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DanH
03-17-2003, 02:41 PM
How do I get video out of the computer via firewire to my Sony DHR1000 DV deck? I am stumped (and maybe stupid?).
Thank You,
Dan

Scott Bates
03-17-2003, 04:59 PM
Can't do it through the Toaster, if that's what you're asking. If you have a Toaster project you want to send out via firewire you'll have to render it to a single DV file first and then use a third-party application like DVapp that used to be included with the Toaster software (don't know if it still is), DVExporter (DVIO) available from www.toastersupport.com, Premiere, etc.

DanH
03-18-2003, 09:01 AM
Thanks for the response. The DVExporter is a good start. Do you know of any similar DV Export application that allows you to export several files in a playlist format, like the DDR does? Thank You, Dan.

SBowie
03-18-2003, 09:29 AM
Another thought on this subject: it is debatable whether there is any reason to bother going through this exercise.

External DV devices can generally accept S-video directly out of the Toaster. Most users who have looked at this freely admit there is no discernible difference between footage converted (to DV, from analog) at the DV device by it's own dedicated hardware and that which undergoes DV compression using a codec on the system. Unless there is some other reason that you need to export as DV-AVI's, why waste the time and space to render the project. Just hook up an S-video cable and let the DV device do what it's good at.

Two cents Canadian doesn't go to far, but there it is anyway :)

Scott Bates
03-18-2003, 10:31 AM
Two cents Canadian doesn't go to far, but there it is anyway :)

You can always hope tomorrow's exchange rate will be better Steve :)

In any case, you raised my $0.00 US by $0.02 (Canadian or otherwise) all because I was too focused on the question to remember the alternative. In fact Dan, I've never transferred a TEd project to DV tape using firewire to my JVC miniDV deck, as Steve points out I always feed the deck y/c and let it do the transcoding in realtime. Can't see the difference and can't see taking the extra time to render an entire project to DV first.

FWIW ;)

DanH
03-18-2003, 04:55 PM
Thanks guys for the help. Okay, so now I know I don't want to go out via DV. In the past I have gone out via S-Video. I just thought that DV might be better. Now, here is a question: Steve, you said "...why waste the time and space to render the project." In the past I have rendered my projects using DV Video with interleaved DV Audio because I was told to do so. If I don't render, how do I play back my projects? Each tape consists of four 28-minute projects with a countdown AVI between them. I have rendered each project separately and then played them all back through the DDR. The rendering takes a long time and the playback is time consuming as well.. I am about 12% of the way through a 64-hour video project. Any advice now is greatly appreciated. Thank You, Dan.

Scott Bates
03-18-2003, 10:56 PM
Not trying to put words on Steve's fingertips, but....


In the past I have rendered my projects using DV Video with interleaved DV Audio because I was told to do so.
Were you told to do so in order to transfer the projects to tape via DV? That's the only reason I can think of for doing it unless it was to then delete all the raw project material and perhaps save some storage space.

If I don't render, how do I play back my projects?
I'm not quite sure where the confusion (?) comes in here Dan, but you just pull the projects into TEd (or a DDR as you have been doing) and play them out to tape via y/c. No matter how you do it, the playback time to tape isn't going to change, but you'll cut out the two hours per tape rendering time. Am I missing something? If I am we'll give it another shot.

PS - Just curious, what kind of 64-hour project are you doing?

DanH
03-19-2003, 11:58 AM
I asked tech support what format I needed to render the projects so that I could export them to DV. They told me to use DV VIdeo with interleaved DV Audio. Okay, so now I know I don't need to render. I know that I can copy and paste four 28-minute projects into a new project along with my countdown AVIs in between. This seems like a convoluted process. Is there a way to play back TEd projects from the DDR? Projects that I load into the DDR do not play. They also have an icon with a white exclamation point in a red triangle displayed to the right of the time. In the past when I've played my projects through the DDR they have already been rendered as AVIs. Since I don't do that anymore, how do I play them back through the DDR?
Thank You, Dan.

P.S. Oops! It's actually only a 32-hour project. It is a theological curriculum that needs to be completed by June.

SBowie
03-19-2003, 03:10 PM
Originally posted by DanH
I asked tech support what format I needed to render the projects so that I could export them to DV. They told me to use DV VIdeo with interleaved DV Audio. Uhuh - their answer would be correct if you were going to use FireWire to transfer the video ... not really necessary, though, as discussed above.



Originally posted by DanH

Okay, so now I know I don't need to render. I know that I can copy and paste four 28-minute projects into a new project along with my countdown AVIs in between. This seems like a convoluted process. Is there a way to play back TEd projects from the DDR? Projects that I load into the DDR do not play. They also have an icon with a white exclamation point in a red triangle displayed to the right of the time. In the past when I've played my projects through the DDR they have already been rendered as AVIs. Since I don't do that anymore, how do I play them back through the DDR? To use the DDR:

You've stumbled on a bug. There is a problem with Adding Projects (or sub-Projects) to a DDR in current versions. To get around it, rather than clicking on the DDR's Add button, simply drag the project's icon from a file bin and drop it directly onto the Add button on the DDR skin. May I suggest making the entire project a sub-project first, since then it be displayed in the DDR list as a single clip.

Note: to get smooth playback of same from the DDR, you may need to jack up the Preferences settings pertaining to DDR playback. Since most don't use it for playing full projects, the defaults are set lower than TEd's preferences.

So, you could stack your projects in a single DDR with the appropriate AVI's between them, or alternatively you could think about ....

Using ToasterEdit:

You can do all this from Toaster Edit directly. Edit and save each individual project. When done, open a New (empty) project, and from a File Bin, drop each individual project file (not the media, mind you-- just the project file) in order on your timeline, then separate them by the appropriate AVI files. Hit Play, done.

DanH
03-19-2003, 04:42 PM
Thanks Steve. I tried dragging the .ToasterEdit Project from the file bin into the DDR, but the project doesn't play and shows a time of (00:00:00.00). Additionally, if I start a New Project and drag other projects onto the fresh timeline the projects that I add are one second long and in that one second nothing actually plays. Any insight? Thank You, Dan.

barahn
03-26-2003, 09:54 AM
Hey, I was just wondering if anyone knows the difference between rendering out a file using "DV with interleaved audio" and using "DV Video Encoder". I've done both and the only difference that I can see is that the encoder way creates a slightly larger file. Is there really a difference and if not why would this be in here. And also, is there a quality difference between Type1 and Type2 DV files that the DVapp uses. Thanks, Bill

SBowie
03-26-2003, 11:21 AM
Originally posted by DanH
Thanks Steve. I tried dragging the .ToasterEdit Project from the file bin into the DDR, but the project doesn't play and shows a time of (00:00:00.00). Again, what does work -- for me, at least Dan -- is to "drag the project's icon from a file bin and drop it directly onto the Add button on the DDR skin". Not into the window, but directly onto the Add button.

vip3dran
03-26-2003, 02:36 PM
Originally posted by barahn
Hey, I was just wondering if anyone knows the difference between rendering out a file using "DV with interleaved audio" and using "DV Video Encoder". . . .
And also, is there a quality difference between Type1 and Type2 DV files that the DVapp uses. Thanks, Bill

the "DV with interleaved audio" is a type1 DV avi, and the interleaved audio is compressed.

the "DV Video Encoder" will create a type 2 DV avi with uncompressed PCM audio.

As far as I know, the only difference between the two would be the compressed/uncompressed audio. I don't believe there is a difference in video quality. (But then again, I may be wrong)

:cool:

SBowie
03-26-2003, 03:02 PM
I 'm pretty sure you're correct about the video quality being identical.

ScorpioProd
03-26-2003, 09:36 PM
Well, first off, I strongly recommend going with the Main Concept DV codec and not the MS DV codec. There really is a quality difference and the MC DV codec is more efficient at encoding (and therefore faster).

As for Type 1 and Type 2, the description was correct. For Toaster based use, it is always better to use Type 2 since that is easier on the computer to decode. Some NLEs with hardware prefer Type 1 because they have hardware for it.

Main Concept's DV codec is Type 2 only.

www.mainconcept.com