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View Full Version : Spline Patch modeling - who uses that technique to model?



Snosrap
02-05-2017, 05:58 PM
I came across an old NewtekPro magazine and there was a tutorial about building a boat using Spline Patch modeling and I had to ask myself - who models using that technique? It seems like it's been 10 plus years since I've attempted to modeled anything using that method and was wondering if it is even relevant today. Maybe for some retopo work but I can't imagine why with some of the great retopo solutions that are out there today. I'd like to hear about some of the advantages - if they exist.

Dodgy
02-05-2017, 08:48 PM
I do. Mind you, I use EasySpline to do it. I like the accuracy of it. You lay out your splines and where 4 or 3 splines are joined at the ends, it automatically patches the mesh. With easyspline you can set the triangle patches' direction using a priority Vmap, and so you can control poly flow that way. When I'm happy with the mesh, I can freeze it and then turn it into subpatches, and keep the old spline cage in a background layer in case I want to modify anything. You can set how dense the frozen mesh is as well.
http://www2.trueart.pl/?URIType=Directory&URI=Products/Plug-Ins/EasySpline135891135892

samurai_x
02-05-2017, 08:56 PM
On some occasion I still do. When the object has a continous but complex smooth surface. Cars usually have that.

jeric_synergy
02-05-2017, 11:37 PM
For a complex, well defined surface, it seems like it would be the best way for a truly accurate model. Especially with EasySpline, which seems awesome.

Surrealist.
02-06-2017, 01:01 AM
I have already been crucified for my opinions on this. So why type it all again, just to get crucified anew...lol:

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?86118-Spline-patch

Danner
02-06-2017, 07:34 AM
I still do for certain things.. I'll have a tutorial about a neat little modeling trick using these when I find some time. I'm posting the tease here to force myself to do it.

Spinland
02-06-2017, 07:38 AM
Only in Rhino for engineering-oriented modeling work.

Snosrap
02-06-2017, 07:50 AM
I have already been crucified for my opinions on this. So why type it all again, just to get crucified anew...lol:

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?86118-Spline-patch

Interesting thread. I messed around with a spline cage and patching to see if it's improved since Sensei's demo of it acting up - and NOT! That's what I remember about it - it was not a forgiving way to model - you have to follow certain rules and they don't always apply. I'm with you Surrealist - why bother. EasySpline however does look fantastic and if those types of tools where ever included natively in LW I would most likely use it.

- - - Updated - - -


I still do for certain things.. I'll have a tutorial about a neat little modeling trick using these when I find some time. I'm posting the tease here to force myself to do it.

Yes - I would love to know more.

tischbein3
02-06-2017, 08:43 AM
Not using spline cages
Not because it does suck in lw, but because the
whole concept is a bit lame:
Not enough control on the output edge flow,
and the risk ending up with too much geometry is too high.

If you got a program wich uses NURBS (The bezier spline ones)
as geometry output there might be some use to them, but imho you
still end up with too much geometry when converting them back go polygons,
making further editing a pain in the butt.

jeric_synergy
02-06-2017, 01:39 PM
tischbein3 is probably right about poly flow, but I can imagine a shape like this:
135898

might be very amendable to spline modeling, and then re-topo'ing in one's preferred sw.

For me, the freezing process always took virtually all the desirable shine off of spline modeling. Had I ever invested in EasySpline, perhaps that would be such a big deal.

++++++++

Interesting thread. I messed around with a spline cage and patching to see if it's improved since Sensei's demo of it acting up - and NOT!
Oh, I think it's better than originally: I used to struggle to get ANYthing to work at all. At some point, it got to where I couldn't make it fail even when I tried. That said, it's still very awkward.

hrgiger
02-06-2017, 03:39 PM
If I were to model anything like a car or other surface that has smooth flowing surfaces, sure. You can control output flow fine by defining them in your splines. You don't need to use them to create the whole object, but for laying out your broad forms, an absolutely valid way of modeling. Sometimes its also useful for filling a gap in a mesh by selecting the border points, create splines with them and patching (and I mean irregular or unusual shapes, not just simple shapes which can be patched in much simpler ways.)

jwiede
02-06-2017, 05:12 PM
I do. Mind you, I use EasySpline to do it. I like the accuracy of it. You lay out your splines and where 4 or 3 splines are joined at the ends, it automatically patches the mesh. With easyspline you can set the triangle patches' direction using a priority Vmap, and so you can control poly flow that way. When I'm happy with the mesh, I can freeze it and then turn it into subpatches, and keep the old spline cage in a background layer in case I want to modify anything. You can set how dense the frozen mesh is as well.

Exactly so, I used EasySpline for that kind of modeling as well. Lately, I tend to do that kind of work in FormZ instead, due to richer toolset, etc.

Still, if all you have is LW, I highly recommend using EasySpline for such work, I feel it offers advantages versus "native".


For me, the freezing process always took virtually all the desirable shine off of spline modeling. Had I ever invested in EasySpline, perhaps that would be such a big deal.

Better control over freezing, etc. is definitely a big part of why I prefer EasySpline over "native".

JCG
02-06-2017, 08:06 PM
I love spline modeling because it's so fast and easy to add (insane amounts of) little details and modify your shape with Splinepoint (part of Easyspline), and to add holes without having to clean up the geometry. But I would not even consider spline patching in LW without Easyspline; not ever.

samurai_x
02-06-2017, 09:11 PM
Spline method is probably more advantageous for people who know how to draw.
Making a spline cage of a car, tracing its body contour and outline, then patching it. Really fast way to model cars.
Ask Lewis if he still uses spline modelling to do cars.

Greenlaw
02-06-2017, 11:10 PM
I still do. It depends on the object.

One example I can think of was a dish soap bottle I modeled for a commercial many years ago. The general bottle shape was easy enough but the front and one side of the bottle had these deep assymetrical 'scallop-shape' indentations, which would have been difficult to model without spline patching. Using this technique, I was able to keep the polygons nicely uniform, and I wound up with a much cleaner object than if I used typical Subpatch methods.

(Although, I guess nowadays, I'd probably voxel sculpt this object in 3D Coat and use its retopo tools instead.)

erikals
02-07-2017, 01:19 AM
pretty sure Lewis still does.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXc0a58Yeus

Reco
02-07-2017, 04:06 AM
I am using it more and more. I found it easier to edit splines, than adding deleting edges. Well I still edit an add edges, but only for fine details.

Reco

Kryslin
02-09-2017, 12:20 AM
Hmm, for truly difficult spline modeling, I hop on over to Rhino. I use Spline modeling for aircraft, some spacecraft hulls, and boat hulls.

allabulle
02-09-2017, 03:57 PM
Anyone rebuilding CAD models using curves and LWCAD? Any techniques or approaches recommended? I'm about to do yet another CAD-object-to-3D-texturing-and-rendering and I'd like to try that work-flow for a change. I have LWCAD 5.2 (current.)

If it's not the place I'll start another thread with those questions, but it seemed that they could fit here.

Snosrap
02-09-2017, 06:59 PM
Anyone rebuilding CAD models using curves and LWCAD? Any techniques or approaches recommended? I'm about to do yet another CAD-object-to-3D-texturing-and-rendering and I'd like to try that work-flow for a change. I have LWCAD 5.2 (current.)

If it's not the place I'll start another thread with those questions, but it seemed that they could fit here.

LWCad curves and LW's native curves are two different animals as you probably know. If your object is mechanical in nature and not very organic you could just clean it up using LWCad Reduce and rebuilding parts that are just too far gone. If your objects are organic I'm not sure if there is anything in LWCad to help you out. Hurley's LWRemodeler may be an option or LWBrush from 3rd Powers. Usually with CAD conversion there is just a lot of manual work that needs to take place to get clean meshes.

allabulle
02-09-2017, 07:12 PM
Yes, if using Modeler+LWCAD I try to heavy tessellate the NURBS object if I can (or subdivide the rubbish obj provided (or some other format exported from the CAD original model)) and try to trace it as best I can, using SNAP tools from LWCAD when possible. Otherwise I just put the somewhat similar [to the original NURBS object] polygonal object in a background layer and model away from scratch using the imported object as reference, as if it were a background image, but in 3D.

I was wondering if others found and were willing to share some techniques. But I guess we're all facing the same issues with more or less the same solutions. Importing from CAD and/or NURBS objects is always tedious. And different clients use different softwares AND different versions of each that not always export the same. If it were easy and painless they wouldn't pay us to do it, besides the pretty pictures, I guess. :-)

Thanks for chipping in, Snosrap.

I wonder if there's a way to export curves from CAD files and import them as such in Modeler, with or without LWCAD. Haven't tried that yet.

samurai_x
02-09-2017, 07:44 PM
I would retopo in 3dcoat or modo for cad models.

Snosrap
02-09-2017, 07:47 PM
I import DXF drawings all the time with LWCad. But it's mostly 2d profiles and such that I add to my LWCad library. Pretty simple stuff - I haven't tried anything complex yet. :)

allabulle
02-09-2017, 07:54 PM
EDIT: double post.

allabulle
02-09-2017, 07:58 PM
I would retopo in 3dcoat or modo for cad models.

I'll try that. I felt that 3DCoat for inorganic models was a bit imprecise, I couldn't place polygons where needed easily. The "modeling with polygons" side of it seemed a bit limited. It's been a few projects since I've tried 3DCoat for that, so I may take another look. Thanks for the suggestion.


I import DXF drawings all the time with LWCad. But it's mostly 2d profiles and such that I add to my LWCad library. Pretty simple stuff - I haven't tried anything complex yet. :)

I probably try to do something like that. "Extract" curves from the CAD model and try to re-assemble it with splines or curves in LWCAD. I hope I'll have the time for this project. It's not that complex.

allabulle
02-09-2017, 08:06 PM
Silly anecdote: when I was starting to do 3D (with Alias Power Animator running on SGI's machines, back in the day) I tried a wicked technique learnt from I don't remember where. We used spaghetti half boiled to stick to the surface of an actual model, to "trace" the curves we'd use if they where splines. Once cold and dry, we removed the rigid spaghettis (did we use a hair dryer too to dry them? I don't remember.) Then we either photographed, scanned and placed the splines or NURBS curves accordingly using the photos arranged as reference or, point scanned them with an arm digitizer (don't remember the name of the gadget: was like an articulated arm with a pointer that read the coordinates to create curves.) We never used that technique again, but for a while called spline modeling "spaghetti modeling."

Sorry for shamelessly derailing the thread. I'll behave, now.

jeric_synergy
02-10-2017, 01:06 AM
WHile the spaghetti procedure has, ISTMe, little applicability in today's CG world, I think it would make for pretty awesome non-CG sculpture work.

allabulle
02-13-2017, 05:37 PM
Hehe, probably yes.

jwiede
02-13-2017, 08:15 PM
WHile the spaghetti procedure has, ISTMe, little applicability in today's CG world, I think it would make for pretty awesome non-CG sculpture work.

Hehe, I suspect sculpting in semolina has some major drawbacks... but at least the artist won't stave. :devil:


(should be "an artist" to retain the pattern, oh well)

lesterfoster
02-13-2017, 09:06 PM
I think I have something that is almost ready for 3D printing.
And I made it 100% EasySPLINE

136002

Lewis
03-16-2017, 03:13 AM
I use spline patching for various things (not just cars but for cars when you have only blueprint or photos it's unbeatable IF you have good sense for 3D space so you can visualise car from splines without need to see polygons always :)), product shapes like bottles. Gives me much smoother polys and easy to control polyflow direction.

This one (attach) was built as spline patching for Protons' Book..

Snosrap
03-16-2017, 04:20 PM
Very nice Lewis. I really like the background.

jeric_synergy
03-16-2017, 04:41 PM
This one (attach) was built as spline patching for Protons' Book..
Damn, that's a sweet build.

Be nice to see the splines.

I just wish LW let splines stay "live" longer.

Dodgy
03-16-2017, 05:10 PM
With Easyspline the splines can always be live.

erikals
03-16-2017, 05:12 PM
never got around to buying that one...

jeric_synergy
03-16-2017, 07:23 PM
With Easyspline the splines can always be live.

If I had the business for it, I'd invest in it. --But do we mean the same thing? I meant: "Adjusting the splines adjusts the polygonal mesh."

I certainly never thought it did THAT, which would be fantastic.

erikals
03-16-2017, 07:58 PM
it does, unfortunately TrueArt's demonstration videos are not good at, well, demonstrating it.

he should just give away a free copy to Liberty3D or something like that so they could do a proper demo.

anyway, it looks great.

jeric_synergy
03-16-2017, 11:46 PM
Maybe I can barter one!

Lewis
03-17-2017, 12:20 AM
Here is more screengrabs for few spline patching jobs.

jeric_synergy
03-17-2017, 01:32 AM
You da man, Lewis.

Laundry bottle=my fav.

jwiede
03-17-2017, 10:32 AM
Maybe I can barter one!

If you have any need for working with spline patches in LW, you need EasySpline, it's really that simple. EasySpline makes working with spline patches much, much easier and more efficient than using the native LW patching tools. The native LW patch tools are painfully manual to use, their UX/workflow is very picky/unreliable in comparison.


https://youtu.be/HirMWauajT8

Lewis
03-17-2017, 10:38 AM
The native LW patch tools are painfully manual to use, their UX/workflow is very picky/unreliable in comparison.


Hmm, I'm using native spline patching tool/technique for 17 years by now so i'm curious to hear what part of native spline tools is picky/unreliable ? Can you please elaborate that part, Thanks.

jeric_synergy
03-17-2017, 10:57 AM
1) Sadly, I have no real need, and it's a bit spendy for me.
2) Once upon a time, when I experimented w/SP, it was VERY picky, to the point of unusability. A couple years ago I gave it a shot and it was MUCH more usable for even such a dilettante as myself. I actually couldn't make it NOT patch, which happened my first go 'round. I never got to Lewis' level of competence, of course, but at least it wasn't completely failing, as it had at first.

Certainly if my income were dependent on it, I'd pick up EasySpline, it looks amazing. But for idle curiosity? Too much. According to erikals it could use some video luvvin' to point out its advanced features.

Sensei
03-17-2017, 11:46 AM
Hmm, I'm using native spline patching tool/technique for 17 years by now so i'm curious to hear what part of native spline tools is picky/unreliable ? Can you please elaborate that part, Thanks.

He provided answer on video he attached..

Lewis
03-17-2017, 11:55 AM
He provided answer on video he attached..

Not really, although your plugin is very cool that video is totally wrong demonstration for splien patching tool, nobody needs to patch cylinder when there is perfectly fine cylinder tool.
Also not sure (it's not clear form that video) but in real world patching needs to have X/Y patches number and not just 1 value for both perpendicular and. I rarely need exactly 5*5 or 10*10 but most of time i need different patching segments like 5*2 or 8*4 or 4*3....

Is there settings for different patching number sin your plugin?

Thanks

Sensei
03-17-2017, 12:15 PM
Not really, although your plugin is very cool that video is totally wrong demonstration for splien patching tool, nobody needs to patch cylinder when there is perfectly fine cylinder tool.

Cylinder was just example.
It's showing that you need to click splines in the right order, 4 one by one (otherwise tool won't work, or newly created polygons will be reversed), then run Patcher, then drop the all splines, and repeat, over and over and over again..
It's showing that Auto Patcher is/can be unreliable.



Also not sure (it's not clear form that video) but in real world patching needs to have X/Y patches number and not just 1 value for both perpendicular and. I rarely need exactly 5*5 or 10*10 but most of time i need different patching segments like 5*2 or 8*4 or 4*3....

Is there settings for different patching number sin your plugin?


The same is with sub-patches, and with Auto Patcher.

EasySpline IS sub-patch. Just instead of analyzing polygon vertexes, it's searching for splines in layer. Analyze them, to find where they are connected.

jwiede
03-18-2017, 04:42 AM
Hmm, I'm using native spline patching tool/technique for 17 years by now so i'm curious to hear what part of native spline tools is picky/unreliable ? Can you please elaborate that part, Thanks.

Lewis,

The two areas where I've had the most problems with LW's native Patcher (and Auto-Patcher) involve:

1. Working with patches bounded by segments of a larger, closed spline as one or two "sides" of the patch (the video clearly demonstrates the issue -- LW will patch using the "outside" part of the closed spline, as opposed to the bounded region). While the simple "circle" case may not be practical in your eyes, the issue still happened when the closed splines were more complex than simple circles as well.

2. The other issue I encountered quite often involved selecting a long spline (but with few knots/"points" composing it) where LW simply wouldn't patch, acting as if that long spline had no regions that intersected the other selected boundary splines. Close as I was able to determine at the time, it had something to do with the number of knots/points present in the spline (or perhaps the intersecting region), as increasing the density of knots in the spline would sometimes resolve the issue.

The issues I was having with LW's splines played a big part in my motivation for purchasing the TrueArt Modeling Pack at the time (it was one of my early plugin purchases, I've owned a license for a _long_ time). It's quite possible there have been fixes to LW's native spline tools since then. Testing with old files in modern Modeler, I'm not encountering the same level of unreliability w.r.t. issue 2 above, though issue 1 still appears to be a problem. I still feel the native patcher's continual need to explicitly re-select all boundaries before patching (as noted in the video) is much more manual/"picky" compared to EasySpline's workflow -- esp. when working with objects where a few long (possibly closed) curves are common across a bunch of different individual patches/surfaces.

Hope that helps explain. I've since moved away from Modeler (for spline/patch work, I much prefer working in Form-Z now). Still, for anyone who's using LW for spline/patch modeling, I strongly recommend they try EasySpline.

Lewis
03-18-2017, 04:56 AM
Hi John!

Thanks for info, i was mostly thinking of manual patcher (i never use Autopatcher since i want specific number of rows ;)) mostly wondering what do you think by unreliable 'coz like i said i had no unreliability issues all those yeas :). Sure it's "picky" BUT only 'coz users didn't follow simple rules, All intersecting splines must be connected by point and u you can't have closed loop spline to make it work and it has to be 3 or 4 splines. Wen you "obey" that rules it always works as expected.

Sensei - can you show me with your plugin is it possible to patch segment with different segments number i.e. patch 4 splines with 5*2 ? I was interested in that plugin long ago when you presented it but i never found video which shows different perpendicular and parallel number of patches and i need that option all the time.

Thanks

samurai_x
03-18-2017, 05:33 AM
Its an autopatcher. I doubt it can assign rows and columns manually. :D

I do use an autopatcher in another app and its probably the same way as Sensei's

The issue Lewis points out is sometimes a small patch will need fewer rows or columns so that its less dense. Thats a valid point.

But these days its so easy to select and delete edge loops. So to me its less an issue.

If there are 10 "areas" to cover with patches, you would be selecting 4 splines per patch and then hit patch function in lw. If you're unlucky the patch would be flipped since there's no consistent way to know which normal direction it would patch in lw afaik.
Then select the next 4 splines then hit patch. Rinse and repeat 10 times to fill 10 patches. Sometimes you use the flip poly function and manually weld points to connect edgeloops, too.

With an autopatcher those 10 areas to patch would be one click.
After that just delete the edgeloops that you don't want. There's no flipping polys or welding points to connect edgeloops.

For me the benefits of an autopatcher outweigh the negative.

Lewis
03-18-2017, 05:45 AM
The issue Lewis points out is sometimes a small patch will need fewer rows or columns so that its less dense. Thats a valid point.


Good for you, for me it's always that way and on longer car panels like A to C pillar roof area, i often need like 15*3 or so to cover lenght, or wheel arches i need 10*2 or even 10*1 so always getting exact same on X and Y would be problematic for my workflow. I guess we use it for different things :).



If you're unlucky the patch would be flipped since there's no consistent way to know which normal direction it would patch in lw afaik.

Ofcourse there is a way to know it, i know exactly which way are they going to face and which is going to be longer or shorter number of patches. It depends on selecting order, it is either CCW or CW order. That determines normal facing in LW native patcher (manual one, i don't use autopatcher as i mentioned earlier).

erikals
03-18-2017, 09:17 AM
But these days its so easy to select and delete edge loops. So to me its less an issue.
yes, still leaves an Ngon though (as it keeps endpoints)

bandglue however works

this is once again where i'd like global settings in LW modeler, where you can choose what global settings different tools should use.


always a challenge with 0pp / 1pp / 2pp

i use an AHK scripts that makes things a bit easier

samurai_x
03-18-2017, 09:32 AM
Good for you, for me it's always that way and on longer car panels like A to C pillar roof area, i often need like 15*3 or so to cover lenght, or wheel arches i need 10*2 or even 10*1 so always getting exact same on X and Y would be problematic for my workflow. I guess we use it for different things :).



Ofcourse there is a way to know it, i know exactly which way are they going to face and which is going to be longer or shorter number of patches. It depends on selecting order, it is either CCW or CW order. That determines normal facing in LW native patcher (manual one, i don't use autopatcher as i mentioned earlier).

If you get the same x and y rows its easy to remove or add edgeloops now. Many ways to do it as erikals mentioned one.
But selecting 4 splines and hitting splinepatch function for many many many parts of a car is very time consuming. Select 4 splines then patch then weld points. Over and over for every patch. :D

The idea is the same as sculpting in zbrush and traditional polymodelling complex objects.

When I didn't know zbrush I thought sculpting then retopo is slower than going straight to polymodelling. Its not slower its super fast because you don't have to think while creating the object. ANd then when you retopo you're just following the shape. Extremely fast so many people create more complex(but efficient) mesh with zbrush sculpting.


Are you sure? In my experience CCW or CW doesn't make a difference. Sometimes its flipped. So which way is it supposed to be? I will try in my old cars splinecage.

Edit. Right I just noticed now. Poly normal in perspective viewport is predictable with CW or CCW.
CW will make poly normal opposite your view. CCW will make poly normal face viewer. I just noticed after 15 years. :D

samurai_x
03-18-2017, 10:18 AM
Manual spline patching in lw. Its been a while I don't really do cars in lw anymore. And Modo absolutely sucks at spling modelling. :D


https://youtu.be/49a_BejI6qM

1 min to patch 5 areas. I'm sure Lewis can do this in 20 secs.
I got lucky the last part the rows lined up perfectly so welding was not an issue.

Is Sensei's autopatcher faster? If so I think it s a good investment.

Lewis
03-18-2017, 10:54 AM
Edit. Right I just noticed now. Poly normal in perspective viewport is predictable with CW or CCW.
CW will make poly normal opposite your view. CCW will make poly normal face viewer. I just noticed after 15 years. :D

See, i told you :D.

I noticed "only" after 2, but then i've not read manuals so maybe it's documented :) :D.

samurai_x
03-18-2017, 11:12 AM
See, i told you :D.

I noticed "only" after 2, but then i've not read manuals so maybe it's documented :) :D.

Yeah but I'm sure you're older than me so you discovered earlier. :D :D
I don't read manual either.

So how long to patch that car chassis manually?
And Sensei's autopatcher should do it in 5 secs since its an autopatcher. The more patch areas the more manual labor.
I can't dismiss the value of smart autopatching scripts if Sensei's is doing everything automatically even welding, etc.

Lewis
03-18-2017, 11:18 AM
When i create full spline cage i takes me 10-20 minutes to patch it with various segment patches, Auto patching never does what i want now will this one 'coz i need 2 different values.

Not saiyng it's not usable or good plugin 'coz it is, i just don't see it in my wokrflow due reasons i already named. Bandglueing and removing edges will not work in all situations (esp 'coz remove edges leaves open edge points behind) so it's just personal taste then.

jwiede
03-19-2017, 01:53 PM
All intersecting splines must be connected by point and u you can't have closed loop spline to make it work and it has to be 3 or 4 splines.

Lewis, that restriction of no closed splines is a serious limitation, IMO (and not a particularly well-documented one either, IIRC). Had it been clearly indicated, I doubt I would have even attempted to use LW's native patching in the first place -- the profile splines I was working with were often ALL closed splines.

At the very least, LW should test for and indicate at use it doesn't understand how to process closed splines, rather than attempting to process them yielding pathological results. Detecting it's been handed a closed spline is hardly a difficult or complex test. This is just another instance where rather than examine operands (and report problems), LW instead silently accepts the operands and allows the tool to go "off the rails" and operate in a pathological state (quite possibly taking the overall app state with it).

The fact that we continue to see similarly-flawed UX/operand handling even in recently-coded new features suggests LW3DG still don't adequately understand WHY such patterns harm quality -- and that's ongoing reason for concern.

Stardust
03-27-2017, 01:13 PM
I think this is the modeling technique I was looking for!

I've beens studying some industrial designers and they start out by drawing circles and elipses (On paper), which intersect, then they do a front, side and perspective drawing of those elipses and basically their entire object is described with a handfull of curves. Then they went and actually built actual wires of the main curves, intersected them in 3D space and built an actually mesh around those elipses and then built the skin using plaster or whatever.

This technique impressed me very much from a design point of view, within 2 days of seeing this technique, I already have about 200 different object designs in my head... and my head is now "intersecting" elipses non-stop...

I'm not seeking to recreate objects, but much rather to design my own and this technique would be ideal for that, If there's an easy way in LW to do it.. Dunno if splines are the thing... there used to be a thing called "Metaballs"...

A visual to explain what I mean would be this...136355

This is literrally just a handfull intersecting elipsis...

erikals
03-27-2017, 01:32 PM
imo, choose what you are more more comfortable with at a given object, SP or SubD

personally i'm a so-so "Patcher" and therefor often go the SubD route.

there are a few cases where i prefer one technique over the other, but quite rarely.

maybe a pro "Patcher" could tell you... Lewis...

Lewis
03-27-2017, 01:56 PM
Spline Patching and SubDs aren't mutually exclusive. I do spline patching to get SubDs model at end :).

erikals
03-27-2017, 03:13 PM
yeah, i just did a test now where one solution was to mix patches that ended up as SubDs, that would be merged with another SubD object.

i wish i was more pro at both SuBD / SplinePatching, but agh... time... :)

luckily we have a Professional around to ask :)
when it comes to modeling, i always wonder "what is Lewis' answer" :D

erikals
03-27-2017, 03:41 PM
...A visual to explain what I mean would be this...136355
This is literrally just a handfull intersecting elipsis...

one method >


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azSe47II79U


one could continue from there.
just one of many techniques...

the intersection area between objects have to have a "good" polyflow.
it's crucial.
you could smack together objects using for example MetaMesh, but often (depending) it wouldn't give you a good enough polyflow.

Stardust
03-27-2017, 04:28 PM
I have a feeling... it's gonna be awhile before I get the results I really want :)

LOL - Funny.. I just watched that ;)

OK, lets say.. a SIMPLE way to intersect this elipsis, like in that video.. once you have the curves you want... extract the curves and then patch them? If that makes any sense at all

... well go figure.... now I can't find any of the drawings to explain what I mean :)

erikals
03-27-2017, 04:50 PM
the main "spear" is faster done in SubD imo

so it's about mixing the shapes from there on.

also check plugin >


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gM91R-iAqec