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View Full Version : Volumetric presets: scale considerations: document feature request



jeric_synergy
12-03-2017, 10:21 PM
I could have tagged this onto the "engine flare" thread, but thought it might be of general interest:

Usually when I add a volumetric light to a scene, all the geometry is already in place. Often as not, using the presets results in no visible effect. My assumption is that the scale of the volumetric effect is such that it just isn't visible/noticable in my scene (although they are generally pretty much RW in scale).

AND, because of the very many (and mysterious) permutations available in the volumetric panel, one can waste a lot of time dickin' around trying to make a given effect (which looks so saWEEET in the thumbnail) work, or even show up, in the scene. YMMV.

How to people address this? Do they make a 'sampler' that says at what scale various Volumetric FX work?

BTW, I notice the bottom of the Presets (VLight Preset) panel there's a text field that shows a string that is different from the name of the preset. Where is this string established when a user makes a preset of their own?

(Without looking at the dox, the procedure for making a new library/new preset is not exactly intuitive.)

prometheus
12-04-2017, 08:35 AM
Use the old viper previewer ..not VPR, and from there you can click on the add preset button, viper also presents the preset better(point lights anyway) since the presets were made from that, and not the VPR.
unfortunately, the presets only contains the volumetric information, not which type of light it is and not rotation etc.
Viper disregards the cam as opposed to VPR, while VPR is really depending on perspective or camera view, thus the volumetric scale is better represented in viper.

Itīs weird that the new VPR didnīt get any implementation of adding presets, for neither hypervoxels or volumetric lights, and yes..the presets shows itīs age, I would be fine if presets are intimately connectied to the light type it is created with, meaning being able to load that type of light and maintain rotation settings as well, though that may cause issues if you do not want lights to change rotation etc.

MonroePoteet
12-04-2017, 01:08 PM
To save presets, you can also press "s" in the Volumetric Properties window and it adds it to the current Custom shelf as unnamed. You then right-click, chose "Set Name" and enter the Name and Description, Description being the pop-up information at the bottom of the Preset panel as you mouse over presets. Note that the Built-in preset shelves are write-locked so you can't add your own presets, you have to set the shelf to the Custom=>Workspace library or one you create (right-click in the Preset window, Add Library).

For visibility, the "Cone Base" and "Height" (or just Radius for Point lights) in the Volumetric Properties panel define the range of the volumetric effect and is visible in the OGL preview as a white geometric shape depending on the Light type. Using Perspective view, zoom out until both the Light icon and the target geometry is visible, then use the "Cone Base" and "Height" sliders to adjust the containment cone as appropriate or adjust the location of the Light.

From my experimenting, it looks like the Presets don't overwrite the Cone Base and Height you set up beforehand.

I almost always start with Enable Texture, Procedural Texture of Smoky3, and Texture Only set to get the visibility "in range", and then adjust it to suite my needs from there.

mTp

jeric_synergy
12-04-2017, 01:55 PM
Re Libraries: I haven't found a setting yet that de-ghosts "Create Library", including "WorkSpace". They all seem to be locked.

I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm saying it's quite unintuitive.

++OK, after using the "S" preset making key (awful, and should be a g.d. button), a new Library was auto-created, ALSO named "Workspace" (also awful), and at that point "Create Libraries" was de-ghosted.

This is effing rubbish.

MonroePoteet
12-04-2017, 02:08 PM
Re Libraries: I haven't found a setting yet that de-ghosts "Create Library", including "WorkSpace". They all seem to be locked.

I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm saying it's quite unintuitive.

++OK, after using the "S" preset making key (awful, and should be a g.d. button), a new Library was auto-created, ALSO named "Workspace" (also awful), and at that point "Create Libraries" was de-ghosted.

This is effing rubbish.

Yeah, I had to go back to a 2013 forum thread to find out about the "s" to save the preset, and agreed it should be a button or a right-click context menu on the Volumetrics Properties panel. I think the Custom=>Workspace library is created by default (or maybe I created it a while ago and forgot!), and I was already working in the Custom=>Workspace library, so the Create Library was already de-ghosted.

Definitely worth a documentation update / explanation / clarification, IMO. And maybe a "Save Preset" button on the panel???

mTp

jeric_synergy
12-04-2017, 02:38 PM
and agreed it should be a button or a right-click context menu on the Volumetrics Properties panel.

YES!!!! --heck, it could be both. (See below.)

I think the Custom=>Workspace library is created by default (or maybe I created it a while ago and forgot!), and I was already working in the Custom=>Workspace library, so the Create Library was already de-ghosted.
On my system (W10), "Workspace" was one of the included, locked Libraries. After using "s", an auto-generated "Workspace" library was added, in addition to the existing one.


Definitely worth a documentation update / explanation / clarification, IMO. And maybe a "Save Preset" button on the panel???
mTp

Since I was just grading on "intuitiveness" (there's gotta be a better word)(ie, no doc critique), and assuming that's how it's supposed to work (I realize OSs are complex) my take is:


1) Auto-generated Libraries should not duplicate built-in and locked Library names. What's the point? It's just confusing. "Custom" would be better.

2) Why is "Create Library" EVER ghosted? There's no reason.

3) While "Copy (preset) To...." is okay, maybe even convenient, this IMO shows a lack of commitment to the "copy & paste" paradigm that is, and should be, almost universal in UI. That's OK, there can be 2 ways of doing things, even THREE!, but one way should always be "Copy/Paste". Philosophically, I don't like it NOT being an option at all, and it seems kinda foolish. For instance, if "COPY" were an option, settings could be copied directly to a new light (vs copying the light). --It's just not smart to not implement it.

3b) Really, several panels would benefit from a global, panel-inclusive "COPY" function. Why not? Duplicating an item just to copy the settings is ridiculous.


On the plus side:

1) I like the little padlock-- clear and simple. :thumbsup:
2) I see now, from your previous post, the "DESCRIPTION" field in the Set Name dialog. This is a possible area in which to include scaling information, e.g. "Works best at 10 meters". (A reminder to people that nodes and Surfaces have a similar description field at the bottom of their editor panels.)

On the bug side: I can easily get re-draw panel errors, when RMB menus tend to hang around when they should not. :thumbsdow