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Ma3rk
10-27-2017, 10:24 PM
I've been having some very annoying weirdness lately with an additional Additional tab that keeps getting created ion Layout. Simply looking at Edit Plug-ins & exiting reliably creates it. Fortunately, repeated viewings don't create even more.

After a bit of sleuthing, it seems that the items that are getting added are all Modeler Python scripts:
for example:

NewTek\LightWave_2015.3\support\plugins\scripts\Py thon\Modeler\CommandSequence\PRIS\addquad_test_pri s_ss.py

What might be causing this, particularly in Layout?

gar26lw
10-27-2017, 10:29 PM
maybe just move the plugins in the tab to some other tab and see if it stops

Greenlaw
10-27-2017, 11:58 PM
It happens sometimes when I add a plugin. I never thought about it being just Python scripts. Will pay attention to that and see it that's it. In my experience, I think I've mainly seen it in Modeler. Just delete the extra Additional tab.

Anyway, this bug started with the initial 2015 release. I don't think I saw it in LW 11.x.

I asked about this years ago but don't remember getting an answer. I'll ask again and mention this thread.

raw-m
10-28-2017, 03:21 AM
Is it a bug? I thought it was a feature for quickly finding the plugins you’d just loaded! I’ve found it useful for moving to locations in the UI I want them instead of being lost in the massive tedious list of obsolete stuff, then delete the Additional tab.

djwaterman
10-28-2017, 04:20 AM
I've has this problem as well. Once you realize this you can move the plugin to the place you want it and get rid of the additional additional tab that was created. But it's very annoying.

gar26lw
10-28-2017, 07:04 AM
i think its feature

Ma3rk
10-28-2017, 09:23 AM
Ya, I've seen it early on with 2015 but didn't think it was doing it when accessing the Edit Pug-ins panel. Guess I'll just have to ignore it for now & hope it gets resolved.

Greenlaw
10-28-2017, 11:36 AM
Is it a bug? I thought it was a feature for quickly finding the plugins you’d just loaded! I’ve found it useful for moving to locations in the UI I want them instead of being lost in the massive tedious list of obsolete stuff, then delete the Additional tab.

You might be right. I think it appears a bug because it creates an additional 'Additional' tab if you kept the previously created one. Maybe it adds a new one if you've modified the first one? Just a thought.

TBH, the behavior doesn't bother me like it did when I first saw it years ago.

Ma3rk
10-28-2017, 12:27 PM
Does anyone else have this happen simply by going to the Edit Plug-ins tab though?

Anyway, maybe it became suspicious 'cuz I was fiddling that & haven't recently. I did do a restore of my menu's recently as I noticed I was missing just the Modeler Tools items. Had the menu, just grayed buttons.

Greenlaw
10-28-2017, 12:36 PM
That sounds like either your the plugin configs or menu configs got corrupted. You may need to reload all your plugins and reset the Menus to Default ('Default' is the only option that's kept updated to lists all of the latest plugins, so it's the best place to start. The other options are dated...some of them are seriously dated.)

Or copy your custom configs from backups if you have them. (I make backups everytime I add a plugin or make a menu change.)

gerry_g
10-28-2017, 12:52 PM
No I put in custom configuration with every install I run and I habitually run into this on a Mac, seems every time you install a new plugin it gets placed in a new tab labled additional, maybe this is intentional cuz if load plugins is set to auto and you place new plugins in your directory you get a new additional menu next time you fire it up, ok so you have to consolidate and delete them but at least you can find them with zero effort.

Ma3rk
10-28-2017, 07:54 PM
That sounds like either your the plugin configs or menu configs got corrupted. You may need to reload all your plugins and reset the Menus to Default ('Default' is the only option that's kept updated to lists all of the latest plugins, so it's the best place to start. The other options are dated...some of them are seriously dated.)

Everything else seems to be stable & working it's just the quirk. Doesn't seem really worth the effort to redo everything menuwise just for that.

Greenlaw
10-28-2017, 08:35 PM
Ok, but I think the grayed out items means those plugins aren't being loaded.

Ma3rk
10-29-2017, 12:38 AM
Ok, but I think the grayed out items means those plugins aren't being loaded.

They were grayed, but not after i restored my saved menu cfg.

Greenlaw
10-29-2017, 01:23 AM
Ok, cool! Thanks for the info. :)

jeric_synergy
12-22-2017, 03:25 PM
Jumped over here from MY "Additional" thread, LWM-style.

One thing that's confusing to me: I have a "3rd Party" tab, and some headings in that tab that got disconnected from whatever plugins were under them. AFAIK, there's no entry that lists MISSING plugins/scripts, it just gets left blank. Is that correct, or is there an entry in the Menu cfg file, LW/LWM looks for it, and just doesn't populate the menu???

I'd prefer it display a ghosted version of the missing plugin's title, so there'd be a clue where to look if a heading suddenly becomes depopulated. :(

Ma3rk
12-22-2017, 04:30 PM
I don't recall ever having a "3rd Party" Tab. Only program that I use that has a Missing tab is After Effects. If you remove a plug I'm pretty sure it'll leave the Menu tab but empty.

Oh. And in Modeler, my Additional's are in a drop down type in a Plug-ins section in a Utilities Tab, that I think I created.

m.d.
12-22-2017, 05:00 PM
My additional tabs pop up in layout as well...usually full of every plugin and script installed

jeric_synergy
12-22-2017, 06:18 PM
I don't recall ever having a "3rd Party" Tab.
No, that was my personal creation. I leave the default menu structure in place to reduce confusion. Somewhat.

I >DO< like that you can have DUPLICATE menu entries, you're not constrained to have a choice in only one place. This is quite useful, I'm glad it wasn't coded out of existence.

Greenlaw
12-22-2017, 11:00 PM
Somebody mentioned that the mysterious Additional tab might be by design, and I'm starting to agree. It always pops up when new stuff is added, and I'm actually finding it helpful for finding the plugins to update my own custom menus. I just delete the Additional tab when I'm done dragging the plugins to my preferred menu location.

I haven't noticed this happening in 2018 though. So, if the Additional tab was an intentional feature, the developers may have changed their mind...maybe because of the complaints? (Me guilty about that, but I don't really feel strongly about it now.) :)

jeric_synergy
12-23-2017, 12:39 AM
Huh.....I always thought the Additional tab was auto-added when plugins were added, and that the massive proliferation of "Additional" tabs was due to the addition of the Auto-Scan feature and some bug in same.

It IS rather helpful in showing which plugins and scripts are unassigned (locations in the UI).

I'd also like the reverse as mentioned above: some indicator (ghosting is the logical choice) showing that a function was placed, but has gone missing.
+++++++

Mark mentioned that it's just the *.py scripts: since they are newISH, I wonder if they got left out of the checking routines that would prevent them from being added repeatedly.

gar26lw
12-23-2017, 01:44 AM
missing plugins highlighted in bright luminous pink perhaps?

Ma3rk
12-23-2017, 01:50 AM
Somebody mentioned that the mysterious Additional tab might be by design, and I'm starting to agree. It always pops up when new stuff is added, and I'm actually finding it helpful for finding the plugins to update my own custom menus. I just delete the Additional tab when I'm done dragging the plugins to my preferred menu location.

I haven't noticed this happening in 2018 though. So, if the Additional tab was an intentional feature, the developers may have changed their mind...maybe because of the complaints? (Me guilty about that, but I don't really feel strongly about it now.) :)

Well that's good to hear. If it's a "feature", it was exceptionally poor in being thought out frankly. As jeric_synergy mentioned in another thread, he ended up with 8 Additional tabs! If they'd named it something like "Newly Added", perhaps. Considering that it's intermittent and happens when simply opening the Plug-ins Panel, that's a big, wiggly bug.

While I've got your attention though & apparently have LW2018, would you mind testing a couple simple things?

1) If you do an F9 render and save off a file, does it save it with the chosen format? I.e., if you choose in the drop-down to save for example LW_Pshop32(PSD), does it actually add the proper extension? LW2015.3 for me anyway leaves that blank. Every version up to 11.6x did & I've been with LW since 4.x.

2) If you change the Auto Key option then save the Default.lws file then clear the scene, is that option set correctly? LW2015 ALWAYS reverts to All Channels where as every version up to 11.6x did.

jeric_synergy
12-23-2017, 12:02 PM
missing plugins highlighted in bright luminous pink perhaps?

Ahhh, you've seen my UI mockups then?

Rather than "Newly Added", I'd prefer, and I think it's a better nomenclature, "Un-Assigned". --I thought that was how it used to work.-- To me, that would serve as a reminder that certain plugins exist, but I never saw fit to put them somewhere specific (and maybe I should).

After Effects has a convention that the program, which TMK always auto-scans the plugin directory, does NOT examine Folders that are prefaced with "~" (the tilde). That allows the user to quarantine or sequester plugins BUT keep them in the Plugins Folder. LW might adopt the same convention, as it will be familiar to AE users and why not?

I suspect, on little evidence, that the proliferation of "Additional" tabs is an interaction between 1) the newishness of *.PY scripts, 2) auto-scanning of the plugin folder, and possibly 3) race-conditions between the time at which *.cfg files are saved and when they are updated, specifically when LWM crashes w/o updating the *.cfg files (which I believe is on exit, and I believe is inadequate).