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View Full Version : Microsoft announces Studio Pro ...and it looks amazing



robertoortiz
10-28-2016, 03:44 PM
Here is the commercial
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzMLA8YIgG0

And here is the presentation:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFP_7dbBZkw

I will let the product speak for itself...

TheLexx
10-28-2016, 04:10 PM
It looks really good, and I've seen some people speculate that the Wacom professional range has very serious competition now.

Schwyhart
10-28-2016, 04:26 PM
For the first time in years, I'm more interested in a PC than Mac.

djwaterman
10-29-2016, 01:35 AM
The actual hardware and software looks really good, but I'm less sure about the Microsoft creative products, like will people be ditching their favorite content creation tools in favor of these things that come with the Surface Studio? It sure looks nice, I wonder how true that is about the no lag in the pen when used with Photoshop brushes.

Spinland
10-29-2016, 05:13 AM
Most interesting. I use Macs in my Studio because PCs brought me too many IT headaches, but I am not even close to being a rabid Apple fanboi. I use the tool I feel is best for the job. This looks very cool and I shall be watching closely to see how it takes off in creative circles when people actually start using and talking about it.

gerry_g
10-29-2016, 08:52 AM
Im impressed by what Microsoft is doing lately but every creative piece of software they produce seems to get canned at some point, Mack iOS seems to do better by comparison though not always, I'm currently playing with Auxy, a FREE app on my iPadPro and I still can't believe the guy is giving it away, totally crazy, oh and that dial thing, there was a Griffin iMate looked just the same, could use it as a video scrubber or volume control, never really caught on, I suspect the same fate for the new Windows device

https://youtu.be/gKfEcFhTRZ4

sadkkf
10-29-2016, 09:21 AM
Microsoft hardware has never impressed me. Phone, music players, keyboards...all crap, IMO. MS Office is still one of the least intuitive packages I've ever used. Their dial does look interesting, however, though I'm still trying to understand how it would be faster than keyboard shortcuts.

Dan Ritchie
10-29-2016, 10:56 AM
Their dial does look interesting, however, though I'm still trying to understand how it would be faster than keyboard shortcuts.

Assuming it has sensitive control like a jog shuttle, I'd guess it's good for doing realtime input for various things that aren't easily controlled with an on/off button. They show it being used to cycle through color hue while painting. There are any number of other parameters I suppose you could control with it more precisely.

tburbage
10-29-2016, 03:10 PM
Assuming it has sensitive control like a jog shuttle, I'd guess it's good for doing realtime input for various things that aren't easily controlled with an on/off button. They show it being used to cycle through color hue while painting. There are any number of other parameters I suppose you could control with it more precisely.

My first thought when seeing that hardware gadget used on the screen was why a hardware gadget vs. simultaneous pen and touch, with touch being with HUD controls... It will be interesting to see it applied to get a better idea.

tburbage
10-29-2016, 03:20 PM
I think this looks very promising.

But along with the new touch bar on the MacBook laptops, taking full advantage will require a lot of UX thought and then platform/hardware-specific implementation by the developers of our favorite CG apps to really take advantage of them.

fablefox
10-30-2016, 04:47 AM
looks like a specialized winning product.

need to watch this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMklcdzcNcU

and also the video on ars technica article nearing the end:

http://arstechnica.co.uk/gadgets/2016/10/microsoft-surface-studio-pc-hands-on/

to see how app developer will utilize this. I don't know how much it will help in 3D, but there are a lot of sectors out there and many will greatly improved by this.

samurai_x
10-30-2016, 08:00 PM
Are they using last generation hardware on this expensive product?

fablefox
10-30-2016, 11:59 PM
Are they using last generation hardware on this expensive product?

I've read somewhere that such devices uses the one they tested in the product creation (read: not latest). Stability and fully tested is one of the reason.

They doesn't want to sell devices priced around $3500 (?) and have it explode like latest Samsung phone.

I guess it really depending on the market. High end 3d users may not purchase it for lack of upgrade-ability, but if you see from the video - there are a lot of market sector that don't care about latest and greatest in term on underlying hardware. They want something that work and stable. And from the presentation, such hardware is more than enough to deliver it.

samurai_x
10-31-2016, 01:18 AM
You're citing a rare example. Several dozen phone manufacturers produce hundreds of phone models a year. Samsung was just unlucky with the latest note.
Comparing a phone with high capacity fast charge batteries to a workstation is not even fair or logical.
MS is bringing out a workstation with a premium price. It should carry this years flagship components not last year.

Edit,
https://www.engadget.com/2016/10/28/microsoft-surface-studio-designer-reaction/
Olly Skillman-Wilson, a game artist working on The Signal From Tölva, However, he can't justify the cost for "the specs of a desktop from two years ago,"

$3,000 model comes with an Intel Core i5 processor, 8GB of RAM, a 2GB GeForce GTX 965M GPU and a 1TB hybrid drive

8 gig of ram? That's like a mid level laptop. :D

Spinland
10-31-2016, 02:52 AM
Heh. Okay, so this is less an actual workstation and more a jumped-up Cintiq, it seems.

Spinland
10-31-2016, 02:55 AM
Question that came to my mind while watching some of the videos: if this device shifts height with zero effort, what if I want to draw on it at some height other than fully down? Sometimes I wail on my Wacom pretty hard (you should see some of my mangled stylus tips after a hard day) so unless there's some way to lock it into place not sure I'd want to be forced to hold it in position with one hand to keep from mashing it flat to the desktop.

gerry_g
10-31-2016, 04:40 AM
Not a jumped up Cintiq at all something orders of magnitude far far superior, I could never see myself using a Cintiq - parallax problem, low res poor quality and too small a screen, bulky in size, ridiculous clutter of oversized cables, takes up space additional to my computer setup – I am Wacom user and have been for some fifteen years and never once have I been tempted by a Cintiq, this actually looks nice, drawing on a 4k 30" screen is as far removed from Wacom's offering as it currently possible to get, my main reservation would be that a tablet lets me sit down comfortably with this I would me standing or on a tall chair and hunched over, not good, also the palm rejection issue,I have a iPad Pro and drawing on that is great but palm rejection isn't perfect, then there is the actual mechanics of drawing, I tend to sketch on a 30" monitor zoomed in by a factor of 250/350% to give me better control, zooming in and out is a lot easier on a tablet than on a screen the software often mistakes you gestures for pen input if you move too fast.

Spinland
10-31-2016, 04:49 AM
Fair enough. Yeah, I've been an Intuos guy through several iterations of that brand and have also never felt the urge to get a Cintiq. I agree with you on the negatives.

Shabazzy
11-01-2016, 04:38 PM
...MS is bringing out a workstation with a premium price. It should carry this years flagship components not last year.

Edit,
https://www.engadget.com/2016/10/28/microsoft-surface-studio-designer-reaction/
Olly Skillman-Wilson, a game artist working on The Signal From Tölva, However, he can't justify the cost for "the specs of a desktop from two years ago,"

$3,000 model comes with an Intel Core i5 processor, 8GB of RAM, a 2GB GeForce GTX 965M GPU and a 1TB hybrid drive

8 gig of ram? That's like a mid level laptop. :D

I think you're looking at this far too much from a consumers perspective.

From a manufacturers stand point this product will undoubtedly start off at a high price due to the fact that it is a brand new concept from Microsoft. They've never made anything like this before and as such it's going to be expensive.

Scales of economies will no doubt lower the price over time, but it's important to remember that there is a LOT more to this product than just processors, memory, storage and graphics cards. There are custom designed and manufactured processes that need to be considered and investments recouped. That's why it's targeted to a certain market sector with the hope that it will appeal and they can make enough profit to release newer lower priced versions.

Think Elon Musk's master plan for Tesla.

The Tesla Master Plan (web link) (https://www.tesla.com/en_GB/blog/master-plan-part-deux?redirect=no)

wesleycorgi
11-02-2016, 05:40 AM
I think the product is intriguing, but I find the dial is a gimmick that will fall by the wayside. Even if Studio succeeds, the dial is a paid accessory and solves a problem that really isn't there IMO. We have a bunch of Lenovo 27" touch screen PCs that shipped with 2 touchscreen game accessories, including joysticks that rested on the glass and provided user Interaction. We use the lenovos for trade show demos, so these accessories ended up in the bin. But at least these were part of the system, not an accessory.

I think Microsoft is going after the high end Apple user base especially those who are content creators, because Apple has partially abandoned the pro designer in their pursuit of iOS based products. Hopefully Apple responds to the competition and innovate in a way that doesn't deliver a new trash can or at least creates a trash can that addresses more needs for digital content creation.

Ernest
11-03-2016, 10:27 PM
Looks like Dell is joining the fray.

http://techreport.com/news/30909/dell-teases-a-surface-studio-competitor


Microsoft made a splash last week with its creator-focused Surface Studio all-in-one desktop PC. Windows Central reports that Dell is throwing its hat into the ring with a machine it showed at Adobe's Max conference in San Diego. Dell showed a 90-second clip of its new machine, along with a Surface Dial-like input device and a second display that serves double duty as both a keyboard and digital clipboard.

Shabazzy
11-04-2016, 12:02 AM
Looks like Dell is joining the fray.

http://techreport.com/news/30909/dell-teases-a-surface-studio-competitor

I can't wait for the comparison reviews.

jwiede
11-04-2016, 12:12 AM
zooming in and out is a lot easier on a tablet than on a screen the software often mistakes you gestures for pen input if you move too fast.

Unless, maybe, you had a big dial to control, say, zoom level... :devil:

Just sayin'.

gerry_g
11-04-2016, 04:47 AM
Yes it occurred to me the dial may be modal, but that is still slow as you have to select mode then zoom, with a conventional tablet/monitor setup its either hotkey+drag laterally on tablet (or tablet scroll wheel in other apps) I believe even a Cintiq has a control bar much like a tablet, gesture based navigation is sow by comparison as you have to give the software a second to understand your intentions, find it hard to understand why they do not simply execute an on-screen nav panel that is universal to the OS and be done with it, hardware idea is limited ,expensive and prone to being replaced with the much improved version two the minute you decide to purchase the original

Dillon
11-04-2016, 08:04 AM
I tried out the Studio with Dial at our local Microsoft Store in San Francisco.

After just a couple minutes playing in various paint programs, I was sold.

The ability to select tools with one hand while painting in another at the same time is something. Doing it on a large 28" canvas feels very completing. I could zoom in on a segment of an image I was working on just by using the natural pinch gesture I've been using on my cell phone for years.

This kind of natural input while painting felt liberating. Using the dial to change the size or color of a brush mid stroke is amazing. What Microsoft has created here is going to unleash a torrent of new creativity that's been bottled up inside a lot of artists, because creating art through a keyboard and mouse combination can be stifling to some people's creativity (like me). I've had a wacom tablet for decades, but it's just not the same as drawing directly on the screen, and having direct control over the image. The cintiq doesn't come close to what the Studio does.

This thing, and all other clones of it, are going to be transformative.

Spinland
11-04-2016, 08:18 AM
I tried out the Studio with Dial at our local Microsoft Store in San Francisco.

After just a couple minutes playing in various paint programs, I was sold.

How well did it hold various intermediate height placements while applying pressure to the screen from drawing and such? Does it lock into place?

Dillon
11-04-2016, 08:21 AM
How well did it hold various intermediate height placements while applying pressure to the screen from drawing and such? Does it lock into place?

It felt natural. When it was laid down, it was easy to just lean in, and literally lean on the screen to paint. Like painting on a real medium. At any other angle (rising up), I didn't feel any inclination to lean on the screen. Just like painting on an easel.

It doesn't really lock into any position, it just floats at the angle you leave it. When laid nearly flat, it's easy to lean on. And at the other end, it acts more like a big, beautiful digital easel that I can paint on.

Brilliant engineering.

Spinland
11-04-2016, 08:26 AM
So at the other-than-flat angles you didn't have issues with it wanting to fold down on you while you were interacting with it, even painting with some pressure?

Julez4001
11-04-2016, 09:26 AM
I think paint programs and Zbrush will benefit, I just don't know if Modeling will get a boost in "ease".

jwiede
11-04-2016, 05:18 PM
So at the other-than-flat angles you didn't have issues with it wanting to fold down on you while you were interacting with it, even painting with some pressure?

The "hinges" are stiff enough that shouldn't really an issue. And if Surface 3 and 4 hinges are any indication (they should be, design-wise), loss of stiffness over time should be fairly minimal.

IANSFMS, YMMV, IANAL, etc.

Spinland
11-04-2016, 05:52 PM
The "hinges" are stiff enough that shouldn't really an issue. And if Surface 3 and 4 hinges are any indication (they should be, design-wise), loss of stiffness over time should be fairly minimal.

IANSFMS, YMMV, IANAL, etc.

:thumbsup: Thanks!