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digiforensic
04-07-2004, 11:40 AM
As far as all the people saying that "the programmers need time", "It has to pass Quality Control", "we would rather have a great working version than allot of patches later on", I agree with all of these. People need time to produce a great product.

But here is my complaint to Newtek. Let us know something. You are making me look like an a** to the people I work for. They constantly ask me, "When that $1000 dollars worth of software going to show up (2 licenses)". It's not the point of what the particular software "or asset" the company has paid for, it's the simple fact that we have paid and the software maker refuses to release any information on the release. I should complain to the BBB of this practice of no information, after receiving payment for a product. Quite frankly it makes me look like a fool when I have to tell the multimillionaire owner of the company I work for something that I read off a forum or something that is a rumor. My boss/es no nothing about Lightwave or 3D in general. All they know is that Microsoft Office is always available and they assume that because Lightwave isn't in the building, I MUST HAVE DONE SOMETHING WRONG. I also can't even count the number of time I told people about new functions of LW8, and how I was going to use this "new function" for a particular animation. Well, those animations have come and gone and producers ask me, "I though that you were going to create it that way?" Oh yea, I am going to take the 20 minutes explaining to a tv producer how I am still waiting for a piece of 3D software... no I am going to tell him something else which probably is going to make me look bad. As a paying customer let me (us) know something! Stop making me look like a sucker to capitalists that I work for that realize that you are making interest off thousands of people's moneys. Is it really too much to ask? Wait any longer and I will simply switch to max or maya, just because I'm a pist-off Irish American and I will hold a chip on my shoulder, about lightwave in general, until your company goes under and I can buy version 8 at a computer show for 20 bucks. It is bad enough trying to convince management to buy other really expensive equipment, when they actually let me purchase something, and it doesn't show up? Yea, that makes me really look good in a television broadcast industry loaded with cut throat people who constantly think that they are going to be screwed by anyone or anything.

Thanks allot Newtek, I hope that the backlash of the built up anxiety of this release bites you in the a##. Just remember as a 3D artist I can switch to another program at anytime, that is my business, and your loss. I really could care less, become the "only" 3D package out there and then and only then will you be able to completely control your customer base. Oh, I'M SORRY, that right your company is in TEXAS, I guess just like the President of the US, you can lead us on not really giving us any information and then providing information which is questionable. Sorry about that I forgot.

Wow a US President and a 3D program, 2 in the same, time for a change. It's amazing how both a person and a program can be distrusted.
Jim

PS I have no bad feelings about people from Texas (great americans), just remember I live in PA and we were pumping oil from the ground, shooting deer/bear, drinking moonshine, and creating government long before you even lost at the Alamo.

TSpyrison
04-07-2004, 11:52 AM
You obviously haven't been paying attention.

And..

You've made the mistake of making promises, based on software that you dont even have yet.. Thats your fault

Go enjoy Maya or Max and quit trying to stir up another debate about L8 or politics.

I dare say you even sound like a troll..

mattclary
04-07-2004, 12:06 PM
Originally posted by TSpyrison
I dare say you even sound like a troll..

I'll second that. Either that or natural selection waiting to happen.

Lightwolf
04-07-2004, 12:14 PM
Howdy Jim,

well, you have now learnt another lesson for life.

Next time talk to somebody who got his boss to approve for XSI 1.0 (or Maya 1.0, or Max 1.0), I think they've all learnt their lesson as well.

Cheers
Mike ;)

A little trivia on the side, NT originally come from Topeka, KA(I hope I got the last bit right).

robinson
04-07-2004, 12:23 PM
What’s that, just because somebody is criticising Newtek, he is a troll ?

BTW It's not KA it's KS (Kansas) :p

ursa
04-07-2004, 12:34 PM
and what was that cheap shot at Texas
all about?

ursa
texan for life

Mikeface
04-07-2004, 12:57 PM
I agree that he shouldn't have promised something he didn't know he'd have.

I also hope his animation skills are better than his spelling and grammar skills.

anieves
04-07-2004, 01:16 PM
Originally posted by robinson
What’s that, just because somebody is criticising Newtek, he is a troll ?

BTW It's not KA it's KS (Kansas) :p

is the whole "tone" of the post with only 2 more posts... This will make ppl question credibility and it seems like he just wants to stir **** up hence the Troll acusation and I must have to agree, sounds like a troll.

Posts that long I tend to ignore anyways.

tokyo drifter
04-07-2004, 01:18 PM
What’s that, just because somebody is criticising Newtek, he is a troll ? I'd say it's because of the whole Texas rant. Criticizing Newtek is everyone's favorite past time. :p

digiforensic
04-07-2004, 01:30 PM
Ok

I realize that Newtek wasn't orgionally from Texas, duhhh. I have been following/using aka "lightwave" since the begining. I just knew when I wrote the e-mail I was going to get a million replys about, "Newtek isn't from Texas orgionally". Well, no crap.

As far as the Troll crap. I guess this is how stupid people talk. Petty, oh so petty. How about, "I really disagree with your position on this matter." wow say that and I might listen tp your opinion.

You started the personal stuff, not me. So beware.

I haven't directed any insults toward user(s), at all. Though I have toward a company which is holding my money, plain and simple. It's my right to complain as a consumer, period.

So,

AS far as the politics:

I don't care. The fact is, it doesn't matter which program I use they all have there advantages and disadvantages. If I am dealing with buying a car, if I order the car, and they take forever to deliver, I am going to buy another car. And I won't buy from that manufacturer again. Don't draw me into a political descussion about what program is better or different, without people all the programs are just that, programs. Ones and Zeros.

In the industry I'm in, ideas are sold way before they are ever built. I need to tell my boss, networks, things so he can sell a potential product "pitch it" to someone who want to see a final result before every starting. Yeah, anyone in television production will, I think, agree that these producers want "bang" and "flair" and I need to sell them on the newest technology, everytime.


"You've made the mistake of making promises, based on software that you dont even have yet.. Thats your fault"

I base promises on a software company not the individual product. And you are completely right, I don't have the program yet, but yet they have my money? To me there is something wrong with that. I don't like being a sucker, I don't care if they throw in 200 free plug-ins. Money is money and people die over pennies everyday. I can't be upset because they have $1000 of my dollars? When all that I want is to know something?

SO, to all you out, I am done responding to people throughout this entire community, people who need to peronally insult people for the lackings in their arguements. Kinda like that six pack drinking idiot I know, who really doesn't see things as they are. When you use a program in a high stress, high profile environment, words are always said about up and comming things.

I ask all of you please.... comment on the company, the lateness, the excuses, the taking of your money, the quality of the program, or several other things besides personal insults against me for no reason. I am free to feel as I want. If I attack you feel free to atack me.

jim

Original1
04-07-2004, 01:30 PM
So is Lightwave 7.5 unuseable in the mean time?

did Digital Fusion not prove useful in the meantime, you purchased an advance upgrade, the last time I did that it was Messiah and it took two years for me to get Messiah studio

That the issue with buying an advance release.

mattclary
04-07-2004, 01:38 PM
L8 hasn't shipped yet, call Newtek and get your money back.

p.s. You will be truly missed... I remember way back when you first joined the forums, earlier this month... (sniff, sniff...) Those were some of the best 4 posts I've ever read.... :(

Original1
04-07-2004, 01:41 PM
Since Lightwave 7.5 is a very usable peice of software it has not affected me one bit except that I now have a wonderful peice of compositing software called DFX+ which works with my video toaster

so the wait for LW 8 has made my more productive since I've learnt to use the tools I've got more effectively rather than skimming over the surface of my new toys.

Anybody seen Tim Albees book and short Kaze Ghost Warrior ?

All done with the above tools, what your excuse? Oh I am waiting for Lightwave 8.

What was it Frank LLoyd wright said

"Man has built most nobely where he has built within his limitations"

The point I am trying to make is that they should have sent you 2 copies of Lightwave 7.5 in the meantime which you must have been able to use, LW 8 will not be that big a leap forward apart from the Character Tools and the Soft boby dynamics and how much of your work will that impact on?

Wade
04-07-2004, 01:50 PM
“Lost at the Alamo."

The point of the Alamo is not that they would have won or lost but, in fighting - and that to the death they gave their lives for others which they chose to do in standing their ground. That self sacrificial act helped others win by giving them more time to prepare.

So one might say they lost the battle, but for it they won the war!

:)

HowardM
04-07-2004, 01:58 PM
see, the problem here boys, is this:

Jim obviously thought when he was told '6 months from your purchase, you will have LW8' that he was going to have LW8, 6 months later.
Then after much ridicule Jim thought, 'hey, in 72 days, Im gonna have 8 finally!?' ...but alas, we saw what happend to Jims happiness.
Finally Jim was told that 'in the next few months, he will FINALLY, no REALLY, WE MEAN IT THIS TIME....get 8'
Jim doesnt have 8.
Jim now is asking for some solid information about where the hell is 8?, and you all have to attack him. So he took a few jabs with words, he deserves to.

He took a risk having faith in NTs word. That shouldnt be a crime. NT balking on their word (repeatedly) and not telling customers exactly what is going on is a crime! (do people who dont even use these forums get ANY kind of info from NT?)

Stop trying to make his opinion less justified by saying things like you got DFX, or you knew it was a risk, or does 7.5 not do the job?
Even if you dont like him, his post, or me, you cannot honestly say he is wrong to be upset. You know he is right.
Iif you bought a car and got a bicycle w/some cookies and a promise for the car eventually, someday, would you be happy?

Anyway Jim, everyones raving about (I still havent gotten mine?!) the email saying that NT is confirming shipping address, and everyone will have 8 soon.

I bet its by the 17th.
:)
YEAH!

TSpyrison
04-07-2004, 02:06 PM
As far as the Troll crap. I guess this is how stupid people talk. Petty, oh so petty. How about, "I really disagree with your position on this matter." wow say that and I might listen tp your opinion.

Yea, But I still think you are a troll


You started the personal stuff, not me. So beware.

Naa, Personal stuff would be saying something like "Hey Jim, you are a stupid idiot"


Don't draw me into a political descussion about what program is better or different, without people all the programs are just that, programs. Ones and Zeros.

You brought up the President, that was the start of POLITICAL discussion, which would surely once again turn into a flame war.



In the industry I'm in, ideas are sold way before they are ever built. I need to tell my boss, networks, things so he can sell a potential product "pitch it" to someone who want to see a final result before every starting. Yeah, anyone in television production will, I think, agree that these producers want "bang" and "flair" and I need to sell them on the newest technology, everytime.

So if you have been using Lightwave since the begining, you should be able to do it with 7.5 thats out and on your computer now. You think that nobody else here works for people that want their fair share of "bang" anf "flair" ? We've all managed before Lightwave 8 was announced.



I base promises on a software company not the individual product. And you are completely right, I don't have the program yet, but yet they have my money? To me there is something wrong with that. I don't like being a sucker, I don't care if they throw in 200 free plug-ins. Money is money and people die over pennies everyday. I can't be upset because they have $1000 of my dollars? When all that I want is to know something?


It is bad enough trying to convince management to buy other really expensive equipment, when they actually let me purchase something, and it doesn't show up?

Seem to me your company paid the money, I doubt you are starving because of it..


SO, to all you out, I am done responding to people throughout this entire community

You'll be missed im sure


Kinda like that six pack drinking idiot I know, who really doesn't see things as they are. When you use a program in a high stress, high profile environment, words are always said about up and comming things.

Would that be refering to me? Talk about a personal stuff.. I perfer long Island Ice tea over beer thank you. And if you are freaking out over a delay in software, maybe you should get out of your "high stress" environment. you'll develop an ulcer.


I ask all of you please.... comment on the company, the lateness, the excuses, the taking of your money, the quality of the program, or several other things...

Sure does sound trollish to me.


Have a wonderful day Jim

mlinde
04-07-2004, 02:27 PM
Originally posted by digiforensic
I base promises on a software company not the individual product. And you are completely right, I don't have the program yet, but yet they have my money? To me there is something wrong with that. I don't like being a sucker, I don't care if they throw in 200 free plug-ins. Money is money and people die over pennies everyday. I can't be upset because they have $1000 of my dollars? When all that I want is to know something? Sorry, I will be company-targeting in a moment, but I thought this was your "millionaire owner's" money?

I see you are frustrated about the long delay in Lightwave 8. Perhaps you should try to contact Newtek about getting involved in beta testing the software if you need new flash/bang features so often.

Show me the message or posting from Newtek that says "order lightwave[8] today and receive it within 14 business days" All the postings I saw and messages and offers were for upgrades and pre-orders. Get that? pre-order

The message I saw was this:

This is it folks! It's time to get off the fence. You've probably heard about the great pre-upgrade special we've been running for the last few months. We've decided to extend that special offer just until LightWave [8] ships --and we're announcing today that it will ship in the fourth quarter, 2003 -- that's some time in the next 72 days!Doesn't say Lightwave was out, although it had a target date. Microsoft had a target date for Virtual PC 7 for March 2004. Guess what, it's April. If you've really been around as long as you say, you should realize that until the software ships, there is NO guarantee that it will ship on time. Did Newtek blow this? Yes, they also admitted they blew it, gave everybody who pre-ordered a free UVEdit plugin, and said "sorry."

Did you get DFX or RealVis? If you did, then you got something for that money, didn't you?

theo
04-07-2004, 02:38 PM
I've made the decision to simply WAIT until the end of April for the new release. And this seems to be the consensus- sometime in April. This is pretty much why the forum has been dead lately when it comes to beating on Newtek concerning the LW8 release date.

So, digiforensic, the note of frustration IS understandable but premature as you probably should be saving that energy up for next month if April doesn't pan out.

I hate to say this friend but you kind of asked for the thread beating in a way.

Wait till next month- if LW8 doesn't show I'll help ya rant ;)

petermark
04-07-2004, 03:08 PM
Ah, such happiness!

tokyo drifter
04-07-2004, 03:18 PM
As far as the Troll crap. I guess this is how stupid people talk. Petty, oh so petty. How about, "I really disagree with your position on this matter." wow say that and I might listen tp your opinion. It would help if your original post was stated in a professional manner. It's hard for people to reply in a civil manner when you talk about politics and losing the alamo which has nothing to do with your problem. Abrasive statements will only bring about abrasive replies.

Original1
04-07-2004, 03:48 PM
Never mind guys it could be worse. You could have bought a Qual Opteron System and be sitting waiting for microsoft to delever a 64 bit operating system.

After 10 years at the bleeding edge of technology I should know better.

gjjackson
04-07-2004, 03:54 PM
*****, *****, *****...

I paid for 8 in Feb. because I thought it was being released very soon. Well it's April and still waiting. No big deal. Received DFX, a good deal, even though I still use AE6. Even when Newtek first offered it wasn't going to be released until the end of the year. It's not as if Newtek is promoting some VaporWare as has happened with some. Software isn't the only thing that you could pay for well in advance. If the boss is on your case, makes me wonder how well you get along with him otherwise. What was it, an excuse for a deadline you couldn't meet.

eggy
04-07-2004, 04:06 PM
Never mind guys it could be worse, you could be sitting in front of a mac, you know these unnecessary boxes (LOL, they call it computer and some people really think they are usefull, LOL).

Ahhhhrrrrr, just think about it, hey can't be worse.....:D

Just kidding:rolleyes:

But hey what's this thread all about, a troll (at least he was called troll) agains the newtek fanboys (it's a about time for this word, no name calling), great !!!