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lsddigital
07-06-2004, 09:43 AM
It is illegal share LW8 pdf manual?

thanks you

TheDevil
07-06-2004, 09:49 AM
No

DigiLusionist
07-06-2004, 10:09 AM
Illegal? No. Ethical? No. Unless it's to another registered LW customer, obviously.

NanoGator
07-06-2004, 10:21 AM
I'm not a lawyer, but they have taken enough steps to let you know they don't want you sharing it. (i.e. only registerred peeps can download it...)

Although if it's with another registerred user, it's probably not a big deal.

lsddigital
07-06-2004, 10:42 AM
I have a LW 7.5 and a VT[3] licence, and I am a register user.
... but i donīt have access to lw[8] pdf ... that is why I did ask.

I want to look it before buy it a upgrade... how can I do?
If that isnīt illegal... any can share it with me?

thanks

NanoGator
07-06-2004, 10:51 AM
May I suggest firing off a note to Chuck or Proton about it?

lsddigital
07-06-2004, 11:02 AM
but you can download LW7, 7.5, and many other stuff about LW.. (owners or not, can download it).
many time before LW8 release!

DigiLusionist
07-06-2004, 11:20 AM
I would think if Newtek had wanted everyone to have the manual they wouldn't be requiring people to input registration info in order to download it.

That's why I said it's unethical to share it with non-registered users.

NanoGator
07-06-2004, 11:28 AM
It's possible they did the registration bit just to make sure that the ppl that paid for it were ahead in line, as opposed to a bunch of people downloading 65 meg manuals just for the sake of having them. Quality of Service as opposed to control, perhaps.

Matt
07-06-2004, 11:30 AM
I can see your point, I haven't upgraded to v8 (yet) so technically the v8 manual is of no use to me, but I'm still interested to see:


a) how good it is

b) what new features made it into the final build

c) how easy it looks to pick up the new tools


I can see why NT didn't have the manual for ALL to download though, all it takes is for someone to find a pirate copy of LW8 off tinternet, then come here to download the manual and hey presto, the full package, at least they're making it slightly harder for them!!!

Titus
07-06-2004, 11:52 AM
Originally posted by Matt
I can see why NT didn't have the manual for ALL to download though, all it takes is for someone to find a pirate copy of LW8 off tinternet, then come here to download the manual and hey presto

We can debate on that, if there's a pirated version of LW8 already then I don't find a reason why the manual isn't online too. Bastards!

caesar
07-06-2004, 11:58 AM
Originally posted by Matt


I can see why NT didn't have the manual for ALL to download though, all it takes is for someone to find a pirate copy of LW8 off tinternet, then come here to download the manual and hey presto, the full package, at least they're making it slightly harder for them!!!

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:


Iīd love to have this precious piece of "digital" paper

lsddigital
07-06-2004, 12:06 PM
of course Matt!
maybe they (newtek team) will say look a lw8 website to know more lw8... but I did.. and I want to know more about LW8, tools more deeply.
That is all
As a client I would have more information, as more infomation I have about LW 8, more I want to upgrade... I donīt ask a demo that is too much ask, I think... I donīt know.
my opinion that it is a marketing mistake (see what the others do with they softwares).
I just my opinion!

lsddigital
07-06-2004, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by Titus
We can debate on that, if there's a pirated version of LW8 already then I don't find a reason why the manual isn't online too. Bastards!

well... but share it with registred users!
owners of LW or VT!

NanoGator
07-06-2004, 12:18 PM
The piracy debate is null. If they acquired 8 to crack, then they can easily get the PDF manual from the same guy to package up with the pirated copy of 8. If Newtek really is thinking "let's not feed the pirates", and I doubt that's on their mind, it's not doing a lick of good.

lsddigital
07-07-2004, 01:22 AM
Originally posted by NanoGator
The piracy debate is null. If they acquired 8 to crack, then they can easily get the PDF manual from the same guy to package up with the pirated copy of 8. If Newtek really is thinking "let's not feed the pirates", and I doubt that's on their mind, it's not doing a lick of good.

Sure!
some people get piracy, that is illegal, i donīt like that (the piracy)!... but maybe they gets manual .pdf (and sure they do), and that isnīt illegal! (if share .pdf isnīt?!?!?!)
but I, paid for a old version (just to know more deep this new version), and I canīt get it!

they share a LEGAL material more easy that me!

men... make share .pdf illegal, and this thread is over! (cover a .pdf with complet copyrights, include share it) ... then I feel better ;)

colkai
07-07-2004, 02:36 AM
My personal take on this,
Given that you are a registered user, I would say that a quick email to Chuck / Proton would probably be met with a positive on looking at it.
Heck, sooner or later I'll warrant it will be up for all on the site anyways. Just that I think they want those who have already got it (LW8) to have the chance of getting the manual without non-users upsetting the download times.

As to whether or not to upgrade, depends on what you want from LW, I'd say if you are struggling with rigging etc.. or dynamics, then yeah, well worth it. Same for if you want the added dopetrack features.
If you are toddling along with LW7.5 quite happily, give yourself some time - like say, wait and see if they produce any surprises at Siggraph. Maybe post-Siggraph you may have more incentive, but I have nothing whatsoever to back that up with. :D

Exper
07-07-2004, 04:07 AM
Originally posted by lsddigital
I have a LW 7.5 and a VT[3] licence, and I am a register user.
... but i donīt have access to lw[8] pdf ... that is why I did ask.

I want to look it before buy it a upgrade... how can I do?I know some other people (who doesn't frequent the forum) with the same problem!

NT needs to know...
they're waiting to download a Discovery Edition or take a look at the PDF...
and this is only for registred users...
then we must count anyone who's potentially interested at LW[8] as a new customer!

Conclusion: I personally give up! ;)

riki
07-07-2004, 08:27 AM
I'm not sure if it's illegal or not?? But it looks like WizCraker has posted a copy on his site. Maybe best to ask Custommer Sevice if you can get a copy.

cgolchert
07-07-2004, 09:57 AM
Has anyone thought that it also may be a way to control the bandwidth they have to pay for? :)

20 meg could even be a lot if you get every legit user racing to grab it. Leaving the pirate element out you are still looking at the possibility of bringing down the server it is on.

BeeVee
07-07-2004, 09:58 AM
I'm not sure that a reference manual for a program is a good indicator of its suitability for purchase. There is a feature list on NewTek's site: http://www.newtek.com/products/lightwave/product/list.html for people who wish to see what's included in the new version, with a helpful asterisk to denote items that are new to LightWave.

B

Titus
07-07-2004, 10:13 AM
Originally posted by cgolchert
Has anyone thought that it also may be a way to control the bandwidth they have to pay for? :)

Not an escuse. They can use Bittorrent. This is the way Linux Distributions are moving legally freeing the developers bandwith. The load is distributed between all the users ;)

But hey, I don't want to say NewTek how to do things, only interested in the topic.

Titus
07-07-2004, 10:22 AM
Originally posted by BeeVee
I'm not sure that a reference manual for a program is a good indicator of its suitability for purchase.

Agree.




There is a feature list on NewTek's site: http://www.newtek.com/products/lightwave/product/list.html for people who wish to see what's included in the new version, with a helpful asterisk to denote items that are new to LightWave.

B

I think the best thing LSDIGITAL and anyone should do is visit a reseller and ask for a demo. Last year I saw Proton and Deuce at SIGGRAPH, they sold me LW[8] that day.

Exper
07-07-2004, 10:36 AM
More than agree!

Ben...
you're point about the feature list is quite true but not completely...
example...
an LW7.5c user, monday, told me that he'll not upgrade cos reading the feature list he doesn't find enough: "Not much changed!"
I told him patiently about all the new stuff... ok now he's a point nearer to [8]... but he wants to test it (DISCOVERY EDITION free download)!

Important Note: he works in a national research lab, he's the foremost LW user there; in the last year their moving to concurrent apps... and probably they'll drop LW if they cannot test the [8] one!

Again and again and again...
not all users are here on the forum...
and not all users are ready to beg...
they prefear a more efficient solution: "DROP IT!"

Then...
nominate the "Discovery Editon" and NT's staff becomes "hush-hush"...
really strange that they don't want sell LW[8] and they don't want facilitate potential users in buying! :(

Really sad! :mad:

Conclusion:
I really and finally give up!
No more moaning...
but Chuck, Bee or Proton...
a couple of lines will be very welcome!

policarpo
07-07-2004, 11:27 AM
It would be nice if the Discovery Edition of LW8 gives users access to the full LW8 manual (or the Full Help system)...this way, a user can judge how viable the purchase or upgrade is for them.

Most other bits of kit offer the full manual with their demos.

When knowledge is set free, power comes to the user. :D

Cheers.

caesar
07-08-2004, 06:23 AM
when I used Maya PLE 4.5 it completly showed me why I had to stick to LW lol!
Discovery Edition v 8 would be great...i want so much to test IK BOOSTER!

Holger
07-08-2004, 06:50 AM
Originally posted by riki
I'm not sure if it's illegal or not?? But it looks like WizCraker has posted a copy on his site.
Hmm, where would that be? I can't find it.

cgolchert
07-08-2004, 09:45 AM
Originally posted by Titus
Not an escuse. They can use Bittorrent. This is the way Linux Distributions are moving legally freeing the developers bandwith. The load is distributed between all the users ;)

But hey, I don't want to say NewTek how to do things, only interested in the topic.

"excuse"?

most Linux Distributions are free. Bit torrent is a poor idea for the companies that want to control things like this. This isn't a free text file you are downloading, this is part of a commercial product.

Torrents can't be secure enough because there are so many people writing their own clients. If a programmer knows the system enough to create their own client I'm sure it can bypass any security that another might have.

Titus
07-08-2004, 11:31 AM
Yep, that's my point. If the bandwith is the problem then it can be solved very quickly, but the problem is piracy. NewTek holds the copyright and it's illegal to copy the manual by any means.

riki
07-08-2004, 11:48 PM
deleted

lsddigital
07-09-2004, 01:45 AM
but.... Is illegal or not?????
if isn't.. somebody can tell me where I can find it, please... or should I said... who can share it with me.

BeeVee
07-09-2004, 02:37 AM
Do you have a registered version of LightWave 8? If not, you have no right to the manual for it, simple as that. If you do, visit http://www.newtek-europe.com/uk/support/download.html and get it. This weekend I tested the connection at home and got 160k/s with it now that the bandwidth has improved because fewer people are trying to download it simultaneously.

B

lsddigital
07-09-2004, 05:39 AM
Originally posted by BeeVee
Do you have a registered version of LightWave 8? If not, you have no right to the manual for it, simple as that. If you do, visit http://www.newtek-europe.com/uk/support/download.html and get it. This weekend I tested the connection at home and got 160k/s with it now that the bandwidth has improved because fewer people are trying to download it simultaneously.

B

don`t worry!... a friend lend me his .pdf to me!
thanks you everybody.

NOW, I can read more about LW8... and maybe I upgrade... let me see.
bye

WizCraker
07-10-2004, 01:35 AM
Just buy Inside Lightwave 8 there is enough info in there that you can learn Lightwave.

I remember using 3d Studio max and maya. There were no manuals and we were stuck buying 3rd party books to get to know the program.

WizCraker
07-10-2004, 01:38 AM
Originally posted by Holger
Hmm, where would that be? I can't find it.

He is talking about this page

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=25271&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

reverie
07-10-2004, 12:43 PM
Just buy Inside Lightwave 8 there is enough info in there that you can learn Lightwave.

I don't think anyone who upgraded to LW8 would be sorry they did. I had V7.5 and V8 was an automatic upgrade because I bought 7.5 so late in the game. I learned on 7.5 and only planned to play around with V8 when it came. However, once I installed LW8 -- that was all she wrote. I have not worked in 7.5 since. The only time I open 7.5 is if I want to transfer an object via Plug-In to Deep Paint -- the DP3D plug in for LW8 won't be out till July 12th.

So, whatever your impression of the manual, LW8 is wonderful. The tools I use now -- cut/loop selection/points to polys/extender plus -- are mostly from LW8. :)