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View Full Version : Terragen 4.1 update release, faster preview RTP window etc..



prometheus
07-30-2017, 12:37 PM
There is a new Terragen 4.1 update release out now, just installed the free version and I am in the process of comparing agains the 4.0 release.

yep..the previewer is a bit faster now in the RTP mode, there was much talked about that in the 4.0 version..but at that time I still thought it was a bit slow, now it seems to be quite a bit faster, both versions tested on my new asus rog system, final render seems much faster too, so this time they really have worked on improving that it seems.

And the cloud renders are way superior to those of vue, the edge softness the actual density fractals and also the scattering and shading within clouds, along with the actual sky and sunligh models, I wish they could work a bit more on the interface though, and some terrain sculpting tools ala vue.

But if I would go for the best cloudy cgi skies, this would be it, unless doing some hero clouds or such which would require fluids ala turbulenceFD or blenders fluid smoke.

http://planetside.co.uk/change-logs/terragen-4-1-11-release-change-log/?utm_source=Terragen+Monthly+News&utm_campaign=041b3ce22f-&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_ece86fd3b4-041b3ce22f-420009297&mc_cid=041b3ce22f&mc_eid=d383f29d4d

Marander
07-30-2017, 02:01 PM
There is a new Terragen 4.1 update release out now, just installed the free version and I am in the process of comparing agains the 4.0 release.


Yes, caught my attention too.

Terragen looks more and more tempting, I just don't see the UI / Node based workflow so intuitive as in Vue (as you noticed too). But what I find positive is that recent Terragen improvements go in the right direction (what I'm missing in Vue for the last couple of updates). On the other hand I know Vue and WM quite well now and to start with another application requires much time again. There is still much to discover and experiment with the Vue metanodes.

For me it's only the Terragen Professional version that would be interesting, the smaller version doesn't offer many workflow features like Render Layers and Elements, FBX import/export, EXR support, Spherical Camera etc.

I'm currently testing Vray Volumetrics for clouds and will also try TFD clouds (frozen / slowed down TFD simulation). Both render quite fast and I think cloud flythroughs can be done without significant performance impact.

prometheus
07-30-2017, 02:39 PM
yep..I can get cloud shapes very nice in turbulenceFD since I know how to tweak the noise and fractals pretty good now, though I need to verify it on larger scales which also means completly different settings in the surface texture scale, what I usually do is to emitt the fluids from a surface procedural texture, in the emitter tab, and also use another fractal layer with maye subtractive or difference layer mode, that will result in the cloud density raising in not equal layers, just as clouds have variations on the heigh, and I got me a good setup for setting opacity shading nicely as well, slight vorticity is also almost necessary.

The issue I see when trying to tweak, that is no multiscattering response in VPR, I hope that can change for the next lightwave as the render should be the same, and the illuminate smoke is still quite slow in turbulence, and that is where the real realism kicks in for proper lighting.

You donīt have to go with the minus frame render and zero frame stepping.
the workflow of simply running a simulation, then check wich frame or frames look good, then do other simulations and do the same, then go in to those cache folders and and reload various cache files on separate new containers to have some nice cloud variation samples, and only save the specific frames that you think look good, keeping full simulations will surely need some hard drive space.
first tries some weeks ago, I will get back with terragen samples later perhaps to be on topic

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=137526&d=1501446993
http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=137525&d=1501446963

137525

137526

Marander
07-30-2017, 02:49 PM
Yep looking forward to your results. The advantage of TFD is that you can easily integrate into the host application / existing LW / C4D scene without the need of compositing. I'm quite happy with the TFD quality and speed.

prometheus
07-30-2017, 03:25 PM
Yep looking forward to your results. The advantage of TFD is that you can easily integrate into the host application / existing LW / C4D scene without the need of compositing. I'm quite happy with the TFD quality and speed.

There is however so many unanswered questions and a couple of features that I do not get any answers on, I can also not use the firelight, it crashes in tfd, while I think it has great simulation speed and a nice way to deal with shaders, it has some flaws I do not like, like I can not see both fire and smoke shader in viewport at the same time, both blender and houdini does, I can not use weight emission for the fluids, in blender I can just paint on a cloth object or a tree or ground that has enough divisions for it, then set it to emitt from that painted vertex group.

and there is more I wonīt go in to there, so I am not sure how much time I will spend on tfd until that is answered on jawset forums, otherwise I might continue with blenders fire and smoke, need to try the same approach for clouds though.

Terragen just crashed on me though..

prometheus
07-31-2017, 12:26 PM
regarding the rtp previewer in terragen 4.1, One has to frequently switch back and forth, One need to generate the terrain at desired level and then the previewer may work properly to render it, so sometimes when tweaking the clouds, lighting and atmosphere, you may have to go back to terrain editor and render that with rtp unchecked the restart it, so this is a bit cumbersome for now, but then are working on it.
http://www.planetside.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,21730.0.html

I also do not like that sun glow renders in front of the clouds not behind in the rtp previewer, I think you can turn that off but only for final renders and not in the previewer.

I also find that the previewer doesnīt always match the final renders in colors.

prometheus
08-02-2017, 10:10 AM
Some things I am not pleased with, changing camera lens, is something the previewer doesnīt respect it seems, so itīs hard to get what you see in the previewer, or one need to find the best match that matches the render, which may be the default setting.

And the color is quite different as seen in this sample, I need to track that down..if it is tonemapping or something that kicks in, though based on a default scene where I havenīt made any changes on that..so it is odd, some images from default settings seems to be the same as the previewer, but if you change to much in the atmosphere settings, it seems it doesnīt maintain consistency to match the previewers rendered image..

5 minutes for that render, though it needs to go up in resolution and quality ofcourse...so will the rendertimes.

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=137556&d=1501690149

lucbianco
08-05-2017, 01:54 AM
Terragen is very powerful software but with its own philosophy and learning curve.... it is why I have created a online store (https://www.lucbianco.fr/store) with presets and scenes among all materials I have created for few years.

It is a good starting point to use Terragen

luc bianco
(https://www.lucbianco.fr)

Yes, caught my attention too.

Terragen looks more and more tempting, I just don't see the UI / Node based workflow so intuitive as in Vue ...

prometheus
08-05-2017, 03:44 AM
Terragen is very powerful software but with its own philosophy and learning curve.... it is why I have created a online store (https://www.lucbianco.fr/store) with presets and scenes among all materials I have created for few years.

It is a good starting point to use Terragen

luc bianco
(https://www.lucbianco.fr)


Thanks Luc, and welcome to the forums with admiration, your stuff is some of the great ones.

Personally I would really like to build my own stuff almost from scratch and not relying on cloud presets too much, or should I say, the UI workflow shouldnīt have to rely on Masters that created preset to overcome bad UI.
so as for what marander referenced, working in vue is Way easier and initiuve than Terragen in my opinion, then again it canīt beat terragen clouds.

For those with immediate need of great backgrounds... or scenery needed for a project or film or something, your presets must be great, but those who know they have it in their mind to be able to create great clouds and scenery, but is a bit in the bottleneck due to the workflow, might not be so attractive to pay up for something they probably can do should be able to do ..with some more effort from themself or from the developers of terragen improving it.

That said, thanks for sharing your resources Luc, will take a look at it anyway.

Keep an eye on Lightwave next..(if you can find it) and the next version of volumetrics that may be great for hero clouds and fly throughs in a different way than using terragen.
Also...turbulenceFD is interesting for cloud generation based on pretty much realistic dynamic equations close to naturally formed clouds, mostly useful for fly throughs or effects in the clouds or hero clouds though, and the more complex advanced interaction between light and shadow scattering canīt compare to terragen though.

m.d.
08-08-2017, 09:46 PM
turbulence clouds with octane scattering is way superior to LW native + TFD multiscattering. Way more control and iterative possibilities.

Interesting of note...Terragen has listened and are looking into vdb export. As many have noted...their procedural (fractal) cloud gen is even ahead of houdini. Dynamic or hero clouds is another matter....

prometheus
08-09-2017, 10:03 AM
turbulence clouds with octane scattering is way superior to LW native + TFD multiscattering. Way more control and iterative possibilities.

Interesting of note...Terragen has listened and are looking into vdb export. As many have noted...their procedural (fractal) cloud gen is even ahead of houdini. Dynamic or hero clouds is another matter....

Terragen and OpeVDB, yeah..I have thought that would be nice, so I need to keep an eye on what happens there.

In way do you mean their procedural cloud is way ahead, do you mean just the type of noise fractal, or do you mean the option of applying infinite cloud layers, or do you mean internal cloud shadowing..or pure speed?

as for tfd and octane, interesting..do you by any chance know if itīs possible to try octane demo with TFD demo to see how that may work?

m.d.
08-09-2017, 11:13 AM
Terragen and OpeVDB, yeah..I have thought that would be nice, so I need to keep an eye on what happens there.

In way do you mean their procedural cloud is way ahead, do you mean just the type of noise fractal, or do you mean the option of applying infinite cloud layers, or do you mean internal cloud shadowing..or pure speed?

as for tfd and octane, interesting..do you by any chance know if itīs possible to try octane demo with TFD demo to see how that may work?

I think I just mean the fractals...definitely not speed.
But for just clicking and getting something pretty good...TG is king, and it has tons of control....but it's buried deep.
I suspect in the right hands, Houdini would be better though.....but it would take work.

As far as the demo's....I dont know as I own both....its more Octanes advantage than TFD. The shading and scattering is so simple and fast.
TFD would just be used as the cloud generator.

prometheus
08-09-2017, 12:16 PM
I think I just mean the fractals...definitely not speed.
But for just clicking and getting something pretty good...TG is king, and it has tons of control....but it's buried deep.
I suspect in the right hands, Houdini would be better though.....but it would take work.

As far as the demo's....I dont know as I own both....its more Octanes advantage than TFD. The shading and scattering is so simple and fast.
TFD would just be used as the cloud generator.

I have tried houdini cloudFX some time ago, but I am not sure..and I am bit dubious when you say the fractals would be the issue..maybe for some feathering stuff or for billowing stuff, but as you said, I think it can in the right hands make good procedural clouds as well if you use cloudfx, I would think it is rather the lighting and shading model where terragen excels in regards to houdini ..and also in mind with the interaction with a sky model.

As for the demos, well..I got tfd demo installed, so I guess I just have to install the octane demo and see if those work together.

I also need to install houdini apprentice again, maybe this weekend, I had issues with the later builds on my win7 system before, but got me a new system to try out the houdini cloudfx with, still have to dig in to blenders smoke for evaluating that VS turbulenceFD.