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Snosrap
01-31-2018, 08:47 PM
Lightwave 2018 has been released and for the most part it's pretty solid. But what's next? There has been virtually no interaction with anybody at LW3DGroup. Who's leading the team? I miss Rob and Lino - they were very active on the forums after the release of the 10, 11 and 2015 series. Matt makes an appearance on FB on occasion. LW needs an evangelist! When I saw this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=WRCv4TakYQg
I was stoked. Not because I have a need for it, but because I though NT finally had their crap together with this new underlying architecture and could now crank out new tools and workflows at a reasonable pace. But then I see it is 3rd party and my heart sunk. :( So again I ask - what's next? Who's in charge?

OFF
01-31-2018, 09:22 PM
I think that 3rd party plug-ins are not a problem - on the contrary, if the architecture has made a step forward (as Oliver Hotz said (https://www.lightwave3d.com/news/article/interview-with-oliver-hotz/)) - this means that the set of third-party tools can greatly increase. Thus, we can see in the near future connectors to cool renderers (Arnold (who knows?), RedShift, Vray, Luxrender, Cycles, etc), plug-ins for creating hair or liquids from famous or new manufacturers, etc. No company can provide all the necessary tools. But you can create a platform on which it is possible to create any modern tools.

jwiede
01-31-2018, 09:29 PM
I think that 3rd party plug-ins are not a problem

Perhaps, but the lack of communication from Newtek regarding LW is still a problem, and so Snosrap's post/questions are still valid concerns.

Myagi
02-01-2018, 04:20 AM
IMHO the praising of the plugin developement side improvements is a bit exaggerated. At least the C SDK, I can't speak for the python API. A simple diff operation on the SDK header files between 2015 and 2018 gives you the raw truth of changes. The big bulk of changes are of course on nodes and rendering, since those systems got an overhaul, but otherwise changes are quite modest. Especially on the Modeler side.

In fact surface related functionality even took a step backwards in some areas in 2018, breaking functionality to the point where I couldn't make one of my plugins work fully. I had to resort to undocumented code gymnastics to make it work somewhat.

I found that quite disappointing. Here they introduced SDK changes (nodes/surfacing) that breaks 100% of existing plugins with node stuff. A huge opportunity to greatly improve that portion of the API, but instead it more or less ends up just like the old one with a few minor additions sprinkled in.


TL ; DR: yes it's nice there are some improvements here and there, I guess more so in Layout, but it isn't the second coming of .. the SDK or anything. As the germans say, let's leave the church in the village :)

Farhad_azer
02-01-2018, 06:42 AM
Dear snosrap, with due respect you are a very negative person against LW and majority of your posts are complain. LW 2018 is released recently and some of us still dont have it and you are asking for future and what we do not have. I can relate to your older posts also.

Of course i have a lot of respect to any member of the forum and you are not an exception for sure but will you please, from time to time, talk a little positive and see the filled half of glass for god sake?

It is a brotherly request and i am nobody telling you what to do.

mummyman
02-01-2018, 07:50 AM
@Snosrap... I think it's a valid question, and not necessarily negative. It's nice to see random posts from Oliver and Lino about third party stuff. Maybe NT is taking it all in with bug reports and comments before releasing more info about "next steps" So far so good for me.

Igu4n4
02-01-2018, 08:55 AM
I think one of the big issues was that everyone, lovers and haters, of lightwave were put into such a sensory vacuum for so long that when they finally announced/released 2018 (only 4 weeks ago)... everyone wanted to just barf up everything they'd been holding in for so long. Good, bad, and ugly. So the people who are typically cynical of the software have new ammo now that some of their concerns have been realized, others have praise to lavish as finally their beloved has moved forward (or at least alive), and the middle ground is having to learn new tricks to do things that we were used to doing a different way, and trying to find ways to evolve their work.

I was speaking to Oliver yesterday, and had to congratulate him (again) on his effort and innovation recently, for whatever reason (new api, new sdk, whatever), he has unleashed a slew of new tools quickly and dramatically that weren't in our view a month ago. And seeing the animated sculpt etc and the possibilities breathes some new hope all in a very short space of time where there was absolute SILENCE for years. For whatever reason, politically, culturally, mechanically it took this long, it did, and we are here where we are. We can encourage the software/development to become what we *really* want it to be... but unless we're prepared to make tools to help it get there, we're just along for the ride.

So I think so much has happened in the past 4 weeks, its just not necessarily where everyone would like it to be. I don't think anyone deserves excuses, but we've seen more activity around and concerning lightwave at the moment than in a very long time, and everyone just wants more because we were holding our breath for so long.

I'm hoping LWG is watching, and honestly planning a better approach than previously as they've indicated with Chuck's new-found involvement and Scott's hand on the forums. And honestly without the 3rd party tools we're seeing showing up and coming up, we'd never get there. I hope we see more. In the mean time I think being religious about any tool is foolhardy, but we can always encourage it to become what we want, socially and financially.

st3.

Snosrap
02-01-2018, 08:00 PM
Dear snosrap, with due respect you are a very negative person against LW and majority of your posts are complain. LW 2018 is released recently and some of us still dont have it and you are asking for future and what we do not have. I can relate to your older posts also.

Of course i have a lot of respect to any member of the forum and you are not an exception for sure but will you please, from time to time, talk a little positive and see the filled half of glass for god sake?

It is a brotherly request and i am nobody telling you what to do.

Not true at all. I really like LW, always have, but we can't be blind to its faults and annoyances. We all know its strengths and I think NT does as well, so my posts are generally written in hopes that someone from NT will notice and take heart of the editorial I bring up. Most likely when/if they get a new person in charge we'll see a blast of communication for a few weeks and then it'll go quiet - I'd like to see that change.

Airwaves
02-01-2018, 09:31 PM
In regards to your post I do agree that it would be nice to have some direction or idea of who is in charge. I think it is a valid concern especially for a small software. If the software were huge and used by the majority then I doubt people would care who is in charge as long as new releases and tidbits keep coming.

For me I just want to see that Newtek is taking the reins and running with it and I think with more interaction that would alleviate some of the issues people have experienced. From a marketing point of view the more they can do to make customers happy the more long term customers they will have.

hypersuperduper
02-02-2018, 12:37 AM
A good plan canít be conjured out of thin air. I believe that there must have been something fundamentally wrong with the plan under which lightwave development had been operating during the last several years. What SPECIFICALLY went wrong is probably the subject of considerable debate within Newtek/LW3DG, but the excessive delays, communication blackout and management shakeup are clear evidence of something not being entirely right at the strategic level. I get the sense that the current leadership is somewhat improvised -People moved from other departments and stuff, and they probably donít really have a plan or even enough familiarity with the issues yet to make one, and they might be just interim management anyways. Who knows? Probably not even they themselves.

I believe it would be prudent considering this for newtek to spend this year polishing the heck out of the current version, getting rid of bugs and issues, and interacting directly with customers to gain valuable feedback. My experience during this past month has been that they are doing an admirable job of doing just that. Aside from the increased forum and fb activity from dev team members, I have interacted more with LW3DG over the past month than over the past three years combined in the form of bug reports, and it has been a good back and forth experience. I really get the sense that they are actively working hard on fixing the specific issues that affect me as a user if I report them. Thatís what I care about right now.

With all due respect to newtek management, even if they had a plan right now I wouldnít trust it.

jwiede
02-02-2018, 01:30 AM
Aside from the increased forum and fb activity from dev team members, I have interacted more with LW3DG over the past month than over the past three years combined in the form of bug reports, and it has been a good back and forth experience.

While that was true at the beginning of the month, the level of communication has seriously dropped in the last couple weeks. I'm hoping it's just a momentary lull, but their history isn't exactly reassuring in that area.

It'd certainly be nice to know if there's effort being put towards providing customers with useful render presets, for example, or further YouTube updates, additional example content, and so forth. That kind of thing is excellent fodder for more frequent communication as well -- f.e. there are some aspects of the render preset system which don't work well (splitting filter type and filter radius is a good example), and having a dialogue with customers on any difficulties they're recognizing internally while putting together preset content (as well as any workarounds they've found) would be quite useful.

The "we're too busy and don't have time" excuse as status quo just isn't believable. Occasional periodic interruptions are fine, but only after a solid baseline has been established to show it's something they take seriously (and that requires more than just a few weeks of post-release discussion, IMO).

hypersuperduper
02-02-2018, 01:57 AM
While that was true at the beginning of the month, the level of communication has seriously dropped in the last couple weeks. I'm hoping it's just a momentary lull, but their history isn't exactly reassuring in that area.

It'd certainly be nice to know if there's effort being put towards providing customers with useful render presets, for example, or further YouTube updates, additional example content, and so forth. That kind of thing is excellent fodder for more frequent communication as well -- f.e. there are some aspects of the render preset system which don't work well (splitting filter type and filter radius is a good example), and having a dialogue with customers on any difficulties they're recognizing internally while putting together preset content (as well as any workarounds they've found) would be quite useful.

The "we're too busy and don't have time" excuse as status quo just isn't believable. Occasional periodic interruptions are fine, but only after a solid baseline has been established to show it's something they take seriously (and that requires more than just a few weeks of post-release discussion, IMO).

I'm sure feedback response is somewhat individual. My experience has been the opposite to yours. I have seen a marked uptick in the response in the last two weeks. So they are fixing my bugs instead of yours! haha!
but seriously, yes, they have a lot to prove and it is only through continued engagement they will regain everyone's trust, but for me at least the signs are very encouraging.

Gungho3D
02-02-2018, 02:05 AM
Not true at all. I really like LW, always have, but we can't be blind to its faults and annoyances. We all know its strengths and I think NT does as well, so my posts are generally written in hopes that someone from NT will notice and take heart of the editorial I bring up. Most likely when/if they get a new person in charge we'll see a blast of communication for a few weeks and then it'll go quiet - I'd like to see that change.

I agree

TheLexx
02-02-2018, 02:14 AM
I think the last couple of years has highlighted the demarcation line between community and company, a line which everyone likes to be invisible but it can't always be the case. My own impression (possibly false) is that the NT dev team toggles between video products and LW, because I think that is where Andrew Cross was plucked from when he intervened during the silence. I don't think Chuck and co can always be expected to be active here at the same level as after LW2018 release, and I'm not sure it right for the community to assume monitoring the company, otherwise elements could wander into the nth degree - "Oi, that dev took too long on his lunch break !" :D. Absolutely not referring to anyone in particular, but in the past sometimes people almost seemed to enjoy goading NT on occasions. NT seem to communicate with 3rd Party, but I'm confident - or should I say hopeful - they won't just say "Oliver, you sort it out for the next five years". :)

jwiede
02-02-2018, 04:10 AM
I'm sure feedback response is somewhat individual. My experience has been the opposite to yours. I have seen a marked uptick in the response in the last two weeks. So they are fixing my bugs instead of yours! haha!

I think there's a significant difference between "general customer communication", and seeing updates on bug reports. While I'm glad bugs are being triaged and fixed, the latter is more about individual customer support, not communication for keeping the general customer base informed about LW efforts and status (the former). They need to be doing both.

ianr
02-02-2018, 09:14 AM
Lightwiki posts are being visited by devs, even this week, one saying

'yeph that's been fixed & will be in the next point release.'

Gotta be a good thang,U 'all.

also: https://www.3dartistonline.com/news/2018/01/lightwave-2018-shows-off-new-features/

Snosrap
02-02-2018, 08:27 PM
I really get the sense that they are actively working hard on fixing the specific issues that affect me as a user if I report them.

No question. Of course a lot of that is the result of a bug reporting feedback agent that actually works. :) Kudos to them for that.

gar26lw
02-02-2018, 08:48 PM
Lightwiki posts are being visited by devs, even this week, one saying

'yeph that's been fixed & will be in the next point release.'

Gotta be a good thang,U 'all.

also: https://www.3dartistonline.com/news/2018/01/lightwave-2018-shows-off-new-features/

notice the first comment to that feature

Chris S. (Fez)
02-02-2018, 10:58 PM
Meh. Blender trolls post anywhere and everywhere they can. Modo. Max. C4D. No forum is immune.

Wickedpup
02-03-2018, 05:03 PM
The LW2018 review from Bugzilla2001...........
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TExpoCdBUpI

gar26lw
02-03-2018, 05:40 PM
The LW2018 review from Bugzilla2001...........
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TExpoCdBUpI

what he says is correct. lightwave needs the ui, workflow, scene loading/reference and modelling tools updated. it’s a fair review. it might not be nice to hear, especially if you are a developer but it’s doing nobody any good to ignore it.

hypersuperduper
02-03-2018, 06:18 PM
I think there are far more workflow changes than he acknowledges. Applying Modifiers and properties on a mass scale is VASTLY improved for example and he just clicked right past it saying “same as before” Why write a review when you just putz around in the demo scenes in the trial version? Who is the intended audience? People who can’t be bothered to play around with the trial version themselves?

Sekhar
02-03-2018, 06:29 PM
what he says is correct. lightwave needs the ui, workflow, scene loading/reference and modelling tools updated. itís a fair review. it might not be nice to hear, especially if you are a developer but itís doing nobody any good to ignore it.

I actually thought it was unfair...and dismissive. Saying stuff like "There is (sic) no new features really, except for some render improvements and a few quality of life things and some view port things" is rather glib and doesn't earn you any credibility points. By all means we should point out what's missing, but we need think and put ourselves in the developers' (and NewTek's) position before mouthing off. By far the biggest MEH is coming from the crowd that wants modeler/layout integration, it seems...anything short of that won't satisfy them.

NT: I suggest opening a sticky thread inviting input on new features. I think you had something like that a while back, it'd be a great way IMO to make this constructive.

Ztreem
02-03-2018, 07:22 PM
The LW2018 review from Bugzilla2001...........
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TExpoCdBUpI

I feel that this is quite a fair review even if he passes a few of the new features. The point is that LW needs to go over the whole structure of UI and workflows of all the old features and not just add new ones. But this is my view and if you feel different then thats OK and you will still use and enjoy LW, good for you.

I look at it this way, I always thought that NT and I had the same vision for LW, a unified app with a modern UI with fast workflows and nice features. I just realised that maybe we donít have the same vision of future Lw, and that is OK. As they never say what is coming and all new versions is lacking any evidence of progress of features that actually help you do the daily work effective besides rendering. I feel that too much is missing and the workflows are too clicky and cumbersome to be effective... its time to move on. Its not NT or LW that is the problem here, its me. I took for granted that we had the same future vision without even asking NT about it. Feels good when I realised this... Now back to explore the other wonderful world of a unified app.

gar26lw
02-03-2018, 08:37 PM
NT: I suggest opening a sticky thread inviting input on new features. I think you had something like that a while back, it'd be a great way IMO to make this constructive.

did you ever see the multitude of feature request threads on here. bevel for instance. bucket loads of good ideas and examples on improving ui, workflow, tools. what’s happened? seen a better bevel tool ? how about edge rounding? uv’s?
someone wrote an epic rant about this on another forum, regarding the focus on a pathtracer. it was quite amusing but at the same time, so disappointing given the time period all these requests and threads have ran over.

it’s worth a shot but like buying a lottery ticket. i hope finally, nt will listen to its users and put in what they request.
there’s some evidence of that now so i remain positive. most of what is requested is in modo. luxology listened and put in a lot of great stuff, newtek should mimic them, if they can get past the chip on the shoulder ;)

i get the feeling that when someone says, hey maya has this great feature, can we get that, nt looks the other way and thinks, no way! we don’t want to be maya, to the detriment of the ui, feature set, workflow etc. consequently new users will not adopt it.

even as a very keen long term lw user and enthusiast i personally find it extremely hard to justify using it, even with the new renderer. as Ztreem said, it’s gotten very clicky and the dropping of simple fast ways of setting up things in favour of nodes has slowed it down.
i feel they fixed what wasn’t broken in 2015 and destroyed the speed of use.
if you use the menus you will probably observe that the ui and ux need someone who actually uses the program a lot to give input and explain why and how things should be laid out and tidied up.
just look at the object properties panel or the strang changes to the backdrop image section. the lack of fast setup and management of nodes and surfaces. reduction in ease of mass edit changes in the surfacing panel.
removal of shaders, so scene wide surfacing is out with no shadermiester.
it really is time to put all effort into the rest of the program. as bugzilla says, perhaps their objective now is to make a renderer and expect all work to be done elsewhere but imho, it will kill it slowly over time through user attrition.

this is why we as users need a roadmap. so we can see if our needs and objectives for our 3d businesses align with nt way of thinking and plans for lw dev. without it, we must assume they do not.

as i said, it might not be nice to hear, especially if you are a developer but it’s doing nobody any good to ignore it. i want to keep using lw and be able to get others to adopt it but without end user feature requests being implemented and things added that won’t happen.

example - add maya nav. i know most at my work just wont touch it without that basic feature. it’s an easy first stumbling block to fix that’s blocking uptake in new users minds.
they don’t seem to want to add it. it does not compute in my mind :)

imho nt need to stop listening to the fanboys and start listening to the rest, who are the majority.

Farhad_azer
02-04-2018, 03:47 AM
Which one should i take more serious? Ryan Roy with tools and top-notch tutorials and projects or Bugzila from nowhere with wonderful art gallery?

LoL the answer is obvious.

Time for me to unsubscribe from this thread and wish you all a warm and lengthy discussion.

Thanks everybody.

vncnt
02-04-2018, 05:30 AM
Reading all this I wonder, should we learn to think like a developer in order to ask the right questions?
Shouldn't we describe our problems (and let the program designers come up with solutions that they can offer) and specify the weight of our problems (to determine profit vs priority).

Examples:

- "We need a modern user interface" vs "I keep updating render parameters when I only have the intention to switch between preview and final render quality, even in VPR mode: 10% loss of my time"

- "Unification asap please" vs "Adjusting weight maps without having realtime feedback keeps me busy for 15% of my time."

When "nothing" has changed, according to a user, while 75% of the engine has changed, the development team should consider "nothing" as a very good compliment.

prometheus
02-04-2018, 05:38 AM
Which one should i take more serious? Ryan Roy with tools and top-notch tutorials and projects or Bugzila from nowhere with wonderful art gallery?

LoL the answer is obvious.

Time for me to unsubscribe from this thread and wish you all a warm and lengthy discussion.

Thanks everybody.
Dont listen to these guys too much..try for yourself and see if Lightwave feels better..In quality. ..speed..workflow...and what you can do with the new stuff.

One of the guys seem overly positive without any remarks..and makes a living with Lightwave. .and the community who uses it..and one guy made a video saying lw was killed...thus painting himself in a corner of having seen lw back as a zombie....same dead Lightwave. ..but growling a bit different.
Your gut feeling...check that foremost.

gar26lw
02-04-2018, 06:31 AM
Reading all this I wonder, should we learn to think like a developer in order to ask the right questions?
Shouldn't we describe our problems (and let the program designers come up with solutions that they can offer) and specify the weight of our problems (to determine profit vs priority).

Examples:

- "We need a modern user interface" vs "I keep updating render parameters when I only have the intention to switch between preview and final render quality, even in VPR mode: 10% loss of my time"

- "Unification asap please" vs "Adjusting weight maps without having realtime feedback keeps me busy for 15% of my time."

When "nothing" has changed, according to a user, while 75% of the engine has changed, the development team should consider "nothing" as a very good compliment.

good idea :)

hypersuperduper
02-04-2018, 06:34 AM
Youtube reviews in general exist to get views and are as such more troll bait than any sort of nuanced appraisal of the subject. There are exceptions of course but the bugzilla review was not an exception.


A SERIOUS appraisal of the software would probably come to the conclusion that the product is hit and miss with some new potential but a lot of old shortcomings, more than a few bugs, and a lot of changes that break old workflows. Whether or not the reviewer recommends the software would be based on weighing these factors along with the price.

A SERIOUS reviewer would at least attempt a small test project with the software instead of just loading up and scrubbing the timeline in the demo content.

A SERIOUS reviewer would then go on to summarize the good and bad of his experience, and attempt to help the viewer make a purchase decision based on their needs.

A SERIOUS reviewer does not, based on a half day's piddling around with a trial version, waste everyone's time time making uninformed assumptions as to what the developers strategy is. Is Newteks strategy to make lightwave an output platform for content produced elsewhere? Who knows? I doubt it personally, but i can say one thing for sure: this reviewer absolutely does not know.

Most importantly, A SERIOUS review would, ultimately, be informative.

For reference: here is a youtube reviewer who does a good job and actually provides helpful reviews.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TZm6SaoZuc&t=20s

ianr
02-04-2018, 07:43 AM
well said , i think you will like Kat's letter essay I just posted .

- - - Updated - - -

I entirely agree ,see Kat's post /Letter /Essay

SBowie
02-04-2018, 08:20 AM
Shouldn't we describe our problems (and let the program designers come up with solutions that they can offer) and specify the weight of our problems (to determine profit vs priority).I think this is a worthy suggestion.

Sweeping generalities are not completely worthless, but don't contribute much to practical progress. There's nothing wrong with specific suggestions ('Could feature x be presented in the UI in this manner rather than that?'), but developers are often in a better position to fulfill something along the lines of "What I need to accomplish is this ..." We have a tendency to think in terms of what we've seen elsewhere ("This is easy to do in Maya, and I'd like the same thing in LW") without any sense of why the Maya developers did it this way and how accomplishing something similar might take a very different form in different underlying architecture.

samurai_x
02-04-2018, 08:34 PM
IMHO the praising of the plugin developement side improvements is a bit exaggerated. At least the C SDK, I can't speak for the python API. A simple diff operation on the SDK header files between 2015 and 2018 gives you the raw truth of changes. The big bulk of changes are of course on nodes and rendering, since those systems got an overhaul, but otherwise changes are quite modest. Especially on the Modeler side.

In fact surface related functionality even took a step backwards in some areas in 2018, breaking functionality to the point where I couldn't make one of my plugins work fully. I had to resort to undocumented code gymnastics to make it work somewhat.

I found that quite disappointing. Here they introduced SDK changes (nodes/surfacing) that breaks 100% of existing plugins with node stuff. A huge opportunity to greatly improve that portion of the API, but instead it more or less ends up just like the old one with a few minor additions sprinkled in.


TL ; DR: yes it's nice there are some improvements here and there, I guess more so in Layout, but it isn't the second coming of .. the SDK or anything. As the germans say, let's leave the church in the village :)

Bummer. How about the layout side?
The new animated sculpt, wonder if its just a deformer. Layout still not aware of vertex, edges, polys...

gar26lw
02-04-2018, 09:40 PM
i think it’s a deformed but wait and see i guess.

samurai_x
02-04-2018, 10:16 PM
From the Kelly conversation thread it seems the hydra or new geo engine implementation failed. So we did get order of operations fixed in layout in the deformer stack but the core architecture(point, edge, poly awareness) changes people hoped for isn't in lw 2018 at all. Its a given the mesh engine will be updated because of the surfacing and rendering changes but at its core it seems to be the same as the old one.

gar26lw
02-05-2018, 05:36 AM
From the Kelly conversation thread it seems the hydra or new geo engine implementation failed. So we did get order of operations fixed in layout in the deformer stack but the core architecture(point, edge, poly awareness) changes people hoped for isn't in lw 2018 at all. Its a given the mesh engine will be updated because of the surfacing and rendering changes but at its core it seems to be the same as the old one.

core 2?

Chris S. (Fez)
02-05-2018, 07:30 AM
Layout viewports are noticeably faster. There may not be point/edge/poly hooks yet but the improved performance and that upcoming paint deformation plug seem to indicate progress. But, yeah, no mention of the new engine in the 2018 marketing material. Does not mean the r&d was without value.

mummyman
02-05-2018, 08:15 AM
well said , i think you will like Kat's letter essay I just posted .

- - - Updated - - -

I entirely agree ,see Kat's post /Letter /Essay

I can't seem to find this link?

Qexit
02-05-2018, 09:08 AM
I can't seem to find this link?He means this thread:

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?155957

Shame it doesn't include a link to the original Lightwiki thread as I am sure that would make interesting reading.

ianr
02-05-2018, 09:43 AM
He means this thread:

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?155957

Shame it doesn't include a link to the original Lightwiki thread as I am sure that would make interesting reading.


Keep your shame. It's all kelly only me the smallquote brackets

the edit was iron Sky war stories so if you want them there on lightwiki

mummyman
02-05-2018, 09:48 AM
Thanks!

Qexit
02-05-2018, 10:07 AM
Keep your shame. It's all kelly only me the smallquote brackets

the edit was iron Sky war stories so if you want them there on lightwikiLightwiki is a right royal pain to search through for specific items, so again please include a link. As I said, I am sure the rest of that thread with the responses to what Kat: Kelly Myers posted would make interesting reading so please provide a link.

Chuck
02-06-2018, 12:42 PM
So again I ask - what's next? Who's in charge?



Steve Bowie and I have both expressed that the relentless obsession of some in the community with "what's next" is not going to be fed any longer. Yes, NewTek and LW3DG are pretty much at fault with making a lot of the marketing of LightWave over the years about advance notices of development rather than the product users could have in their hands today - but that is irrational marketing, and we're stopping that. If nearly three decades of consistent development hasn't assured someone that LightWave has a secure future, they just can't be assured, and it's time to apply those energies to what can be productive.

If releasing an ordinal update with several major new systems implemented, yet that has the stability that was often only achieved in the final incremental update of a series, hasn't made NewTek's commitment to the product and to quality clear to someone, they can't be reached.

We aren't saying that there won't be reasonable discussions with the users about what you want and need in the product; there certainly will be. But the community at the time of a major new release should be, for a significant length of time, about exploring LightWave Now, not roiling up angst about LightWave Next. There is a lot to explore, after all.

NewTek is in charge, and continued advances based on both user input and internal innovation is what's next.

Snosrap
02-06-2018, 06:55 PM
NewTek is in charge, and continued advances based on both user input and internal innovation is what's next. Ok. :) It would be nice however to hear a thing or two from NT as to some of the issues we have discovered with the new release and whether they are going to be resolved or why it is the way it is.

ianr
02-07-2018, 06:27 AM
Screengrab of LightWiki original

http://forums.newtek.com/newreply.php?do=postreply&t=155957

ianr
02-07-2018, 06:36 AM
Steve Bowie and I have both expressed that the relentless obsession of some in the community with "what's next" is not going to be fed any longer. Yes, NewTek and LW3DG are pretty much at fault with making a lot of the marketing of LightWave over the years about advance notices of development rather than the product users could have in their hands today - but that is irrational marketing, and we're stopping that. If nearly three decades of consistent development hasn't assured someone that LightWave has a secure future, they just can't be assured, and it's time to apply those energies to what can be productive.

If releasing an ordinal update with several major new systems implemented, yet that has the stability that was often only achieved in the final incremental update of a series, hasn't made NewTek's commitment to the product and to quality clear to someone, they can't be reached.

We aren't saying that there won't be reasonable discussions with the users about what you want and need in the product; there certainly will be. But the community at the time of a major new release should be, for a significant length of time, about exploring LightWave Now, not roiling up angst about LightWave Next. There is a lot to explore, after all.

NewTek is in charge, and continued advances based on both user input and internal innovation is what's next.


I just caught this Chuck,

its just a thought but if the feedback forms had active boxes for apart for tick boxes for Bug/modeler

Bug/layout which could help Deuce & Co . Also a voting system for users with a bar density how many

have voted for a paticular feature. I always thought lots of Plug- ins came from users wanting a improvement?

AnimeJoex
02-07-2018, 06:41 AM
With the groundwork that's been laid, Lightwave 2018.5 is going to be bada$$! :D

Qexit
02-07-2018, 06:43 AM
Lightwiki is a right royal pain to search through for specific items, so again please include a link. As I said, I am sure the rest of that thread with the responses to what Kat: Kelly Myers posted would make interesting reading so please provide a link.For anyone interested, this link takes you to the original thread on Lightwiki Facebook:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/lightwiki/permalink/1321020144670648/