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jdavidbakr
10-04-2004, 07:26 PM
Having a strange problem with ParticleFX and HVs. Here is the skinny:

I create an emitter, move it around so that it leaves a nice trail of particles (think a rocket trail). Now, I want the particles to be 50mm on the front and grow to 1m over their life. So I put a gradient attached to particle size, which works fine in 7.5... but, when I put it in 8, the HV's do something really weird. Every third frame or so the newly emitted particles don't have any HVs attached to them until the following frame. So the end result is that every third frame or so my particles pop on at the head.

Anyone else experiencing this problem or know of a workaround (besides going back to 7.5)? :confused:

jdavidbakr
10-04-2004, 07:30 PM
OK, more info, it doesn't appear to have anything to do with the particle size, I took that off and the HVs still don't attach themselves to the new particles about every other or every third frame.

jdavidbakr
10-04-2004, 08:12 PM
Here's a screen grab that illustrates what's going on. The following frame after what I show below would have treated the particles as if they were new, along with the new particles that would be generated on that frame.

It's not an OpenGL thing because it renders this way too, even in LWSN.

Also, I'm running 8.0.1 on 10.2.8

Darth Mole
10-05-2004, 04:45 AM
One for the (neverending) bug list?

Glendalough
10-07-2004, 03:17 PM
Have had scenes with HV particles made in 6.5 which came out quite different when the scene was rendered in 7.5. As someone said here on this forum it's best to stick to the original program it was created in...........have to keep a few versions running.......

jdavidbakr
10-07-2004, 03:30 PM
Well, I only mention that about 7.5 because the same particles don't work in 8.0.1 that work in 7.5. However, I built the whole scene in 8.0.1 and the last addition was the particles, which aren't working correctly from the beginning. And I can't load the scene in 7.5, it freezes up halfway loaded. I'm lamenting the apparent result that HV's don't work correctly in 8.0.1; no one has either confirmed or denied it at all, do people not use HV's? I still don't know if this is isolated to my system or if it really is a bug in 8.0.1.

Glendalough
10-07-2004, 03:41 PM
Not in a hurry to buy 8 because of all this, can't upgrade OSX beyond 10.2 on main machine as Lightwave doesn't run as well...........All this OSX and newer versions of Lighwave not working seems to be going on for years...........at least you can say -boast it's not everyone that can run this program.....

eblu
10-08-2004, 10:36 AM
jdavidbaker,

I made an attempt to reproduce the problem.
this is what I did:
1. new scene
2. new emitter
3. add HV to the emitter
4. make them sprites
5. animate size over lifespan of particle, using a gradient
6. show particles

this does not result in your specific symptoms.
what else are you doing with your HVs?

jdavidbakr
10-08-2004, 12:44 PM
Well, that is encouraging, maybe it is something specific to my system.

The only other thing is that I have parent motion set to 0% so that the new particles are separated from the pack of the old particles as the emitter moves. I'm not at that system and am at a shoot all night tonight but tomorrow I'll post a scene that has the problem, and see if anyone has the same problem with that scene.

BTW, are you running Panther? I am wondering if upgrading to Panther would fix it. I haven't yet because I was originally waiting on LW 8, and then now they're already starting to talk about the next Mac OS and I don't want to get Panther right before they release the new one :eek:

eblu
10-08-2004, 03:13 PM
im in 10.3.5 on a dual 2 gig g5

jdavidbakr
10-09-2004, 08:41 AM
Ok, look at this scene if you will, I have also posted an illustration of a problem area, What I did is turn the motion blur off on the particles so that each frame's particles are clearly separate from the previous frame's. As I step through the scene, frame 1 has HV's with the particles, then frame 2's HV's dont appear until frame 3. It continues to lag one frame behind until it gets to frame 15, where it catches up, and then skips frame 16's particles until frame 17, with frame 17's particles' HV's appearing correclty. It continues every other frame until frame 29, where the HV's work as expected until frame 32, and frames 32 and 33 have the HV's one frame behind again, then frame 34 it catches up, then does two frames correct, two frames late until frame 44, where it does one frame late and two frames correct, then ends with frames 47 and 48 being one frame late.

Nothing would please me more than for you to load the scene and tell me that there is nothing wrong on your system, because that means that there is something with mine... either Jaguar or some config or something. If anyone else can test this under different systems, I'd like to try to get to the bottom of this.

Thanks again, eblu, I'll look forward to your report ;)

eblu
10-11-2004, 07:41 AM
jdavidbakr,
looked at your scene file.

the good news is that you are in fact, not crazy. we loaded your file, and everything you described was there. the lack of voxels till frame 15, then the skipped voxels every other frame, then every two frames.

I then tried to duplicate it again, and had success. I now see what you are describing in all the HV anims I have done this morning. Don't know why i missed it before.

Here comes the bad news, we then loaded it onto a PC version of LW... and the problem does Not exist there. We tried to save the Mot file for the particles on the mac, and it had no effect on the problem (but we did uncover a strange display error with particles/saved mot files/ and HVs.) so it is a MAC only bug, and I can't find a workaround.

jdavidbakr
10-11-2004, 08:06 AM
Thanks, eblu, for confirming this, I sent an e-mail to NT and also posted it in the bug forum, I guess that's all you can do... :( For now it looks like I'll have to render my particles in a separate pass using LWSN 7.5. I guess worse things could happen...

WeAreTheLeeches
10-18-2004, 02:51 AM
Not in a hurry to buy 8 because of all this, can't upgrade OSX beyond 10.2 on main machine as Lightwave doesn't run as well...........All this OSX and newer versions of Lighwave not working seems to be going on for years...........at least you can say -boast it's not everyone that can run this program.....


im in 10.3.5 on a dual 2 gig g5

Im on Mac OS 10.3.5 also, and happily runnning 8.0.1 with no ill effects, infact everything is running very well :D

jdavidbakr
10-18-2004, 07:50 AM
Im on Mac OS 10.3.5 also, and happily runnning 8.0.1 with no ill effects, infact everything is running very well :D
Did you try the scene file I attached without any issue? If so, then I wonder what the difference is between your and eblu's systems?

WeAreTheLeeches
10-18-2004, 09:54 AM
i just ran it, and the glitch is still there.

My post was in refernce to the earlier post that 8 is unstable on mac os x

ehadint
10-18-2004, 04:50 PM
I thought that i was doing something wrong and i guess this turnes out to be a defect. its good to know that i wasnt imagining this.
here is an example of what i was experiancing.

jdavidbakr
10-20-2004, 03:26 PM
I thought that i was doing something wrong and i guess this turnes out to be a defect. its good to know that i wasnt imagining this.
here is an example of what i was experiancing.

I did get a response from NewTek and they confirmed that they saw the problem, although they had a hard time finding it until I sent them my sample scene. I guess if the particles aren't moving fast like my and ehadint's scenes it's hard to notice (I have a particle generator in the same scene that I didn't notice it on, but the trails move much more slowly); ehadint, you might want to e-mail tech support just to let them know there's more than one person who is needing this fixed!

Right now, unless they get the fix out soon, I'm going to have to render the HV's in a separate pass in a 7.5 LWSN. I still have lots of other details to fix on the scene, though, so maybe - just maybe - there will be a fix soon...

On the issue of whether 8.0.1 is worth upgrading to, I tried to rebuild this scene in 7.5 and was frustrated at how much was lacking that I didn't even realize. I also started using some LScripts that don't run correctly in 7.5. Aside from this particle bug and the weird text box issue (which, I have to say, is really frustrating, but NT has already acknowledged that they know about it) and the slowness of the OpenGL, I have been very happy with 8.0.1