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DrStrik9
06-09-2017, 11:38 AM
<rant>

As a long-time Mac user (since the 512 mb "Fac Mac," from about a million years ago, in computer years), I now feel the absolute need to "learn about Windows."

Apple has lost its way. Their version of profit-making is to enslave Chinese kids in horrible factory conditions and sell phones at absurd of profit levels. Last time I checked, Apple had more cash than the US government. But their computers have been left in the dust a LONG time ago.

Could old Billy G. have the answer after all? That is my question, and I'm pretty sure I know the answer, and the time has now come to jump ship. I am seeing a complete lack of any attempt at Apple to compete with the Windows/Intel/AMD teams. I've come to realize that Apple just doesn't care anymore. This is a HUGE disappointment to me, as I built a successful design firm on Apple's products, back when it made FAR more sense to use the Mac than using pre-Windows at the time. Yes, I drank the kool-ade, but it made a lot of sense and turned out to be a very good investment overall, during that period of time. At one time, Apple was truly awesome.

However, I am very sad to see Apple now.

So I'm looking at Windows, and far better hardware than what Apple is selling. Right now, the best computer Apple offers is the Mac Pro, built using 4-year-old tech, at costs concurrent with (and above) MODERN tech. The ongoing cost of remaining with Apple will be FAR more expensive than going with Windows in many ways, including what it costs to replace every piece of software and utility. And the FORM FACTOR of the newest trash can Mac Pro is a JOKE. Nothing is internal; there are wires-upon-wires and accidents waiting to happen all over my office.

I hated Microsoft for many years, because of their shady business practices and a glaring lack of creative design. I was guilty of this for decades.

But if Intel and AMD are as smart as I think they are, along with certain video technologies as I understand them, the really good hardware is going to be expensive, but absolutely killer in performance.

With Adobe Creative Cloud (or free alternatives), Blender, and Lightwave Next (if it ever happens), the future is looking very bright.

</rant>

Surrealist.
06-09-2017, 12:22 PM
Not even going to read all of that. But suffice to say, if you are doing 3D you should be on a PC. There just is not the same level of support and development on the Mac. It is not universal enough. I like Apple. But I would never invest in it as a platform for this kind of work. Likely you'll find you will want to keep your Mac around and use the PC for work.

3dworks
06-09-2017, 12:47 PM
yeah, let's start a platform war! LOL (joking)

there are true points made, but you forget one thing: the cost (especially in terms of time) of maintaining a windows based system is much higher in my experience than with OSX. if you need the ultimate hardware, there is sure no alternative to windows based hardware. but if the next best level is an option, keep your old mac pro's, pimp them up to the max and use them! that's what i've done and i'm very happy with that solution. i've a windows workstation as well, but i'm keeping it as a 'closed' system - almost no internet use, just essential updates and definitely no other software than the few 3d apps i need to use on it - and as a single setup, it is still consuming more time to keep it virus free, driver updated and running than all my other 6 macs put together.

btw. now there are finally some new apple pro machines on the horizon - let's see if they deserve a closer look once they are out ;-)

cheers

markus

jwiede
06-09-2017, 01:11 PM
Apple has lost its way. Their version of profit-making is to enslave Chinese kids in horrible factory conditions and sell phones at absurd of profit levels.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but all the major tech companies making consumer electronics are guilty of the above, not just Apple. Microsoft, Google, Amazon, all rely on Foxconn and friends for manufacturing, that's public knowledge. Apple is in no way a "unusual violator" in that regard.

DrStrik9
06-09-2017, 01:24 PM
... if you are doing 3D you should be on a PC. ...

Yup. But is there much of a diff for other kinds of graphic work?

DrStrik9
06-09-2017, 01:29 PM
yeah, let's start a platform war! LOL (joking) ...

there are true points made, but you forget one thing: the cost (especially in terms of time) of maintaining a windows based system is much higher in my experience than with OSX. if you need the ultimate hardware, there is sure no alternative to windows based hardware. but if the next best level is an option, keep your old mac pro's, pimp them up to the max and use them! that's what i've done and i'm very happy with that solution. i've a windows workstation as well, but i'm keeping it as a 'closed' system - almost no internet use, just essential updates and definitely no other software than the few 3d apps i need to use on it - and as a single setup, it is still consuming more time to keep it virus free, driver updated and running than all my other 6 macs put together.

btw. now there are finally some new apple pro machines on the horizon - let's see if they deserve a closer look once they are out ;-)

Yeah, not trying to start a platform war. LOL

Thanks for those perspectives. I knew the cost of maintenance was far better for Mac long ago, but interesting to hear your current experience is the same as of old. I wasn't aware of new Mac Pro's in the pipeline either. So we'll see ...

- - - Updated - - -


Sorry to burst your bubble, but all the major tech companies making consumer electronics are guilty of the above, not just Apple. Microsoft, Google, Amazon, all rely on Foxconn and friends for manufacturing, that's public knowledge. Apple is in no way a "unusual violator" in that regard.

Thanks for the reminder. ... Same as it ever was ...

jperk
06-09-2017, 01:37 PM
Amiga is still king.

raymondtrace
06-09-2017, 03:38 PM
At one time, Apple was truly awesome...I hated Microsoft for many years, because of their shady business practices...

It looks like the problem here is that you are attaching too many feelings to cold electronics or businesses that really all behave the same. Just use what hardware and software does the job and save feelings for real people.


...it is still consuming more time to keep it virus free, driver updated and running than all my other 6 macs put together...

I may need some education on why keeping any system virus free or otherwise updated should be time consuming. You may be doing this computering thing wrong.

wesleycorgi
06-09-2017, 04:48 PM
I think Apple's announcements this Monday in what they are doing with AR/VR is compelling. Also their announcement to support an eGPU is also a good move.

Ernest
06-09-2017, 04:55 PM
It looks like the problem here is that you are attaching too many feelings to cold electronics or businesses that really all behave the same. Just use what hardware and software does the job and save feelings for real people.

I have to disagree a bit there. If we treat all businesses the same, regardless of how they behave, then they will really all behave the same. The one reason why some businesses behave better than others is because they recognize that good PR reaps real rewards. If we stop rewarding good PR, all businesses will behave at their worst.

BigHache
06-09-2017, 05:24 PM
I started on Mac but moved to Windows when I made the decision to focus on 3D and motion graphics. That proved to be a smart move for me. I don't work for myself/own my own studio, so I'm not in control of the hardware.

It's a Windows world. I think the main current reasons are:
1) IT departments (typically) do not want to support multiple platforms nor are they necessarily trained on Mac backends
2) In my experience, to a degree, Macs have not needed as much IT maintenance/involvement as Windows systems.

Again this has been my experience, YMMV.

At one point Macs seemed to either hold some sort of advantage for graphics work, or at least people were convinced there was an advantage to using a Mac for graphics work. If it was ever true I don't think it holds true anymore.

Viruses are not as much a concern on Macs. They don't have the same places to hide and those who write viruses usually are looking to do as much damage as possible before antivirus softwares kicks in. Macs don't have the market share to warrant doing the most damage so at least it seems they're largely ignored. From what I've read this tends to infuriate Windows users that work with people whom use Macs. The Mac can be a "carrier" for a virus but can't run the code, and the file can be transferred to a Windows system and infect it. That with driver updates and Windows updates (which can break your software pipeline) can cause unnecessary troubleshooting and software repair time that might not occur on a Mac.

I never cared for the trashcan Mac. Sure it looks nice but the form factor is unlike everything else on the market so now you've made even more proprietary the platform. No one cares for or appreciates that.

On the rendering side, last time I did a comparison, Macs would not give up all resources to commit to a render. Some nonsense about not interrupting the user's experience on the machine so the CPU would never 100% task out without some creative tricking of the system. I shouldn't have to do that to use all the power I bought.

Lots of words that say neither platform is "better" or "worse" than the other. Since you have Macs I wouldn't be so quick to get rid of them, but I'm not convinced you should get new ones either.

Verlon
06-09-2017, 06:10 PM
Sorry to burst your bubble, but all the major tech companies making consumer electronics are guilty of the above, not just Apple. Microsoft, Google, Amazon, all rely on Foxconn and friends for manufacturing, that's public knowledge. Apple is in no way a "unusual violator" in that regard.

What he said to the x86th power.

Every major tech company has been caught doing crappy things to its employees including
manipulating deadlines
using questionable patent practices
Using non-compete hiring practices
dodging taxes using the Dutch Sandwich


And whole lots more.

So, unless you want to do your rendering on an abacus, there is no moral high ground.

corsa
06-09-2017, 11:08 PM
I think Apple's announcements this Monday in what they are doing with AR/VR is compelling. Also their announcement to support an eGPU is also a good move.

The native eGPU support was the most exciding annoucment for me. You can use eGPUs now with a Mac, but it is pretty much a hack. Official support will be nice.

bazsa73
06-10-2017, 01:43 AM
My main issue with windows is that it wants to know better than me.

CaptainMarlowe
06-10-2017, 02:12 AM
The native eGPU support was the most exciding annoucment for me. You can use eGPUs now with a Mac, but it is pretty much a hack. Official support will be nice.

Agreed ! I have a pretty decent iTrashCan, but I'd like to add some eGPU at some point. If High Sierra allows for that without too many hassle, it will be a very interesting move.
I often think I'll build a dedicated PC some day for 3D, but now, as an "enlightened" hobbyist using 50% LW/substance and 50% FCP X/Motion, Mac is still a no brainer for me.

graviel
06-10-2017, 03:29 AM
For databases the best is Solaris, for networking BSD, for web servers please use Linux, for graphics OSX, if you work on videogames or animation probably Windows. 3D is well suited in Osx, Windows and for some apps in Linux. What to say, the last time I tried to open up a mac the parts were glued together to prevent servicing, so yes, apple has done far worst **** than microsoft ever did, but until microsoft moves to unix (which is happening) 60% of my work is on the mac basically cause of the shell, automator, ect ect.. windows just cant go there. But when it comes to specialised animation another 15% of the work is in windows cause it just wont run anywhere else. I will not buy a laptop from apple, thats clear, using glue is just so low. So my next purchase will probably be surface or something similar.

Another note about graphics on the mac, it all depends what you do, if you need some easy color worflow it is the best but it depends what you do, there are many good raster image processors just for windows, requiring a bit more work, so once again it depends. I do think for a bit larger deployments mac pays back in simplicity of administration since the system is designed for the job.

DrStrik9
06-10-2017, 08:53 AM
I appreciate all the thoughts and wisdom in this thread. I feel less conflicted about the whole thing than I did. Thanks. I'll have to look into eGPU stuff as well ...

Being a "generalist," I do design and illustration more than I do 3D and video, but I do need decent 3D performance, especially rendering (without the use of a farm so far), so maybe my solution is two boxes, as suggested earlier.

Greenlaw
06-10-2017, 09:36 AM
I started out with the 'Fat Mac' too, back in 1985, and stayed 'Mac-loyal' until I switched to Power Computing, which was a Mac Clone based on mostly PC hardware. Otherwise, it was still a Mac but more powerful than Apple's original at the time. Anyway, Mac hardware and software carried me through a career as a 2D/3D illustrator up through the late nineties, and I had no interest in Windows.

I finally built my first PC in 1998, shortly after I got into CGI and VFX for film production and found the Mac couldn't compete with the PC for 3D graphics card tech. Back then Apple was insistent on everybody using QuickDraw 3D, which was slow, crude and crashy compared to OpenGL-based tech used in by the rest of the industry. A third party developer came up with Conix OpenGL which was a software OpenGL for the Mac. NewTek adopted it for LightWave, and that gave LightWave a little longer life for me on the Mac. Eventually, I dropped the Mac because a lot of software and plugins I needed was only available for the PC, and a lot of the Mac software I relied on was being ported to Windows. (Apple eventually bought Conix OpenGL and abandoned QuickDraw 3D, but I was already moving on by then.)

I do love my Apple iPad though. I have a 3rd gen iPad Retina that I bought used for $300 a few years ago, added a Wacom pressure sensitive stylus, and I use it for design work all the time. A couple of months ago, I shattered the screen and replaced it myself for about $30. I don't recommend it--it's a messy and somewhat stressful process that took me a better part of a day to do. I got a lot of small cuts in my fingers and a piece of glass in my eye, even though I was wearing goggles. (Geez, I swear, I only took them off for a second!) Luckily, the tiny shard washed out. Anyway, the repair was successful and I am very pleased with the result, but next time I'm going to pay a pro to do this for me. :)

137032 137031 137030

But I digress...

I know the Mac has become more 3D-friendly since the early 2000's, and when I'm working I may occasionally use somebody else's Mac but only for 2D design and compositing. But I still see users asking for Mac versions of plugins often in these forums. However, when I started dabbling in music and sound production, I noticed that there's a lot of cool stuff out there for Mac users that I can't use for Windows.

So here's my take:

1. For 2D design and art, the two platforms are pretty much the same. Video editing too--some Windows programs even support ProRes now.

2. For sound and music, the Mac appears to have the edge.

3. For 3D production, Windows is still preferred.

As for Foxconn and employee abuse, I hate what's going on over there, but I'm not sure what to do about it. I can't exactly boycott the computer software and hardware that I depend on for my livelihood.

FWIW, for a lot of stuff I use, I try to deal with smaller companies and independent developers directly. I also buy used hardware when I can and where it makes sense, and I even build my own equipment if I'm up to it. But that has limits and, while it reduces the amount of money certain corporations may make from me, it really doesn't solve the human rights problems.

There are other ways to affect change in the world but boycotting my tools of the trade isn't one of them. One way is to use the tools I have to create works that educate, inform, and raise awareness of problems. My wife, for example, has been involved with a couple of organizations by painting backgrounds and other elements for 2D animated PSA's. If I can ever manage the time, I'd like to do the same kind of thing, but until then the best I can do is contribute to organizations that work for causes I believe in. (I'm not going to list any organizations because everybody will have their own ideas about what's 'worthy.' If you really care, don't just react to a flippant or inaccurate facebook/twitter post, do the research and act responsibly.)

Zerowaitstate
06-10-2017, 09:37 PM
Amiga is still king.

did you see there is a newly released Amiga 5000 ?

bit expensive but for ageing Amiga die hard .... that has to much money , why not?

Greenlaw
06-11-2017, 01:16 AM
Being a "generalist," I do design and illustration more than I do 3D and video, but I do need decent 3D performance, especially rendering (without the use of a farm so far), so maybe my solution is two boxes, as suggested earlier.

That's a good idea. I used both a Mac and a PC together in my home studio for a few years before I finally dropped the Mac. I'm not saying you should transition but you will want to keep one system around that you know can get the job done while you're still learning how to use the other.

BTW, learning how to use a Windows system is not that bad but it will take time, especially in the more 'nerdy' areas when it comes to maintenance. That's where I kinda miss using a Mac. :D

When it comes to using applications though, it's more or less the same experience on either platform.

kattkieru
06-11-2017, 09:48 AM
Just to throw in: I've been doing freelance professionally on Mac for over ten years (always a powerbook / macbook pro of some kind). I do 3D freelance in Maya, Blender, Cinema 4D, and ZBrush. Mac is fine. Sometimes with LW and Maya you don't get access to certain plugins (render plugins are the worst, especially GPU ones), but really, you can work around that.

Before anyone jumps on me, my Mac dual-boots to win 10. I have a surface pro 4 and I run win 10 at the day job. I know windows very well, and I know the differences and how the Mac limits OpenGL, etc. Overall my experience is still always better on the Mac.

I say stay where you're comfortable.

Danner
06-11-2017, 10:28 AM
I've also used both systems and have stayed on PC just for pure bang for the buck in terms or rendering power, and being an avid gamer It also limits your game catalog significantly (VR was a year late for example and I'm heavy into that). I do like the Mac hardware finish and the interface polish, but in the end I'm working most of the time inside programs that benefit little from OS differences. In the 90's I was deep into competitive first person shooters and I had to disable mouse acceleration (also called mouse precision) and got used to it for all operations. I tried to disable it on Mac and failed and that was the deal breaker for me at some point, but that it would be a moot point now since I use a pen tablet for work. As far as viruses go I've had no issues in about 15 years. But I always have an up to date antivirus and OS, and I always force-quit browsers if I get a weird pop up.

pinkmouse
06-11-2017, 11:29 AM
OSX is like a supermodel, beautiful, out of your league, and sometimes you wonder where she's going or what she's going to do next. Windows is a rich stockbroker, a whizz with figures, very well dressed and with all the bling, yet ultimately dead inside. Wheras Linux, that's the weird old lady down the street with all the cats and a hoarding problem... :D

hypersuperduper
06-11-2017, 11:49 AM
Personally. I would be have to think long and hard before purchasing another windows laptop. My experience has been very poor with them (that was a while ago, though). Laptops are the kind of thing at which apple excels, where the benefits to reliability, power management, and usability that are afforded by an integrated hardware and software pipeline are imo worth the tradeoffs, and for lots of work, even a lot of 3D work, a laptop is sufficient.

As for a desktop workstation for 3d work, it is the reverse. Difficult to justify the extra expense, fewer plugins, limited extendability, and generally crappier drivers that you are stuck with on mac. PC seems like the way to go.

I like the double box solution you suggest. That is probably in my future as well.

JamesCurtis
06-11-2017, 02:04 PM
The Marketing Agency I generally do freelance work for, uses Mac's for most of their work, but they have PC'S there too. I use PC'S in my studio, and have been for 26 years. They use the mac's for DTP, Web work, and Video Production. My use of LW is exclusive to them. Getting work to them has never been an issue either way.

Spinland
06-11-2017, 06:05 PM
I have one token Windows 10 box in the studio, because there is a handful of apps I need to run on that OS. A small handful. Not interested in dual booting or virtual machines. There has yet to exist a Windows-only LW plugin I needed badly enough to put up with that OS to run, but LW is installed on it in case one ever emerges.

I have a graduate degree in software engineering, know UNIX type operating systems and command suites inside and out, and have used Microsoft-based computers as far back as MS-DOS 4. I know their stuff quite well, both as a power user and as a developer. I vastly prefer the *NIX based underpinnings of OS X (or MacOS as they're calling it now). To me, Macs are like having Linux machines that can actually run useful software. I won't ever go back, not fully. Apple has p***ed me off royally no few times over the past couple of years but I still consider them the heavy hitter in the OS field.

As far as the "iTrashcan" goes, I'm rather happy with mine. I have no issues with multiple external devices connected to a central CPU unit, that was the paradigm of most of my decades in computing. I have a large NAS running a Linux based control suite and my Macs autofs mount whatever volumes they need as they need them. One of the many reasons *NIX based OS is the way to go. I couldn't care less about the appearance of the blamed thing, and it's tucked away out of sight in a server cabinet anyway so all that sexy design stuff is lost on me. It's just the best tool for my job so I got one. When more software supports OpenCL in addition to (or instead of) CUDA stuff then so much the better. I'll wait.

kopperdrake
06-12-2017, 04:58 AM
I was all Mac Pros up until about five years ago. Plugins made me move, and to be honest I really don't regret it. It's just a tool to do a job. I still have a couple of MacPros here as render boxes, they were insanely good value for money at the time and can still hold their own against modern single CPU boxes on a farm. They're running Bootcamp with Win 7 Pro installed. However, lack of consistency with Apple and their support for higher end 3D wouldn't make me move back - I fear they go where the money is at the expense of keeping existing users happy, and an OS swap isn't a small step for a small outfit.

That all said, the majority of our work is LightWave based - our graphics guys all use Macs and we have no issues swapping stuf backwards and forwards, hence my initial statement still stands - "It's just a tool to do a job."

raymondtrace
06-12-2017, 07:37 AM
I have to disagree a bit there. If we treat all businesses the same, regardless of how they behave, then they will really all behave the same. The one reason why some businesses behave better than others is because they recognize that good PR reaps real rewards. If we stop rewarding good PR, all businesses will behave at their worst.

I'd agree, or disagree, if I had the slightest idea of what that post meant. :D

Spinland
06-12-2017, 07:45 AM
... hence my initial statement still stands - "It's just a tool to do a job."

QFA. My switch to the Mac paradigm was a business decision based on where I thought was my best ROI. If that conclusion ever changes I won't weep a tear as I switch to the next best thing. I do have preferences, such as my aforementioned liking for the *NIX command line, but in the end what matters is delivering top-shelf product on time and at a price I and the client can both live with. :jam:

Spinland
06-12-2017, 07:48 AM
I'd agree, or disagree, if I had the slightest idea of what that post meant. :D

Methinks what he meant is the best curb on potential malfeasance by companies comes from the crucible of the marketplace, not from artificially imposed limitations. Or I could be totally off base, in which case let's fuggedaboudit and have a beer. :beerchug:

raymondtrace
06-12-2017, 11:08 AM
Methinks what he meant is the best curb on potential malfeasance by companies comes from the crucible of the marketplace

The crucible of the marketplace is focused on price, not corporate malfeasance. That's why all our tech toys come from China and we turn a blind eye to issues with human rights and free speech.

Spinland
06-12-2017, 11:10 AM
The crucible of the marketplace is focused on price, not corporate malfeasance. That's why all our tech toys come from China and we turn a blind eye to issues with human rights and free speech.

We'll have to disagree on that one, the actual causes for those issues are not problems with the marketplace itself. This is not the forum for a discussion of economics and regulation. :jam:

Airwaves
06-12-2017, 12:14 PM
If you have a decent Mac I would hold on to it but definitely go PC. I do work with 3D but also with the Unreal Engine and in order to export a game for Apple you need to do it from a Mac so keep one just for exporting if you plan on using game engines.

As for the debate between Mac vs PC I think it is interesting. You will hear from both sides and it is really preference. I have heard many people tell me it saves time using a Mac because of not fighting viruses, updates, not having things work from the start, etc. I think this might be useful for some users but I do enough stuff that when I use the Mac I spend twice as much time trying to get a Mac to do things. So I think it comes down to preference.

I will say this for rendering though, about 6 years ago I was getting into 3D and found a company near where I live and I met with them to pay them for help with my projects. I was shocked to find that in their studio it was all Macs. The problem I had was when it came to rendering. That is when I found out my pc built render farm outdid all their studio macs so I stuck with my render farm.

This post is going on a while but there is another cool thing you can do with a PC is build your own server from a full sized tower. I did that and have a 16 core xeon and it is AMAZING!

Best of luck.

sk810
06-12-2017, 03:08 PM
DrStrik9, I guess you missed the announcement from Apple about the iMac Pro with the monster 16 core 36 thread i9 due out in Dec and the new Mac pro due out next year. Available with tons of ram.

Aren't all the computer parts companies are using cheap labor in China.

I recently built a beefed up PC I was going to run as a Hackintosh, but ran into some issues. So I just installed Windows on it to run Lightwave.

3dworks
06-13-2017, 04:06 AM
a tip for anyone using macs and windows based pc's together is to use software which makes the sharing of files over network painless. i'm using HFS+ from paragon software on the windows side and NTFS for mac from the same company on mac side. this way i can use the other OS file system as it was the native one. a small expense as this is not for free, but very, very handy!

fortunately there are very few lightwave plugins with issues on mac side nowadays, and as long as my preferred engine, octane is running well on macs i will keep the setup i have. with all recent OSX versions you can use the latest nvidia cards with the last pre-trash-can mac pro generation natively, so from this side (GPU) there is no need to switch for me. also apple seems to improve opengl and GPU capabilities with each version, and fortunately, nvidia is supporting their CUDA and screen drivers for mac as well on a very frequent base.

cheers

markus

raymondtrace
06-13-2017, 07:28 AM
a tip for anyone using macs and windows based pc's together is to use software which makes the sharing of files over network painless...
Paragon software is for reading/writing directly to a drive. You don't need special software to share files between various platforms over a network. But you're correct that Paragon software is a good, inexpensive way to handle local file storage.

sadkkf
06-13-2017, 10:47 AM
Neither platform is ideal, IMO. Both OS's are crappy. I've heard a lot of FX houses use a *nix OS instead. Can anyone weigh in on that? Maybe not since Maya isn't supported on those.

My problem with Apple is their ludicrous proprietary stranglehold. I can build a PC cheaper than buy one with their identical specs and have the freedom to upgrade at will. My laptop included.

I understand Apple's want to control everything for security, but honestly, I can't even recall the last virus or malware I had on my PC.

sadkkf
06-13-2017, 10:53 AM
The crucible of the marketplace is focused on price, not corporate malfeasance. That's why all our tech toys come from China and we turn a blind eye to issues with human rights and free speech.

Yep.

Still, when Apple bowed to pressure to address this issue, the did very little to improve it. They never addressed worker conditions, overtime pay and the like. They had a very public stage to bring change to this and chose not to. They also chose to build a new data center and power it with coal instead of renewables.

I'm not saying they are worse than any other company, they just squandered an opportunity to take the lead and push for improvements.

corsa
06-13-2017, 11:02 AM
I've heard a lot of FX houses use a *nix OS instead. Can anyone weigh in on that? Maybe not since Maya isn't supported on those.

Since macOS is a *nix OS, I guess any FX house using a Mac is technically using a *nix OS. :) And Maya is available on Linux too.

corsa
06-13-2017, 11:15 AM
Yep.

Still, when Apple bowed to pressure to address this issue, the did very little to improve it. They never addressed worker conditions, overtime pay and the like. They had a very public stage to bring change to this and chose not to. They also chose to build a new data center and power it with coal instead of renewables.

I'm not saying they are worse than any other company, they just squandered an opportunity to take the lead and push for improvements.

As of now, all their data centers are powered by 100% renewable energy, and 96% of all their facilities run on renewable energy. (According to the latest updates on their website: https://www.apple.com/environment/ ) The Apple Store near me on the Upper West Side in NYC recently went 100% renewable energy, for example.

Agree about the worker conditions issue though. Although the Mac Pro is assembled in the U.S. and made from U.S.-manufactured components, that was pretty much just a token gesture. There is definitely a need for improvment.

sadkkf
06-13-2017, 11:22 AM
As of now, all their data centers are powered by 100% renewable energy, and 96% of all their facilities run on renewable energy. (According to the latest updates on their website: https://www.apple.com/environment/ ) The Apple Store near me on the Upper West Side in NYC recently went 100% renewable energy, for example.

Agree about the worker conditions issue though. Although the Mac Pro is assembled in the U.S. and made from U.S.-manufactured components, that was pretty much just a token gesture. There is definitely a need for improvment.


Hm. I just looked up the data center and you're right. It's not coal-powered. They must have changed that because I read early stories of them using coal. No matter. This is good.

- - - Updated - - -

raymondtrace
06-13-2017, 12:00 PM
...Can anyone weigh in on that...

https://www.google.com/search?q=linux+used+in+film+production

..and made evident by all the apps that run on Linux: Fusion, Maya, RenderMan, Houdini, 3D-Coat, Blender, Silo, Modo, Mari...


I understand Apple's want to control everything for security, but honestly, I can't even recall the last virus or malware I had on my PC.

That works the other way around as well. Sadly, because many Mac users think that they are impervious to attack and don't bother with hardening their system, they can't recall when they've been exploited. :D Security confidence is dangerous.

All platforms help to control everything for security. The Windows and Apple app stores borrowed their concept from software repositories long used for *nix.

Chernoby
06-15-2017, 03:58 PM
I just switched. Still getting used to PC. I do NOT like the operating system at all. But so many awesome plugins and programs never make it to Mac or are severely delayed: a lot of Autodesk products, Fusion took forever, tons of Lightwave plugins, GameMaker Studio, Blender features like microdisplacement.

DrStrik9
06-16-2017, 10:53 AM
All of this great info makes me think my best path is an additional PC box for now. THANKS, EVERYONE!!! :+)

Scazzino
06-16-2017, 10:57 AM
I have one LightWave utility that always appears first on Mac OS X. I just updated our cross-platform network render controller, DreamLight Constellation, to version 2.1.4 (http://dreamlight.com/shop/dreamlight-constellation-lightwave-3d-network-render-controller/). It now runs with the same user friendly drag-and-drop approach on both Mac OS X and Windows. The last few updates fixed a few minor default issues on Windows. So for those like me who run Mac OS X it's one of the few network controllers that runs natively on Mac OS X and probably the only one actually developed on Mac OS X. And for Mac users who may have switched to Windows you will feel right at home with it running on either Mac or Windows. The free lite version can even be used as a simple render queue controller on one computer (local or remote) for background rendering while you continue to work in LightWave.