View Full Version : rotate skelegon help

01-21-2004, 08:08 AM
real quick... I have a toon, I added skelegons in modeler, converted them in layout. when I try to animate, all is good except for the legs, they rotate sideways..like jumping-jacks. with this type of piviot, I cannot create a walking sequence.

I went back in modeler, and made the skelegons in the RIGHT view port this time, did a quick test, was good. Finished up the rest of the skelegons. Saved, brought back into layout, the things are back to the way there were (side-rotation)..

I just cant grasp the rotation concept using the bank rotation handle. What view port should I use to make skelegons for the legs? and how can I rotate the leg set-up so that when I convert it in layout, I can create a walk sequence without his leg kicking out to the side, all ghey-like?

I don't need a huge explaination, I catch on quick, I just need a point in the right direction, I have the book in front of me, but it's not much help in setting up the initial state.


01-21-2004, 08:36 AM
OK I "think" I figured it out. I normally start by dragging out the first part of the leg bone at the hip and work my way down to the toe. I now just tried it in reverse, started at the toe and worked up to the hip, it seems to be the piviot I am looking for. I just have to add in an extra bone up at the hip, so I can actually rotate the hip. Is this correct? or, is there really no correct way, as long as it works?

01-21-2004, 09:11 AM
ok.. that ain't gonna work, I need to start at the hips and work down... any tips on rotating the skelegons before conversion in layout?

01-21-2004, 09:36 AM
OK, I found this:


Take a look at step 9 and 10. That is my problem, he has a solution, but I don't have the button. LOL

How.where do I find this "rec piviot rec" button. I has a "rec rest pos" - but no button to rotate the pivit point. Is this a 3rd party plug-in?

01-21-2004, 10:26 AM
Ok I got it, all set now.

I have another question tho... Fingers.

They are seperate bones. They are not parented to anything, so, obviously, when I move the arm, the fingers stretch and warp.

When I parent them to either the wrist bone, or any other bone for that matter, one of the fingers flies out of the area.

My guess is the parent structure should be this:

-Shoulder (parent)
-upper arm (child of shoulder)
-fore arm (child of u. arm)
-wrist (child of forearm))
-right thumb
-right index finger
-right mid finger.....etc

But when I do this, a finger flies off into space...
I tried to parent the 4 fingers to the thumb, which is parented to the wrist, but this doesnt seem to work either.

Whats the proper structure for working with fingers? do I need to recreat the bones in modeler from shoulder to thumb, then parent the other four finger to it?

01-21-2004, 03:13 PM
When parenting the bone structures, ensure that Parent in Place is on (under Scenes tab, under Global options).

01-21-2004, 04:38 PM
poor random_human, 1 reply that wasnt your own :(


i need about as much help as you with skelegons, i hate the things!!!!

01-21-2004, 05:01 PM
What issues are you having with skelegons SS? i have spent a bit of time messing about with them so i will help where is can


01-22-2004, 01:45 PM
thanks jorbie

i dont kno how to set up weight maps or anything... about the only thing i know how to do is put the skelegons in the model

the problem i have is that the skelegons always move stuff they arent supposed to move; when i have a skelegon in the arm and it is moved or rotated, it moves or rotates part of the chest or body, etc.

1 big problem i have is with the head, when i rotate it, it seems to flatten


01-22-2004, 02:49 PM
Hi SS,
you need to set up some weightmaps. sounds daunting at first, but it isn't really that bad.
what you need to do for say, the arm is select all the points you want the bicept bone to effect (ie between the shoulder and the elbow).
Next, down in the bottom right of the Modeller you should see a W, T, and M. Click on the W and select "new" from the drop down list next to these buttons. Give the map a name and press ok. there, you have created a weight map.
To assign it to a bone, go into your Skelegon Tree (under the Details tab), find the bone you want to use the newly created weight map, double-click in the weight map column and select the name of the wieght map you want it to effect.
and that's pretty much it. divide up your body into the regions you want the bones to effect (eg. thigh, calf, neck, head ect) and create a new weight map for each area as above.
if you need to tinker about with the weight maps look under the Map tab to Set Map Value and Clear Map for adding and subtracting points from a map.

good luck :)

01-22-2004, 10:58 PM
thanks i'm gonna try all that :)

01-29-2004, 12:27 PM
i setup the weight maps and it worked but now im setting up another model and for some reason the maps arent working...

do you select the points or the polygons?

1 more question: for a bone like say... in the middle of the body, one that when moved you would like it to move the whole bottom part of the body... how would you set that up? If you make weight maps for the legs and then you make another for the whole bottom part of the body (including the legs), will the one for the whole bottom part of the body delete or override the ones from the legs?

thx :)

01-29-2004, 04:13 PM
I select the points when making the weightmaps. it lets me be more exact over the area of influence.
to make sure the maps work, remember to assign the weightmap to the bone (using the skelegon tree in modeller).
as for your question about moving the whole bottom of the body you need to realise that the bone influence is additive. so if you have a Hip map tied to a Hip bone, and the Hip bone is the parent of the Thigh bone, which in turn has a Thigh map; moving the Hip bone influences the Hip map and the Thigh bone. and since the Thigh bone has a Thigh map moving the Hip bone moves the Thigh map too.

01-30-2004, 07:38 PM
thanks for all the help :)

something i forgot to ask is- what happens if some of the geometry on the model doesnt get weight mapped?

thx :)

02-01-2004, 02:36 PM
if you don't place weightmaps on all the points then the normal weight influence for each bone will be determined by its falloff setting. try to weightmap every point to a total of 100% as it gives you more control over what is effected by each bone. ie. for the elbow you might have the points 50% weightmapped to the bicept and 50% to the forearm. try to always make it add to 100%.