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gdkeast
05-15-2019, 01:38 AM
In a previous post, I had floated the idea of NT selling older versions of LW at a significantly discounted cost. Originally, I had suggested they sell a version with reduced render options, but now feel they can just sell a version two back, like 2015.

My reasoning for this was:
1) It shouldn't cost NT anything because the older version is not receiving any updates or staff resources.
2) It would potentially expand the customer base for those concerned with costs (and with Blender the cost argument is often the first heard).
3) It would help with marketing in general and potentially help a good cause (Humble Bundle?).


This should be a win-win for Vizrt and NT. They can unload a perfectly good program that is sitting around collecting dust, potentially expand the customer base, and make some money too. And if NT doesn't want to bother too much with the promotional aspect, they can outsource to a site like Humble Bundle and help a charity at the same time.


I only offer this as a friendly suggestion from someone who wants to see LW succeed in a competitive environmenthttps://www.humblebundle.com/.

3D Kiwi
05-15-2019, 04:46 AM
I cant see how this would work, Why would people want an older version of an application that is struggling in its latest version.

If Vizrt\Newtek want Lightwave to do well they need to communicate and develop simple as that.

gar26lw
05-15-2019, 05:26 AM
adapt or die.

lardbros
05-15-2019, 05:44 AM
Whenever NewTek have offered limited or different packaged versions of LW, it's kind of failed. Inspire 3d, 3d Arsenal... whatever else they tried, didn't really work.

Also, the 2015 would need an update to work on Apple Mac's.

JohnMarchant
05-15-2019, 06:09 AM
They would also have to find a way to stop them using this route to buy an update to the latest version or what would be the point of buying a new seat.

RPSchmidt
05-15-2019, 06:36 AM
I cant see how this would work, Why would people want an older version of an application that is struggling in its latest version.

If Vizrt\Newtek want Lightwave to do well they need to communicate and develop simple as that.

Struggling in its latest version? How so?

If you mean the brand as a whole, I can see it... but for my money, the latest version has been the best of the crop.

Dexter2999
05-15-2019, 11:08 PM
Newtek tried a version of this some time ago. They packaged an older modeler with presets and pitched it as sort of "3D for people who aren't 3D artists". It was called Lightwave Arsenal. (I think?) If I remember correctly it was like 30%-50% less than full blown Lightwave.

I believe it sort of proved a niche market with additional support needs. Not sure how long they marketed it.

It seemed like a good idea on the surface but I don't think it panned out.

Perhaps some of the old timers around can correct me on this.

EDIT** It was bugging me so I looked it up. The product was 3D Arsenal.

JohnMarchant
05-16-2019, 01:48 AM
Newtek tried a version of this some time ago. They packaged an older modeler with presets and pitched it as sort of "3D for people who aren't 3D artists". It was called Lightwave Arsenal. (I think?) If I remember correctly it was like 30%-50% less than full blown Lightwave.

I believe it sort of proved a niche market with additional support needs. Not sure how long they marketed it.

It seemed like a good idea on the surface but I don't think it panned out.

Perhaps some of the old timers around can correct me on this.

EDIT** It was bugging me so I looked it up. The product was 3D Arsenal.

There was also NewTek Inspire which was sort of like ZBrush Core, sort of cut down version of LW. I think the market for LW, in general, is small at the moment and also the team, so can't see any reason that it would really work. I certainly would not like limited resources taken away to work on another application.

Thing is there is Blender and whilst not a full and complete package and it does have its problems it's free. So like any business, NT can't compete on price so the only other option is quality, reliability and rebustness. I've seen quite a few people jumping to Blender from Max and indeed Maya and im sure some have jumped from LW as well.

3D Kiwi
05-16-2019, 01:54 AM
Interested to know why you think Blender isn't a complete package? It can do pretty much anything the others can.

JohnMarchant
05-16-2019, 03:26 AM
Interested to know why you think Blender isn't a complete package? It can do pretty much anything the others can.

Because it still has flaws, it can be flakey some times, some of the stuff in it can be a PITA and frustrating sometimes. Actually, i think Blenders strength is also in a way its Achilles heel, the very nature of the openness means that you can lose some consistency on the way things work across each part of the app. The UI has improved in 2.8, which is what i use but still has some way to go, however, it's getting there. I also think that it is changing the 3d industry and software for the better, which can only be a good thing.

Blender can compete with the best and in some features its streets ahead. I got back into using Blender after seeing the work done on Man in the High Castle, some excellent work done on that.

3D Kiwi
05-16-2019, 05:43 AM
Because it still has flaws, it can be flakey some times, some of the stuff in it can be a PITA and frustrating sometimes.

Sounds like every 3D application out there.

JohnMarchant
05-16-2019, 06:42 AM
Sounds like every 3D application out there.

Oh indeed, no one package does all. Try modeling in Houdini, not the nicest experience. Blender has grown on me especially since 2.8, before the UI was confusing and took to long to do something simple. That's because i knew how to do it in LW and had a lot of time and money invested in it. I'm now investing more time and money in Blender, not to replace LW but to get up to speed on a very popular and increasing user base.

If i were someone new to 3D, then i would absolutely start with Blender, even the paid add-ons to Blender are relatively cheap, i have most of the well-known ones and i recently got Flip Fluids for $56, what's not to like about that. I hope Blender comes on leaps and bounds but i mostly like what it's forcing other 3d software companies to do. Houdini, AD, Pixologic and others are all offering free or cut down versions of their major packages and this is in part because of Blender. Of course this business model does not work for all, because many of these companies offer other things, like in the case of NT, LW is a very small revenue maker to the core business.

I just hope that VizRT has the same commitment to LW as NT did before, only time will tell.

AnimeJoex
05-17-2019, 12:18 PM
They should track down and scoop up some of the old Softimage developers and give us SoftWave. ;)

Nicolas Jordan
05-17-2019, 02:19 PM
I can see people running into lots of issues if they are trying to run older versions of Lightwave on newer hardware. I struggle enough with running LW2015 to update older projects on my Threadripper some of which I just import into LW2019 instead to safe myself stability issues.

TheLexx
05-18-2019, 04:09 PM
LW2015 and Threadripper have some sort of incompatibility, or is the problem Windows 10 constantly updating rather than the cpu ?

3D Kiwi
05-18-2019, 05:58 PM
They should track down and scoop up some of the old Softimage developers and give us SoftWave. ;)

Most of them at the time went to Houdini i think, Couldn't imagine Lightwave being much of the draw card for them.

Free4Ever
05-26-2019, 12:46 PM
I would buy a Lightwave 2015 "Classic" version at a lower price, as an entry ticket to the Lightwave world. Say 99$ or 199$ with or without a plugin like NevronMotion. I guess a classic version cannot be used for update offers, but maybe you can get the 99/199 as a rebate when buying the full version.