PDA

View Full Version : Help with Noah's Ark



jimiclaybrooks
10-07-2017, 04:07 PM
This is a test render of the scene I'm working on. 138232 What I'd like to do is get some foam to "wake" around the ark, along with some displaced water splashing off the sides of the box. Of course, one of the problems is, the water isn't relatively flat like it is in most ocean scenes, so doing the wake, the splash and the foam is a bit of a challenge. Also, I wanted to get some water pouring off of the top of the box, but my transparency maps wouldn't work. Instead of the foamy water flowing down the sides of the boat, the polygons just disappeared. They're visible in open GL, and in modeler, but when I tried to render them it just didn't work, so the water here looks pretty corny right now. Don't know why they wouldn't work, but after three days I just gave up. I'll revisit that after I get something figured out with the water, since that's more important. Any criticisms or suggestions is more than welcome. Thanks PS. I'm also looking for ways to generate some foam and spray on the crests of the waves.

jimiclaybrooks
10-08-2017, 01:27 PM
some time ago cageman did a really nice tut on how to float your boat with Hot Ocean. I'm pretty sure the tut isn't online anymore, but just to be sure, does anyone know if its still out there? thanks
I found this link to a webpage that says, the video is archived by newtek:
ftp://ftp.newtek.com/multimedia/movies/Wakes/
when I try and open the file, it says "video format or MIME is not supported". Does that mean the video is there or is it really gone?

jimiclaybrooks
10-08-2017, 04:27 PM
I FOUND IT!!!!!!!!! Thought about an old external HD that I have, and whaddaya know!! I found all the old tutorials! SPFloater using Nodes, pts one, two, and three. So I'm off to the races. Lets see what we can cook up.

MonroePoteet
10-08-2017, 04:58 PM
Hey Jimi,

I'd hoped some more expert member would reply, but here we go:

Fluid dynamics (e.g. water sloshing around, splashes, foam, etc.) is one of the really tough 3D simulations to accomplish. VERY expensive in terms of computation costs and simulation. If you want photo-realism, I think you're going to need to purchase a fluid-simulation package, such as as RealFlow.

BY FAR (correct me if I'm wrong, you other forum members), your easiest, cheapest solution is to settle on a NON-photo-realistic production design. Tell your story, but don't try to pretend it's photo-realistic.

My favorite example is the 2nd or 3rd scene from "The Iron Giant", where a fisherman is caught in a storm off the coast of (U.S. state) Maine, and runs into a giant robot (or is it a lighthouse?). There's NO photo-realism about the shot, but it TELLS THE STORY!

By settling on a non-photo-realistic production design, you ease many aspects of your animation, including substantially reducing the requirement on the fluid-dynamics.

mTp

shrox
10-08-2017, 07:09 PM
Neat. I've seen squared off versions of the ark in studies, the design seems most stable in high waves.

Gungho3D
10-08-2017, 08:40 PM
What I'd like to do is:
1. ... get some foam to "wake" around the ark,
2. ... along with some displaced water splashing off the sides of the box.
3. ... get some water pouring off of the top of the box

Like mTp said:
1. Know what you're up against technically and computationally, and be aware software-wise what the likely tools are (e.g. RealFlow) ... if you are gunning for photo-realism
2. His advice is to consider dialing back from photo-realism to something much more manageable / semi-cell shaded

What is not clear in your original post is
1. Are you looking to create a single image render?
2. Or maybe a series of renders, like multiple angle snapshots of a single "moment in time"?
3. Or are you aiming at an end result which is fully dynamic, able to animated

jimiclaybrooks
10-09-2017, 04:16 AM
Monroe:
yeah, I saw what Phoenix FD can do. Millions of polygons! But its really realistic. I don't think thats an option. But... Steve Worley's plagins come to mind, if I can justify coming up with the cash to buy them. I have a "style" that has already been set, so there's no going back now. I will have to be reasonably realistic. So I'm hopeful something can be done.
shrox:
The word "tebath" in Gen 6:14 can be literally translated as "box", which is what Moses' mother put in the Nile River. Its also the word that is used to describe the "ark of the covenant" that was placed inside the Most Holy Place of the
Tabernacle. Interesting, huh?
Gungho 3D:
"What is not clear in your original post is
1. Are you looking to create a single image render?
2. Or maybe a series of renders, like multiple angle snapshots of a single "moment in time"?
3. Or are you aiming at an end result which is fully dynamic, able to animated
Well, I think from the image that I posted, you can see that the scene is pretty realistic so far. The scene itself is 8 seconds, so its quite long. I think it'll need to be dynamic, but if I have to manually do this, so be it. Just so long as I get it done.

Gungho3D
10-09-2017, 06:48 PM
Gungho 3D:
"What is not clear in your original post is
1. Are you looking to create a single image render?
2. Or maybe a series of renders, like multiple angle snapshots of a single "moment in time"?
3. Or are you aiming at an end result which is fully dynamic, able to animated

Well, I think from the image that I posted, you can see that the scene is pretty realistic so far. The scene itself is 8 seconds, so its quite long. I think it'll need to be dynamic, but if I have to manually do this, so be it. Just so long as I get it done.

Ok, looks like you have a handle on where you want this scene to go visually ...

As I'm looking at the scene, the scale of the Ark may dictate that you adjust (reduce) the size of your waves relative to the Ark - the sea state seems a little excessive.

wingzeta
10-09-2017, 09:11 PM
He doesn't explain the technique, but he gives some insight into doing this with HOT Ocean toolkit free plugin in LW. He is using Octane, but you might be able to figure out a way to recreate the technique with LW nodes. Check it out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnPqfdNpTOU&index=2&list=PLjJ6WwiAQ0wrtpSWyxb4OuxZpDram2GQg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LyHf8qulVw&list=PLjJ6WwiAQ0wrtpSWyxb4OuxZpDram2GQg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yD8iAI-2UM

wingzeta
10-09-2017, 09:16 PM
Also to control the boat

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1StTLCbv2Yk&index=8&list=PLjJ6WwiAQ0wrtpSWyxb4OuxZpDram2GQg

Clipping path
10-23-2017, 07:32 AM
Great work! don't give up or stop, go ahead and achieve success.

jimiclaybrooks
10-24-2017, 06:18 PM
138370 I've spent days trying to understand the node system in Hot Ocean, but I haven't gotten very far. I guess I just need more time. Anyway, I"ve tried to fix this stripe thats spread across the water, but I haven't been able to do so.
Can anyone tell me, what is this and why is it doing this? How can I get rid of it? This is the default Ocean scene that comes with the download. Thanks

wingzeta
10-24-2017, 07:08 PM
138370 I've spent days trying to understand the node system in Hot Ocean, but I haven't gotten very far. I guess I just need more time. Anyway, I"ve tried to fix this stripe thats spread across the water, but I haven't been able to do so.
Can anyone tell me, what is this and why is it doing this? How can I get rid of it? This is the default Ocean scene that comes with the download. Thanks

Just a guess, but it looks like as if a texture isn't tiling correctly.

jimiclaybrooks
10-24-2017, 08:41 PM
Ok, but I'm not at all sure how to fix it. If that's the case,then its just repeating itself on one axis. Right?

jeric_synergy
10-24-2017, 08:58 PM
138370 I've spent days trying to understand the node system in Hot Ocean, but I haven't gotten very far. I guess I just need more time. Anyway, I"ve tried to fix this stripe thats spread across the water, but I haven't been able to do so.
Can anyone tell me, what is this and why is it doing this? How can I get rid of it? This is the default Ocean scene that comes with the download. Thanks

Not familiar with HOT, but: are there images involved? If it's a tiling issue, there might be a one-pixel border on an image.

jimiclaybrooks
10-24-2017, 09:03 PM
I don't think so. The foam is procedurally generated.

jeric_synergy
10-24-2017, 11:12 PM
Well, FWIW, maybe backing out to a very wide shot will reveal a pattern and hence the issue.

Gungho3D
10-25-2017, 09:24 PM
138370 I've spent days trying to understand the node system in Hot Ocean, but I haven't gotten very far. I guess I just need more time. Anyway, I"ve tried to fix this stripe thats spread across the water, but I haven't been able to do so.
Can anyone tell me, what is this and why is it doing this? How can I get rid of it? This is the default Ocean scene that comes with the download. Thanks

My recommend: rip out everything (anything you've added) from that scene so that it is just the bare bones ocean only (BUT still with problem seam) ...

... push the resulting minimalist scene to this forum so others can help by looking at the problem directly. It may save you some more wasted days ...

jimiclaybrooks
10-28-2017, 08:20 AM
Sorry for the delay in responding, had to take wifey to the hospital. Thanks for the offer to help with this. I do appreciate it. Here's the ocean scene, with the foam anomaly. Maybe you guys can figure this out.

MonroePoteet
11-01-2017, 04:00 PM
It appears the wide white stripes along the edges of the ocean geometry are caused by the top (of three) HOT Ocean node's Resolution being set to 1. Setting it to 6 or 8 eliminates them.

The dark single-pixel edge is due to the transition between your "close" ocean geometry and the "distant" ocean geometry. You might be able to apply an Image-based transparency map to the "close" ocean geometry to make the edges vanish smoothly, showing the "distant" ocean through. Use an image similar to this one on the Transparency channel with Automatic Sizing on the "close" ocean. You'll probably also need an inverted version of the same mapped image on channels like Reflection and Specularity.

138433

Good luck!
mTp

jimiclaybrooks
11-01-2017, 08:47 PM
Thanks Monroe, this will be a great help to me, and I appreciate it.