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View Full Version : Why arent many lightwave tools realtime interactive?



Ade
10-04-2004, 03:39 AM
Ive noticed LW seems to be the only one who doesnt have many interective realtime tools. 3DS has the gizmo happening, Cinema4d too has a bandsaw like tool that you can see whats going to be affected before you commit to the tool. With Modeler you have to commit then undo is undesired outcomes.
I wonder this alot, is itb a limitation of the SDk's?

I feel realtime interaction with tools is a massive "need".

vbk!!!
10-04-2004, 03:46 AM
agree 100%
interactivity is my request N 1

Exper
10-04-2004, 05:16 AM
Core + SDK... as far as I can tell! :o

cresshead
10-04-2004, 07:02 AM
huh?

bandsaw pro shows you in the viewport...with multi bandsaws too...
edgebevel is realtime feedback...
bevel can be used with the mouse..and muti bevels are just a r h click mouse away...no need for a "gizmo" or a dialogue box to be filled in...
magic bevel is err... magic!

you might want to look at day to day use of edit mesh or edit poly in max...sloooooooooooooooooooow

or look at xsi and it's pop up dialogue boxes everytime you want to do something..not much dragging in the viewport for a "hands on" feel to modelling though xsi is still good...as are all apps nowdays...

some people on see half empty glasses
I tend to see them half full. :)

steve g

vbk!!!
10-04-2004, 07:08 AM
i prefer full glasses

with interactive cloning tools
with interactive smooth tools
with interactive extrude tools
with interactive patch tools etc ...

hmm ...well .... 3/4 full glasses i take !

blabberlicious
10-04-2004, 04:47 PM
arrgh - don't get me [email protected]


Warning:
After 10 minutes in C4D, you may experience nauseating flashbacks, as much of your former LW life whizzes past - all those 100000's of hours of painful noodling, workarounds, and laborious 'old school' nonsense.

LW Modeler IS interactive, until you drop that tool or go to layout (or it crashes)


Another thread that destined for land-fill....

cresshead
10-04-2004, 05:26 PM
after 10 mins in cinema 4 i always get a headache...which is similar to the headache i get in max and yet is nothing to migrain i get when using flash mx!
...lightwave is much kinder to my head...xsi looks like it will either be nice or get me a brain tumor!

bit o fun!

steve g

Mylenium
10-04-2004, 11:47 PM
Yepp, LW's approach (or my Modo's approach for that matter ;o)) to interactivity is quite nice. No unnecessary gizmos, no crazy pre-selection highlight blinking, no nonsense tools. Personally I really don't understand why people go so crazy about C4D's new selection tools - I find them terrible. It seems the program never can decide what to select next and so your screen is blinking all the time and you're just lucky if it selects what you want. Gizmos I never liked very much and as already stated, many tools in LW are interactive, even though not in a way some people expect it. Still, there can be no doubt about it that LW lacks that interactivity in some places and the painful thing is, those areas are rather critical so it shows even more. But I'm quite sure they'll implement that anyway, if only to spite their former employees and catch up with Modo...

Mylenium

blabberlicious
10-05-2004, 02:07 AM
after 10 mins in cinema 4 i always get a headache...which is similar to the headache i get in max and yet is nothing to migrain i get when using flash mx!
...lightwave is much kinder to my head...xsi looks like it will either be nice or get me a brain tumor!

bit o fun!

steve g


Just turn those annoying guides off! Those helpful people at Maxon make it easy to do that.

They are good at that sort of thing.

If LW had proper edge modelling support for N-Gons, and didn't crash on average of 30 times a day, then I'd happily put up with some 'anxious to please' selection guides.


And finally - Speaking of Interactivity:
Since LW8, all of the Blue radial selection Guides for the drag tool have disappeared. Playing madding 'guess the radius of this tool' is so lame it defies belief.

Reported to NT about 3 times, posted threads showing it affected other people too - but Support seem to have the lost the will to fix it.

LW and interactivity?


Yeah, right.

Dodgy
10-05-2004, 04:33 AM
Just turn those annoying guides off! Those helpful people at Maxon make it easy to do that.

If LW had proper edge modelling support for N-Gons, and didn't crash on average of 30 times a day, then I'd happily put up with some 'anxious to please' selection guides.


And finally - Speaking of Interactivity:
Since LW8, all of the Blue radial selection Guides for the drag tool have disappeared. Playing madding 'guess the radius of this tool' is so lame it defies belief.

Reported to NT about 3 times, posted threads showing it affected other people too - but Support seem to have the lost the will to fix it.

LW and interactivity?


Yeah, right.

I really don't get how you're having sooooo many problems. I'm using LW on virtually the same set up as you and find it crashes maybe once every couple of days. There must be something odd with your system.

As for the radial selection guides, I've never had them on the drag tool. Do you mean dragnet? Or Magnet? Because again, they've always worked for me. Maybe your gfx card is shonky? I'd really like to help you get to the bottom of this, because I've found LW to be as stable as other packages and it seems you're getting rogered...

blabberlicious
10-05-2004, 05:23 AM
Thanks Dodgy:

Done all the usual mac things, re installs etc....

As you can see the problem isn't with:
my graphics card,
my mac set up,
postcode,
dog or chair height.

It's with LW8


LW7.5 example image:
Blue Falloff Guide appears letting you interactively RMB the size of the Drag Tools influence. If you do any character/organic modelling -you use this all to time to tweak sections of the mesh - quickly.

Not in LW8

LW8 Example (same machine)
Nothing. No Guide. Two suspicious blue lines appear BEHIND THE Numeric Box ???


Dodgy: Get the same thing?

I'd appreciate a response.


I've posted this so many time it feels like Groundhog Day.....

It's the little stuff like this that you use every day that needs to work right.

That's reasonable?

TheDevil
10-05-2004, 05:50 AM
I use LW8 and no problems. How can you get 30 crashes a day when I use modeller most hrs of the day with a crash every few days. There again, I'm using a PC.

I have no problem getting the guide coming up. Just RMB as usual to visually set the influence and then drag. Or are you saying that the blue circular guide was visible even before using the RMB? My 7.5 memory is getting hazy.

vbk!!!
10-05-2004, 07:12 AM
i have some display trouble with my ati card especially with cursor

with my other pc ( with geforce card) i have no problem

blabberlicious
10-05-2004, 07:43 AM
BTW, I added my spec to end of my signature - but realise that some of you turn those off.

Spec : MAC Dual 1GHZ G4, 1.5g Ram, Geforce 128 Ti, OSX 10.3.5

anieves
10-05-2004, 09:07 AM
you know what? I tend to agree with Ade. Clone and Array come to ming right away. how about the integrated DI Cut? you can not move around the viewports while the cut window is open; there is no cancel button... select edgeloop won't work with more than one layer on. My ponit is that yes, alot of the tools in LW are very interactive but there are some that aren't or that are half way there. I sent this to the features email awhile back but if you feel strongly about it then submit again. ;)

Karmacop
10-05-2004, 10:41 AM
I actually started my first Lightwave plugin (and first C program) the other day. It's going to be a more interactive clone tool. It's going alright at the moment, bu there's still a lot to do. Just imagine that the box wasn't there and that each of those ticks was a clone of an object ;)

Dodgy
10-05-2004, 10:47 AM
I must be getting punchy, I read your specs as P4 not G4.... Jeez I'm am soooo embarrassed :P
Not much I can do there I'm afraid. I do have a mate who has a mac, I'll ask him how he got on...

digefxgrp
10-06-2004, 12:01 AM
Karmacop-
It's cool you're doing an interactive clone and array tool for Modeler.
Take a look at how Modo does theirs. Fully interactive in both mouse and numeric panel operations. Simple, powerful and fast.... the way it should be.
If more of LW's tools were like this, we'd all be sittin' reeeal pretty.

Craig Paup
DEG

faulknermano
10-06-2004, 01:53 AM
If LW had proper edge modelling support for N-Gons, and didn't crash on average of 30 times a day, .


speaking of which, lw8 seems to be _significantly_ more unstable than lw7.5. is it me or has anyone also felt this?

faulknermano
10-06-2004, 01:55 AM
I actually started my first Lightwave plugin (and first C program) the other day.


<applause><applause>! wish i was you.

Karmacop
10-06-2004, 03:51 AM
I'm sure you'd be able to make much better plugins than me ... which reminds me, I should add that script to your site.

Anyway, all I did was get a free ide and the gnu compiler for windows, open up the box tutorial, and started hacking. Hopefully I'll finish this plugin and more.

art
10-06-2004, 08:32 AM
I wonder if I should I finish my interactive torus plugin which in essence would combine torus and wedge tools into one interactive tool with a couple of extra tweaks. I almost gave up on it because I thought no one would find much use for it...I started writting it pretty much to learn plugin programming, that's why it is not an 2 hour job for me.

Finish it or not?

Dodgy
10-06-2004, 10:52 AM
Well there is an interactive torus tool already (it's a called the quadric tool, but you can use it to do torii too) but it's a bit fiddly.

art
10-06-2004, 12:48 PM
yeah, im aware of the quadric tool and thats one more reason for me not to waste my time with my torus plugin. It was meant to be my "learning project" anyway.

Karmacop
10-06-2004, 10:39 PM
I hate the quadratic tool, I'd much prefer a specialised torus tool. Also, if anyone wants to help me figure out how to connect a UI from LSID to my plugin I'd be thankful :p

Exper
10-07-2004, 02:06 AM
Also, if anyone wants to help me figure out how to connect a UI from LSID to my plugin I'd be thankful :pUse LSID's File / Export then you can choose some different ones: "Panels" provides the UI's "C" source code.

colkai
10-07-2004, 03:34 AM
I hate the quadratic tool, I'd much prefer a specialised torus tool.

Totally agree with Karmacop - Art - please carry on - I'd wager it would be a useful little tool - beats the heck out of having to offset lathe a disc each time. Though I'd guess if it was interactive, it would be a combination of lathe and the oportunity to alter the width, diameter and segments of the resulting object.

Leastways, off the top of my head, that's what would be a really cool setup for an interactive build for me.

dmg3d
10-07-2004, 06:33 AM
LW8 Example (same machine)
Nothing. No Guide. Two suspicious blue lines appear BEHIND THE Numeric Box ???


Yup, I get the same thing on mine. I've noticed selecting "radial" and then selecting "activate" brings in the guide lines. But not for "point radial".

My Spec : MAC Dual 1.4GHZ G4, 1.5g Ram, ATI 9000 Pro, OSX 10.3.5


-Dave

BTW - Modeler doesn't crash for me... but Layout does a handful per day... mainly when using fPrime...

blabberlicious
10-07-2004, 07:59 AM
Yup, I get the same thing on mine. I've noticed selecting "radial" and then selecting "activate" brings in the guide lines. But not for "point radial".
BTW - Modeler doesn't crash for me... but Layout does a handful per day... mainly when using fPrime...

Phew - so I'm not mad, then.....:-)

I posted Scott at NT with the Bug, and suggest you do the same to get things rolling.

Oh, another bug I found - again annoying!

SPLINEs don't have a diamond shaped 'start handle'. Mac or PC is the same.

They did in LW7

Perhaps another workflow enhancement?

Karmacop
10-07-2004, 09:09 AM
Use LSID's File / Export then you can choose some different ones: "Panels" provides the UI's "C" source code.

Thanks for your help exper, but that's what I did and I get compilation errors straight off without editing it. I was hoping I'd be able to add the c file and slowly connect it to what I already have going, but it seems I'll have to read and understand how Xpanels work first. Creating an interface in lscript is so easy compared to xpanels
:o I'll just keep at it and see how far I get :)

Exper
10-07-2004, 09:30 AM
@Karmacop: just sent a PM (just a trivial one)... take a look and let me know if it works! ;)

art
04-04-2007, 08:53 AM
I'm sorry for resurrecting this (very) old thread. Here is the little tool: torus

http://www.artssphere.com/download.php?itemid=39

years in making... sleepless nights...
just kidding :)

intel only :compbeati

-EsHrA-
04-04-2007, 09:10 AM
yeh why?!...

mlon

Captain Obvious
04-04-2007, 09:34 AM
What, people still use Modeler for modeling? :eek:


Edit: Ah, I guess they might've used it three years ago...

Captain Obvious
04-04-2007, 12:29 PM
Longer lines have been drawn, so to speak. :)