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genesis1
01-20-2018, 04:22 AM
Been trying to use the strand tool on fiber fx in modeler. Head is quite high poly and I dublicated just the scalp part on a second layer for creating the fibers. Soon as I've created the fibers I switch to that layer. I then hit strand tool and fatal error pops up straight away. This happens repeatedly. However if the original head is a low poly there is no problem. Seems if a higher poly head is loaded it will always crash.

CaptainMarlowe
01-20-2018, 12:47 PM
Works here. 2018.0.1/Mac.

prometheus
01-20-2018, 01:18 PM
Been trying to use the strand tool on fiber fx in modeler. Head is quite high poly and I dublicated just the scalp part on a second layer for creating the fibers. Soon as I've created the fibers I switch to that layer. I then hit strand tool and fatal error pops up straight away. This happens repeatedly. However if the original head is a low poly there is no problem. Seems if a higher poly head is loaded it will always crash.

You probably need to reconstruct what kind of polychain you got, I skipped using strand tool, or really any modeling tool inside of modeler, and went for combing and styling in blender..send back to lightwave and copy and paste edges, not polys..and that worked with 2015 without having fiberfx to crash.
But I need to check 2018 for that as well.
otherwise, sculpt combing in blender is way better than anything in lightwave in my opinion, for styling hair.

genesis1
01-20-2018, 02:01 PM
Hey, that sounds a great idea. I'll give that a go. I agree blender hair sculpting and indeed rendering is still superior to LW unfortunately.

Sensei
01-20-2018, 02:27 PM
I would check if you have 1 point polygons, 2 point polygons,
then whether you have "flattened" polygons (two points at the same location, when 3rd is somewhere else).
For a start: merge points, unify polys, unify normals.
Then select 1-2 point polys in Poly Statistics window and delete.
And try again.

prometheus
01-20-2018, 03:24 PM
Yep it works, not sure if I got the time to record it..but writing it he.

Anyway, just grow your hair, paint a weight map on your object, apply particle emitter in blender, change type to hair and under under vertex group, choose the group created when you painted it, and the hair should grow from that, further some enable dynamics and play the timeline to let the hair fall a little perhaps, then go to the object modifier tab, there you should see the particle system and a button called convert, click on that and it converts it to a poly mesh, save out as obj.
import obj to lightwave, select the hair guides, preferably you select the scalp mesh, then invert selection..which results in all the hair polychains selected, whatīs important here is to change selection mode to edges, then copy and paste those to a second layer....delete the first layers hairguides, you should only have the edge copied mesh on the second layer, save object and save layout, I had no crash in 2018 the very first test.

Thats a bit about it, about combing and editing in blender, I should showcase that, you enter the tab available called particle edit,at the same place where you have the sculpt/object option selection, the combing is better, cutting, and the collsion agains a scalp mesh, you can edit individual strands by checking tip mode selection mode for the particles, (in the same place as where you would select face, point or edges..it changes to another set of selection modes if you are in particle edit mode) so check that, then hold ctrl down and click on the tip of a hair guide, that allows for similar ik editing of a single strand without effecting the others.
tip mode or point mode to select wether or not you only want to edit from the tip or point mode for other points in that single chain.

Kryslin
01-20-2018, 04:06 PM
You can also skip using strand modeler altogether, and just use your splines guides. Make sure your spline start is on the scalp, and your good.

prometheus
01-20-2018, 04:24 PM
You can also skip using strand modeler altogether, and just use your splines guides. Make sure your spline start is on the scalp, and your good.

the strand tool is for editing single strands with IK ctrl.
and for spline guides? you need to convert splines to polychain anyway I believe, if you want to have polyhair with dynamics.

AS for blender, forget my bad workflow description of selecting hair in lightwave after import...hit " W" for open statistics panel, do so when in poly mode, then click the plus icon for 2 vertices, and it will select all hair guides imported from blender, and then convert to edge selection ..when youdo that, the hair switch from normal yellow selection, to green selection for edges..then copy and paste the edges to another layer, then go back and delete the poly hair in the first layer.

Edit Oops..just got a crash by selecting it that way..hold on.

prometheus
01-20-2018, 04:34 PM
..well, the crash was probably due to something with having two objects open, and having used the strand tool on one of them, I did a new retry of copy and paste the edges after "w" selecting 2 vertices in the statistic panel...and it worked after reloading modeler fresh after the crash, fiberfx in layout also activated fine without crash.

Sensei
01-20-2018, 05:28 PM
You cannot have multiple LW running at the same time, so no e.g. LW 2015.3 and LW 2018 opened simultaneously.
If somebody wants to switch versions, must shut down Hub in right-bottom panel first.

Kryslin
01-20-2018, 08:53 PM
the strand tool is for editing single strands with IK ctrl.
and for spline guides? you need to convert splines to polychain anyway I believe, if you want to have polyhair with dynamics.


Sorry, I misunderstood.

prometheus
01-21-2018, 10:46 AM
You cannot have multiple LW running at the same time, so no e.g. LW 2015.3 and LW 2018 opened simultaneously.
If somebody wants to switch versions, must shut down Hub in right-bottom panel first.

And that was an answer to what? since you didnīt refer to anyone, and posted after my post.
to clarify, I did not use 2015 and 2018 at the same time, I said I had two objects opened ..meaning two objects in 2018 in modeler, and had just used the strand tool on one object, then copied to another object instance within modeler 2018, and starting to copy edges etc.
So I think you misunderstood? or did you just pass on a general information on working with Lightwave ?

prometheus
01-21-2018, 11:16 AM
will not make it to create a vid today, so short images ..main steps, exporting to obj from blender you have to figure out yourself, itīs just a matter of go to export and export obj :)


This works with 2018, but try and keep modeling sessions clean, meaning donīt try it after having fiddled with the strand tool previously, best to shut down modeler in such case and have it fresh when importing and doing this.


check right corner and modifier tab of blender, convert you particle hair to a mesh...

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=139640&d=1516558195

Export as obj..(not shown)

import as obj to lightwave (not shown)

while in poly mode, hit "W" to open statistics panel, click on the 2 vertices polys, that will select the hair strands...


http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=139641&d=1516558304

Use selections drop down menu and convert poly to edges selection, then copy and paste these edges to another layer, then go back to first layer and select the poly mesh hair on that layer and delete those, it is the copied edges hair mesh we should use for fiberfx, otherwise it will crash.

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=139642&d=1516558362

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=139643&d=1516558378

So that is a workflow working for me, both in Lighwave 2015 and 2018, without any plugin or script needed...just make sure to use chain strands copied as edges, and not polys..and layout hasnīt crashed for me neither in 2015 or 2018 with this approach.

Sensei
01-22-2018, 07:38 AM
And that was an answer to what?

People who are trying to figure out whether bug is in one version, and not the older one, are switching them e.g. 2018 vs 2015.3. I just reminded them, that hub must be shutdown manually..

OFF
01-22-2018, 09:40 PM
change selection mode to edges, then copy and paste those to a second layer
How do you get to copy and paste? Not for the first time I see such a method, but I still do not understand how it is implemented - Modeller rejects me in this action.

Sensei
01-22-2018, 09:43 PM
How do you get to copy and paste? Not for the first time I see such a method, but I still do not understand how it is implemented - Modeller rejects me in this action.

Normally. Ctrl-c, Ctrl-v.. ;)

OFF
01-22-2018, 10:16 PM
Hmm. Regardless of which edges I try to copy/paste, I get the same answer - "The operation cannot be applied to edges".
139673
139674

prometheus
01-23-2018, 12:22 AM
Hmm. Regardless of which edges I try to copy/paste, I get the same answer - "The operation cannot be applied to edges".
139673
139674

You are not using older versions of lightwave ..like 11.62 o something?

checking again, it should work, however, did you really hold ctrl- down, if you only happen to click c, it wonīt work..so make sure your copy and paste operation works as it should.

not sure..make sure if it varied over lw versions, try stand in edge mode and select them and copy and paste, but otherwise, standing in polymode and select them and then convert o edge selection should work.
I suspect you are standing in edge mode, since when I check the edit button, the copy and paste tool is greyed out, so make sure you stand in polymode, not edge mode, then select the two vertices polygons, then go to select convert to edges, then use ctrl-+ to copy and ctrl-v to paste on another layer.

Always use a windows version, not mac :)

prometheus
01-23-2018, 12:37 AM
And do not try to use cut..It won't work on edges. .hence the workflow of copy and paste.

jwiede
01-23-2018, 01:43 AM
Been trying to use the strand tool on fiber fx in modeler. Head is quite high poly and I dublicated just the scalp part on a second layer for creating the fibers. Soon as I've created the fibers I switch to that layer. I then hit strand tool and fatal error pops up straight away. This happens repeatedly. However if the original head is a low poly there is no problem. Seems if a higher poly head is loaded it will always crash.

Works here as well, no crash/error, 2018.0.1 Mac64 on 10.13.2. I have 32GB of RAM, and after creating 1-per-poly guides on a 100x100 square of polys (top of a 100x1x100 box copied to new layer), I was able to activate strand tool and move guides around just fine (albeit sluggishly).

How much memory do you have? Also, can you give some guidance as to how many polys were in the "low" and "high" poly scalp surfaces of yours?

OFF
01-23-2018, 02:35 AM
You are not using older versions of lightwave ..like 11.62 o something? - nope, LW 2015.3 and LW 2018.

What is assigned in the your keys config on the combination Ctrl-C/V?

139679

genesis1
01-23-2018, 03:01 AM
Make sure you are on the layer you wish to copy. Shortcut is cntrl-c to copy then cntrl-V to paste. Or do it from the drop down list top left.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think it works on edges. I maybe wrong.

prometheus
01-23-2018, 03:14 AM
- nope, LW 2015.3 and LW 2018.

What is assigned in the your keys config on the combination Ctrl-C/V?

139679

It seems you are not reading my response fully..refering to your latest image. .If you had read my previous post..I wrote that it is greyed out if you are in edge mode...do it could have spared you posting it:)
But it should work with ctrl c for copy and then paste.
Best to follow ..exactly as I described...meaning..stay in polymode select in first ...hit w and select 2 vertices polys. Then convert to edge selection through selection drop down/convert to edge selection..
Then copy..not cut...and then paste.
PS. ..I assume you are doing this on a exported hair mesh from blender...and not something else?

Sensei
01-23-2018, 09:03 AM
PS. ..I assume you are doing this on a exported hair mesh from blender...and not something else?

ctrl-c and ctrl-v technique works with even plain box.


What is assigned in the your keys config on the combination Ctrl-C/V?

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=139683&d=1516722972
139683
CopyEdges is command from EdgePack.

It is not working in default LW v11.0.3. But EdgePack exists in LW v11.0.3.
If somebody is using older LW, he/she can Edit > Edit Keyboard and change Ctrl-C from "Copy" to "CopyEdges", and trick will be working in older LW also. I just tried, and it works.

OFF
01-23-2018, 09:32 AM
hmm, edge pack.. thanks! will try..

prometheus
01-23-2018, 11:28 AM
ctrl-c and ctrl-v technique works with even plain box.



http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=139683&d=1516722972
139683
CopyEdges is command from EdgePack.

It is not working in default LW v11.0.3. But EdgePack exists in LW v11.0.3.
If somebody is using older LW, he/she can Edit > Edit Keyboard and change Ctrl-C from "Copy" to "CopyEdges", and trick will be working in older LW also. I just tried, and it works.


Not sure if edge pack now is a part of lightwave 2018, but I havenīt installed anyone.
I just got a flashback regarding hair and sensei, just recalling the hair tools you made for lightwave:D did you loose all the hair tools at a certain age? :D

Sensei
01-23-2018, 11:51 AM
Not sure if edge pack now is a part of lightwave 2018, but I havenīt installed anyone.

Yes, it's part of LW 2018 Modeler.

genesis1
01-30-2018, 09:10 AM
Yep....that works. Still not getting the hair styling I want in LW though. Is there a way of fading just the edges of the hair or clumping just the tips. I end up with kind of square edges of hair rather than like tapered clumps at the end if that makes sense?

prometheus
01-30-2018, 09:23 AM
Yep....that works. Still not getting the hair styling I want in LW though. Is there a way of fading just the edges of the hair or clumping just the tips. I end up with kind of square edges of hair rather than like tapered clumps at the end if that makes sense?

fiber thickness, add a gradient like v-fiber, it will taper the hair tips, but a bit tricky to get right, set initial gradient marker to very low, or you will get hair all over the screen.

Kryslin
01-30-2018, 09:40 AM
When Prometheus is saying very low, he isn't kidding. We are talking microns here, with the average human hair being 100 um (0.0001 Meters, 100 micrometers) in diameter.

It'd be easier to set up using nodes (Gradient as a percentage, then multiplied by the diameter, then plugged into a "Fiber Width" input, but the node editor in FFX has been removed.

I wonder if such an operation can be done in the layer system...?

prometheus
01-30-2018, 10:32 AM
When Prometheus is saying very low, he isn't kidding. We are talking microns here, with the average human hair being 100 um (0.0001 Meters, 100 micrometers) in diameter.

It'd be easier to set up using nodes (Gradient as a percentage, then multiplied by the diameter, then plugged into a "Fiber Width" input, but the node editor in FFX has been removed.

I wonder if such an operation can be done in the layer system...?

quick testing, adding a node editor procedural texture ..and looking for fiberfx nodes, fiber info is there, but I do not get anything to work there.
Itīs very odd, I was complaining of the change of workflow for volumetrics, where it is required to now enter node editor, just to add a hypertexture, and here it is the opposite, they have removed node editor and makes it simpler..but lack the flexibility to do more advanced stuff, why can we just not have it All?..so much of inconsistency in the Lighwave workflow now.