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samsoe
01-21-2020, 05:23 AM
I am preparing some previz material for a large liquid simulation. I have just downloaded the Real Flow demo package, setup and exported the simulation and now all the fun begins… So I thought…

I have an Alembic object sequence. All the individual files/objects run just fine in LW 2019.4, but as a sequence.., hmmm, no.
Fair enough, I think most packages requires a single Alembic file to work as expected.

I then stitched all the Alembic files and imported again. This time the first frame/object is fine, but the rest of the sequence is corrupted (the vertices are all over the place).
I tried to open the very same Alembic file in Fusion, no problem. The water is flowing perfectly.

It seems like the development of RealFlow / Lightwave integration is discontinued due to the lack of users.

And finally to my question, what is the best way to go using Real Flow and Lightwave? I am really hoping for Alembic to be the choice instead of proprietary software solutions.

I guess my next issue is getting the same surface on all objects and probably motion blur… but for now I need to get the meshing to work in LW.

Any ideas? Kind regards
/Samsoe

Oldcode
01-21-2020, 09:08 AM
Hello,

I use Lightwave and Real Flow a lot. You need to download their Connection Software for Lightwave. Once installed into Lightwave, it will enable you to import Real Flow mesh files into Layout. I use the BIN format as instead of the ABC Alembic format, it just is easier and more straight forward.

Once the Connection software is installed, CTRL-Q will open up the master plugin panel, and you should be able to get into the Real Flow app from there.

The Connection software is also how you apply the Surface settings, but in 2015 and before. I've not tried Real Flow in 2019 much yet, so I'm not sure if it will work the same way since the surface editor is very different. I do know that you need to turn off motion blue with Real Flow meshes or it will not look right.

Good Luck,

samsoe
01-21-2020, 10:54 AM
Hello,

I use Lightwave and Real Flow a lot. You need to download their Connection Software for Lightwave. Once installed into Lightwave, it will enable you to import Real Flow mesh files into Layout. I use the BIN format as instead of the ABC Alembic format, it just is easier and more straight forward.

Once the Connection software is installed, CTRL-Q will open up the master plugin panel, and you should be able to get into the Real Flow app from there.

The Connection software is also how you apply the Surface settings, but in 2015 and before. I've not tried Real Flow in 2019 much yet, so I'm not sure if it will work the same way since the surface editor is very different. I do know that you need to turn off motion blue with Real Flow meshes or it will not look right.

Good Luck,

Hi,
Thanks for helping. Yes, I did read about the connection software. But it is outdated and not supported anymore.
I was hoping for Alembic to be our savior :)

I will try to make an account and see if I can still download the connection software.
Kind regards,
/Ole

kolby
01-21-2020, 11:08 AM
I am preparing some previz material for a large liquid simulation. I have just downloaded the Real Flow demo package, setup and exported the simulation and now all the fun begins… So I thought…

I have an Alembic object sequence. All the individual files/objects run just fine in LW 2019.4, but as a sequence.., hmmm, no.
Fair enough, I think most packages requires a single Alembic file to work as expected.

I then stitched all the Alembic files and imported again. This time the first frame/object is fine, but the rest of the sequence is corrupted (the vertices are all over the place).
I tried to open the very same Alembic file in Fusion, no problem. The water is flowing perfectly.

It seems like the development of RealFlow / Lightwave integration is discontinued due to the lack of users.

And finally to my question, what is the best way to go using Real Flow and Lightwave? I am really hoping for Alembic to be the choice instead of proprietary software solutions.

I guess my next issue is getting the same surface on all objects and probably motion blur… but for now I need to get the meshing to work in LW.

Any ideas? Kind regards
/Samsoe

You can import RF meshes into LW very easily. Use RF Importer or via obj or even lwo sequences directly from RF.
The Surface replacement does not work since v2018 but you can partially or completely resolve this problem if you convert imported meshes to VDB volumes.
The Motion blur also does not work and the only way I know is to render these elements as a separate pass without MB and use Revision RSMB or something else in a composite package.

jwiede
01-21-2020, 05:24 PM
You can import RF meshes into LW very easily. Use RF Importer or via obj or even lwo sequences directly from RF.
The Surface replacement does not work since v2018 but you can partially or completely resolve this problem if you convert imported meshes to VDB volumes.
The Motion blur also does not work and the only way I know is to render these elements as a separate pass without MB and use Revision RSMB or something else in a composite package.

RF's days on LW are numbered, and it probably isn't a high number. Eventually, a LW API update will break it, and the RF plugin dev(s) don't seem at ALL interested in supporting/maintaining it any longer, so a fix is highly unlikely. Use it while you can, sure, but have a "migration plan" ready as well.

Quite the shame, LW RFRK was a nice option in the day. Not really surprising RF stopped support either, though, given LW's current market situation.

Carm3D
01-21-2020, 06:18 PM
There are other options. DeepFX, UP, Storm. I did this with Storm: https://vimeo.com/377628922

samsoe
01-22-2020, 06:29 AM
Thanks for the VDB tip jwiede! Using an OBJ sequence (straight from RF) in combination with VDB seems to be the way to go.
The surface problem is eliminated and now I am down to the missing motion blur. But this issue is solved in Fusion using RSMB.

I have attached a few screenshots from Fusion.

Looking foward to render the liquid in LW using VDB.
/Samsoe

146704

samsoe
01-22-2020, 06:39 AM
There are other options. DeepFX, UP, Storm. I did this with Storm: https://vimeo.com/377628922

I did try DeepFX In LW Layout, but I was not able to get the result I was looking for.
Storm Granular Solver looks very promising. How do you exchange data back and forth between the apps?
Up, never heard of this one before?
/Ole

Carm3D
01-22-2020, 07:45 AM
UP is not very good and the same price as Storm. UP is at Hurleyworks.com.

In LW2018 there is no way to load data from Storm into LW. Storm exports alembic particles, and LW can only load alembics with polygons. It also exports to .BIN and .PRT (I believe). If the RealFlow plugin worked beyond LW2015 that would do it. But currently all I can do with Storm is export meshed .obj sequences of liquids.

samsoe
01-22-2020, 08:23 AM
Thanks, OBJ is fine using the VDB trick. I will give Storm a go :)
/Samsoe

Carm3D
01-22-2020, 08:27 AM
Have fun! Let me know if you need help making your way through it's interface.

Carm3D
01-22-2020, 08:35 AM
I'm looking forward to when Storm gets it's point deformer feature so we can do soft bodies with it!! :)

samsoe
01-22-2020, 09:50 AM
Have fun! Let me know if you need help making your way through it's interface.

Thanks, sounds good.
The Hurley tool seems quite good, and it is native LW :) Do you know if this is still in full production? A good long-term investment (future updates, LW 2020 support etc.).
/Samsoe

raymondtrace
01-22-2020, 10:13 AM
The best plan is to contact Hurley and ask directly. Developers are motivated to continue projects when they know there's interest. Most LW plugin developers are 1-person operations.

After some silence on YouTube, a new demonstration was just posted this week. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9CDEYizDegHNd61z4yYSFQ

He's still developing...just not sure what tool this is.

Carm3D
01-22-2020, 10:37 AM
I'm glad he's still working on it. I had fun with UP, but it is very poor doing collisions with deforming models. Storm handles this far better.

samsoe
01-22-2020, 11:04 AM
The best plan is to contact Hurley and ask directly. Developers are motivated to continue projects when they know there's interest. Most LW plugin developers are 1-person operations.

After some silence on YouTube, a new demonstration was just posted this week. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9CDEYizDegHNd61z4yYSFQ

He's still developing...just not sure what tool this is.

Yes, you´re right. I just wrote him an email.
/Samsoe

samsoe
01-22-2020, 11:06 AM
I'm looking forward to when Storm gets it's point deformer feature so we can do soft bodies with it!! :)

But are you able to get motion data into LW for true 3D motion blur? RSMB is good, but the real thing is just that extra kick :)
/Samsoe

Carm3D
01-22-2020, 11:25 AM
Then the point deformer works, yes motion blur will work. Not with .obj sequences.

erikals
01-23-2020, 06:58 PM
I'm looking forward to when Storm gets it's point deformer feature so we can do soft bodies with it!! :)
Hi Carm, I've been looking into Storm / Houdini / BlenderFluids

Lately i've been wondering, Why should I choose Storm instead of the $70 Blenderphysics plugin,
also adding OD Tools we can import Foam,Spray,Waves easily.

Storm for LW is interesting, but is it a smarter path than the $70 Blenderphysics plugin?

Carm3D
01-23-2020, 09:46 PM
If you want a liquid solution, then Houdini or Blender is a better option... You can do foam, etc. I bought Storm for it's potential of doing amazing soft bodies. The liquids it does is just a nice bonus, and it does them far better than UP.

erikals
01-24-2020, 05:10 AM
Thank You! good info! https://i.imgur.com/tJGL61i.png

Carm3D
01-24-2020, 09:09 AM
Storm does create white-water based on how fast it moves, but that is lost when meshing. If LW could load .BIN or possibly particle-based alembics we would at least get that bit of extra detail.

ssmithers
01-24-2020, 09:33 AM
Mantaflow will do everything the flip fluids add on does, plus it does fire and smoke also and its free in the upcoming 2.82 release.

erikals
01-24-2020, 11:42 AM
Mantaflow = pretty neat, but read there were quite many crashes at the moment. + no LightWave plugin.

Storm might get more advanced water fluids in the near future, but looks a bit limited now.

samsoe
01-27-2020, 08:36 AM
If you want a liquid solution, then Houdini or Blender is a better option... You can do foam, etc. I bought Storm for it's potential of doing amazing soft bodies. The liquids it does is just a nice bonus, and it does them far better than UP.

The OD Houdini Shelf Tools are extremely cool a long with the work he has done regarding Blender (Flip Fluids).

Houdini
https://vimeo.com/325587339

Flip Fluids
https://vimeo.com/showcase/4335852/video/294946103

/Samsoe

samsoe
01-27-2020, 08:38 AM
If you want a liquid solution, then Houdini or Blender is a better option... You can do foam, etc. I bought Storm for it's potential of doing amazing soft bodies. The liquids it does is just a nice bonus, and it does them far better than UP.

The OD Houdini Shelf Tools are extremely cool a long with the work he has done regarding Blender (Flip Fluids).

Houdini
https://vimeo.com/325587339

Flip Fluids
https://vimeo.com/showcase/4335852/video/294946103

/Samsoe

erikals
01-27-2020, 05:26 PM
indeed. https://i.imgur.com/kWfIGoZ.gif

both nice. i guess Houdini must be superior in terms of quality / calculation times. (?)

Carm3D
01-27-2020, 06:29 PM
Not so sure... Storm has a video comparing calculation times to Houdini, showing how Storm is faster.

erikals
01-27-2020, 06:45 PM
yep, Storm seems limited tho' in regards to Foam, ParticleSpray, Waves
once they get that...

Houdini >


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gkucg9i5l44


when it comes to Houdini vs Blender Flip Fluids, i think perhaps Houdini is faster ?  not sure tho'