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twister47
08-07-2004, 07:08 PM
Been working over ideas for a way to put together a cool working portfolio. But I'm wondering would it be legal to use music on/in the portfolio, to go along with stuff that isnt mine? The portfolio wouldnt be sold of course, it would just probably be on a website and on dvds. I would include a credit for the music and more if needed.

Anyone?

Whit
08-08-2004, 10:45 AM
As I'm not a lawyer, this is my understanding of US copyright law, not good legal advice.

I think that one of the main principles of the copyright law involves public display of the copyrighted work. I think that if I make an animation and add copyrighted music, and show it to friends in my home; then there is no public display and I am OK. If I put that same animation and copyrighted music on my web page, I have created a public display and I'm in violation of the law.

There are sources of music that you can get at (fairly) reasonable prices. You buy the CD and get a license to incorporate the music into your work. You probably want a license that lets you use the music as many times as you like (some places provide music for CDs/videos where you pay based on how many CDs or videos are made).

You can find places on the Web through Google (try searching for "music copyright free library"). Many of them have short excepts available online so that you can get a sense of what you are about to buy. I have used Davenport Music Library:

http://www.davenportmusic.com

On the down side, this music may not be as exciting as the most recent hit. One friend of mine refers to tracks on music libraries as "music-like products."

--Whit

twister47
08-08-2004, 10:55 AM
thats what I figured

thanks Whit!

Martin Adams
08-08-2004, 01:15 PM
Hi,

I use a program called Propellerhead Reason to create music. I wanted to do this for the exact same reason you have, in being able to produce cheap music.

There are a lot of users in their community and quite a lot publish their music to the main web site (http://www.propellerhead.se). Since these people are most likely to be artists like you and I, they may be willing to share their music on your work. Naturally it's all down to the individual, but I'm sure they'd like the exposure as well.

Just a thought.

meshmaster
08-09-2004, 07:22 AM
Only use the stuff that you have rights to use or that are in public domain thus giving you the right to use them... assuming you make the music yourself and don't use a midi or wav file or whatever that is copyrighted that someone made based on the public domain work, unless of course you have their ok...

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=public+domain+music

Martin Adams
08-09-2004, 07:46 AM
Originally posted by meshmaster
Only use the stuff that you have rights to use or that are in public domain thus giving you the right to use them... assuming you make the music yourself and don't use a midi or wav file or whatever that is copyrighted that someone made based on the public domain work, unless of course you have their ok...

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=public+domain+music

Thanks for the idea meshmaster. I had a brief look at the google search you pointed to. I discovered now that I can import midi files in Propellerhead Reason and change the instruments to something, well, less crap.

So would I need permission to use someone's interpretation as a midi file I wonder, even if the music is in the public domain??? I guess that is down to the info and licensing with the midi file.

stargatesg1
08-09-2004, 12:17 PM
One thing i do is use royalty free music.
I do lots of video/dvd photo montages and grab music from www.shockwave-sound.com
they seem to have bits from all kinds of genra's and are reasonable in the fees. lets me incorperate the 29.95 price into my project easily and then we can use them on other projects. Good way to build ones library while passing the cost down stream. Its only like 29.95 for a project im making like 300.00 or so on. So easy to justify.
Chris Adams
silicondreamscapes.com

WizCraker
08-09-2004, 05:13 PM
You can use the music for non profit it is called the Fair Use Act. if you use it for anything else Usually if you give the label a heads up that you will be using it theres no problem.

twister47
08-09-2004, 05:24 PM
You can use the music for non profit it is called the Fair Use Act.

You are telling me that you can use ANY music? So you could use it on a portfolio?

Any links to docs?

Whit
08-09-2004, 05:37 PM
Fair Use provisions of the copyright law can be treacherous. The provisions are not entirely clear, but I'm not aware of any part of them that say if you aren't making a profit that the copyright law doesn't apply.

The two main applications of Fair Use are: "Comment and Criticism," and "Parody." People are allowed to use limited sections of a copyrighted work for comment and criticism (such as quoting a section of a novel while writing a review). People who create parodies are given more latitude than most with the copyright law.

Even if you were covered by Fair Use provisions, an important factor to consider is whether you have the cash and desire to defend yourself against a lawsuit from a large music company.

See http://fairuse.stanford.edu/ for an article on Copyright and Fair Use on the Stanford University website.

Avebeno
08-09-2004, 05:41 PM
At least Whit was wise enough to mention that he was a not lawyer. In my opinion, it is all about licensing. Just like a software license, you get music licensing too.

When I look at a reel, when a popular song is being used for someone's demo, in the back of my mind I wonder if this person might be a liability at some point in time because of what they don't understand about copyright and fair use.

meshmaster
08-13-2004, 11:06 AM
as far as fair use goes, you CAN use fair use IF you are using it SOLELY for EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES, I think... get a hold of a lawyer if you really want to know.... but anyways, using such an interpretation of fair use would probably not be applicable to creating derivitives based off of the original (i.e. remixing it in your reel and putting it to video) especially since you would be using it in a commercial way, to get a job, even though you would not be profiting from it directly.... Also, if you are doing all of that on your own and you are not a student or professor it becomes massively grey area as to what exactly educational is...

all of that having been said... if it's midi, you could probably fairly easily make it your own by adding a note here, moving a note there, etc., making it almost impossible to tell the original from your own as both would be based on the original if the original was in public domain.

sbrandt
08-13-2004, 03:30 PM
SOUND DOGS

http://www.sounddogs.com

WizCraker
08-13-2004, 04:02 PM
Did a search on google. This should answer your question

http://la.siggraph.org/Newsletters/1999_05_11.html

About 3 quarters down the page you will see an article on Demo Reels and Fair Use.

And some sites on the explanation of fair use and when and how you can use the music.

http://www.benedict.com/

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=345567

http://www.sundancemediagroup.com/articles/copyright.htm

cgolchert
08-13-2004, 06:23 PM
TV stations use copyrighted music all the time. They* said if it is under 20 seconds they can do it. I'm not sure how that would translate to a non-broadcast entity.


Edit:* They=Tv stations.

Avebeno
08-13-2004, 07:48 PM
There are people out there who will aggressively protect their work.
To me, it is the same as someone coming along and using an animation I made in their demo reel. Even if it was just for a simple "The End" graphic.

I was warned once about the "let's get ready to rumble" guy.
He owns the copyright to his announcement recording separate from the music you often hear with it.

You can hear it on his web site:

http://www.letsrumble.com/

I did a little searching and found this link.

and he protects his work here:

http://www.bufferzone.net/join/index.html

Whit
08-13-2004, 08:08 PM
As Avebeno has pointed out, the copyright law that protects your work is the same law that protects musicians (and others). It is in your long term best interest to have an effective copyright law that lets you protect your work. Without a copyright law, anyone who gets ahold of your work can use it however they want. Most people making money through 3D work are doing so because they (or their employer) can sell or license copyrights.

--Whit