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meshmaster
01-03-2004, 08:44 AM
I am really new to DVD burning - just bought a DVD burner the day after xmas because it was a pretty good deal - got a 169.99 burner for 99.00... I've been doing some looking around on google and places trying to learn anything and everything that there is to know about dvds. Recently on a few google searches I found out about the freaking huge dvd-18 disks that hold 17 gigs of info, which some movies are packaged on, such as the original release of T2... Does anybody know of prices that it costs to burn something like that or where you can get disks that are that freaking gigantic!?! Seems like something like that, if it worked with a normal dvd burner would be a super awesome way of doing backups! ;) I truly doubt it's available to the public, but if anyone has info on this, it'd be greatly appreciated.

Nakia
01-03-2004, 09:02 AM
Only solution I have on my mac for something larger than 4.3gigs DVD Authoring is I use a SCSI DLT 20/40 drive. Then send the tape off to a DVD mastering joint and have em burn a DVD for you.
Roxie Toaster sends to DLT, most backup apps do. Also Pro-Level DVD Authoring tools do to.

Rich
01-03-2004, 11:10 AM
There is also a new format of DVD coming out soon called Blu Ray which can hold 27gigs of data which will be needed for High Definition movies. Here is more info

www.matsu****a.co.jp/corp/news/official.data/data.dir/en020219-4/en020219-4.html

Edit: the forum puts stars in the link because its the word shi*

Avebeno
01-03-2004, 04:29 PM
Home DVD recorders can only burn on single layered DVDs. Even if you were to get some of the larger capacity discs you wouldn't be able to use them.

Nakia
01-03-2004, 04:45 PM
Doing multi-layer stuff DLT is best used. DVD9 and up.

meshmaster
01-05-2004, 07:29 AM
guess we'll justs have to wait for the 25 gig blue-rays that were released not so long ago in Japan.

lvsoule
10-27-2004, 03:01 PM
Then send the tape off to a DVD mastering joint and have em burn a DVD for you.
Roxie Toaster sends to DLT, most backup apps do. Also Pro-Level DVD Authoring tools do to.

Hi Traveling Man,

my name is Larry I was on the newtek discussion board and read your DLT DVD authoring message. I was wondering, I've been authoring to DVD from DVD studio Pro- I Author to DLT and send it off to the glass mastering company. However they are saying that because I use Mac it is not compatible with many machines out there(especially PC laptops) something to do with the way it codes in Mac(Final cut pro, QT Mpeg2 encoder) is this bogus or what! they want to farm the jobs out to some other guy using ULEAD, I think its a way to get the company to bump me.
Is there any compatibility problems with authoring on MAC when it goes to DLT Tape? any info would be greatly appreciated.
thanks for your time
- I use PC(VT3) and Mac daily, but I like to do all my authoring on the Mac.

-Larry Soule
Soule Producitons

rogergbh
10-28-2004, 07:49 PM
I just came upon this thread and would like to offer my expertice.

There are two distict forms of DVD's in use.

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First is the Replicated DVD.

This is your store bought DVD. A glass master is made from DVD files usually suplied on DLT IV tape (made with a DLT-4000 or 8000). This becomes a "stamper" and is used in an injection molding machine to produce pressed DVD disc's. These are by far the most compatible (baring against encoding, authoring and mastering mistakes) and are exactly what you rent at Blockbuster.

The forms of replicated DVD are as follows:

DVD-5 Single Side, Single Layer - 4.7 GB capacity. Other side is fully Printable on single side discs.

DVD-9 Single Side, Dual Layer - 8.5 GB capacity.

DVD-10 Double Side, Single Layer on each Side - 4.7 GB on each Side. 9.4 GB total, but needs to be flipped (Look at a lot of older movies with a Letterboxed Version on one side and a full screen version on the other, ie: first edition Total Recall). You can only print on a small inner ring on either side on Double sided disc's.

DVD-14 Double Side, Dual Layer on one Side Single on the other (8.5 and 4.7 GB)

DVD-18 Double Side, Dual Layer an each Side (example - T2 Disc) 8.5 and 8.5 GB

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Now we come to the second form, the DVD Recordable disc, called Duplication.

Currently there are several formats:

DVD-R/RW (3.95 GB and 4.7 GB)
DVD+R/RW (4.7 GB)
and DVD+R Double Layer (8.5 GB)

"+" and "-" media need compatible Burners but work about the same on Players (about 85% playback without any hiccups). Some burners out there are + and - (plus and dash) capable.

"R" discs are record once and "RW" are record and erase (just like CR-R/RW)

All these formats are called "General Purpose" media except for the 3.9 GB and a single 4.7 GB stock avaiable in "Authroing" media. These need special Authroing Burners (Pioneer S-201, S-101) and are (were) very expensive. We paid $17,000 for our first 3.9 GB only S-101 in 1997!

These are all Single Side media (though you can find rare packs of Double Sided DVD-R with 4.7 per side). I'm not too happy with the playback compatibility of the newest Doulbe Layer (8.5 GB) stock. Right now it's Verbatum and only about 4 months out on the street.

Encoding is an art, Authroing is a skill and mastering can be mysterious...

No shameless plugs for my compnay but I will hand out some advise :)

Shoot, aquire edit and render out to the best output format you can, uncompressed TIFF/TGA, HDCAM, Digital Beta and so on. This is money well spent on your masterpiece!

Go with an Authroing shop that uses Sonic Scenarist, Creator or Spruce Maestro. Make sure the encoding is top shelf and all digital (with Pre-Processing or Telecine available), Sonic SD series Encoders, Spruce MPX-3000, Digital Vision Bit-Pack, Sony Visaro, Cinimacraft PRO and any older Minerva Compressionest.

And make sure you know who's doning the Mastering (Glass Master) and who's doing the Replication (it's a factory after all)... there are a lot of "brokers" out there. Idealy keep it under one roof (or as few as possible) and do your research - even just watching DVD's and paying attention to Menu Design, Audio fidelity and Encode quality, there are limits in DVD's - you need to know them to push them...

A quick comment about the last post... DVDSP is under a grand. Ulead comes in about $500 dollars. Sonic Scenarist is $15,000 to $25,000. All three do DVD Authoring. Sonic Creator is on the MAC, Scenarist is PC based. The Sonic SD series used to only be MAC based (now it's finally ported over to the PC, it was fussy under OS 9.1). Many, many, many A-List hollywood titles were done and done excedingly well on the Creator system. So I wouldn't buy any simple "MAC" problem making DVD's. It's the software and the skill that matters (however encoding without hardware, like using Apple Commpressor and QT, are NOT proffesional, IMHO). But I wouldn't call Ulead (no offence to them) an "upgrade" from DVDSP. They both have good and bad points about them. They both can say Pro and do have some nice features for the price, but not Pro results when compared to the real Proffesional Apps (again only IMHO)... so I use DVDSP at home making cool christmas DVD's for the family and burn 'em off to DVD-R, 2 at a time. I'll do the real deal at work... now if only I was as good at Lightwave :)

Check out <http://www.dvddemystified.com/dvdfaq.html>

-roger

lvsoule
10-29-2004, 02:41 PM
Thanks Roger very very helpful. It sounds like to me I need to go with a different DVD authoring. I will look into the Spruce and Maestro. Kind of spendy, but if I can get the company to sport the money it'll be worth it. the problem we're running into is another company really wants this bid for authoring, even though I shot it! I can do the authoring in half the time, but I'm familiar with DVDSP.

thanks
-Larry

rogergbh
10-29-2004, 09:54 PM
Hey Larry,
I'd try a new Mastering facility! If your DVD-R proof discs work flawlessly then I'd really want to know specifics from them. They should be using something like Eclipse for verification. If your making a DVD-9 project then mux it down to a File Folder (VIDEO_TS folder) and use "DVD Shrink" on the PC to make it fit a DVD-R for testing. Test it on as many players as you can. You can also reduce your bit rate to around 5 Mbps and make sure you're using Dolby AC3 and not PCM for Audio (that right there means 224k instead of 1.5 Mbps in overhead). DVDSP has notorious problems making a 100% compliant DVD-9. They have claimed to have fixed it now about 4 software revisions. The negative posts on Apple's list mysteriously disappear after a while :)

Good luck to you, let me know if I can be of any assistance.
-roger