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View Full Version : New computer Gtx 1080 VS 1070?



prometheus
06-29-2017, 06:03 PM
Not sure how outdated the 1079 is, I found two stationary models that are of interest, might book them tomorrow.

ASUS ROG G20CI It has the 1070 gtx nvidia card, 32 gb mem and upgradable memory option, seem to have better processor,( i7-7700 3.6 GHz) then we got the other on which is a bit more expensive..
ASUS ROG G20CB It has the 1080 gtx nvidia card, but no option to upgrade memory 32 gb processor ( I7-6700 3.4 GHz)

price for the G20CI..around 2340 usd
price forg the G20CB ..arouond 2808 usd

my first instinct is to ge with the 1080 card though, I suspect the difference between the two graphics card are much bigger than the difference in cpu speed?
Any advice on what you would go for...or someother recommended pre-package, except for building your own..I donīt got time for that.

hereīs the data on the two models..
https://www.dustinhome.se/product/5011002883/rog-g20ci
https://www.dustinhome.se/product/5011026901/rog-g20cb

New chemical taxes on electronics will probably be introduced after tomorrow, so the pricing is suspected to raise a lot for computers, so I am thankful If I can get fast insight.

Planned applications, Lightwave, blender, houdini, daz3d (iray rendering), photoshop, after effects and presumable a lot that deals with gpu rendering and simulation, gpu fractals like fractron 9000 etc.
Cheers.

Marander
06-30-2017, 12:04 AM
The 1070 is not outdated, just a model lower than the 1080. Both are good options but for GPU / CUDA based stuff (TFD, iRay, Cycles) of course the 1080 is much faster). In LW itself you will probably not see a difference. Maybe an option is to go with 1x 1070 and later add another one (if the PSU is strong enough and cooling allows it).

I would suggest you have a look at a different motherboard. 32 GB can be limiting, specially if you want to work with displacements. Therefore I chose the ASUS X99 motherboard line which has 8 RAM slots and I went with 64 GB DDR4 from beginning with a Hexacore CPU (which is also not supported on many other mainboards but works well on the X99). Runs fine constantly at with 12 Threads at 4.2 GHz.


https://www.asus.com/us/site/motherboards/X99/

By the way I would have the RAM maxed out from beginning (32 or 64 GB) as one RAM Kit because adding RAM can really make the system unstable. I have 2x 16 GB DDR3 Kit laying around (it's even the same brand and model but one bought a little bit later) which I cannot use together and had to buy another 32 GB Kit for an older i7 to have the system stable. This is all due to the auto tuning of the BIOS which sometimes doesn't get the RAM timings right. It can be tweaked manually but in this case I was not successful (it works perfect with the new Kit).

Since many years I exclusively use Intel based machines, but you should also have a look at the new AMD hardware where you can get a 8 or 10 core maybe for a similar price. Note that AMD Pro Render is now available for Blender which should run great on AMD / OpenCL GPUs. However (if at all), I would only consider AMD CPU but NVidia GPUs because of CUDA support. But I believe AMD GPUs are also having a revival because the next iMac Pro has the 580 inside and AMD Pro Render is supported in a lot of new or upcoming software.

rustythe1
06-30-2017, 01:15 AM
the new core x series 8 chips have just come out too with a large price drop too, they also have shown a 30% increase in performance over previous chips, you will be far better off getting one of these, the Intel Core i7 7800X is about the same price as the 7700 here in the uk, but its a 6 core 12 thread and early benchmarks put it above the ryzen 1700, it also clocks much higher,
you say i7 7700, if its just the 7700 and not the 7700k then you wont be able to overclock much, so for an extra Ģ20 that's a lot of extra power,
Ģ323 Intel Core i7 7700, S 1151, Kaby Lake, Quad Core, 8 Thread, 3.6GHz, 4.2GHz Turbo, 8MB Cache, 1150MHz GPU, 65W
Ģ359 Intel Core i7 7800X, S 2066, Skylake-X, 6 Core, 12 Thread, 3.5GHz, 4.0GHz Turbo, 8.25MB, 28 Lane, 140W
prices on scan

rustythe1
06-30-2017, 01:36 AM
also you can save a lot of money at places like scan, they will do processor/motherboard/memory for you as a pre build, then you can use an old case/hdd/psu/gpu I paid Ģ1500 for my 5960x pc, at the moment its nearly a $ to Ģ so 2340$ seems a bit steep to me

prometheus
06-30-2017, 05:16 AM
In LW itself you will probably not see a difference. Maybe an option is to go with 1x 1070 and later add another one (if the PSU is strong enough and cooling allows it).


turbulenceFD will definetely take use of it, so that means lightwave difference as well.

Not sure I will have the time to make any s pecial builds, and I will not have the time to investigate a special build either as rustythe1 suggest..donīt think, so...I am a bit late now and may need to order today before the taxes increases tommorrow, so not much room to look for special build by something I suggest, I would need to look further in to that more than a day in such case, so it leans on that G20CB package.
Thank you very much both you guys for the advices.

rustythe1
06-30-2017, 06:36 AM
no offence, but why would you buy an old 7700 pc when you can buy a water cooled 7800 x that has 45% more power for the same price pre built? at current exchange rate this https://www.scan.co.uk/3xs/configurator/overclocked-custom-gaming-pc-uk-intel-carbon is $2300 (Ģ1800) clocked to 4.4ghz

prometheus
06-30-2017, 07:48 AM
no offence, but why would you buy an old 7700 pc when you can buy a water cooled 7800 x that has 45% more power for the same price pre built? at current exchange rate this https://www.scan.co.uk/3xs/configurator/overclocked-custom-gaming-pc-uk-intel-carbon is $2300 (Ģ1800) clocked to 4.4ghz

Iīs a 1070 gtx card, I want the 1080
that prebuild only got 16 gb ram as well, and the price..well if you add more ram that would soon equal the pricing I have on the more expensive package I suggested.

ActionBob
06-30-2017, 09:04 AM
If the 1080ti were an option, that would be the clear choice, given that the extra you pay would be well worth it.

-Adrian

Marander
06-30-2017, 10:27 AM
Iīs a 1070 gtx card, I want the 1080
that prebuild only got 16 gb ram as well, and the price..well if you add more ram that would soon equal the pricing I have on the more expensive package I suggested.

- 32 GB should be the minimum configuration
- i7 67xx vs 77xx is not a big performance difference. I even heard that for some tasks the kaby lake / 7xxx is slower in rendering but don't nail me on that one. If I recall correctly the AFX2 performance is slightly slower (which is used by Vue for example). I would go for the 6700 if there is 32GB and a 1080.
- If you intend to use Cycles / Pro Render in Blender in future, the 1080 would be a good option. For LW there will be no improvement and for TFD there is not much difference also because for large / complex simulations you will run out of GPU memory anyway (TFD will fail back on CPU simulation).

Both are average gamer machines but certainly capable for many 3D tasks. I would just make sure you get 32 GB min., i7 4/5/6/7 generation doesn't matter that much.

Even though I have assembled all my PCs myself since the 386 age, I understand if your decision to buy a complete machine. From a warranty / repair point-of-view you are on the safer side.

erikals
06-30-2017, 11:07 AM
i'd go with the 1070, not that much difference anyway.

save the cash, wait 5+ years, then use that money on a new card, or something else.

think of it this way,
1070 will render 1900 voxels in X time
1080 will render 2560 voxels in X time

(roughly) you pay 4000 extra for 660 voxels.

an alternative? > buy the 1070 and add an extra 1070 (totals 3800 voxels) ...if the power source can handle it.

Marander
06-30-2017, 12:16 PM
i'd go with the 1070, not that much difference anyway.

save the cash, wait 5+ years, then use that money on a new card, or something else.

think of it this way,
1070 will render 1900 voxels in X time
1080 will render 2560 voxels in X time

(roughly) you pay 4000 extra for 660 voxels.

an alternative? > buy the 1070 and add an extra 1070 (totals 3800 voxels) ...if the power source can handle it.

Yes I second that, good thought. My advise: Go for the i7 6700, 32GB and Nvidia 1070, SSD of course, it will be a good machine. Maybe you will have some extra cash left for a new or second screen. Or TFD :D Or LW Upgrade :D

erikals
06-30-2017, 12:24 PM
always go for the next best, the best will be way overpriced and old in a year anyway.

i dread all the cash i wasted on "the best" as a young man.  [agh] :)

prometheus
06-30-2017, 01:28 PM
i'd go with the 1070, not that much difference anyway.

save the cash, wait 5+ years, then use that money on a new card, or something else.

think of it this way,
1070 will render 1900 voxels in X time
1080 will render 2560 voxels in X time

(roughly) you pay 4000 extra for 660 voxels.

an alternative? > buy the 1070 and add an extra 1070 (totals 3800 voxels) ...if the power source can handle it.

Perhaps...itīs to late though, I ordered the 1080, had to order today so it was only a few hours left, and I do not go for waiting 5 + years, at that time I will be 57.
Thought that I think the newer graphics card is more valuable for me, so thatīs how it goes, thank you very much for all your sugggestions though guys. :)

If it werenīt for those taxes raising up tommorrow, then I may have taken a second thought, but I am glad itīs on itīs way now, so a couple of days and then off to installin stuff etc...and will see how it works with windows 10 as well.

just installed daz3d 4,9 with iray a couple of days ago, so itīs gonna be interesting to see which boost I can get on that, it has both cpu and gpu option in the interactive viewport, it works quite decently with my crappy laptop when it iterates for some things like changing sundial, but as soon as you try and rotate or switch to other tabs or simply trying to initialize it, it takes too long time.
Iray sunsky is great in quality though, much better than sunsky in lightwave.
Michael

erikals
06-30-2017, 02:01 PM
well, good thing is that now you have a kick-a** PC that will last a loong time. :)

Congratulations, looking forward to seeing some renders. :king:

sorry to hear about the tax, hope it didn't raise too much. over here it's 25%... that's more than enough.

-------


so itīs gonna be interesting to see which boost I can get on that,
think you'll see a Massive boost   :)

ActionBob
06-30-2017, 02:34 PM
Congratulations, that 1080 will serve you well. You will not be disappointed.

-Adrian

Danner
06-30-2017, 03:00 PM
At first glance the Nvidia naming scheme is very confusing. You would think a 1060 would be faster than a 980, but it's not. The way it works is that the first number is the "series" or generation and the second number is the tier. So if your card ends with 50 or 60 it's a low end card, no matter the generation. If ends with "80 ti" it's the highest numbered tier you can buy. But just to confuse you a little they added the Titan series which are a step above all the numbered tiers for that generation.

Marander
06-30-2017, 03:47 PM
Congrats on your new machine! Yes, iRay runs very fast on this machine for sure, I'm using iRay in DAZ and Substance alot as well. Win10 works very well too for me, but I would suggest you check if there's a cheap upgrade from Home to Pro (I think only Home is included).

So what's the final specs for the machine, i7 6700 with GF1080, 16 or 32 GB and with M2 SSD?

Edit: I'm taking back the 'average gamer machine', that doesn't fit, it's actually a hell of a gamer machine (just checked the website). Nice!

prometheus
06-30-2017, 04:45 PM
At first glance the Nvidia naming scheme is very confusing. You would think a 1060 would be faster than a 980, but it's not. The way it works is that the first number is the "series" or generation and the second number is the tier. So if your card ends with 50 or 60 it's a low end card, no matter the generation. If ends with "80 ti" it's the highest numbered tier you can buy. But just to confuse you a little they added the Titan series which are a step above all the numbered tiers for that generation.

Titan was in the thoughts initially, but I came across reviews that says 1080 gtx actually beats 1080 titan in some areas.

prometheus
07-02-2017, 06:51 PM
Congrats on your new machine! Yes, iRay runs very fast on this machine for sure, I'm using iRay in DAZ and Substance alot as well. Win10 works very well too for me, but I would suggest you check if there's a cheap upgrade from Home to Pro (I think only Home is included).

So what's the final specs for the machine, i7 6700 with GF1080, 16 or 32 GB and with M2 SSD?

Edit: I'm taking back the 'average gamer machine', that doesn't fit, it's actually a hell of a gamer machine (just checked the website). Nice!

this summer in sthlm sweden is quite cold and raining away so far in june, the latest summers have been hot, but not this one..got two weeks left on my vacation so it would be great to have the machine at home soon, but it was ordered, late friday, so it may not show up until the middle or end of the week.


On my laptop ..gtx 560m and only 8 bit of ram, iray and daz studio works semi decen in iteration speed when I change lighting etc, but something is extremely slow and whacky when either initializing it ..it takes almost half a minute between switching from wireframe mode and iray, with genesis 2 and 3 figures and sunsky activated, a bit faster with other models and some hdr images.
Also when switching between render, tab, lighting tab and actors etc...I got some ghosting within the viewports showing various content in that viewport.

I am not that fond of how it works now, I would have liked o have my daz 4.0 version intact till they sort out daz 4.9 a bit better, not sure if it is possible to install 4.0, since the 4.9 overwrote it.