
Give me an E...

retinajoy
11-21-2004, 02:55 PM
For LW 8.5 I want a free Guinness every time I start modeler... ;)


I want a free Guinness with every update!!! :D

The ripper
11-22-2004, 04:04 AM
SDK Changes!

In our quest to make the life of third party LightWave developers a bit easier, there have been approximately 22 additions/changes made to LightWave’s SDK. This is the start of a general re-work of the SDK that will give developers the ability to provide better and more powerful plugins to the LightWave community.

Peter Jespersen
3D Project Manager

Very good news... among those additions/changes, are they any about "rayCast functions" wich would allow developers to make shaders like true BSSRDF ?

The ripper.

Hervé
11-22-2004, 04:21 AM
cool.... now let's guess WHEN the new baby will be in the download section.... :D

Tiger
11-22-2004, 12:24 PM
cool.... now let's guess WHEN the new baby will be in the download section.... :D

Hmmm...I think it will appear 19/dec. 2004.
:)

Pensart
11-22-2004, 12:50 PM
WOW, just found out the great news :p
The new uv options make me very happy, thanks newtek team!!

bishop
11-22-2004, 08:57 PM
I completely agree about the architectural modeling problems. The rendering engine is fantastic, but converting from architectural models in CAD to LW is so troublesome!

IgnusFast
11-22-2004, 11:24 PM
Maybe I'm just greedy, but what happened to 8.1? If you're going to adapt a numbering scheme for revisions, at least stick to it...

Cman
11-23-2004, 07:21 AM
Maybe I'm just greedy, but what happened to 8.1? If you're going to adapt a numbering scheme for revisions, at least stick to it...

LOL! That's pretty funny. :D

I wonder if it's not just a typo, or was there an 8.1 that only went to "special" customers instead of us rank-and-file, "not-so-special" customers.

Karmacop
11-23-2004, 07:38 AM
8.1 would probably be an internal or beta release. Odd numbers are for adding features, even numbers are for fixing bugs (and thus releasing to the public) :)

Pangloss
11-23-2004, 07:39 AM
Wow, the reasons to upgrade to 8.x are mounting! It's nice to see some changes that weren't already available as free 3rd party plugins for 7.5!

Para
11-23-2004, 07:45 AM
8.1 would probably be an internal or beta release. Odd numbers are for adding features, even numbers are for fixing bugs (and thus releasing to the public) :)

Yeah and promoting version 8.1 after 8.0.1 would certainly confuse a lot of people.

Jamel
11-23-2004, 02:15 PM
**** this sucks for me if the update is going to be on the website. I never got 8.0.1 update. Just wouldnt work for me ohh well ill just have to wait for an other cd upgrade :(

hrgiger
11-23-2004, 04:30 PM
And if my highly educated and astoundingly perceptive guess is correct "more
than a few of these planned" would look like this when expanded:


8.21
8.4
8.41
8.6
8.61
8.8
8.81
9.0
9.01

"Deducting reasoning", heh! Junk science! Hehehe j/k :D

:cool:

Hmmm, you have 7 point releases listed before version 9.0 is released which pretty much shows my orginal estimate of 4 -7 releases is dead on. Never underestimate the science of semantic dissection! Ha!

Steve :)

TheDevil
11-24-2004, 05:33 AM
This is terrible news :mad: for the naysayers :D :p

I bet some will complain and say "How dare Newtek move forward now with all these great improvements, when I have already wasted money on jumping ship to Orange 4D and Softpie CSI. Humbug Newtek!!!"

:D

P.S. I want the animation export from my brain to work properly in LW and in the correct layer order.

mattclary
11-24-2004, 06:52 AM
.01 releases are pretty much "emergency" fixes. Hopefully, we will only see .X releases.

Emergency fixes take development and quality assurance time away from main code changes.

Phil
11-24-2004, 09:16 AM
.01 releases are pretty much "emergency" fixes. Hopefully, we will only see .X releases.

Emergency fixes take development and quality assurance time away from main code changes.

The silver lining from an emergency release is that the QA team gets a swift kick up the bum for failing to sufficiently test the product in the first place. There has traditionally been a need for NT to ship a 'brown paper bag' release after a major launch : 6.0 -> 6.0b and 7.0 -> 7.0b are good examples. Even 8.0 required a 'b' release (8.0.1) to patch up various bugs (some from 7.5 or earlier; others from 8.0 alone). I'm waiting to see how well QA will shape up to this more aggressive release strategy from NT.

8.0 wasn't a strong release for bug fixes in my eyes, although 8.0.1 appears to have done better in that regard as it should have done. Hopefully, we'll also begin to see an acknowledgement of what remains broken / suboptimal in the release notes with 8.2.....it would save a lot of frustration knowing that an issue is in fact being worked on.

anieves
11-24-2004, 11:42 AM
**** this sucks for me if the update is going to be on the website. I never got 8.0.1 update. Just wouldnt work for me ohh well ill just have to wait for an other cd upgrade :(

that's odd, I have downloaded the thing 3 times... twice at work once at home... no problems. Call CS.

Shrp77
11-24-2004, 12:21 PM
Just wondering if the SDK will include setup / config instructions for use with Borland compilers (like C++ builder, or Turbo C)?

Thanks

Jamel
11-24-2004, 02:49 PM
that's odd, I have downloaded the thing 3 times... twice at work once at home... no problems. Call CS.
I all ready called them they have no idea why it wont load. I mean i try to it says wait for your download and it just never loads. oh well ill just do with out :confused:

LFGabel
11-24-2004, 06:13 PM
What browser/version are you using? Latest IE6 seems to work for me.

AVT
11-24-2004, 11:54 PM
I think there is a several things in LW interface, that should be improved in LW8.2

- Keyframes in "Dope track" is too small! Its hard to pick them up and drag (dragging works too fast). Keyframes in "Dope track" must be wider, just like "Dope sheet" and user dont have to select time range in order to select and move one keyframe.

- There is no way to delete keyframes when using sliders. Why??? I dont get it... Why I cant just click on the key button (like one in "Morph mixer") and delete the key? I can create it easely by moving slider but in order to delete it i have to open graph editor, find and delete it by hand .... thats awful....

- F9 must be accesible when editing any string (just like G2). Maybe any of F1- F12 should be accessible too.

- "Show rendering in progress" must be 640x480 by default or let it remember my settings. Now it drops to 320x240 when next started - BUG maybe?

- "Mosaic" mode should be used by default in VIPER or let it remember my settings. How about UV support for subpatches?

- Why there is no minisliders for setting up timeline working range? Do we really have to enter numbers here instead of easy mouse move?!

- Open GL textures creation is VERY SLOW an sometimes there is no indication about this process going on! I think often that LW is hang up already... I know there is a plenty of time needed for correct downsampling of big textures but in 99% of all cases NOBODY NEEDS IT. I trying to not use "Texture" mode, because I dont want to wait 2 minutes every time I turning it on (I`m using BIG textures). Please, add "Fast & dirt OpenGL texture creadion" option! That option have to create textures with missed pixels (from original) but will save many nerves when waiting!

- There in no support for Lens Flares in VIPER. Why? It would be very nice to setup it with realtime feedback.

I hope this issues will be fixed in LW 8.2

badllarma
11-25-2004, 12:44 AM
- There is no way to delete keyframes when using sliders. Why??? I dont get it... Why I cant just click on the key button (like one in "Morph mixer") and delete the key? I can create it easely by moving slider but in order to delete it i have to open graph editor, find and delete it by hand .... thats awful....



Well said that man!! Having just completed some charater work where I have been using sliders this has been driving me NUTS!!! :eek:

jaeckel
11-25-2004, 02:12 AM
- Why there is no minisliders for setting up timeline working range? Do we really have to enter numbers here instead of easy mouse move?!



In wath range should that minislider work? From -1000000000 to 10000000000 ?
That will be a fine minislider ...

Karmacop
11-25-2004, 06:06 AM
By mini slider I think think he meant one of those ones that is just a single button and you can drag left or right, there is no actual slider. One of these type of mini sliders would also be useful on the x y z/h p b channels.

Lightwolf
11-25-2004, 06:30 AM
One of these type of mini sliders would also be useful on the x y z/h p b channels.
But only if you give me a little [E] next to each one first ;)

Cheers,
Mike

Karmacop
11-25-2004, 08:50 AM
Is it that hard to click on the graph editor? :p

Lightwolf
11-25-2004, 08:59 AM
Is it that hard to click on the graph editor? :p
Is is that hard to use the left or right mouse button to change a value? ;) Or for that matter, to grab a handle?
Seriously though, try getting just _one_ animated channel of an object into GE quickly, and you'll see what I mean :)
Also, you could quickly shift-rmb on it to remove the animation on _one_ channel, etc...
Cheers,
Mike

Karmacop
11-25-2004, 04:11 PM
I know, but we can't have too many buttons down there :)

How about if you could right click on numeric input and the popup would allow you to view single channel, and remove all keyframes?

faulknermano
11-26-2004, 12:27 AM
Seriously though, try getting just _one_ animated channel of an object into GE quickly, and you'll see what I mean :)


wha? you guys lost your programming selves or what???



generic
{
s = Scene().firstSelect();
c = s.firstChannel();
while(c)
{
if(c.name == "Position.X")
{
str = string("GE_SetEnv ",s.name,".",c.name," 1");
info(str);
CommandInput(str);
break;
}
c = s.next();
}

}


in maya you have this functionality where, after selecting the channel in the channel box, holding down the MMB and dragging left and right will it make act like as if you had a minislider. rather useful, actually.

i prefer, however, a hold-down-type key for each channel (specifiable, of course). for instance, if you want to modify Rotation.P, hold down 5 and LMB or MMB or RMB and pitch is modified as you drag. release 5 and the you go back to the normal mouse functions.

Lightwolf
11-26-2004, 03:14 AM
wha? you guys lost your programming selves or what???
So, how do I add the little [E] functionality to the numerics in LScript then ? ;)
Or should I just add them to another tab, which makes it almost just a slow as the current approach? Or shortcuts?
Hehe, I mean , basically you're right, but it doesn't do it in this case...


i prefer, however, a hold-down-type key for each channel (specifiable, of course). for instance, if you want to modify Rotation.P, hold down 5 and LMB or MMB or RMB and pitch is modified as you drag. release 5 and the you go back to the normal mouse functions.
Well, since we are talking about single channels here, ALT as a modifier and mouse left/right would for example do as well imho. RMB wouldn't work because that is where the standard input context menu sits on PCs (cut, copy, pase, undo). Then again extending the [E] with a menu like in some parts of LW8 ... :)

Cheers,
Mike

EmperorPete
11-26-2004, 05:34 AM
I want a free Guinness with every update!!! :D
I just want a free Guinness ;)
This update is sounding good, guys, especially the new AA options which should save me some time. I look forward to getting my hands on it :)

G3D
11-26-2004, 10:39 AM
allow the pale yellow selected polygon color to be user editable in the next release. Yellow on gray is had to see in many situations. This is both in Modeler and Layout.

faulknermano
11-26-2004, 11:03 PM
So, how do I add the little [E] functionality to the numerics in LScript then ? ;)


that's not as easy but certainly doable. but if it was part of the lscript feature i'm sure it would be a bit more convenient. i think the [E] functionality (in regards to lscript) is just an automation of creating an envelope. you'd still have to old that envelope proxy so you can do something with it. (...if i'm understanding the discussion at all... :D )


Well, since we are talking about single channels here, ALT as a modifier and mouse left/right would for example do as well imho. RMB wouldn't work because that is where the standard input context menu sits on PCs (cut, copy, pase, undo).

the idea i shared was mainly based on maya. in fact, the whole key system of maya is like this. it has events for keyPress and KeyRelease. the whole system is sensitive to that (except for shift alt and control modifiers, which are exclusively for navigation). i'd like something like that for lw. :)

Lightwolf
11-27-2004, 10:07 AM
Hi faulknermano,
sorry for tugging your leg ;)

that's not as easy but certainly doable. but if it was part of the lscript feature i'm sure it would be a bit more convenient. i think the [E] functionality (in regards to lscript) is just an automation of creating an envelope. you'd still have to old that envelope proxy so you can do something with it. (...if i'm understanding the discussion at all... :D )
Actually, my point was: "How to I actually add the [E] to the numerics ui in Layout using LScript?" - more of a rethorical question than anything else.
While a lot of things can be cludged in (like your script for example), there is just no way to change ui layouts from the outside, so this is more of a core feature request.

I 100% agree with you on the other point. And while we're on it: Visual feedback in the input area on the status of the underlying envelope (animated or not, on a keyframe or not) - plus a way to add keyframes by just entering new values on _all_ inputs ... aaahhhh :D

Cheers,
Mike - he who thinks that sometimes the little things make a big difference

Exper
11-27-2004, 10:31 AM
Mike - he who thinks that sometimes the little things make a big differenceExper - who thinks that always the little things make a big difference! :eek:

Lightwolf
11-27-2004, 11:48 AM
LOL

Cheers,
Mike

faulknermano
11-27-2004, 09:16 PM
Hi faulknermano,
there is just no way to change ui layouts from the outside, so this is more of a core feature request.



ah.. i see. THAT is an ambitious request given the current abilities of lw. in maya, i'm fairly certain ("fairly certain" because "i havent done it") it may be possible to use viewports as a means for UI creation, but i dont "think" you can change the core GUI, like channel box, layer panel and tool bars, hypershade, etc.

what will be interesting as well: some people, like me, have requested current windows (Graph Editor, Scene Editor) to be dockable to current viewports. it wouldnt hurt to be able to have lscript (or plugins for that matter) to attach to these viewports as well.. just thinking. :) i suspect an overall "core" change here as well.

Lightwolf
11-29-2004, 03:23 AM
Hi faulknermano,
we are getting seriously OT here, but what the heck :)
One thing I'd love to see in the (probably far) future is an entirely customizeable ui, probably based on XML or something like that. Yeah, I know X** has that, and m*** from l**** (self-concorship here :) ), allows for that too.
Just imagine if ever panel layout would be stored externally to the app, and you could edit it, adding custom functionality ...

So, how is 8.2 doing? (lame attempt to get back on-topic).

Cheers,
Mike

Exper
11-29-2004, 03:31 AM
Centrifugal force cannot be stopped before the crash! :D

faulknermano
11-29-2004, 03:33 AM
Hi faulknermano,
we are getting seriously OT here, but what the heck :)
One thing I'd love to see in the (probably far) future is an entirely customizeable ui, probably based on XML or something like that. Yeah, I know X** has that, and m*** from l**** (self-concorship here :) ), allows for that too.
Just imagine if ever panel layout would be stored externally to the app, and you could edit it, adding custom functionality ...

So, how is 8.2 doing? (lame attempt to get back on-topic).

Cheers,
Mike

LW 8.2 pushing LW X. :D

you're right on. i think the future in any serious 3d app would be transparency of its power to non-programmatically inclined users. i think that UI should go beyond GUI. the more modular the interface is (not GUI, per se), the better it should get, in principle.

whats l****? :D

Karmacop
11-29-2004, 06:47 AM
They should use something like XUL, which is used in the Mozilla project ;)

lwaddict
11-29-2004, 08:13 AM
Ah ah ahhhhhhhhhhh...
if you guys give him the "E",
then give us the "T" as well...

should be able to get some interesting dynamics with the "T" in there as well.

:D

Lightwolf
11-29-2004, 08:19 AM
should be able to get some interesting dynamics with the "T" in there as well.

Channel modifier -> Texture :D (or the motion panel, whatever you need...)

Cheers,
Mike

Chris S. (Fez)
11-29-2004, 10:17 AM
Release it already! I have been busily unwrapping UVs all morning and am one "unweld" session away from self-combustion. :)

AVT
11-29-2004, 04:46 PM
- Sometimes its too hard to find currently selected item in Scene Editor when hierarchy is too complex. Autofind function needed, which can collapse all other channels, expand all parents of selected one and scroll view to show it.
- When changing Layer Type or pressing Automatic Sizing button, confirmation is needed ( I`m loosing all my layer settings, isnt it? I should be warned.)
- Normal blending mode in Bump texture doesnt work as Normal, it looks like Additive instead. I just cant use gradients here and, for example, overwrite previous layer with zero values - it wont work, because of that "additivity" of bump layers.
- When opening Texture Editor, keyboard input focus often jumps to second parameter of procedural texture ("Frequencies", "Wave Sources" or whatever else placed here), it prevents me from pressing F9, i have to press Enter or close that window before rendering.
- Surf Mixer slows down rendering, because renderer always thinks that it is doublesided surface. Bad decision.
- When using Special Buffers options, there is no hint, which buffer belongs to which filter in current scene. It was filter names in LW5 surface editor, instead of "Special Buffer 1...4" in LW8. LW5 way was better, I think.
- Additive Transparency works completely wrong, when used with Transparency around 40 - 60 %. Surface becomes opaque, looks it is a old bug.
- I think right-click popup menu would work much better in Texture Editor, than that Copy/Paste/Remove controls.
- VIPER works very slow with heavy geometry in scene, it freeses computer for 5-10 second before each update. Sometimes its faster to press F9 instead.
- Why I cant use Scale/Position/Rotaton/Faloff stuff when using UV projection layer? Sometimes I need to change scale of UV or shift it right now, in Layout. It could be animated that way. Lets use X channel to control U, and Y channel for V !
- "Constrain proportions" checkbox in Scale tab is highly needed!
- Why there is no "Diffuse lighting", "Specular lighting" and "Shadow strength" parameters for Gradient layers?
- VIPER loses resolution, when changing to 160x120 and back to 640x480.
- Why there is no special quick render mode for VIPER only, when I press Render button in VIPER and it asks me to rerender all scene. It should start render my scene in current VIPER resolution, with all shadows, reflections, antialiasing and radiosity turned off.
- Point/Polygon selection in Modeler SDK works too slow! It demonstrates me selection process for each point\polygon. Well, maybe its good for demo purposes, but can it select all items in once when "me->done( me->state, 0, 0 );" is called?
- Subdivision Order must be "Last" by default (small, but annoying thing).
- Interface panels for Object Properties is very big. Could Newtek programmers increase number of lines in Custom Objects and Displacement list?
- Displacement map for object could be used only along one Displacement Axis (which is very strange, becouse procedurals textures are 3D). It would be great to add "All" and "Normal" axis modes!
- Render window should display CORRECT elapsed time from beginning of rendering. There is an error in SDK, when I trying to use system monitor in Layout, Lightwave shows completely wrong rendering time when finished.

spec24
12-02-2004, 11:06 AM
Glad to hear these improvements are coming. Maybe I'll hold off on going to another product. :) When 8 came out and these issues were still there I was horribly disappointed - hope the improvements keep coming! Thanks!

Chrusion
12-02-2004, 11:45 AM
- Displacement map for object could be used only along one Displacement Axis (which is very strange, becouse procedurals textures are 3D). It would be great to add "All" and "Normal" axis modes!


I was informed earlier this year why this is so. It stems from how the procedural textures were written. Yes, proc. txtrs are "3D", but are so only in VALUE SPACE... that is, color, opacity, diffuse, etc. ie. FLOATING POINT values. A dmap requires VECTORS to define the DIRECTION in which to MOVE a vertex. Since the proc. txtrs aren't written to support true vectored dmaps, you are thus left with a forced axis selection in which the floating point value of the texture at point x, y, z is combined with the direction axis to create a vector.

True, all the txtrs could be rewritten to produce bump normal vectors (like the original fractal noise), but then they would be much slower in rendering.

One can use the Normal Displacement plugin to work around this limitation. It basically gathers vectors for all the normals of the object's vertices and uses them along with the texture value to move vertices along their existing normal. Slow, but it works. I think the plugin has been revised to be far faster than it was in 7.x

Red_Oddity
12-02-2004, 01:26 PM
I believe Lynx programmed a better (and faster) Normal Displacement plugin

sleeperwp
12-03-2004, 09:08 AM
Great, but what about the blue logo shirts?

Chris S. (Fez)
12-04-2004, 11:59 AM
I think an awesome 8.2 surprise would be the ability to see transparency in Modeler...

Ztreem
12-04-2004, 03:49 PM
I think an awesome 8.2 surprise would be the ability to see transparency in Modeler...

I'll would rather see reflections in modeler, or why not everything layout can do. :D

Ramon
12-05-2004, 10:46 AM
Thanks for all the hard work on LW (it's an ECELLENT program and still ranks among the best IMO) Thanks for the increase in AA speeds!
However, PLEASE, as soon as you guys can, implement:
1. Ngons that seemlessly work in Subpatch mode.
2. Edge Weights and edge functions.
3. Hierarchal SubD's would be real nice.
4. Subpixel displacement for much better use of displacement maps - This makes for a much more realistic and effecient model.

These are the modeling areas where LW is getting left behind by the likes of Maya and a few others. LW has always been renown for it's modeling. I hate to see that aspect of it fall behind.
Thanks for all your work. You programmers amaze me! That's some real skill. :)

Klowno
12-05-2004, 12:12 PM
What he(Ramon) said :)

Even though I have another application now I still wan't Lightwave to
be the best again modeling wise. If subd's(with all what that means, like edges and stuff) would be in Lightwave it would be hard to beat imo, but this I guess you allready know ;) .

This is though a great update, and I respect your hard work behind it Newtek.

The subpatch UV thingy will be greatly appriciated.

AVT
12-09-2004, 06:35 PM
- Master Plugins panel doesnt updates when external (by Lscript) changes takes place. Its very buggy and crashes often when changes takes place. Dragging wont work here.
- Graph Editor cant track item selection correctly when Proxy objects is used.
- There must be an option for toggling only between tools "Move"/"Rotate" by mouse wheel (most used when animating), instead of toggling between "Move"/"Rotate"/"Size"/"Stretch".
- When starting rendering animation, LW asks for turning off Render Display, but doesnt restore it after rendering! It constantly asks me to set render end frame to the slider end frame, when it differs - its VERY stupid, I know what i`m doing (Expert mode turned on)! I just hate that message...

AVT
12-09-2004, 08:13 PM
- Scene Editor has a problem with custom banks, when creating one, using it, saving and loading scene. It disappears.
- Dope Sheet has no ability to set numerically first and last frame of selection range. "Select All in time range" numerical option needed.
- Dope Sheet crashes often when trying to select long list of keyframes, when window needs to scroll down. There seems to be a problem with vertical scrollbar, just try to select vertically as big as You can...

Kvaalen
12-10-2004, 05:10 AM
Please! There is a whole forum for feature requests. Why clutter this thread?

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=27

You must agree with me it's a silly thing to do!

Hervé
12-10-2004, 05:32 AM
yeah please dont electrolize that thread.... :D

anieves
12-10-2004, 08:34 AM
Release it already! I have been busily unwrapping UVs all morning and am one "unweld" session away from self-combustion. :)

Same here! 7 characters to unwrap here. I want 8.2 NOW! :)

retinajoy
12-10-2004, 08:45 AM
I hope I get to play with 8.2 before I vanish for about two months very soon.

;)

AVT
12-10-2004, 04:15 PM
Kvaalen , it looks like people from Newtek NEVER READS THREADS WITH USER REQUESTS AND BUG REPORTS, so I decided to put my requests and reports here. After all, I really want to see them fixed in LW8.2 . Newtek plays its own silly stupid games for last 4 years and dont want to fix even the smallest of the old bugs, maybe new developer team will show us the way programmers must work (I am programmer and I think there are many bugs in LW which can be fixed in one working day, but we waiting for years instead).

Chuck
12-10-2004, 04:30 PM
Kvaalen , it looks like people from Newtek NEVER READS THREADS WITH USER REQUESTS AND BUG REPORTS, so I decided to put my requests and reports here. After all, I really want to see them fixed in LW8.2 . Newtek plays its own silly stupid games for last 4 years and dont want to fix even the smallest of the old bugs, maybe new developer team will show us the way programmers must work (I am programmer and I think there are many bugs in LW which can be fixed in one working day, but we waiting for years instead).


That assertion that NewTek never reads threads with bug reports or feature requests is completely untrue, thankfully. Both marketing and development staff read the forums and that includes the support sections where suspected bugs should be discussed and the feature request forums. In terms of fixes, every new iteration of LightWave has included as many fixes as the team can manage and certainly with every effort to eliminate those that would be of highest priority to our customers.

The new team is proceeding very actively with fixes, as the list of fixes for 8.0.1 demonstrates, and lists will be included from this point on so you will be able determine quickly of a matter of concern for you has been addressed. If it hasn't and if you have any doubt that we are aware of a particular issue, then by all means report it to our technical support staff - they will test and confirm the issue and insure that it gets on the list for development to address.

Elmar Moelzer
12-10-2004, 06:49 PM
Hello!
I may not have the time to reply all the time, but I read all of the feature requests and bug- reports and take notes.
CU
Elmar

Ade
12-10-2004, 11:52 PM
That assertion that NewTek never reads threads with bug reports or feature requests is completely untrue, thankfully. Both marketing and development staff read the forums and that includes the support sections where suspected bugs should be discussed and the feature request forums. In terms of fixes, every new iteration of LightWave has included as many fixes as the team can manage and certainly with every effort to eliminate those that would be of highest priority to our customers.

The new team is proceeding very actively with fixes, as the list of fixes for 8.0.1 demonstrates, and lists will be included from this point on so you will be able determine quickly of a matter of concern for you has been addressed. If it hasn't and if you have any doubt that we are aware of a particular issue, then by all means report it to our technical support staff - they will test and confirm the issue and insure that it gets on the list for development to address.

The NEW Newtek does... They have even been working with worley to get their SDK'super and have been good with the mac community.
Thats why they are working on a LW 64bit OSX...hehe

Nemoid
12-11-2004, 01:31 AM
Hey Nt guys!

maybe a sticky thread with some advices and the emails addresses for users to send bug reports and feature request could do a good job in Nt forums?
i'm personally tired to see these "Nt doesn't read posts "
complaints.

obviously people would post both here , where Nt team could reply publicly and both send you guys good emails with bug and feature lists to allow you to work better.

Writing this because this could help you guys and Lw developing BTW ;)

Exper
12-11-2004, 04:53 AM
Hey Nt guys!

maybe a sticky thread with some advices and the emails addresses for users to send bug reports and feature request could do a good job in Nt forums?
i'm personally tired to see these "Nt doesn't read posts "
complaints.More than agree! :)

@AVT: I can say that they read (Chuck, Deuce, Elmar and Ben... al least).
The "new" NT is working hard... give them a little more time... don't ask for miracles... they're human as we are... too!

Phil
12-11-2004, 07:26 AM
The new team is proceeding very actively with fixes, as the list of fixes for 8.0.1 demonstrates, and lists will be included from this point on so you will be able determine quickly of a matter of concern for you has been addressed. If it hasn't and if you have any doubt that we are aware of a particular issue, then by all means report it to our technical support staff - they will test and confirm the issue and insure that it gets on the list for development to address.

That highlighted part is very good news indeed. I'm really glad that this apparent change in policy has been made as it will eliminate all kinds of post-update/release frustration.

blabberlicious
12-11-2004, 10:26 AM
That highlighted part is very good news indeed. I'm really glad that this apparent change in policy has been made as it will eliminate all kinds of post-update/release frustration.

Hurrah. I've been asking for that for so long.

I guess that's why they are employing a 2nd mac guy; to compile the bug list....

Only joking :-)

Keep up the good work....looking foward to 8.2.

AVT
12-11-2004, 11:25 PM
Well, looks like I was wrong about new Newtek team (I`m really happy to see it), but the old team was not so good. Sorry about last post, I was in awful mood that day... Still waiting for LW8.2 (any news about release date ?)

AVT
12-11-2004, 11:39 PM
- One small thing is highly needed right now: Surface Editor in Modeler must have an option to track polygon selection, every time when I select polygon its material name must be selected in Surface Editor. It could be multiple material selection, if many different polygons selected or just the first selected. It would be really helpful when working with HUGE list of materials.

- Option to hide locked objects from item list in Layout will be highly appreciated. I have a big character rig, many nulls and bones, many of them are locked, but I still can see them in item list (at the bottom) and its hard to find the needed one.

policarpo
12-11-2004, 11:49 PM
Personally I think NT should just go into a cave for 6 months, keep silent and emerge in LA @ Siggraph with something none of us ever expected.

But maybe that's me.

I love the drama and the passion of creation. Keep up the good work guys and gals!!

:D

Hervé
12-12-2004, 01:41 AM
I am like you Policarpo.... like I am more interested in the Rembrandt INS&OUTS of his painter life than the finished product itself... when something is finished, then creation has died... :)

but.... I 'd lock them in a vey high tower, this way they could keep an eye on the others.... :p

Karmacop
12-12-2004, 06:53 AM
I like the idea of locking them in a cave for 6 months and coming out with somehting amazing ... but I want my 8.2 update first :p

policarpo
12-12-2004, 09:21 AM
Let me rephrase things a bit.

In a cave on the peak of a mountain with a view of world with all the luxuries life can afford so they can concentrate and bring to us mere mortals the alchemist's grail.

It could be a sort of Allegory of the Cave meets Prometheus PR story if you will. :D

AVT
12-12-2004, 11:20 PM
- "Triple" in Modeler doesnt want to triple subpatches. I had to write special script to fix that.
- "Drag Net" wont work with curves. Its VERY strange, because I didnt find too many differences in LW SDK between curves and other polygon types. Actually, there is no difference at all, when working with polygon points.
- "One undo" for any command is HIGHLY NEEDED! Even if plugin uses many mesh edit commands, it would be cool to undo them all at once. Its easier to implement than everybody thinks. Let Modeler count how many commands and mesh edits was used in time of plugin execution, and let it automatically undo it all, when I press "u" button. I just hate to press "u" 21 times and watch when I have to stop.
- Undo for selection changes. I had to write special scripts for "deselect"/"select inverse"/etc. commands, that allowed me to undo them in some cases (it performs "move(<0,0,0>)" before selection change). Thats not right, there must be a support in Modeler. And one more time - PLEASE, DISABLE OR MAKE OPTIONAL THAT AWFUL FEATURE, WHEN SELECTION AND TOOLS DROPS BY CLICKING IN GRAY UI AREA, its makes me crazy. It kills hours of my non-stop work with MagicBevel. 5 hours of complex hair modelling with MagicBevel only, without dropping tool or selection, and suddently I missed and clicked on the UI area.... Dont get me wrong, but in that moment I wanted to kill the guy who developed that "click-and-die feature".
- Option for disabling or tuning backlight in Perspective window in Modeler will be useful (it will look just like in LW5 OpenGL mode). Sometimes it good to turn the second light off and look at the model with more contrast lighting. It will work a little faster, after all.
- When creating patches, UV generation is highly needed. Subpath generation would be very nice too.

private
12-13-2004, 06:11 AM
Please post your scripts.

BeeVee
12-13-2004, 06:15 AM
...but not to this thread please. This is a thread to discuss the emergence of LightWave 8.2, not a feature request or 3rd party thread. Keep it on topic please.

B

Hervé
12-13-2004, 09:26 AM
.... but WHEN is the emergence...?

I think LW8,2 should be called "EMERGENCE POINT 2"

Is it going to be long Doctor...?

Question
Does the new AA resolves the "stairs FX" with diagonal lines...... very IMPORTANT :D maybe even more...

kntemplar
12-14-2004, 08:03 AM
Proton
post more videos
me luv videos

More videos and possibly a little more info on the release itself.
BTW I LOVE YOU GUYS! :eek:

Ztreem
12-14-2004, 08:12 AM
More videos and possibly a little more info on the release itself.

I totally agree, I want more, more, more, more....

I can't wait any longer, I want it now... :D

anieves
12-14-2004, 08:40 AM
man, I hope is out by the Christams break. ;)

Exper
12-14-2004, 09:20 AM
Crossed fingers! :D

Cman
12-14-2004, 11:09 AM
Maybe they're making MORE changes and it's going to be 8.5 instead of 8.2!?
(Just like 8.1 never appeared)

Panikos
12-14-2004, 05:04 PM
Traditionally there is a deadline for adding things and I assume this was over some time ago.
Peter made the announcement during the beta testing, so aparently they are trying to make the release more solid. I assume that they are about to release ...

hmmm Xmas will find us happy :)

gjjackson
12-14-2004, 07:30 PM
man, I hope is out by the Christams break. ;)

Don't hold your breath. I'll bet next year. Shall we take bets.

blabberlicious
12-15-2004, 04:34 AM
Don't hold your breath. I'll bet next year. Shall we take bets.

Yeah, then NT Insider could generate development money with some shady inside bets...

I remember making the same joke about this last year....

I hope the punch-line is different

;-)

Chris S. (Fez)
12-15-2004, 08:51 AM
Dude, where's my 8.2? How about the full feature and bug fix list. Speaking of which, I wonder if the unweldable (or whatever you wanna call em) UV's will be listed as both a bug fix and a feature...

chrisdz
12-15-2004, 11:58 AM
I think perhaps I may have formed a different connotative understanding of the phrase "coming soon" than was actually intended by the swell folks at NewTek.

Soon means... soon, right? I mean... nobody would announce something as coming soon, build excitement and interest, and then just disappear into the woodwork and not come through without actually releasing some thing "soon" or even "soon-ish"... right? Nobody would do that. That'd be... kooky.

ddho1981
12-15-2004, 01:09 PM
well, I still remember last december when hopes were high that LW8 was coming by christmas. And they [NT] almost made it except for it was released 5 months later . . . i'm not holding my breath. Granted, it's a point release and not a full version release, but still . . . i will continue to breathe.


I think perhaps I may have formed a different connotative understanding of the phrase "coming soon" than was actually intended by the swell folks at NewTek.

Soon means... soon, right? I mean... nobody would announce something as coming soon, build excitement and interest, and then just disappear into the woodwork and not come through without actually releasing some thing "soon" or even "soon-ish"... right? Nobody would do that. That'd be... kooky.

ufo3d
12-15-2004, 01:34 PM
when can we have the features/bugs list?

Alliante
12-15-2004, 02:29 PM
well, I still remember last december when hopes were high that LW8 was coming by christmas. And they [NT] almost made it except for it was released 5 months later . . . i'm not holding my breath. Granted, it's a point release and not a full version release, but still . . . i will continue to breathe.

Plus don't forget that they're not having to have the new team learn the old code.

I for one hate working after people coding wise....

harlan
12-15-2004, 04:08 PM
This lack of patience is most assuredly the reasoning behind not announcing an update until its ready to ship.

Chill folks. It'll be out when it's out - till then just enjoy the fact that you know whats coming down the pipeline. We don't want to scare them back into hiding.

colkai
12-16-2004, 02:27 AM
I for one hate working after people coding wise....

I hear you on that one, nothing worse than trying to figure out some peoples "unique" way of coding :eek:


This lack of patience is most assuredly the reasoning behind not announcing an update until its ready to ship.

Hit the nail on the head there, I'm sure Chuck is thinking some choice thoughts about now. As we often say "darned if ya don't, darned if ya do!" ;) (for some reason 'dam*ed' ..is considered offensive by the forum filter.)

Now to resort to my favourite phrase....
It will be out when it's out, and will contain what it contains. :p

nick2k
12-16-2004, 06:25 AM
Hey guys one thing id love to see in 8.2 is the metalink updated so we can build lowres objects that we deform with bones that then can be applied to a hires object, thats the first thing i tried in lightwave 8 with metalink but nope it didnt work unless you add softbodies or some kind of simulation on to it.

I noticed that it was a big new feature in 3d max and lightwaves should work the same? Super low poly rigging on to a high poly mesh :D sounds good to me and its almost there with it!!!

Nick

Mister NO
12-17-2004, 02:28 AM
AND WHAT ABOUT HISTORICAL SNAP TOOL.
LW SHOULD CREATED THAT TOOL 10 YEARS AGO!!! :mad:


sorry for my english! :D

Chris S. (Fez)
12-17-2004, 09:35 AM
Patience...must learn patience...