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View Full Version : 8.0.1 didn't fix the display problem...



hrgiger
09-01-2004, 09:23 PM
So far, the Lightwave 8.0.1 update seems very solid however, one thing that I was hoping to get fixed was the annoying blank viewport bug. Whenever I start up modeler, my viewports are blank until I click on them or zoom in or out in them. Not life threatening but really annoying. They also go blank when I switch from one viewport to the 4 standard setup. I have the latest drivers for my GeForce card and I never had this problem with 7.5 or earlier. I know others were having this problem as well. How many others?

hunter
09-01-2004, 10:02 PM
So far, the Lightwave 8.0.1 update seems very solid however, one thing that I was hoping to get fixed was the annoying blank viewport bug. Whenever I start up modeler, my viewports are blank until I click on them or zoom in or out in them. Not life threatening but really annoying. They also go blank when I switch from one viewport to the 4 standard setup. I have the latest drivers for my GeForce card and I never had this problem with 7.5 or earlier. I know others were having this problem as well. How many others?

Well I don't have that problem but that's not all that is not fixed. I am glad to have much of it repaired but if you clone lights the name always just says light in the property panel, not light(1), or light(2) etc. Not a bad update but let's get the rest fixed.

gregsduncan
09-02-2004, 02:15 AM
I occasionally get that hrgiger but more so when I go into graph editor in layout - blank graph so I have to click on it! :( Not in 7.5

mattclary
09-02-2004, 05:54 AM
Steve, you use a Dell, right? Those come with ATI cards, don't they? ;)

NanoGator
09-02-2004, 10:03 AM
Steve, you use a Dell, right? Those come with ATI cards, don't they? ;)

I have geforce on 2 computers, same problem.

Not that worried about it, though. The workaround is simple enough that I prefer they fix the stuff that causes crashes.

brap
09-02-2004, 10:30 AM
I have geforce on 2 computers, same problem.

Not that worried about it, though. The workaround is simple enough that I prefer they fix the stuff that causes crashes.

What's your workaround if I may ask? I discovered that if I keep the Layers window on the main screen instead of on the second monitor, it prevents the blank windows.

w_will
09-03-2004, 08:36 AM
Hmm, I have the same issue on my Dell 800 laptop. It has an Nvidia series graphic adapter, so I doubt it is ATI driver related, but it mght be Dell related. It is easy to clearup simply move anything in the window by rotating or zooming and it clears itself up... ie things in th viewport become visable again.

Lamont
09-03-2004, 11:15 AM
What kind of geForce card do you have? What apps are running when this happens? And how dense are the meshes you are trying to display?

hrgiger
09-03-2004, 11:58 AM
What kind of geForce card do you have? What apps are running when this happens? And how dense are the meshes you are trying to display?

I have a pretty base 64MB GeForce card (I dont' remember the model number, it came with the computer), I'm running only Lightwave when this happens and the windows are blank whether there is a mesh loaded or not so mesh density is not a factor.

brap
09-03-2004, 12:05 PM
The LW OGL issues are well-documented problems affecting Mac and PC, ATI and Nvidia, dual and single displays, and seemingly all drivers, although strangely it does not affect all systems. To my knowledge, no one has pinned down specifics about systems/cards/os. The last thing that Elmar said about it was that driver "issues" had been discovered. Since this is affecting so many people, it would be nice to get an update on what's happening in this dept.

A couple of threads that cover some of the permutations:

http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=147267

http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?t=143613

Lamont
09-03-2004, 01:16 PM
I remember when I had a GF3 card I'd run out of texture memory and some things didn't display if I started Modeler last.

But I haven't run into this problem yet. But we had a similar problem at work where on one system anything that had parallax maps (normal maps on steroids) applied showed up super saturated, the other showed up fine. Same drivers and videocard specs (videocards were from different vendors). Nearly identical systems. Programmers tracked it down to a driver issue and we had to wait for an update.

mattclary
09-03-2004, 01:26 PM
I have a Geforce 5900se and I "think" I saw this issue not long after upgrading to [8], but I haven't noticed it in a very long time.

hrgiger
09-03-2004, 03:09 PM
You know, it doesn't sound like a big deal and in the big scheme of things, it's probably not but it really does slow down my workflow. I'm used to working with 4 viewports in modeler and often change between fullscreen and 4 view. Everytime I come back from full screen, all the viewports are blank until I refresh them (click on them or pan/zoom). Now if I want to see my model in all four views which I usually like to, then I have to go and click on each one. It's really a pain in the as$ when you start doing that 40 or 50 times in an hour period.

I'd love to just upgrade my video card and hope that it fixed the problem but I won't have it in my budget to do that until after New Years and by then I'll probably be thinking of another system anyway. I just hope there's a fix before then or it's going to be a long winter. What's the bug report address just so I can not let Duece and the boys that the problem exists for some of us?

John Fornasar
09-03-2004, 08:20 PM
Everytime I come back from full screen, all the viewports are blank until I refresh them (click on them or pan/zoom).of us?

If anyone is compiling this info, here's what I have...
at home, an old NVidia GeForce 2 MX/MX 400 32 ram, no problem at all.

Work machine, some sort of ATI card (I'll get the number Tuesday when back to work) - when I have four viewports open (my usual modeling setup) and I change the Texture setting in the Perspective window, the other three go blank.
My workaround is to hit the numerical 0 twice - go full screen and back to four - all windows are redrawn.

Laptop is a Dell Latitude with ATI Rage Mobility 128 AGP 2X - no problem with screen redraws.

jevinstudios
09-04-2004, 04:34 PM
This is definitely a graphic card driver issue, not a LW problem. I've got LW 8.0.1 running on a system with an nVidia Quadro 900 XGL 128 MB card, and no problems. Also got LW 8.0.1 on a system with an ATI T2 128 MB card -- never had an issue at all. GeForce cards are pretty low end, and are prone to such problems on high-end software (Maya won't even run with a GeForce card). Would seriously recommend investing in a better card.....

For those who have Dell systems, Dell re-writes all card drivers to match their version of the Windows operating system. You're pretty much stuck with whatever they release, and most likely will encounter problems if you install factory-released drivers to match the Dell version of your card.

As LightWave continues to evolve and take on more extensive OpenGL attributes, users with older or lesser cards are going to have to upgrade as well to take advantage of the more robust capabilities.

Lamont
09-04-2004, 06:00 PM
I think with the current round of software, people should try to get any current card that supports the latest features. It doesn't have to be top of the line.

Yog
09-04-2004, 07:24 PM
This is definitely a graphic card driver issue, not a LW problem.
.....
.... GeForce cards are pretty low end, and are prone to such problems on high-end software (Maya won't even run with a GeForce card).......

I can't entirely agree with either of those statements.

I would say that LW/Nt do shoulder some of the responsibility as all previous versions ran well with the same graphics cards.
As to other progs needing more powerful cards than LW. Both XSI and Maya run just fine on both my GF-2 MX 32Mb and my GF-4 4200 128Mb, although LW8 refused to work with either. The LW problem (and I found it impossible to work with it) wasn't solved until I got a new Quadro-4.

Perhaps NT should have an approved hardware page like the other two apps, perhaps next to the downloadable demo page ? :rolleyes:

hrgiger
09-04-2004, 07:27 PM
This is definitely a graphic card driver issue, not a LW problem.

Perhaps, but I didn't have the problem with 7.5 at all and the computer hasn't changed, only the version of the software.

HarverdGrad
09-04-2004, 09:53 PM
Same,
7.5 never gave me this problem.
Only started happening in 8.0.

Other Apps I use on my Computer - Gaming, Development, Other 3d Rendering do not display this problem.

I think it's pure 8.0 and not my Nvidia 5900.

Regards,
JB

Silkrooster
09-04-2004, 10:57 PM
If I remember right, NT stated in the upgrade notice that there would be problems with the text. That these problems would be taken care of in the next upgrade.Silk

jevinstudios
09-05-2004, 12:45 AM
I have not had any display issues at all on either of my systems, with LW 8 or 8.0.1. Have worked flawlessly -- in fact, even better than Maya. I can say with all confidence that there is not a problem with the LW code in relation to the blank viewport issue stated in this thread. Install the very latest drivers for your card, and see if that fixes the problem. If not, as mentioned before, would invest in a better card. It is NOT true that even lower-end cards function as well as high end ones. You get what you pay for.

hrgiger
09-05-2004, 01:02 AM
I have not had any display issues at all on either of my systems, with LW 8 or 8.0.1. Have worked flawlessly -- in fact, even better than Maya.

How nice for you.

I have the latest drivers from Nvidia, that has already been mentioned.


I can say with all confidence that there is not a problem with the LW code in relation to the blank viewport issue stated in this thread.

Well, if I haven't changed cards (I haven't) and the only thing that changes is the software (it has) then it seems to me that the code indeed is the problem. Just because you are not having a problem does not mean that a problem does not exist. And unless Newtek is going to change the minimum requirements for a graphics card which mine currently meets, then perhaps they should be looking into correcting the display problem. I've also already mentioned my reasons for not investing in another card at this time.

Karmacop
09-05-2004, 01:19 AM
I've had some dispay issues, but rarely. I find it's usually because I have a lot of apps open or am low on memory/hdd space. Newtek have said they cannpt fix these display issues because they are unable to reproduce them. If you can find a way to reproduce them then send them a bug report and I'm sure they'll get right on it.

mrunion
09-05-2004, 05:19 PM
Instead of looking at LW as the "problem" because something was changed, isn't it safe to assume a few things? Like:

+ There were OpenGL enhancements.
+ Some people have problems with 8.0 and not with 7.5.
+ Someimes moving to new versions of software causes problems with older hardware (and this is not a bug)

LW8 DID have OpenGL enhancements, and now some cards/systems that worked fine with 7.5 don't work well with 8. It's the price of innovation.

FWIW, I have an nVidia GeForceFX 5600 Pro. I CANNOT use the LATEST drivers and get LW to work aceptable. I have to use vresion 52.16 of the Detonator drivers. I have NO problems with this card and driver version.

hrgiger
09-05-2004, 06:32 PM
I'm not calling Newtek the Anti-Christ or anything, I'm just saying that if they're going to put minimum requirements for what graphics cards will work with the new version of Lightwave, they should be fairly sure that the cards that meet those requirements won't have problems such as blank displays. Or mention that such and such cards may have these certain problems. Perhaps they can't reproduce it themselves or have even seen it themselves but I'm certainly not the only one having this issue, there have been several threads on it already, I'd just want to make Newtek aware that this problem exists, in the event they may be able to look into it. I'm not sure what people's problem is with that.


It's the price of innovation.

Certainly. But that's not an answer. Is that what the mac users were told when they had all those problems with 7.5c or whichever update it was?

Karmacop
09-06-2004, 01:56 AM
mrunion, if you always get errors with your setup and certain drivers then you should send a bug report to Newtek.

evilemil
09-06-2004, 11:35 AM
It's the price of innovation.

that is not true.
the Open GL features that are implemented do not (!) justify an upgrade to one of the latest graphics cards (btw the X800 PE at work has no blank screen, but a reduced response time...).
some competitors manage it to have different drawing modes in one panel for different objects, without blank screens.

If LW8 had hardware accelerated rendering included i would be very happy to shell out my money for a big consumer card.
But if we are talking about buying a new pro-card, because they implemented a texture/shaded wireframe mode (max had this since version1), i will be very likely to loose confidence.

A Gforce 4200 TI with 64MB should do the job, as it did before.


btw i work in games and know, that graphic issues are hard to fix for all the machines out there, but for the sake of happy customers, NT should take care of that asap.
Nvidia is very helpful when it comes to driver/card problems.
I know this from my own experience.
Or ask John Carmack, as you are cooperating with id, there should be a possibility to use their OpenGL knowledge.

evilemil
09-06-2004, 03:13 PM
I was annoyed the last two days and almost gave up.
But I made up my mind and tweaked my graphic card settings, so that lightwave runs now almost as expected.

have a look at the picture, perhaps it might help someone.

I still think, that openGL is not implemented as solid as in former Lightwave releases and that NT has to spend some time on it, but at least modeller works now (although a little bit slower than before and layout has still problems with the graph editor).

evilemil
09-06-2004, 03:50 PM
it is again me....

and i have to apoligize again.
i was to fast with my statement about the settings.
they have nothing to do with the fact that the OpenGL refresh works (on my gforce 4200 ti).

but:

if you start modeller and layout and switch colour depth of the desktop (i.e. 16 bit to 32 bit), the OpenGL refresh will work correct.

Can somebody please confirm this with their machines.
If this happens with other machines, i bet, it is an implementation issue rather than a driver issue.

NEWTEK DEVELOPERS, PLEASE TAKE A NOTE. IT MIGHT HELP YOU FIX THE PROBLEM. THANKS

brap
09-06-2004, 04:36 PM
it is again me....

and i have to apoligize again.
i was to fast with my statement about the settings.
they have nothing to do with the fact that the OpenGL refresh works (on my gforce 4200 ti).

but:

if you start modeller and layout and switch colour depth of the desktop (i.e. 16 bit to 32 bit), the OpenGL refresh will work correct.

Can somebody please confirm this with their machines.
If this happens with other machines, i bet, it is an implementation issue rather than a driver issue.

NEWTEK DEVELOPERS, PLEASE TAKE A NOTE. IT MIGHT HELP YOU FIX THE PROBLEM. THANKS

Yes, I can confirm that here.

Karmacop
09-06-2004, 11:20 PM
Newtek don't check these posts for bugs. Please send your bug reports to [email protected]

Elmar Moelzer
11-05-2004, 10:44 AM
Hello Everyone!
The new 66.81- beta- drivers from Nvidia should fix most if not all of the OpenGL- problems, users have experienced with LW8.0.
Please try them and let me know whether you still have problems.
Oh and please dont forget to use detonatorRIP, or Detonatordestroyer, before you install new drivers.
Thanks
CU
Elmar

Exper
11-05-2004, 12:31 PM
Due to the new driver settings...
I found 53.03 drivers stable, fast and working perfectly with LW (expecially for everyone who's using a not recent NVidia card).

cresshead
11-05-2004, 04:00 PM
a positive thing that users could create is a defined list of good graphics cards for lightwave7 & 8 for pc and mac
... and the driver version that's running
...plus the o/s and service pack!

you could start a list on the general lightwave area and ask for it to become a "sticky" item.

that would be a good thing that users could take hold of and create a positive knowledgebase for installing/running lightwave.

steveg