PDA

View Full Version : What EDITING solution?



marc
07-16-2004, 01:08 AM
Hello, everyone,

I have come to the conclusion, that editing computer animation with my dv-based editing software (Pinnacle's Liquid Edition) is not a very good idea due to the dv compression. Also it keeps me limited to PAL resolution.

What editing solutions are out there that allow me to edit uncompressed (or less compressed than dv) at any resolution (even non standard ones like 360x800)?

Are all the consumer products dv-based? Do all resolution-independent software require special hardware? Has anyone tried Avid Mojo (it's just SD but at least uncompressed)?

What do YOU use to edit your animations?

Any suggestions (PC- or MAC-based) greatly appreciated.

Cheers,
Marc

Mattoo
07-16-2004, 10:15 AM
I use Sony Vegas 5 and love it. Beats the crap out of Premier in all respects.
However, it's not that cheap ($560) but it's not bad considering it's "pro" software and the competition.

You might also want to take a look at Avids site, last time I looked they had a free version of their software for consumer use, although I remember that it was WindowsXP only or something else which prevented me from using it...

Neither of these require hardware, neither are they resolution locked of course.

Cman
07-16-2004, 02:49 PM
If you have a Mac, there's only one answer: FCP.

If you have a PC, I would also suggest Vegas 5 over Premiere AND Avid.

I use Avid at work and got a copy of Vegas for myself, and much prefer Vegas eventhough I can do a basic edit faster in Avid.

I just completed a personal project in Vegas that mixed tga and jpg stills, 24p DV, 29.97 DV and 24p Uncompressed Animation as well as an animation sequence. At all times there was a minium of 2 video layers with transitions and effects and it all played back realtime with no rendering at all.

It's great.
In many ways it's better than the Avid Symphony I use at work. For example, the Avid software scopes are not realtime, whereas Vegas' ARE realtime.

tokyo drifter
07-16-2004, 04:25 PM
Vegas is so cool! I make sweet love with that baby. It takes a little while to get used to, try the demo.

And so mac'ers don't get pissy, yes FCP rocks my pants too.

Titus
07-16-2004, 04:33 PM
This is so incredible, I thought this was NewTek's forum!

Tom Wood
07-16-2004, 05:47 PM
Heh, okay I'll bite.

I render out TGA image sequences from LightWave, composite in Mirage and render out RTV animations from there, and then edit in VT3. All uncompressed.

How's that Titus?

TW

Cman
07-16-2004, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by Titus
This is so incredible, I thought this was NewTek's forum!

Well that's true.

Does anyone know how would VT3 stack up to Vegas, FCP, Premiere and Avid?

sadkkf
07-16-2004, 07:24 PM
I've used Premiere for years before switching to VT[2] and think it was an upgrade in every respect. It's stable, flexible and works great with LW, of course.

I'd love to get Vegas if only for the 5.1 support. :)

How 'bout it, NewTek? any 5.1 support for the future of VT?

eon5
07-16-2004, 07:57 PM
Video Toaster 3 is your solution, really.

robewil
07-16-2004, 08:09 PM
Originally posted by Cman
Does anyone know how would VT3 stack up to Vegas, FCP, Premiere and Avid? Well I say that VT[3] is the Lightwave of video editing products.

What that means is that it may be quirky at times or lack a feature or two and it may not get that much press attention.

What it also means though is it is an incredible value and and boasts features not found in other products. I use mine daily and I love its workflow and speed. I also use Premiere Pro and believe me, while it has superior audio tools, it feels clunky and I don't like it's workflow nearly as well. Ironically, I use Premiere Pro on a machine nearly twice as fast as my VT[3] and it feels half as fast for many operations.

On the VT forums there have been other discussions about how VT[3] compares with the other products, particularly Final Cut Pro and Vegas. Check them out.

Titus
07-16-2004, 11:45 PM
Well, maybe I was a little crancky :cool: . But not listing the Video Toaster as an option for POST in the NT forums was incredible.

I like the VT+Combustion combo. I want Shake but it's too expensive for my budget.

harlan
07-17-2004, 12:45 AM
FCP on the Mac and VT for SD on the PC!!! ;)

If I'm doing any really serious editing (ie: HD, etc..) then I use FCP on the Mac. If I'm doing some quick and dirty SD stuff I always go with the VT (it's incredibly fast for this type of work).

marc
07-17-2004, 04:33 AM
Thanks, everyone, for your input.

I thought that Vegas might be an alternative and it's good to hear people being happy with the product. An it really leaves tga sequences uncompressed? Ah, well, I guess I just am going to give it a shot and find out myself.

About VT[3]: I really would like to have one, but at 3000 and requiring a new computer it is currently out of my financial range, although I would really, really like to have one. The editing reminded me a lot of Liquid.

Same with FCP; I'm sure it's great, but I have yet to find the offer with the free G5 to go with it ;)

Cheers,
Marc

Beamtracer
07-17-2004, 04:50 AM
Originally posted by marc
with FCP; I'm sure it's great, but I have yet to find the offer with the free G5 to go with it ;)

Nothing beats FCP. The price of the G5 is offset by savings in other areas.

One software, all resolutions (unlike Avid which makes you upgrade to higher priced software to get higher resolutions). The same software that is used to cut Hollywood feature films can also be used for HD or SD uncompressed video, or even DV.

Nobody does HD like FCP. No other system can do DVC-Pro HD without a capture card. Only FCP can.

The best video capture cards are on the Mac. Kona, Black Magic etc. This has always been the case. Some other solutions (ie Avid) make you go with one particular proprietary card.

Final Cut Pro project files can be read by any Quicktime player. Mac or Windows. This is a major advantage. It basically plays through your edit, dissolves and effects included, sound mixes included, on the fly on a Quicktime player, even when FCP is not on that machine.

No wonder the world is switching!

Cman
07-17-2004, 05:11 AM
Originally posted by Beamtracer
Nothing beats FCP. The price of the G5 is offset by savings in other areas.

One software, all resolutions (unlike Avid which makes you upgrade to higher priced software to get higher resolutions). The same software that is used to cut Hollywood feature films can also be used for HD or SD uncompressed video, or even DV.

...

No wonder the world is switching!

This is generally true of Vegas as well. Supposedly it can handle all resolutions and framerates, mixed in the same timeline, etc etc.

However, if I had the cash I would agree getting FCP because it has a standard interface compared to Vegas - and Apple's full support for development.

From what I can tell of longtime Vegas users, Sony isn't 100% behind developing Vegas because they already have a "highend" editing system they push - XPRI - and why create in-house competition!

harlan
07-17-2004, 10:25 AM
I hope to god, for the sake of sanity, that no one is comparing Vegas to FCP.

Vegas is a glorified consumer editing app - yes it has capabilities, but I'd consider a "lite" application. If you're doing high-end image work, you wouldn't use Photoshop LE, you'd use the full blown.

The VT is pricey in my opinion, but it's really a great package. For the same money you can buy a G5 & FCP. So it's really your preference in that department.

Cman
07-17-2004, 11:29 AM
"Vegas is a glorified consumer editing app - yes it has capabilities, but I'd consider a "lite" application."

I think the term Prosumer would apply for Vegas. It's more than a "lite" application, but it is not as "finished" as FCP.

tokyo drifter
07-17-2004, 03:44 PM
FCP is great. Vegas is great too, quirky but **** fast in it's workflow and previewing capabilites and excellent integration with Sound Forge. Some features are lacking but for quick editing, I love it. I'd love a VT3 but it's way too expensive, although it is a lot more then just an NLE.

I'm also curious about Avid Xpress Pro and Premiere Pro and Edius. If anyone uses any of these I'd love to hear your opinions.

(LOL! d.a.m.n. is filtered! Looks like Newtek's got a politically correct stick stuck up their ***) :D

harlan
07-17-2004, 09:21 PM
The word "Prosumer" is a bunch of turd!!! It's either a Pro app or a Con app!!! ;)

tokyo drifter
07-17-2004, 11:45 PM
Vegas is definitely a professional app, I'd say a mid-end professional app, like Lightwave.

So Premiere Pro, who uses it out there? How good is the integration between the other adobe apps like After Effects and Photoshop? Is it stable or buggy?