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View Full Version : Modeler requests, lets have em'....



hrgiger
12-30-2003, 05:58 PM
In the spirit of being constructive, I'd like to start a list/thread about modeler. Obviously , we still don't know what all enhancements there will be to modeler yet for Lightwave 8 but there seems to be a certain amount of grumbling on the supposed lack of work that has been done on modeler in spite of all the great work that has been done on Layout.
Soooo.....
All of you modelers out there who are looking for big improvements in the workflow and toolset of modeler, post your requests or ideas here and I'll add it to the list. Even if it's a bug fix or minor change to an existing tool, let's have em.


NEW FEATURES AND TOOLS:


True Edge selection- We some new edge tools in Lightwave 8 but they work off of points instead of edges. True edge selection would allow you to select an edge between two points and perform modeling operations on them.

Edge Weighting- Edge weighting is similar to point weighting in Lightwave although much more powerful. Working on edges would allow you to have a round shape in one direction and sharp in another direction where as point weighting sharpens the lines going in and out of the vertex in all directions. Think of a hockey puck shape...to get that shape with a subpatch model now in Lightwave, you would have to bandsaw in more detail to get sharp edges going around the perimeter of the top and bottom of the puck. Edge weighting would allow us to get fine shapes with a minimal amount of geometry.

N-Gon Support- As it is, we have to keep our subpatch models limited to 3 and 4 point polys. Being able to tab 5 point or more point polys would really improve workflow as you could add edges to your hearts content.

Instancing/Cloning- The ability to have instances tied to your base model, change your base model and all your instances update automatically.

Non-Linear Morphs- The ability to have morph targets along a curve rather then linear. I think the best way would be to have a slider in the Morph window so you could set different morphs from a -100 to 100 range.

New snapping tools- Snap to edge, snap to point, snap to polygon, snap to backgound points, etc...

Interactive spline patching- patch a spline that isn't quite right? Move the splines and have the polygons follow the new contour interactively. Also known as parametric or relational modeling which means, alter one shape and have another update. For instance, do a rail extrude, then you can adjust the rail and have the extruded polygon shape match to fit interactively. Very powerful.

New Bezier options- The ability to reuse the last used setting on the bezier panel. Also, the option of readjusting the bezier points after the tool has been dropped and picked up again.

Cameras or Lights in Modeler- Cameras could be useful in Modeler for making projection planes for front projection maps for compositing. The ability to adjust Light display in modeler would be nice also.

Shaded background or locked layers in Modeler

Deformation Lattices

Lscript Commander For Modeler

3D Paint- Perhaps some evolution of vertex paint to allow us to paint textures directly on 3D objects?

Local Sudivision for Subpatch mode- The ability to add a lot of local detail but keep the surrounding geometry simple. This would require the above n-gon support feature. There are already many ways to add local detail, but workflow would be eased if we could butt a 5 point poly against a 4 point that subpatches worked on.

Subpatch Viewport, low polygon editor- Edit the polygon cage, while a subpatch version in another viewport updates.

Open point info panel- Let us keep the info panel open during modeling to allow for ease of use when copying and pasting point info, very useful for using the set value function. I also think a right click drop down to copy and paste point coordiantes would be easy.

Tool Widgets- Open up the numeric panel for scale for instance, and have a the option to enable a 3D widget to precisely place the point to scale from.

Symmetry mode for all tools- being able to knife or bandsaw and have it work with symmetry.

History

Shift and Drag copy- Select an item, hold down the shift key and drag on the object and a copy is pulled out of it.

Shift and Translate on the Axis of a polygon normal

Custom Grids

More Export/Import file options

Symmety on all Axis or a radial symmetry

Airbrush modeler-Airbrush tool that works with things like smooth/smoothscale/Jitter/Clone/Relax/Push&Pull Normals/ etc...

3D Fonts- Suport for 3D text with beveling edges options in the numeric panel.

Mixed Display Modes- Have a wireframe model and a shaded model in the same window and layer.

Extrude/Bevel along surface- No need to line up geometry to lay on top of another piece of geometry. Just line up your shape to be extruded and have the extrude follow the surface contour. I saw something like this in XSI where they imprinted a curve onto a globe obect and then extruded a shape to follow the curve along the surface of an object.

Better Measures-- For greater scale precision.

Updating UV's... Have the UV update as you're modeling.

New Layer Editor- Perhaps similar to Photoshop's layering editor?

Filleting and Chamfering- Preferably to have an checkbox option to do either group or individual polygons for multiple selections. Should have the option of number of bevels as well as interactive offset and shift capabilities.

Renderable Splines with options for Volume and textures

How about any new feature that prevents us from jumping back and forth between modeler and Layout such as testing weighting deformations?!!

Interatively add more points to splines after creation- After dropping the spline tool, go back to a spline, select it and have a slider to control point count.

Recover last selection-How many times have you carefully selected a group of polygons and then accidentally deslect them?

Better Boolenas- Have boolean cutters that will create 3 and 4 point polys for subpatch reasons. Also, have them be animatable.

KEEP CURVE- The option when bandsawing in detail to keep the origial curve of a suppatch object or to add a point to a spline and keep the splines original shape.

Customizable Hotkeys-Being able to have different hotkeys based on the tab that is active. Having the ability to turn this feature on and off would be a must.



FIXES AND QUIRKS:


Easier and more intuitive bend tool

Fix it so that when you switch from UV Window to background image, it doesn't screw up your image settings.

No Subpatch UV Distortion




List content provided by Ade, Chingis, Cresshead, evenflow, hrgiger, JDaniel, Julos, Kvaalen, marlo.steed, mkiii, Nemoid, papou, Prospector, Riki, Sculptactive, TSpyrison, Yog, Zeno, .

prospector
12-30-2003, 11:16 PM
Radius Morphing

marlo.steed
12-30-2003, 11:21 PM
Instancing! I came from Strata Studio Pro and even though that is considered a lower end program, compared to Lightwave, it had instances. It is a great tool - make one object, clone it and then go back and change the original and all the clones change automatically.

hrgiger
12-31-2003, 12:02 AM
What is radius morphing?

Kvaalen
12-31-2003, 12:36 AM
I'm sort of surprised you didn't already put subpatched n-gons. :)

Marlo.steed: Instancing isn't a modeler request as far as I know.

hrgiger
12-31-2003, 01:03 AM
I have heard of being able to modify one object and have it update all the instances. I think it could be both a modeler and layout tool.

evenflcw
12-31-2003, 02:38 AM
I agree to all of the above. Probably radius morphing too, even though I'm not sure what that is.

Instancing would be very welcome in modeler aswell as Layout. Maybe through a mirror instance we could get a more consistant working symmetry.

My biggest Modeler wish for LW8 however was a powerful edgebeveler/chamfer as it would fit my way of working great. DAZ's was the best out there imo, but not very powerful as it pretty much lacks any options except for distance. I'd like to see something that can do any number of segments, accepts absolut or relative input, has a slider to produce sharp or smooth results etc. What I'm really looking for is something that has the amount of options of Add Edge (I love that tool) but bevels edges.

I'd also like to see alot of snapping/constraint options. Snap to point, edge, polynormal, constrain to edge or normal etc. These should work for regular operations aswell as (falloff) guides. An alternative would be a visible live action center/guide/handle that could be draged around and snap to just about anything (I'll try and make a feat. req/mockup for this as it's kinda hard to explain in just text.)

And just in general, I'd just like see alot of tools merged into one or have hotkeys/menu buttons be able to pick the right function depending on what is selected (point/poly/edge), because Modelers interface is simply starting to feel abit heavy with all the very specific tools. For example the regular bevel and edge bevel could aswell be on or use the same button/hotkey.

EDIT:
I forgot. I'd also like to be able to alter selections without having to turn tools off. This would make workflow abit less quirky, but would require a change of what the mousebuttons do so it would need to be optional.

Oh and more spline tools with realtime patches!

jin choung
12-31-2003, 04:15 AM
i don't even see the point of making constructive requests anymore.

if all that lw 8's modeler is gonna get is not much more impressive than what's shown in the videos, i think i've just lost hope for lw....

jin

meatycheesyboy
12-31-2003, 05:25 AM
I think what prospector means by radius morphing is the ability to morph things in a circle, like eyelids closing, etc. I would prefer doing this through some sort of keyframeable morphing. So you would setup up an object with say 10 different morph states, and the object would go through them in order with one slider, if that makes any sense.

Old versions of LW had something somewhat similar in Layout where you could tie multiple morphs to one curve in the graph editor but it was confusing and hard to setup. I would like to see it more elegently setup and integrated into the endomorph system so it could be done in modeler.

hrgiger
12-31-2003, 06:22 AM
I understand where you're coming from Jin.

However, I really think for one, you should wait until 8 comes out to pass judgement.

But I would also speculate that the majority of work has been done to layout.

But then, I think you'll find that most people would agree that if there was to be focus on the program, it would have to be Layout. Perhaps we'll see bigger changes in modeler in a . release after 8.

TSpyrison
12-31-2003, 07:04 AM
The Instancing/Cloning thing..
I had a feature request once, that I don’t think I expressed it properly..

Lets say I build a building with 4 walls and a window in each wall…
Id like to be able to say that the 3 windows are an instance of the first..
so that If I decide to change the first one.. all the others are automatically updated

I kind of thought of it as like After Effects “Pre-composing” but for 3d models instead..

Yes yes?
:)

mkiii
12-31-2003, 07:19 AM
Instance cloning would probably entail a complete re-write of modeler from the ground up & I really don't see that happening any time soon.

I'm sort or in agreement with Jin here. Modeler has been given a few new tools of late, but apart from the various mapping tools, remains substantially the same as the first versions. Granted, it *is* a very good polygon modeller, and sub-d modelling is somewhat easier than it used to be, but it is starting to creak at the seams a bit, and is being overtaken in leaps & bounds by most other 3d apps in the last year or so.

LW 8 was never supposed to be a major modeler update according to Newtek. Let's just hope that 8.x *IS*

prospector
12-31-2003, 07:52 AM
Yea..Radius Morphing
The ability for modeler ti remember what tool was used to create a morpf.

Bend a finger.morph
Modeler remembers the point spacing in the base model and KEEPS it thru the bending of a finger. leg,arm, eyelid.

As it is now, it takes a straight line from 1 morpf to the next.
So that fingers shrink from straight to bent.

Mutli morphs (like meetycheesyboy) mentions works but requires many morphs and the transition from 1 to the next results in the total movement from BOTH morphs, even if they cross at 50%.

TSpyrison
12-31-2003, 08:03 AM
Count a vote for Interactive spline patching, and..

Spline tool and curves:

I would like to be able to make a spline, drop the tool, the be able to go back to that curve later on and re-adjust the curve using the bezier spline controls....

and Id realy like to be able to select the Bezier spline tool, then shift click (or something) on an existing point, and have the tool start the new curve at that point. Then shift click another point, and have the curve end there.. then be able to adjust the curves after I've placed the begining and ending points.

I have a hard time getting the placement of the start and end points of my curve just right in the 3 axis without alot of fiddling..

:)

TSpyrison
12-31-2003, 08:08 AM
Modeler background resolution..

Here is another hairbrained scheme...

Take a background image in modeler..
Lets say its a high res picture..

when you are zoomed out, it would display at a lower resolution, then as you zoom in, it could use the higher resolution of the image for a more detailed zoomed in view...

im not sure if what im typing is what I mean...

Kvaalen
12-31-2003, 08:19 AM
Somthing I think could be really usefull is to be able to have one view port or somthing that shows the model in subpatch mode while the others don't. That way you can simply model on a non subpatched model and see the results as a subpatched model in real time. I don't think I explained it well, but you guys probably get an idea. :)

Oh, and simply being able to change the subpatch level won't be enough. :)

BTW, I would like as TSpyrison said, an option to have the last used setting for a bezier spline. After creating a box you can choose the box tool and hit "n" and you will get the last settings. It is like that with many of the tools but not with the bezier tool. It is pritty annoying when you want to modify a bezier spline you created before and you can't. I'd like it if you could delete the old spline, select the bezier tool, hit "n" and then you can tweak it.

Yog
12-31-2003, 08:31 AM
Some suggestions just off the top of my head, but if you gave me five years I'm sure I could come up with more ;)


Symmetry function to work with all tools, like knife and add edges.

Splines to allow straight sections.

The Create UV’s in tools like Rail Extrude and UV Spider to respect polygon spacing (the uniform spacing at the moment makes it all but useless).

The ability to create and screen pick by Groups (or parts). The current Parts have a couple fundamental flaws, if you copy a part the new polygons get added to the original part instead of forming a new one, and you can only pick them from the statistics window instead of direct from the viewport.

Automatic un-welding of points in the UV window (without un-welding in the other windows).

Smoothing groups (ala MAX), saves adding extra geometry (especially useful for sub-D models), or cutting and pasting to form an edge.

Edge weighting, for many of the same reasons listed above.

Standardisation of the Subdivide tools. Subdivide->Metaform is the easiest to use, but doesn’t respect Sub-D weights, Freeze does respect Sub-D weights but is a pain to use with half it’s parameters found under the Options tab.

Construction Planes, hey there are some 3rd-party plug-ins that do it already, so no reason for Newtek not to make an offer and incorporate them as a “new” feature.

A Camera viewport in Modeler, would make shadow/reflection catchers a breeze to construct when using front projection techniques.

Multiple content directories. Having built up a library of standard objects and images it would be useful to be able to specify more than one content directory at a time, say point one to the current project directory, and point another to my library directory.

Point chamfering. Very useful for branching geometry.

A decent polygon reducer that doesn’t destroy UV maps. Qemloss3 does this.

Sort out UV warping on Sub-D objects. Other programs don’t have this problem.

Making lathing and rail extrudes parametric objects so you could always go back and alter the profile.

Allow the Magnet and Dragnet tools to be represented as temporary weightmaps in any viewport that has weight shading enabled. Would give far better feedback over the area of influence.

The ability to reduce any point selection down to 100% weighting without scaling all other weight values. At the moment I can do this with a combination of Select by V-Map Value (I think it is a 3rd party plug-in), inverse selection and Set Map Value, but it would be a lot easier if there was a single function.

Axis constraints for the Bend tool. Can sort of be done in the numeric panel, but it is not dynamic or as easy as it would be by dragging in the viewport.

UV Stitcher, Similar to the function in Maya. You have polygon groups in the UV window, you select a row of points from one group, the points that they would normally be attached to in another group are automatically selected (but can be added to or the selection reduced), and when you run the tool it will attempt to move, rotate, and scale one piece to match the other, whilst at the same time welding the common points.

Lattice deform.

Being able to specify a UV map tiling amount. Having to scale up geometry by several magnitudes of order in order to get a UV map to tile just a few times is madness.

Instancing and Referencing. Instances mean that if either the original object or the copies is changed, then all objects are changed. Reference objects are created the same way as instances, but differ in the was changes are applied. If changes are applied to the “parent” object, all the children are similarly changed, but if changes are applied to a “child” object, the changes are not propagated. This allows for changes to be applied to the children for variety, yet they can all be altered at any time by the parent.

Kvaalen
12-31-2003, 08:49 AM
Oh, and I forgot... something like JettoFillet only in real time. (Sorta like rounder ;) .)

zeno
12-31-2003, 09:14 AM
and Point Info under run...mmmm.. i mean... mm... you can copy and paste points coordinates while you use any other tools... for instance, rove tools to make center of rove tools... or circle tools.

you can always have "Info" opened while you're using another tools.. so you can just copy their coordinates to another place without closing the "info" window and activate other tool's window, paste coordinate x.. close it again and open info window again, copy y coordinate.. close "info" window... etc etc...

Any plugins do this?

heheh... drag drop the coordinates would be great....

zeno
12-31-2003, 09:43 AM
Originally posted by marlo.steed
Instancing! I came from Strata Studio Pro and even though that is considered a lower end program, compared to Lightwave, it had instances. It is a great tool - make one object, clone it and then go back and change the original and all the clones change automatically.

yes... Instancing... I THINK if we have instancing we can have the interactive patch modeling..
I remember the first time i tried patch modeling in 3dsmax in 1997.it can do an interactive patch modeling thru "instancing"....... heheh... 1997...it was 1997... and i knew nothing about lightwave that time....
well we'll see lightwave3d 8 or 8.a, 8.b, 8.5 in 2004 or.. 2005...
i'm sorry.. i'm just a little desperate.
after those years hard workin' now i can afford registered lightwave3d.. i was so happy at the first time... but after digin' and digin'... and read all these posts...... :(...

i love Lightwave...
"think you" so much :)

TSpyrison
12-31-2003, 09:49 AM
We gonna mail this list in? or shall we just assume that they read it here?

WilliamVaughan
12-31-2003, 10:55 AM
We read it....but if I were posting I would have a back up plan and send it in as welll...never hurt to cover all bases :)

julos
12-31-2003, 11:35 AM
Edge and ngon subs of course, with all the edge tools like meshtools, wings, silo (connect edges etc..).

The universal tool like in Silo :
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/julien.tromeur/stuff/universaltool.jpg

It really improves the speed, and you don't need 4 windows to model anymore.
I know the gizmo is not in Lightwave's philosophy but if we could at least have the choice...

- Better bend (and such) modifiers, i could never make it work the way i want, i like the simplicity of the ones in 3dsmax for example.
- Splines that create cylinders in real-time (great to do pipes, hair etc..)

julos
12-31-2003, 11:40 AM
And deformation lattices, this is great to deform organic shapes (cartoony characters, caricatures etc...)

hrgiger
12-31-2003, 01:57 PM
Hey thanks for all the feedback guys. I'll update this a little later this evening when I have time.

Chingis
12-31-2003, 05:33 PM
Wait! Let me add a couple.

This ones been requested a bunch but...

1. In both Modeler and Layout there should be a little Wireframe
overlay button so you can see wireframe over any view mode-
be it flat shade, smooth shade, texture, sketch etc....

2. The ability to lock layers from being selected/edited- like Photoshop. Either this or shaded background layers. I'm needing
this all the time.

3. O.k. in general things need to be consolidated, and I agree with the posts regarding this. The way to do it would be hot keys.
For example ; sure you could have a little xyz move/rotate/scale
widget (which would be great as an option) but that's just another thing to turn on and off - plus, when I'm working in Maya
I often find that the handle gets in the way of selecting other points etc... Why not have constraint keys that you can hold down for xyz, snap to vertex, snap to grid, snap to polygon, move on normal, slide on edge (In HASH these are the 1,2,3,4,5, & 6 keys)- and they would all be the same hotkeys and work with all the tools (some of them would only apply to the move tool. This way you wouldn't have 50 billion different tools. Just hold down keys as you work - nothing beats this workflow. No switching tools, no funky little handles to grab or get in the way. Modeling soley in the perspective view would be a breeze. THis is HUGE on my list - CONSTRAINT KEYS.

4. The ability to turn backface culling ON/OFF. I wanna be able to edit/select points that are behind shaded geometry(i.e. the with the drag tool). This is also huge on my list.

5. Different amount of sub patch divisions per connected piece of geometry.

6. UV mapping wil require a seperate thread I'm affraid. I have pictures I need to show.

7. Vertex painting/lighting needs a major overhaul - but I'm not sure if this is a Modeler or Layout issue - another reason to merge. Oh, and vertex alpha is awesome. Beats clip mapping.

8. A regular Marque select tool - none of that bounding volume crap. And it would be nice if it wasn't a seperate mode - in either polygon or point mode you could just middle mouse button drag or something and it would be a marque select - like layout.

9. A decent working Texture guide tool with easy to grab handles(and a "fit to best plane" option). And all of the make UVs option buttons on tools like Cyllinder, rail extrude, etc... shouldn't have seem polygons in the UV map, annoying.

10. custom lights in Modeler would be nice - and a drag out scanline renderer from any view... (o.k. now I'm dreaming) but some day eh?

That's it for now, more later. And even though it's easy to point out a programs weaknesses and critisize it, Lightwave is one of the most intuitive and enjoyable modelers to use. We all obviously use it for one reason or another. Our pipeline at work is tied into Maya, but I model in Lightwave whenever I can.

Cheers,
Chris

hrgiger
12-31-2003, 08:52 PM
I updated some of the list. I'm still getting to some of them....

riki
12-31-2003, 09:31 PM
LScript CommanderSomething like this would be great for Modeler.

Also I'd add Viper Spport and and some kind of 3d Paint APP.

Kuzey
12-31-2003, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by Kvaalen
Somthing I think could be really usefull is to be able to have one view port or somthing that shows the model in subpatch mode while the others don't. That way you can simply model on a non subpatched model and see the results as a subpatched model in real time. I don't think I explained it well, but you guys probably get an idea. :)


I doooooooo love that idea:p :p

So, besides being able to change viewport Rendering styles....you also have an option to turn subpatch on or off in that view.

The more I think about it...the more I love it!!!

;)

Kuzey

Kvaalen
01-01-2004, 02:39 AM
Another thing you could add to the snapping options is the ability to snap to points in a background layer.

Dodgy
01-01-2004, 07:14 AM
Originally posted by julos
Edge and ngon subs of course, with all the edge tools like meshtools, wings, silo (connect edges etc..).

The universal tool like in Silo :
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/julien.tromeur/stuff/universaltool.jpg

It really improves the speed, and you don't need 4 windows to model anymore.
I know the gizmo is not in Lightwave's philosophy but if we could at least have the choice...

- Better bend (and such) modifiers, i could never make it work the way i want, i like the simplicity of the ones in 3dsmax for example.
- Splines that create cylinders in real-time (great to do pipes, hair etc..)


To be honest, I only really like the gizmos in maya when they're working in poly planes etc. not the global coordinates. It's always too faffy to get hold of them...
And I've never really had any problem with the bends etc.

But the cylinder spline stuff would be very cool indeed. But would you be doing sas out of a job? LOL

Tom Wood
01-01-2004, 04:01 PM
I'd just like a 'make it look cool' button. :p

Happy Holidaze.

TW

cresshead
01-01-2004, 05:40 PM
the idea of having a non subpatched model in one view and a subpatched version in the other could be implemented with "referencing" possibly, in 3ds max you can have a lo poly mesh and copy it via 3 methods [copy, reference and instance]

copy is just that..an independent copy of the object with no link to the origonal object

reference is like a one way street copy you can change the origonal and the referenced copy will update but anything you add to the reference is no copied back toward the origonal

instance is a two way street..which ever one you select, it being the origonal or the reference any modifacation will be updated in both [or more copies]

so with a reference copy you could switch on or add subpatches
the thing is though with any instancing or referencing capability you'll need to make an object have a "modifer" like that of 3dsmax so it would be a fundemental change to how modeler works as of now....a big job in my opinion.

some people who model said that they'd like to switch off subpatches and edit the lo poly version but it looks too messy whan you "un tab"...but if you reduce your subdivision level down to 1 you get the lo poly version that's not messed up....you can then play with this and dial the subdivisions back up later or you can freeze your model with subpatch set to 1...this works for most models but be aware that some thin items will get "thinner" when you re apply subpatches later on....still it's a thing to think about.

cresshead
01-01-2004, 05:45 PM
"shift drag copy" in modeler would be fantastic...

as i come from a max background [don't hit me!!] when i need several copies of something i just select the object and hold the shift key down as i move the object...when i release the mouse button a dialog box asks me how many copies i'd like and if the want to be copies/referenced or instansted...then i creates copies..say 10 of them at the distance i dragged the first object away from the origonal fomr each of the newly created objects...so it's great for fence posts etc as you can determine the distance "by eye" rather than a tape measure or dialogue box...it's more fun and one of the things i miss from 3dsmax quite often.

Karmacop
01-01-2004, 06:10 PM
Cresshead, I had a feature request for cloning tools similar to what you've asked.

Look at

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10564
and
http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10567

Chingis
01-01-2004, 06:48 PM
I have a simple request regarding cloning. I wish when you selected some polygons and do a copy/paste that the newly pasted geometry would be selected (rather than the original) so you could then easily move it away from the existing geometry.
As of now, if you want to copy and paste just part of a solid mesh you must paste it into a new layer, move it, and then paste it back in the original layer. Kind of annoying.

Ade
01-01-2004, 07:13 PM
Instances definately, also history tree.

hrgiger
01-01-2004, 08:15 PM
Added a few more to the list. I still might add some more from the suggestions I have but I might not be totally clear on some of them. If you suggested something and I didn't post it yet (or didn't give you credit for posting), then let me know and I'll rectify. (huh, huh, rectify- Ok, I'm still a Beavis and Butthead fan).

mkiii
01-02-2004, 01:43 AM
Originally posted by cresshead
"shift drag copy" in modeler would be fantastic...

as i come from a max background [don't hit me!!] when i need several copies of something i just select the object and hold the shift key down as i move the object...when i release the mouse button a dialog box asks me how many copies i'd like and if the want to be copies/referenced or instansted...then i creates copies..say 10 of them at the distance i dragged the first object away from the origonal fomr each of the newly created objects...so it's great for fence posts etc as you can determine the distance "by eye" rather than a tape measure or dialogue box...it's more fun and one of the things i miss from 3dsmax quite often.

Instancing would be nice - but I'd bet my house that it isn't going to happen in LW - at least not in the way you used it in Max.

Meanwhile, the various clone tools work quite well now, and the 'hidden' multiply\duplicate\paste function creates multiple copies on right clicks of the mouse.

Kvaalen
01-02-2004, 02:21 AM
Originally posted by cresshead
so with a reference copy you could switch on or add subpatches
the thing is though with any instancing or referencing capability you'll need to make an object have a "modifer" like that of 3dsmax so it would be a fundemental change to how modeler works as of now....a big job in my opinion.

some people who model said that they'd like to switch off subpatches and edit the lo poly version but it looks too messy whan you "un tab"...but if you reduce your subdivision level down to 1 you get the lo poly version that's not messed up....you can then play with this and dial the subdivisions back up later or you can freeze your model with subpatch set to 1...this works for most models but be aware that some thin items will get "thinner" when you re apply subpatches later on....still it's a thing to think about.

The problem with that is that I don't want to have two copies of something. And changing the Subpatch level doesn't work for many reasons:
When you look at it in wireframe mode, the wireframe is still subpatched, meaning that it is rounded. Not the way it is when subpatch is off.
Also, even if you don't look at it in wire frame mode, it gets smoothed which you don't always want especially if you have to model in that mode.

I think it would be cool if every viewport had an extra dropdown menu where you can choose that and other stuff such as toggeling other often used viewport options. :)

marko
01-02-2004, 02:31 AM
i think there is decent way to implement instances in current modeler.
1. use parts
when you are in parts selection mode parts acts as objects in lw
you could copy them instance them etc.
editing one part would mean all instances are updated

your opinion?

mkiii
01-02-2004, 02:35 AM
You can display the sub-d version in one window & the low res cage in another already by turning on Show Cages & turning off Show Surfaces.

What is needed, is a simple option to display this as a wireframe shaded mode as well as the current dashed lines..

zeno
01-02-2004, 05:27 AM
:)... more additions...

- offset line, surfaces, curves.... (act like offset in rhino or autocad)

- you can select the coordinates on the left bottom corner of modeler (while you frezze them with one button so it won't follow the cursor's position, or it tells the position of selected points (single/multiple average) and restrict x movement, or y, or z, or H, P, B.---------- just like layout... (bottom-left corner)

-Lofting curves.
Lofting curves with multiple rails
Lofting curves to a point. ----> Oo.

-slice or trim curves.
-Nurbs Curves

-and ability to make soft shadow for every ligthtype (just like Cinema4D) OR integrate with shadow designer.... :))

riki
01-02-2004, 06:15 PM
• Better support for importing and exporting other object file formats.

• Improved Text Tools, the current tools are below par and don't recognise most fonts on my system.

Ramon
01-02-2004, 08:32 PM
Originally posted by hrgiger
All of you modelers out there who are looking for big improvements in the workflow and toolset of modeler, post your requests or ideas here and I'll add it to the list. Even if it's a bug fix or minor change to an existing tool, let's have em.


N-Gon Support- As it is, we have to keep our subpatch models limited to 3 and 4 point polys. Being able to tab 5 point or more point polys would really improve workflow as you could add edges to your hearts content.

Interactive spline patching- patch a spline that isn't quite right? Move the splines and have the polygons follow the new contour interactively. Also known as parametric modeling which means, alter one shape and have another update. For instance, do a rail extrude, then you can adjust the rail and have the extruded polygon shape match to fit interactively. Very powerful.

Deformation Lattices

Non-Linear Morphs- The ability to have morph targets along a curve rather then linear. I think the best way would be to have a slider in the Morph window so you could set different morphs from a -100 to 100 range.

No Subpatch UV Distortion

New Bezier options- The ability to reuse the last used setting on the bezier panel. Also, the option of readjusting the bezier points after the tool has been dropped and picked up again.

Deformation Lattices

3D Paint- Perhaps some evolution of vertex paint to allow us to paint textures directly on 3D objects?

[/B]
Guys, these are the ones that I most agree on! I've really been waiting for these tools/funtions! I rearranged the order that you had listed in order to show which ones I charish the most.
1. Ngons! and localized detailing levels for use with Sbpatches.
2. Interactive spline patching.
3. Deformation Lattices but, not only in modeler, in layout as well-to aid in animation.
Let's keep the hope alive for NT to impliment these features!!!

JDaniel
01-03-2004, 01:52 AM
1. How about UV's that update when you're modeling.
2. To be able to shift and translate on the normal axis of a poly also.

riki
01-03-2004, 02:23 AM
I like the sound of this Max feature


None of the walls are aligned with the home grid so I have had to make custom grids that are aligned with each wall of the house, I then activate it to work on the designated wall.

re: http://www.cgnetworks.com/story_custom.php?story_id=1650&page=

bloontz
01-03-2004, 09:06 AM
I would like to see smart selection capabilities like you have in Wings 3D. Mainly the Select Similar and edge loop selection types, like Edge Loop, Edge Ring, Previous/Next Edge Loop etc. (would require edges I suppose though similar functionality could be applied to points)

It would also be nice to be able to choose the axis for symmetry, and multiple axis/ radial symmetry would be cool.

papou
01-03-2004, 09:09 AM
hi, I agree with lot of things here and got some too..

Detection collision in all Bevel, SShift,EdgeBevel etc,...im mean like bevel++. It will be cool to reproduce the precedent selection bevel with the secondary mouse button...

A better Cloner tool: point/poly and Normals - Rotate/scale all direction - non destructive Vmap - Random value/Vmap - Value/progressive Vmap - Populate Poly - Clone Array - Clone random layer / realtime feedback with some simplified clone.

Points Aligner tools with Relax UV tool.

Tool workflow improvement:
-All plugin need to become interactive (or realtime preview button).
-automatic position and scale of the tool's gizmo on the selection.
-They must work with 'along a curve' (Bevel/Move/Rotate/etc..) or 'on normals' or 'on Background' etc...
-non destructive Vmap. I want to rotate all my Morph too easily.

i agree with the better Bend tools, less strange and improve with curve bending possibility/ with CTRL key/ etc..

Better use of Airbrush tool: more fast on heavy mesh - possibility to use it for smooth/smoothscale/Jitter/Clone/Relax/Push&Pull Normals/ etc...

Soft Selection,: I know it's possible to do that in Modeler but it's too long to do:
select some point, create a WeightMap, blur it with F'isVMapBlur, then drag it with Dragnet in Weight mode....
I want a faster one.

3d Warp Cage deform tool

I would like to select 1 more point to close the DiLoop selection:
i mean select first point, a second one for direction, a final one to close the selection. So we can select only a part of a Points loop.

Detect polygon position/Rotation/Normals when modeling on them. I mean the possibility to draw a curve on mesh surface, or add a Button on a Jacket, it will stick on the Jacket and Align to Normals...whohoo!

maybe more Workflow things: Highlight the Vmap Name Button when a Vmap is active. I just become crasy when i made all deformation to a morph, and not to the base.

Display improvement

There are a lot of third party plug in Lw, very cool but a pain to class them, we need a better Plugin/Menu Panel.

papou
01-03-2004, 09:20 AM
Originally posted by Tom Wood
I'd just like a 'make it look cool' button. :p

Happy Holidaze.

TW

Smooth: Strength100, iterations 5.
looks cool.
;)

Dodgy
01-03-2004, 12:16 PM
Originally posted by papou

A better Cloner tool: point/poly and Normals - Rotate/scale all direction - non destructive Vmap - Random value/Vmap - Value/progressive Vmap - Populate Poly - Clone Array - Clone random layer / realtime feedback with some simplified clone.


DONE ALREADY...There are LOADS of these on www.flay.com all free...




Better use of Airbrush tool: more fast on heavy mesh - possibility to use it for smooth/smoothscale/Jitter/Clone/Relax/Push&Pull Normals/ etc...


DONE ALREADY...Create a morph target which has had the operation done on it already, then use that in the vmap options of the airbrush tool.



Soft Selection,: I know it's possible to do that in Modeler but it's too long to do:
select some point, create a WeightMap, blur it with F'isVMapBlur, then drag it with Dragnet in Weight mode....
I want a faster one.


Don't you use the tools with falloff modes on? LW has load of different types, all easy to use..



There are a lot of third party plug in Lw, very cool but a pain to class them, we need a better Plugin/Menu Panel.

I agree, a way to copy and paste submenus in the menu editor would be great.

papou
01-03-2004, 05:31 PM
:p

DONE ALREADY...There are LOADS of these on www.flay.com all free...
...that the problem... too much clone plugin...and most of them break the Vmap. So no it's not done. It's not productive to try all clone plugin when u are modeling. All of them don't prupose some features i am asking.
Flay.com, i recommend it too. it's my Startpage from too long time.


DONE ALREADY...Create a morph target which has had the operation done on it already, then use that in the vmap options of the airbrush tool.
I know that fake 'Artisan' style modeling. Great thing. That the reason i'm pushing the idea a bit more. I'm asking cause you can't do any of them with this trick.


Don't you use the tools with falloff modes on? LW has load of different types, all easy to use..
Weight Map mode is last of falloff modes. Maybe i would like to see the falloff zone better than a Radial gizmo... With the extend/retract selection, a colored soft points selection will help me a lot with my actual multiple tentacles modelisation.

Dodgy
01-03-2004, 07:59 PM
I use clonesz2 which keeps the vmaps intact. This was the problem I had with Lw's own clone tool so I looked throught the options till I found one which worked fully. Once I had it, I dumped all the rest. I'd be temted to push HD instance, as this is get for this stuff and is only done at rendertime :)

You can create a morph map, then jitter/smoothscale/smooth, then use it like the artisan trick.. Push/pull normals would be based on the previous normals, so I could see this being a bit more useful but I'm not sure many people would really use it?

Not sure what you mean by relax, isn't that just a kind of smoothing? Could you be a bit more specific?

The only thing missing is cloning. That's heading into maya paint fx territory.

Colouring the selection area is a good idea, to give you more idea of your selection, but I really think with all the falloff types there are already do you need anymore? Creating a very custom soft selection couldn't be made THAT much easier for a very limited use idea. How often are you going to use it after all? I use it for jaws of characters and eyelids and everything else I use the linear/radial falloffs on with different curve definitions. Not that there's anything wrong in asking for more, but it just seems this is getting into some really narrow band stuff :)

I'm sorry if if it seemed I was implying you were a newbie, but it seemed a lot of what you were asking for was already in there, if hidden away a little. That's why I only picked out bits, as the rest was quite useful stuff :)

eacide
01-03-2004, 08:08 PM
1 - An old request from me... Which exists as a plugin: an efficient and user-friendly map manager. I really hate ctrl-F6. When I want to clean-up a model and delete temporary morph maps and weight maps I have to select each of them, right click and delete/rename the map. It is tedious when you have 50 weight maps on a model.

2 - If skelegons remain in LW's workflow. It should be useful to have the "rotate skelegon", "skelegon editor" properly implemented in modeler. It should also be very convenient to have smartskin or equivalent in modeler to create perfect endomorphs.
BTW, if so, rewrite third party plugins. I have frequent crashes with skelegon editor ;)

Ramon
01-03-2004, 08:11 PM
Man, I sure hope that Proton, Chuck and or any others from the NT crew are reading this.

hrgiger
01-03-2004, 09:44 PM
Added a few more items on the list. I've been reading through some of your ideas and I haven't added some of them because I think they are ideas that either already exist or ideas that are being implemented already.* It might be easier to suggest one item at a time and include a description of what exactly the purpose of your idea would be. There were some things I hadn't heard of.

* For instance, eacide, I think there is a new map manager in Lightwave 8. Don't know much about it yet, but it'll be easier to make this list once we see what we have or don't have in Lightwave 8's modeler.

marko
01-04-2004, 04:04 AM
i wish there is UV editor with different aspect ratios than 1:1

sculptactive
01-04-2004, 05:33 AM
Improve the Magnet and Dragnet tools.

The ability to freeform rotate these tools before implementation.

Improve 'Measure' tools and viewpoints for greater scale precision.

.STL exporter included as standard not as plugin.

mkiii
01-04-2004, 06:49 AM
Originally posted by marko
i wish there is UV editor with different aspect ratios than 1:1

Agreed - Obviously UV is still going to be square internally, but it would be nice to toggle 'Fit to backround image'.

Viewports forget their settings:
This might avoid the other major bugbear of mine when I'm modelling, namely the fact that a carefully scaled & positioned background image goes totally to pot if I subsequently select UV Map Display for that viewport.

When I return to the top view or whatever, my image is reduced to a small square, forcing me to re-load my settings from disc - assuming I'd saved them beforehand. It seems pretty stupid that the Top viewport, UV Display etc can't remember their own settings.

Tool 'widgets': Apart from the ones mentioned, The Volume Select tool needs a numeric requester.

papou
01-04-2004, 09:45 AM
I use clonesz2 which keeps the vmaps intact.
What about MorphMap? all are completely destroy.
With clonesz2.2, you can't select polys you want to clone on. The only one which can do that is SP_Clone LE 1.2.
But both can't rotate on the normals.
The only Clone tool which keeps the vmaps intact is RandomCloner from Polas, and it's a commercial one. But it can just populate randomely on some polys.

relax, kind of smooth... make space between points...cool for UV but cool to correct ovelapped polygons too. per example, between Arms and Torso...

The only thing missing is cloning. That's heading into maya paint fx territory..
yeah, maybe...but more lite. I made a script to clone with layers, in fact i can draw each direction with random layer clones. I made a town quickly with that. I would love to see that kind of stuff more implemented.
http://mapage.noos.fr/webto/Images/Pict3_22.JPG

cheers,

hrgiger
01-04-2004, 10:16 AM
I was going to add the 1:1 UV raito request but I think there is a good solution for that now. You can keep your model the same ratio it is now by dragging out a box polygon around your model. When you make your UV's, it will keep your model the same ratio as it is now, it will use the square polygon to fit to the window keeping everything the same inside of it.

hrgiger
01-04-2004, 10:22 AM
Added a couple of items and also broke down the list into New Features and Fixes and Quirks.

Also alphabatized the name list at the end so it's a little easier to read.

Nemoid
01-04-2004, 10:59 AM
Great Thread !:D

1) what about some tool similar to Maya's make live tool
to easily build things on surfaces, align easily buttons on cloths e.g. and also to build curves from surfaces (but not following poly flow ) to be used like a trail for animation?

2) another cool add would be a gizmo, wich simply shows the direction in wich you move rotate scale items when in perspective view.
not a gizmo in wich U have to click on, but a simple indicator so that you are more sure of what're you doing in some case.

3) non - additive endomorphs. pls! :rolleyes:

4) banal, but enhancing the way of panning/rotating objects in viewports to smth more similar to Maya's way to go,(alt+lmb,mmb,rmb ) would be great and efficient.

5) a more efficient and powerful layer editor, with rename, color, group multiple items functions, drag and drop to change their order like in PS .

6) different rendering options for background layers.

7) customizable visualization of selected items

8 etc. (this is the one I like the most).

Dodgy
01-04-2004, 11:12 AM
Originally posted by papou
I use clonesz2 which keeps the vmaps intact.
What about MorphMap? all are completely destroy.
With clonesz2.2, you can't select polys you want to clone on. The only one which can do that is SP_Clone LE 1.2.
But both can't rotate on the normals.
The only Clone tool which keeps the vmaps intact is RandomCloner from Polas, and it's a commercial one. But it can just populate randomely on some polys.


It doesn't destroy them, but doesn't rotate the morphs with the surface normals either. It just keeps the vector displacement as it was instead of transforming it along with the object. Maybe you could suggest it to the author. As for selelecting all polys, I hide the unwanted polys and then it works. Is this a bit too much work? Seems like clones does most of what you want, but if you want a little bit more, you'll have to pay for it :) Random cloner at $80 seems like a bargain if you really want all that :). HD instance does a lot of the same but without the geometry overhead. You can use weightmaps for a lot of the functions, use multiple objects and all sorts. I own it and I can highly recommend it. Again $149 is quite reasonable IMHO :).



relax, kind of smooth... make space between points...cool for UV but cool to correct ovelapped polygons too. per example, between Arms and Torso...


Is it some sort of special algorithm? I find smooth okay to use, but I would love to see a UV version. I've been trying to figure one out myself but I'm not as up on maths as I used to be :P



The only thing missing is cloning. That's heading into maya paint fx territory..
yeah, maybe...but more lite. I made a script to clone with layers, in fact i can draw each direction with random layer clones. I made a town quickly with that. I would love to see that kind of stuff more implemented.
http://mapage.noos.fr/webto/Images/Pict3_22.JPG

cheers, [/B]

As I say I've used HD Instance. You seem like a good programmer looking at your web page, couldn't you knock one out? :) Could make a bit of spare cash! Or be very generous? If Ino is working for NT now, I'm hoping they'll include his jetstream fx, one part of which is a particle instancer. Could be used for this?

JDaniel
01-04-2004, 11:18 AM
Originally posted by JDaniel
1. How about UV's that update when you're modeling.
2. To be able to shift and translate on the normal axis of a poly also.
Anyone agree w/ these?

hrgiger
01-04-2004, 11:20 AM
Sorry Jack, I missed that one. I'll add the UV update request.

As far as teh normal axis, isn't that what shift and translate work on now? wasnt' sure about that one.

EDIT: I guess I didn't notice I had already added this one on the list too...

JDaniel
01-04-2004, 01:09 PM
Smooth Shift does, but the new poly is sized up the farther you shift. The only way to achieve it is to bevel w/ no inset. This is a few more steps.
The move tool has no normal axis option constraints. Does any one know how to move a poly in the persp. win., or any win. on the normal axis only? You can't. :( :confused:

EDIT: I see it now hr. :cool:

riki
01-04-2004, 03:17 PM
How about the ability to create renderable Splines with a Properties panel that lets you assign volume and textures. Get rid of the need for Rail Extrusions.

tmdag
01-04-2004, 04:34 PM
maybe somebody said that allready but:

1. ability to work while [point/polygon info panel] or [skelegon tree] is opened

2. ability to turn on/off axes arrows (like in layout) for each viewport.. it would be very helpfull specially when modeling in perspective
http://popierdulka.pdi.net/tmdag/lw/axes.jpg

3. mix few different surfaces like in xsi

4. costum grid for UV viewport with numeric pannel (eg. i would like to set grid 200% x 100%)

5. remember position of opened tools/windows on second monitor

6. open viewport on different window so i can eg set uv map second monitor while haveing opened mesh on first monitor.

7. Polygon/edges statistic: show edges connecting 3 polygons at once so I can easlly select that kind of polygons and repair mesh.(this is problematic for game developpers eg when calculating smooth groups etc.)

http://popierdulka.pdi.net/tmdag/lw/trojkaty.jpg


8. In display settings for each viewport - dot-line - showing how are setted tritangles on >3 point polygons (before makeing them 3 point polygons)

http://popierdulka.pdi.net/tmdag/lw/dot-line.jpg

9. measure tool snaping to points/edges and showing measure results not only when pressed but all the time when selected.
Also I think that working on mesh while measure tool is still actived would be helpfull
http://popierdulka.pdi.net/tmdag/lw/linijka.jpg

Kuzey
01-04-2004, 04:56 PM
A better preferences setup...something like the "System Preferences" pane in Mac OS X. Where the File, Windows, interface, Options, Plugin-ins etc. could go, freeing up interface space.


The ability to cycle through Tabs (Create, Modify, Multiply etc.) using "Command" and "Option" keys....this will really speed up workflow :p

Kuzey

eacide
01-04-2004, 05:29 PM
Originally posted by JDaniel
Smooth Shift does, but the new poly is sized up the farther you shift. The only way to achieve it is to bevel w/ no inset. This is a few more steps.
The move tool has no normal axis option constraints. Does any one know how to move a poly in the persp. win., or any win. on the normal axis only? You can't. :( :confused:

EDIT: I see it now hr. :cool:

I think DI Supershift with no offset is much better for that type of problem and... it is shipped with LW8

mkiii
01-04-2004, 07:57 PM
Originally posted by hrgiger
I was going to add the 1:1 UV raito request but I think there is a good solution for that now. You can keep your model the same ratio it is now by dragging out a box polygon around your model. When you make your UV's, it will keep your model the same ratio as it is now, it will use the square polygon to fit to the window keeping everything the same inside of it.

That trick is useful for auto-sizing a background image when you first load an image, but it won't stop a background image forgetting its size settings once you return from UV display mode.

The UV display aspect ratio was a different problem. I may have confused matters by tagging the bg image bit on after it.

BTW - If you use the Texture Guide numeric panel to create all your UV sets - then your UVs will never be deformed or distorted.

Obviously, to make proper use of this, you need to use square textures.

JDaniel
01-04-2004, 08:42 PM
Originally posted by eacide
I think DI Supershift with no offset is much better for that type of problem and... it is shipped with LW8
Yes, I agree eacide. I use it too. I wish LW would add the script to their smooth shift so I have one less plugin to load, that's all. :)

Kvaalen
01-05-2004, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by JDaniel
Anyone agree w/ these?

The smooth shift tool has some options under the numeric panel that might be what you want, not sure though.

papou
01-05-2004, 03:54 PM
small request:
I would like Di2SelectLoop to give the possibility to select a rail of points and not only a loop.
I seem to be possible with the selection of 3 points: point(1), point(2) for the direction and the point(3) will break the loop process.
http://mapage.noos.fr/webto/Files/ikeda.htm

About a 3Dpaint, im not happy with vertexPaint, don't know why..maybe if it 'd be more integrated.
but I dreamed a lot about a Aura integration in a advanced Image/Surface editor...

riki
01-05-2004, 04:49 PM
Just a couple of small suggestions.

• A Paste tool with a numeric panel, that lets you set limits for random rotation and size values. This would be great for building up complex detail. Like pasting flowers in a garden.

• Also a measuring tool to measure the length of a curve.

hrgiger
01-05-2004, 09:37 PM
Riki,

I think point clone plus is pretty much the answer your looking for for your first small suggestion.

And I think there is a plug-in to measure a curve....

riki
01-05-2004, 09:50 PM
The plugin is PC only and isn't accurate by the author's own admission. Becuase he's not up-to-speed on LW's curves.

Point Clone Plus is good, but my suggestion would make it interactive. Though I wouldn't be surprised if there was already a plugin for this.

hrgiger
01-06-2004, 12:27 AM
Originally posted by riki
The plugin is PC only....



And this is a problem because....?;)

riki
01-06-2004, 12:38 AM
My Dual Xeon hasn't shipped yet, so I'm still not "Politically Correct!" :D

prospector
01-06-2004, 12:39 AM
A totaly LW specific intigrated voice activation system so we don't have to buy other programs like Naturally Speaking.
Well this would help both but hey...

But Mainly a 3D PAINT SYSTEM !!!!!

riki
01-06-2004, 12:43 AM
I'd like to see metaballs working better.

Hervé
01-06-2004, 01:34 AM
you're right HGigr, Intancing/cloning in modeler would be even better than in layout.... jeeezz how many times after cloning parts for an object, I wanted to do small retouch-ups, and I had to to all of it again... I mean deleting the clones, modifying, recloning, verifying, and so on....

That would be a real plus....

marko
01-06-2004, 02:26 AM
thats right herve.
imagine that every chair could be instance... in large interiour there could be more than 100 chairs with 2000 polys which are easier to position in modeler than in layout.
i repeat myself but parts in modeler are ideal for this. parts should remain integral when mooving. if you select one instanced part for example chair it will automaticaly select all its polygons. than you would simply move it arround as object in layout without concern that you will strech or destroy instance. suddenly if you decide that you need different chairs in same position you would go to edit mode load different model and all chairs would change automaticaly. this functionality is present in autocad as blocks. and it just works.
someone could also write a plugin that would load existing layout scenes in modeler with automatic conversion of repeated objects into instances (parts) and supportfor lights.
for long time i was thinking that lights should be one of modelers entities. i would like to keep my lamp objects with its lw_spotlights (with all properties) for every later scene. same goes with cars. properly riged car would have at least 15 lights. it is easier and more precise to position them in modeler and keep them together within lwo.
if instancing is implemented imagine office floor with 200 downlights. you do instancing of downlights and it works perfectly but there are no proper light attached! luxigons may help here but it is just not simple workflow. if this is well implemented in layout if you suddenly have too much light you just change one instance and light is dimmed on all clones!

Hervé
01-06-2004, 05:21 AM
yes, I vote for that.... some lights could be included in the lwo., ideal for those noens signs as well as cars that you mentionned... again another real plus....

Karmacop
01-06-2004, 07:39 AM
Why you can't define all of the light propertis with Luxigons is beyond me. In my opinion it makes them useless. :rolleyes:

prospector
01-06-2004, 09:35 AM
Why you can't define all of the light propertis with Luxigons is beyond me

Why can't you??
I just made a tut in another thread and did that (tho not part of the tut). It just automatically works that way.I thought it was normal.:eek:

Kuzey
01-06-2004, 02:50 PM
The ability to export UV Maps as a texture map and/or copy to Clipboard from within the UV viewport.

I think it's about time to cut out all that extra work..take a screen grab, copy, paste in photoshop, crop and then start working on the texture map.

Kuzey

tmdag
01-06-2004, 03:03 PM
Originally posted by Kuzey
The ability to export UV Maps as a texture map and/or copy to Clipboard from within the UV viewport.

I think it's about time to cut out all that extra work..take a screen grab, copy, paste in photoshop, crop and then start working on the texture map.

Kuzey

gush, don't tell me You're exporting UV these way ;] ....

open somewhere UV in viewport, EXPORT EPS (Encapsulated PostScript) , select UV view, with no grid, save, open photoshop in size whatewer u want (eg. 512x512) and uncheck antialiasing, and pres OK.

making screen from viewport is really not needed extra work ...

Kuzey
01-06-2004, 03:40 PM
ok...but I still like the idea of copying it to the clipboard.

:p

Kuzey

hrgiger
01-06-2004, 06:29 PM
Kuzey,

There's also a great plug-in called UVImaginator that will export your UV in whatever background color and resolution you want. Not sure if it's available for the mac though...

Karmacop
01-06-2004, 06:33 PM
Originally posted by prospector
Why can't you??
I just made a tut in another thread and did that (tho not part of the tut). It just automatically works that way.I thought it was normal.:eek:

Umm .. are you agreeing or disagreeing with me? :confused:

Anyway, these are the light properties you can't define with luxigons:

individual names
intensity falloff
affect diffuse, specular, opengl and caustics
lens flare
volumetrics
shadow colour/shadow map options
area light quality
spotlight angles
projection image

In all seriousness, if you want to model a car and setup luxigons, you'll still need to edit the lights alot after bringing them into layout, so what's the point of even using luxigons? They're only good for putting in basic lights, precisely placing lights, and doing advanced light setups, like easily modeling lighting arrays etc.

prospector
01-06-2004, 06:39 PM
karmacop
yep ya can
showed them ya could do everything in the list you listed 'cept I didn't try to change the name

Like I said..I thought it was all a normal way of doing it, I'm not smart enough to find an undocumented thingy in LW.

Karmacop
01-06-2004, 11:42 PM
Oh really? Where do you show to do this? I'd love to know how. Thanks :)

prospector
01-07-2004, 07:27 AM
It's the
Need Help With Glow and Luminosity
thread

Karmacop
01-07-2004, 07:59 AM
http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15930 - the thread incase anyone else was wondering.

Anyway, you can't define anything I listed in modeler. You can change them once in layout and converted the luxigons to lights, but not in modeler. You can't even see the luxigons and have no way of changing them in modeler as far as I know. If I'm wrong please tell me. Thanks.

EDIT: yes I know you can just "add luxigon" again to a polygon to change it but how do you know if a polygon is a luxigon yet or not?

prospector
01-07-2004, 08:30 AM
Ahh you want modeler (did I miss that?)
because I saw your posts on lighting abilities and my brain auto went to Layout As there aren't lighting capibilities in modeler.
But then Why would we need them there?
But I will try to check on seeing and changing them in modeler.

Proj
01-07-2004, 08:34 AM
I might be missing something here but I would like to see a visual browser that works. The present one seems worse than useless. unless its my system i cant see thumbnails of my objects this would be really usefull also certain image formats dont show thumbnails.eg jpegs or tgas cant remember which now.
A lot of packages have working visual browsers even some budget apps so it would be nice to see one in lightwave.
I realise this is probably not high on the wish list...........

prospector
01-07-2004, 09:28 AM
HMM
can't name Luxigons
in modeler, so this would be a good idea
But I could name the polys a surface that I want different Luxigons on and in layout they are a little easier to spot.
and surface name has no difference in the scheme of surfacing if a UV mapped object is used, and I would normaly surface these different anyways if I was doing headlights and marker lights anyways so there is no extra work there.

But lighting qualities in modeler...don't know if that would be good as you can't see the changes to begin with in perspective and no viper to check.

naming would be nice tho.

Chris S. (Fez)
01-07-2004, 02:10 PM
Well if the hub was more robust (ie. didn't suck), we would be able to create and edit luxigons in modeler on our left screen while watching Layout update with lights on our right screen in real time. Would be really cool with a g2 window open.

prospector
01-07-2004, 02:20 PM
yea, that would be better
Using the Hub.

I guess putting lighting options in modeler gets us closer to a unified app which is the wrong way to go.

marko
01-07-2004, 02:21 PM
at least it would be good if we could select luxigons within statistics window (w)

Karmacop
01-07-2004, 04:22 PM
Yeah sorry Prospector, I meant in Modeler. Wouldn't it be better if you could convert luxigons to lights and not need to worry about changing any settings or names?

you guys bring up some other good points too. The best one is why aren't luxigons just loaded as lights and get edited in modeler and updated in layout via the hub? That would make them so much more useful. Same with Skelegons, once we convert them there's no point in having them in the object file.

Kuzey
01-07-2004, 04:32 PM
Originally posted by hrgiger
Kuzey,

There's also a great plug-in called UVImaginator that will export your UV in whatever background color and resolution you want. Not sure if it's available for the mac though...

Yes, there's a mac version but it's an Alpha release and made way back in 2001.

It doesn't load, but it's good to know someone has done it...maybe Newtek could develop it further :p

Thanks hrgiger.

Kuzey

01-08-2004, 12:26 PM
I'd like to see some more functionality assigned to skelegons in modeler. It's a PITA to have to weight in one app and rig/animate in another. Sending the mesh back and forth for tweaking isn't very efficient.

I'm thinking either add some simple IK to either Vertex Paint (need to be able to support separate heirarchies and unlinked skelegons for this in VP for this as well) or add it to the Rotate Skelegons Plugin. Both of these already have FK controls over skelegons, so why not take it a step further? Then you could spend less time doing test poses and such while weighting, right in modeler, and also reduce the amount of back and forth work between modeler and layout.

theo
01-08-2004, 01:57 PM
I want a free box of clay as a feature in LW modeler- that way I can bash my monitor screen out, throw the free clay into the gaping, steaming hole (after I unplug it of course) where the screen once was and proceed to gently push and pull and prod in real 3D space to my hearts content. Then- after I have the clay image created I can just plug the smoking monitor back into the outlet and watch in real time as high amounts of electrical voltage render my sweet little creation into oblivion.

Afterwards- I can remove the white little jacket with the ridiculously tight straps that I am wearing all the while muttering sundry syllogisms under my breath and wander down the hall looking for a Pepsi machine to quench my creatively inspired thirst.......FOR COMPLETE CONTROL OF LIGHTWAVE!! AAUGGH!!

It ain't gonna happen puppies :)

cresshead
01-08-2004, 04:02 PM
you can get this already..but not i lightwave..there's an app that has virtual reality clay and you can use a data glove or a virtual knife,spatula etc for scultping out your 3d form it has resistance as well so you can "feel" your model takng shape..last time i saw it is was around $20,000 though.

riki
01-08-2004, 04:54 PM
I seem to remember at College we had some kind of 3d scanner, I never got a chance to play with it, so not sure what the results were like.

pixelinfected
01-08-2004, 08:19 PM
Originally posted by mkiii
Agreed - Obviously UV is still going to be square internally, but it would be nice to toggle 'Fit to backround image'.


but in your paint software, you can deform the image referenced from uv how you want, conform image with proportion which you need, then paint on them. when you load image on uv, image are fitted in the square of uv.

SmEsh
01-09-2004, 03:36 PM
1. Possibility to add dots in a spline without losing the curvature : every time, when you draw cross-section splines to better define the flow of the patch, the curvatures of the border lines get spoiled. The best solution is to freeze them, hope that a point will be created where you need it, cut the points, paste them and create an open cure with them. Naturally you will be not able to modify this curve in a second time as a spline. Also, if the point is not created where you need it, you will need to freeze again and repeat the process. In my opinion this is NOT a good workflow at all.

2. Splines with control handles: or, at least, bezier curves always re-editable with their handles.

3. Possibility to add detail in a SubPatch object without losing current curvatures: but someone should tell me: "it's not possible", but I don't now, I'm not a programmer yet. I know I would LOVE this feature.

It would be fantastic a button like: "Keep curvature". You select a cureve or SubPatch polys and from now you can add points or details without changing the curvatures. These curves and polys would be listed in the Statistics Panel to be selectable and would have a different color to be ricognizable. Then, selecting them and clicking the button again, you would be able again to modify their curvature.

With these features making design modeling would be a LOT easier (not as easy as with Rhino but...).
But maybe it would be easier to add real splines instead...

eacide
01-09-2004, 06:15 PM
Simple tricks that can be Lscripted in 7.5 but that are worth being integrated in 8.1

Customisable display of the background layers When I model clothes, I would prefer that the background layers could be shown in shaded mode.

Quick display change I happen to switch between the 4 viewport scheme and the 2 viewport scheme (with two perspective viewports one shaded and one in wireframe shame mode). It could be helpful either that the display option dialog become non modal or that we could configure two display presets and have a command to switch between them.

Better outlining of selected polygons Similar to Max feature (F2) have the possibility to highlight the select polys by painting them in red for instance.

recover last selection I often lose my selection when I want to click on a Modeler tab. I often click in an empty area. That could be nice if we could recover the last selection set by a simple key stroke.

save/load endomorphs in modeler

more interactivity for instance when I patch spline cages, I'dd like to preview the creation of polys (it happens often to mismatch the parallel and perpendicular value)

more control on the rail-extrude tool similar to Max Loft-tool, it should be useful to stretch / shrink the extruded surface following an interactive spline (you change the spline while the tool is selected), twist it and so on (see C_Snake plugin)

falloff mode - spline It could be useful in some occasions to copy a spline from the modeler and paste it in a falloff window to modify the shape of the falloff (obviously this assumes the spline is planar).

animated boolean The existing fake boolean shaders plugins do not work properly IMO. And it seems that they are the only way to actually provide animated boolean (as long as we have linear morphs). See this thread on CGTalk (http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=76657&perpage=15&highlight=fake%20boolean&pagenumber=1) introduced by Steve Warner and where I post some pics in the end (telamon is my nick there).

I had many other ideas popping in my mind during the modelling process, I will certainly take a sheet of paper and write them down on time.

clever add point/cut/bandsaw that is a request I already discussed with Larry Shultz. Bandsaw/Cut/Add point do not take into account the curvature of subpatched objects. The same for edge tools. It would be very very useful that new points are added without losing the curvature of the object. When I add detailed to a low poly mesh, it is often a nightmare to stretch/ move/ rotate all the new points while a routine can do it for me :D

JelloGnome
01-10-2004, 11:36 PM
In Modeler, allow us to configure hotkeys determined by the tabs at the top.

For example, when the "Construct" tab is highlighted, pressing "t" will create a box.

But, when "Modify" is highlighted, pressing "t" will activate the move tool.

hrgiger
01-11-2004, 10:57 AM
Hey, I added some of these features to the list. Keem em coming.

tmdag
01-11-2004, 11:15 AM
Originally posted by hrgiger
Hey, I added some of these features to the list. Keem em coming.

is there updated official feature list? because I would like to know if there will be edge info tool in lw8 etc

hrgiger
01-11-2004, 04:00 PM
No, not yet. This list is for things we'd like to see after Lightwave 8. We dont' know what's going to be in Lightwave 8 yet completely but if there's anything that is on my list that is already in Lightwave 8, I'll take it off.

Kuzey
01-11-2004, 05:00 PM
It would be fantastic if you can select your surface names within the Preset panel. It beats opening the surface editor to select a surface before opening the Preset panel just to apply a preset texture.

Kuzey

Nemoid
01-12-2004, 05:23 AM
What about a funny tool like "Magicsmshift" ? it could work just like magic bevel, but with more than one poligon or one poli if you select one . also, it would be great if you could change the shape, inset and related parameters interactively after you extruded. :)

papou
01-12-2004, 06:58 AM
I'm with Nemoid, MagicBevel need some improvement.
- possibility to reedit after beveling.
- Group beveling like Smshift.
- Circular handles only on selected polys.
- detection of normal at start bevel to prevent a flat/strech beveling.
- undo only the final rail bevel.
- maybe integrate it in the airbrush mode too.

evenflcw
01-12-2004, 07:50 AM
Originally posted by papou
- possibility to reedit after beveling.
- undo only the final rail bevel.

It might be that I'm missunderstanding, but have you guys checked the "Operation" dropdownmenu at the top of the numerics panel when Magic Bevel is active? It will allow you to edit the bevel and delete (undo) any segment/node. Flat/stretched beveling are easily prevented by always placing the first segment parrallel to the original polygon (assuming that align to path is on).

I do agree though that MagicBevel could see some improvements. Handles only on selected polys and group beveling would be nice. And getting abit more control over each segment would really be something - like a scale and bank(spin) handle for each node. A "Use background curve" option like Spline Guide has would be really helpfull.


And just in general it would be great if toggling subpatches wouldn't interupt other tools (like magic bevel for example) and require an undo.

Nemoid
01-12-2004, 08:37 AM
Love Magic bevel cause its very fun and effective to use,so i thought some improvement of this excellent tool would be cool. Papou stressed very well the improvements i was thinking about, and undo only for last bevel is required indeed!! :)

you can use magic bevel as it is now for multiple polys but you have to tab to poly cage and merge the 2 polis you want to work on,then split the final polys to make 'em quads and tab back.. this is not so efficient.

papou
01-12-2004, 10:53 AM
hi evenflcw,
Possibility to reedit after beveling: i mean reedit tentacle when we reopen the plug. a 'Modify' tentacle option. i think a feature like that can't be add before a total rewrite.

How about a 'Export MagicBevel Path to Rigged tentacle'?

flashover
01-12-2004, 04:15 PM
My features that must to be on list! (If u want :) )

Patch it plug 0_0

Caustic raytrace mode

Caustic 3D

More velocity to render Glass surface!!!!!

Keytrack plug 0_0

Visual Preset for rig same Lifeforms!

When load object layer i would to see all scene not only layer number.

Ghost animation (onin skin)

Editor for the shape 2d parametric

Vocal commands

and more INTERACTIVITY

TNX bye

papou
01-12-2004, 05:34 PM
Lot of your request are for Layout Flashover, but When load object layer i would to see all scene not only layer number. can be for modeler too. I would like to see something better like that : maybe like Hurley 'LoadThis' plugin, where you can see your model , layers, and much more before import to scene or lwo.

flashover
01-13-2004, 08:21 AM
Originally posted by papou
Lot of your request are for Layout Flashover, but When load object layer i would to see all scene not only layer number. can be for modeler too. I would like to see something better like that : maybe like Hurley 'LoadThis' plugin, where you can see your model , layers, and much more before import to scene or lwo.

I know loadthis but is commercial :(

tburbage
01-16-2004, 12:28 AM
Well, hrgiger,

I think I would be pretty thrilled with just your original list, but would put forth a few (some of which have been at least partly touched on in your and other posts):

- Curves on steroids: Introduce a higher order of curve which can take on all of the attributes of a polygon: point weight, vertex color, UV value, surface, part, etc. Why, so they can be used as the template for any operation (lathe, etc.) that you otherwise need a polygon to do -- and without freezing -- and have the attributes carry over onto the created surfaces.

When freezing a curve, the default behavior should be to not add any points to the curve, but it would also be useful to be able to specify a subdivision level to use when freezing. Subdivide should work on curves just as on polygons.

A true multi-curve loft should be implemented, and both good old Lathe and Rail Extrude could be made into more powerful tools.

Fillet and Chamfer tools (another thing curves can be used as profiles to define)

More powerful layers Drag and drop, single key/click insertion, deletion. Ability to either: snap to points in a background layer -OR- add an additional layer attribute *LOCKED*, which lets a layer be foreground and accessible to ops like point snap but not modifiable.

Powerful point snaps and other great alignment tools and modeling aids like in Rhino3D

Switch to Use Normal(s) mode for translations with a simple modifier key

Redesigned SubD implementation with true edge weighting and more local control over subdivision level I also think you should not have to be in Polygon mode with no polygons selected in order to turn on SubD for a layer. In other words, I would find it very useful to be able to toggle to/from SubD for reference while interactively manipulating either point or polygon selections

UV coordinates must be able to be re-interpolated for SubD to minimize or eliminate distortion problems.

Beefed up UV support Better aids to unwrapping, UV relax, no unweld requirement for UV positioning. And back to that distortion in SubD mode problem...

I know there is alot of interest in more esoteric features like built-in 3D paint, but I personally would rather see continued refinement of workflow, more and better core modeling tools, and a higher order surface technology (i.e. more advanced subdivision surfaces) than anything else. That's what a modeler is all about.

marko
01-16-2004, 01:03 AM
layers editor in modeler should look like scene editor in layout
with reordering, grouping and multiple selectioning

http://www.newtek.com/products/lightwave/product/8/features.php#SceneEditor

Dodgy
01-16-2004, 03:34 AM
Originally posted by tburbage

- Curves on steroids: Introduce a higher order of curve which can take on all of the attributes of a polygon: point weight, vertex color, UV value, surface, part, etc. Why, so they can be used as the template for any operation (lathe, etc.) that you otherwise need a polygon to do -- and without freezing -- and have the attributes carry over onto the created surfaces.

When freezing a curve, the default behavior should be to not add any points to the curve, but it would also be useful to be able to specify a subdivision level to use when freezing. Subdivide should work on curves just as on polygons.

A true multi-curve loft should be implemented, and both good old Lathe and Rail Extrude could be made into more powerful tools.

Fillet and Chamfer tools (another thing curves can be used as profiles to define)

I know there is alot of interest in more esoteric features like built-in 3D paint, but I personally would rather see continued refinement of workflow, more and better core modeling tools, and a higher order surface technology (i.e. more advanced subdivision surfaces) than anything else. That's what a modeler is all about. [/B]

The loft idea has been implemented as a free plugin, but I would like to see a lot of these features too, especially the vmap values carrying over into geometry generated from them. If you used a spline to extrude a face, the extruded geometry could use the vmap value of a vertex on the face X the vmap value of the curve's closest vertex. This would mean you could fade values along an extrusion or all kinds of funky stuff...

SamuraiSlayer
01-16-2004, 04:21 PM
hey Hrgiger switch your avatar back the other one is better :)

hrgiger
01-16-2004, 07:53 PM
Originally posted by SamuraiSlayer
hey Hrgiger switch your avatar back the other one is better :)

Sure Samurai... here's a different one...

papou
01-16-2004, 08:10 PM
better!

RLM
01-17-2004, 12:12 AM
I'm not sure how to do this, but would it be worth putting some sort of poll together?

A top ten feature request.

That's a great list there, but I wonder if it could do with putting into some sort of order of priority.

Russ

RLM
01-17-2004, 12:17 AM
Sorry, if I had a brain I would be dangerous.

I see that there is a thread of this title already. Doh

Kvaalen
01-17-2004, 01:05 AM
The things I don't like about the polls is that you can only choose one option, you can't set your priority to each one.

If we have to have something I'd prefer a list of your 5 most wanted features and in the right order (first to last). Then at the end someone can let's say make a table with all the features, and for every persons choice, he gives 1 point to the fifth choice, 2 to the fourth, 3 to the third and so on. The features with the most amount of points is the most requested.

I would really prefer that. Also that would make people vote seriously and not choose what sounds cool or vote because the poll is going to close soon and they can so they do.

JelloGnome
01-17-2004, 01:26 PM
unlimited undo's :)

Kvaalen
01-17-2004, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by JelloGnome
unlimited undo's :)

128 isn't enough :eek:

Personally I have my limit set to 50 and I never use half the undos (it's just to be safe ;)).

tburbage
01-19-2004, 03:11 PM
Another small one which would also apply to layout:

The File > Open dialog should be able to show a preview view of a model. This might be a simple live render of the model, but could also be a pre-rendered view embedded in the .lwo. Not that high tech, but would make browsing directories of old models alot easier.

hrgiger
01-19-2004, 04:07 PM
Hey guys and/or girls, I'm still listening, I've just been busy working on my latest WIP:

http://vbulletin.newtek.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16293

When I have time a little later, I'm going to look through your requests again and see if I can add anything else. So, don't hesitate to add anything else that you may think of.

themaxx
03-07-2004, 02:00 AM
Originally posted by Chingis
I have a simple request regarding cloning. I wish when you selected some polygons and do a copy/paste that the newly pasted geometry would be selected (rather than the original) so you could then easily move it away from the existing geometry.
As of now, if you want to copy and paste just part of a solid mesh you must paste it into a new layer, move it, and then paste it back in the original layer. Kind of annoying.

hope this is fixed in 8. (i was about to post this as a request.)

zeno
03-07-2004, 03:47 AM
i tried to made a lscript with my minimum knowledge of lscript... by trial and error.

it will copy the selected point(s) or polygon(s) and paste to the next layer.. and automate selects the layer with the pasted object
and the original layer as a background layer.

hope this lscript help you.

thanks.

Karmacop
03-07-2004, 04:47 AM
Woah, you went the wrong way man. I'm going now, so I'll tell you how to do it.

don't worry aboutthe copy, what we want is a paste tool.

So get this tool to:

deselect all polys
invert selection (all polys will be selected now)
paste
invert selection

If you don't do it I might later ...

zeno
03-07-2004, 05:02 AM
thanks, but....
what if i just want to select 3 of 47 point(s) in one same layer?

thanks a lot

zeno
03-07-2004, 05:05 AM
awww yeaahhh... okay i understand now.. hehe sorryy.. you're right karmacop....
please do it man...
i already forgot what i did to that lscript by now.. i did that about one month ago and that's it.. i didn't dig it deeper... i've lost it

thank you so much

Karmacop
03-07-2004, 05:09 AM
No worries :)

I haven't done an lscript for awhile so I thought I'd just do it before I went out ;)



@script modeler
@name "Select Pasted"
@version 2.3

main

{
selmode(USER);
selpolygon(CLEAR);
selinvert();
paste();
selinvert();
}

zeno
03-07-2004, 05:21 AM
wow great ls karmacop!! thanks a lot...
at last ..... hehe :) after those days using my stupid script :)

thank you so much...

mmmm.....
but it seems the "clearing selection" code doesn't work. how to fix it?

Karmacop
03-07-2004, 07:10 AM
Oops, sorry, i changed something at the last minute and it ruined my script. Simply replace selmode(GLOBAL); with selmode(USER); . I've edited my previous post so that the script is correct :)

zeno
03-08-2004, 04:20 AM
you're the man karmacop..

thank you so much.

i was trying to use it with points but doesn't work...
i guessed it must be because the -selpolygon[CLEAR]- code only works for polygons...
so i tried to add codes, selpoint?....selpoint(CLEAR); is it right?..
hehe it works.... thank you so much karmacop.

thanks thanks thanks thanks....

Yog
03-08-2004, 07:40 AM
Good work guys, I always wondered why LW worked this way.

Karmacop
03-08-2004, 07:59 AM
yeah, selpoint(CLEAR) .. I'm sure there must be a way of finding out what selection mode you're in (point or poly) but I don't know how and can't be bothered :p

Mister NO
03-24-2004, 01:52 PM
We need snap tools in all forms.
Without snap tools it is hard to model precise objects.
This stuff is very important for architects!!!
You must give us this tools NT!!!!


(Sorry for my english!):o

Nemoid
03-25-2004, 12:36 AM
hehe .. Mister No.. for a moment i thought you was Italian.. do you read Mister NO comics??

i agree with snapping tools.this was said many times, but reepeating it is always good. :)

Ciao from Italy

Mister NO
03-25-2004, 04:45 PM
Hehe well Nemoid i read only the best comics!!
(It is good for modeling inspiration!!):D
By the way Nemoid do you knowe when this LIGHTWAVE 3D 8
is going to be finished, i'm tired of waiting!!!!!:confused:
And one more thing about feature requests:
Measure tools(but i mean real measure tools!:D ),
and faster renderer(it's slow when using refraction and reflection).
I think that is all!(for now!)


(sorry for my english)

:)

Nemoid
03-26-2004, 05:18 AM
No prob for the english i am Italian! Bonelli comics rock!

as for Lw 8. as you can see from some post in discussion board, its quite ready.
i dunno if it will have astonishing new tools for modelling, but however it will have DI's power tools fully integrated plus other good tools. some user is projecting new measure tools. search for infos in SpinQuad forums (lw related Proton's forum).

Lw 8 development was focused into Char animation as first priority, bit I'd be not surprised if some new tool will make its appearence for modelling too.

and don't forget FPrime!!

Jeez, Nt should hire me as 2nd evangelist...:D

Mister NO
03-28-2004, 04:16 AM
Fprime !
I heard that it is wery fast!
But what about renderer quality, is it
better than Lightwave's.
Greetengs to Italy :D


(sorry for my english):p