PDA

View Full Version : Long Bone Chains



daforum
03-18-2017, 03:39 PM
Is there a script/ plugin to create looooong bone chains at once in layout?
I don't want to have to sit here and hit 'create bone' lots and lots of times.

prometheus
03-18-2017, 04:00 PM
Is there a script/ plugin to create looooong bone chains at once in layout?
I don't want to have to sit here and hit 'create bone' lots and lots of times.

whatīs wrong with drawing child bones? at least faster than create bone, so not add bone and not add child bone, but draw child bone, you can first check split bones then go to draw child bones, that way you can draw them and directly after right click to divide.

if you mean dividing a single bone you can do that with setup/ detail and split bone, you can middle click and drag a marque around one single bone, you will get the bone highlighted with a red split guide, to execute it just right click.
however, I would probably just do the bones in modeller if possible with skelegons, you could for instance draw with the line pen and divide it with artspheres divide edge to get exact splits, then convert he line pen chain to skelegons, then to bones in layout.

about bone dynamics with bullet..but at
0:45 to see how to draw a bone chain


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jLkdoQcqus

prometheus
03-18-2017, 04:18 PM
you could also just copy edges from any drawn geometry in modeler and convert to skelegons.

Ryan Roye
03-18-2017, 04:22 PM
Is there a script/ plugin to create looooong bone chains at once in layout?
I don't want to have to sit here and hit 'create bone' lots and lots of times.

Download the script here. works with multi-selections too.

http://www.smallanimations.com/addbonechain

daforum
03-19-2017, 10:33 AM
you could also just copy edges from any drawn geometry in modeler and convert to skelegons.

Nice idea! :)

- - - Updated - - -


Download the script here. works with multi-selections too.

http://www.smallanimations.com/addbonechain

Thank you Ryan, that looks like a great script.

daforum
03-20-2017, 06:03 AM
Hi Ryan.
I've just had a chance to download the script and I'm still on an 'earlier' version of LW, so do you have a '.ls' version?

mummyman
03-20-2017, 11:49 AM
Download the script here. works with multi-selections too.

http://www.smallanimations.com/addbonechain

WOW. Thank you Ryan. Huge time saver.

Ryan Roye
03-20-2017, 01:39 PM
Hi Ryan.
I've just had a chance to download the script and I'm still on an 'earlier' version of LW, so do you have a '.ls' version?

I do not, I never really got into .ls scripting.

daforum
03-20-2017, 02:08 PM
Ah well! Maybe when i get to upgrade i'll get to use your python script.
Thank you for the share anyway.

jeric_synergy
03-20-2017, 08:32 PM
??? Generally, since it's a very general question, I'd create long bone chains in Modeler, as Skelegons or Splines -- there's a "Spline To Skelegon" script isn't there?

daforum
03-21-2017, 06:32 AM
I suppose that's the way for me to go.

I was watching this video the other day and heard the script mentioned.
LightWiki™ Live 17/03/2017 here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yl1fb4DGjA&feature=youtu.be&t=1150

RebelHill
03-21-2017, 07:51 AM
Dont know whats so wrong with draw child bones... its basically the same as draw skelegons, but in layout, so no loading/converting/etc.

Otherwise...


generic
{
nBones = 10;
AddBone("MyBone_1");
for(i=2;i<=nBones;i++)
AddChildBone("MyBone_"+i);
}

erikals
03-21-2017, 12:15 PM
skelegons can be fast, depending, in Modeler though
might not be what you want in this case, but here's how, if of interest.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlY9NhgHDQ0

daforum
03-21-2017, 12:56 PM
Dont know whats so wrong with draw child bones... its basically the same as draw skelegons, but in layout, so no loading/converting/etc.

Otherwise...


generic
{
nBones = 10;
AddBone("MyBone_1");
for(i=2;i<=nBones;i++)
AddChildBone("MyBone_"+i);
}

Thanks very much for this RebelHill, it works like a charm!
I ended up making 2 more versions ( x25 and x50 ) for future use; and I now know how to make a generic version with more bone creation if necessary.

- - - Updated - - -



skelegons can be fast, depending, in Modeler though
might not be what you want in this case, but here's how, if of interest.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlY9NhgHDQ0

Cool tutorial erikals.
A neat and tidy way of solving the problem, if i may say so!

prometheus
03-21-2017, 01:04 PM
Dont know whats so wrong with draw child bones... its basically the same as draw skelegons, but in layout, so no loading/converting/etc.

Otherwise...


generic
{
nBones = 10;
AddBone("MyBone_1");
for(i=2;i<=nBones;i++)
AddChildBone("MyBone_"+i);
}
Right..thatīs what I said :)
One could always also just remap the add childbone to a single key..or just record the process with ls commander.



skelegons can be fast, depending, in Modeler though
might not be what you want in this case, but here's how, if of interest.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlY9NhgHDQ0

Right...thatīs what I said :)
Isnīt it unnecessary to go to edge to poly? why not just copy and paste the edge to another layer and then setup/convert to skelegons, so it is free to pose from there.

erikals
03-21-2017, 01:20 PM
Isnīt it unnecessary to go to edge to poly? why not just copy and paste the edge to another layer and then setup/convert to skelegons, so it is free to pose from there.
could/should work, but found this to be cleaner/better for preview. multiple ways.

prometheus
03-21-2017, 01:40 PM
could/should work, but found this to be cleaner/better for preview. multiple ways.

It works!

And you can also use the line pen to rough out a structure, select edges and use artpsheres divide edge on that to specify divisions, which ultimately specifys how many bones after it first has been converted to skelegons.
And if using a spline do draw in modeler, and you know itīs gonna be a lot of bones, you could re-edit with path divider on the spline, then convert to skelegons...no need to copy and paste edges at all, path divider lets you set or slide a value of desired divisions...back and forth.

erikals
03-21-2017, 01:46 PM
yeah, i wish i had more time to look into it.

i'll link this page for future thoughs   :)

prometheus
03-21-2017, 01:51 PM
yeah, i wish i had more time to look into it.

i'll link this page for future thoughs   :)

Iīll try to record something the upcoming weekend, and with voice probably to make it easier to follow..or not :) I need to train my oral english skills, so itīs one way to get started.

erikals
03-21-2017, 02:00 PM
the more the merrier i say,

i appreciate all LW vidz i can get, and i know many other also do.   :)

prometheus
03-21-2017, 02:32 PM
??? Generally, since it's a very general question, I'd create long bone chains in Modeler, as Skelegons or Splines -- there's a "Spline To Skelegon" script isn't there?

Yep..drawing splines works, but spline to skelegon isnīt correct, you simply go to setup and use convert skelegons, the command name is make skelegons, but in the modeler menu it is called convert skelegons, the spline curve needs nothing else than clicking on that convert to skelegons button under setup/skelegons.

Also to note..It could be interesting, if you draw a spline with spline draw, you could enter strand tool, hit numeric and check all knots, then you can repose the spline curve with the ik sort of movement, but do not try to add knots in a spline curve, it will create extended curve as straight chains.

You could also use strand tool on skelegons to pose...hair skelegons for instance.

daforum
03-22-2017, 07:36 AM
Here are 3 versions of RebilHills code posted on page 1.
Thank you Rebel for the code :)

They are just quick scripts and I've made x10, x25 and x50 versions ( see the zip attached )
They can be adjusted according to how many bones you want by editing the 'number' in the script.

Hope they are useful to you as they are for me.

jeric_synergy
03-22-2017, 10:29 AM
Here are 3 versions of RebilHills code posted on page 1.
Thank you Rebel for the code :)

They are just quick scripts and I've made x10, x25 and x50 versions ( see the zip attached )
They can be adjusted according to how many bones you want by editing the 'number' in the script.
Nice! :thumbsup:

+++++

I'm curious: what task are you doing that just requires random bone chains extending, I guess, from the last bone selected?

prometheus
03-22-2017, 11:18 AM
Probably a bit off topic, but may be interesting..if some of you havenīt seen it before, it would be great if Any tube, or structure ..could create a skeleton chain based on the shape direction and a center structure, like dp_tree verdure pack, in dp tree..you just have to create the tree with polygon or subd mode, and then switch to another layer, create the tree again with the same branch settings, but in line mode, then itīs just a matter of converting it at once with convert skelegons, paste back to the same layer as the polymesh tree, send to layout and convert skelegons to bone, add ik booster and pose the tree.

Would be great if there was a plugin to run a center line structure insdide a mesh like a character or armature on any figure/mesh, without actually having to draw it yourself.

The part where I do the tree line skelegons is shown later in the vid at around..0:50


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aAxA6XUU0c8

erikals
03-22-2017, 11:57 AM
yes, i often miss functions like that, functions that keep or creates polychains in the center of an object.

it's yet another feature to add, so doubt we will see it   :)

daforum
03-24-2017, 09:35 AM
Nice! :thumbsup:

+++++

I'm curious: what task are you doing that just requires random bone chains extending, I guess, from the last bone selected?

Hi jeric.
I was watching this video the other day and heard the script mentioned: LightWiki™ Live 17/03/2017 here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yl1...outu.be&t=1150
so I thought I'd ask about it as it looked useful.
Not using it for anything specific at the moment just adding to the arsenal of scripts for future use...

jeric_synergy
03-24-2017, 10:21 AM
The bone function I "miss" (for low values of "miss") is the one that would divide a bone into a user-defined number of smaller bones.

I don't know if I've just forgotten where it is, if it went walkabout, or was deprecated in some upgrade or other.

There're interactive versions, but they seem really clumsy, and they don't allow simple dialog driven use. :\

daforum
03-24-2017, 11:19 AM
I think that was a Pictrix plugin, i remember using it to quickly divide a long bone chain for a project. It made life easier than having to go into Bone Edit mode and split the bones 1 at a time!!

Just would like to be able to select some/ all bones and type in 'divide by 2' or 3, or 4... :(

prometheus
03-24-2017, 11:55 AM
I think that was a Pictrix plugin, i remember using it to quickly divide a long bone chain for a project. It made life easier than having to go into Bone Edit mode and split the bones 1 at a time!!

Just would like to be able to select some/ all bones and type in 'divide by 2' or 3, or 4... :(

Not sure pictrix had that, hereīs another one, lscript to add as plugin in layout, but Only tried in lw 11.6.2 and 32 bit, will have to try the others.
Just make sure to add a null first or your object, go to the slider and drag to the desired amount of bones, or add exact number by keys.
http://www.neko.ne.jp/~asagi/P2P/LScript/lay/Add_Bones.ls

Oldcode
03-24-2017, 12:31 PM
whatīs wrong with drawing child bones? at least faster than create bone, so not add bone and not add child bone, but draw child bone, you can first check split bones then go to draw child bones, that way you can draw them and directly after right click to divide.

if you mean dividing a single bone you can do that with setup/ detail and split bone, you can middle click and drag a marque around one single bone, you will get the bone highlighted with a red split guide, to execute it just right click.
however, I would probably just do the bones in modeller if possible with skelegons, you could for instance draw with the line pen and divide it with artspheres divide edge to get exact splits, then convert he line pen chain to skelegons, then to bones in layout.

about bone dynamics with bullet..but at
0:45 to see how to draw a bone chain


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jLkdoQcqus


This is a great video, thanks! I started playing around with the bone dynamics and I've got lots of evil ideas I want to try, but there's one thing I could not figure out how to do.

Is there a way to have the bone at the top be kinimatic so it does not move, and rest of the bones to be free to move around, but the last bone (or any of the other bones) follows a null or other object as it moves? For example, is there a way to have a rope hanging from a tree, then have a character grab the rope with their hand and move the rope around but still have the top of the rope anchored on the branch?

Thanks,

jeric_synergy
03-24-2017, 12:52 PM
Hi jeric.
I was watching this video the other day and heard the script mentioned: LightWiki™ Live 17/03/2017 here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6yl1...outu.be&t=1150

Link no workee.

prometheus
03-24-2017, 01:03 PM
This is a great video, thanks! I started playing around with the bone dynamics and I've got lots of evil ideas I want to try, but there's one thing I could not figure out how to do.

Is there a way to have the bone at the top be kinimatic so it does not move, and rest of the bones to be free to move around, but the last bone (or any of the other bones) follows a null or other object as it moves? For example, is there a way to have a rope hanging from a tree, then have a character grab the rope with their hand and move the rope around but still have the top of the rope anchored on the branch?

Thanks,

Thatīs a lino showcase vid, he is the expert, and I myself havenīt had time to work much with it..along with too many crashes with 2015 made me put such stuff on hold unfortunately, but what I do know...
The first bone is automaticly made kinematic so it wonīt just drop all bones, you can manually in the bullet tab change any bone to any type of bullet type, so you could actually pin a hanging bridge by making the first bone and the end bone kinematic and let it be affected by gravity in the middle, or move the end bone in various way.
You could also probably use other hinges type to make it move differently or even use motors.

In this sample (all samples) the bone chain needs to be created in order, and you select the bones you need and make them point to point bulletfx, each bone is connected and set up with a constraint type..which could be changed to hinge, cone twist, slider, spring etc...and that determines the connection movement constraints, while the bones themself are made as rigid bodies.

I would say yes to your proposed scenecase without having testing it, It should be possible ..In my mind :)

daforum
03-24-2017, 04:36 PM
Link no workee.

Oh no! :stumped:
This one should work as i've just copied and pasted the link!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6yl1fb4DGjA

prometheus
04-01-2017, 01:23 PM
I just rediscovered the germinator plugin, and I must have missed something seriously good while testing it way long time ago, the germinator plugin is sort of an L-system, where you specify rules how the polygon branch or the polychain will be made, and what I missed is that you can go in to the options tab, and let it create skelegons at the same time it creates the L-system, so if you know your Axioms ...or load some of the accompanying seed scripts in to germinator, you can then create a tree branch already rigged, of course... you could do similar with the dp verdure tree pack, but this may be a bit simpler and more specific when setting the L-system rules, It works nicely to do roots, convert skelegons to bones in layout, apply ik booster and bone dynamics, add a rock, make it a collision object then hit ikb calculate and make the roots drape over the rock.

daforum
04-18-2017, 12:14 AM
Can you demonstrate the ideas you suggest above?
Would like to see ( to learn ) the 'roots drape over rocks' idea as that sounds good.

erikals
04-18-2017, 08:40 AM
seem to recall Prometheus made a video on it earlier on?

a video, partly there...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhbO9c5zoF0

prometheus
04-18-2017, 11:06 AM
Can you demonstrate the ideas you suggest above?
Would like to see ( to learn ) the 'roots drape over rocks' idea as that sounds good.

my desktop computer is down, so I need to install the recording tools first..like camstudio etc, and see how it goes on my laptop, it would be a bit slower..but I wonīt be able to record until the weekend, If I get the time.
But basicly you use ik-booster as mentioned..and partly as shown in the vid I did as erikals pointed to, william vaughan also has an ik booster octopus on the tube somewhere that conforms to a collision object.
For a tree, or roots you first need to dress the tree up with skelegons and convert to bones, but if you use dp tree you just create the tree mesh first, drop the tool, after that, select your layer with the main object you need to create the tree and run the tree plugin again..the previous setting should be intact..but this time you just create the tree in render / line mode, itīs located just under add preset..and from there you choose subpatch mesh or poly mesh or just line, so line is what you want in the background layer, then you convert that layer to skelegons,
convert to skelegons can be found under setup/skelegons/more/convert skelegons..
adjust the direction if any bone is in need of that by hitting "f" for flipping polygon.

Then itīs just a matter of sending it to layout and convert skelegons to bones, add ik booster, make your rock or ground object a collision object (old legacy collision objects) and hit ikb calculate, now you could also use bullets bone dynamics, which may be a bit harder to set up since it requires a certain order...and you wont get ik booster to work with that if you want to manually adjust the roots as well.

my previous post was about germinator, an old plugin that you would need to enter certain L-system axioms..so you can get very interesting branching there as well, though dp tree is specially designed for treeīs...Germinator has a mode to create the L-system with skelegons directly though..so you do not have to go through the steps you do for dp tree to create the skelegons...so itīs a bit faster there, a future idea may be if Denis could implement a skelegon mode as well for
dp tree, and work a bit more on the root system to allow it for more extended branches in several split generations.


You can also use blender and lightwave in combo, that is to use any polyline structure (edges) and fold it dynamicly to any object in layout with bullet deforming body or clothfx legacy, then save it as transformed object, load it in to blender and add the skin modifier wich wraps a mesh around the polyline structure.

On the other hand, you can draw instant mesh roots with the newer blender..or use grease pencil and convert to paths and then bevel thicken them, that suggest a perfect drawn curve and mesh over any surface, while using the dynamic method allow for gravity wrapped structure and that can produce gaps between the rock/ground and the root ..where they dynamic forces has interacted..and it may actually be what you want.

prometheus
04-18-2017, 11:13 AM
hereīs William at it with an old ik booster tute...what you need to figure out for yourself...by my description, that is how to rig the tree with previous suggested workflow with dp tree...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apKvqIAY4Fo

prometheus
04-18-2017, 11:15 AM
seem to recall Prometheus made a video on it earlier on?

a video, partly there...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhbO9c5zoF0


Ahh..great..I thought you pointed to my vid first, but thatīs how to do it, as I mentioned in my previous post, it would be great if dp tree worked as germinator, germinator creates skelegons directly if you check that box in the germinator options.