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jeric_synergy
08-22-2016, 11:56 PM
Here's a cheap-o trick! (VPR render using the "negative thickness" hack):

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This object was constructed (by accident) and rendered by:


Lathing a CUBE, which results only in POINTS being created
Selecting a ring of points
hitting "p" to construct a (crazy) polygon
using STRANDMAKER to convert the (crazy) polygon into a bunch of 2pt polys
Importing to Layout
Using -0.03mtrs line thickness in the Object: Edges tab

Actually, this is 2 loops of points. --VERY oddly, I was just researching moire patterns earlier today. Huh! Synchronicity!

erikals
08-23-2016, 01:57 AM
Dang cool trick isn't it?!  :)

thank you for the preview. an excellent time / memory saving technique.  :)

prometheus
08-23-2016, 05:14 AM
Try and print that out as true 3d form.. with the render trick :D

Yes..renderlines in layout, if a render is all you need, that will be good enough.
you do not need strandmaker for this, though it depends on what you prefer, you could simply just select all edges and copy, kill the polygons and paste back the edges.

If you would want to print the stuff, you could try with the skin modifier in blender, though I have noticed that it can be slow to handle to many edges.
in blender you can also twist the edges/polychain and have the skin mesh follow without actually distorting the mesh points..it will just deform based on the distortion of the edges if you apply the deformer in a level before the skin modifier , so all kinds of weird twisted branches or structures can be made that way...You can also connect each edge, vertice so you get a skin bridge between them, but now I am going off topic as I often do.

erikals
08-23-2016, 06:24 AM
nah, for that you use Truss2


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMLs9-tJTu8


still the trick mentioned by Jeric is great for cities, where low poly-count is important.

use 2 point poly chains for a fence for example, or pipes on a building.

excellent!  :)

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Blender might be cool though, installed it yesterday. http://www.erikalstad.com/emoti/matrix.gif


an earlier thread by the way, by... Prometheus
http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?150432-How-would-you-model-this-in-lightwave-SpiderCage-form

prometheus
08-23-2016, 07:28 AM
nah, for that you use Truss2


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMLs9-tJTu8


still the trick mentioned by Jeric is great for cities, where low poly-count is important.

use 2 point poly chains for a fence for example, or pipes on a building.

excellent!  :)

----------------

Blender might be cool though, installed it yesterday. http://www.erikalstad.com/emoti/matrix.gif


an earlier thread by the way, by... Prometheus
http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?150432-How-would-you-model-this-in-lightwave-SpiderCage-form


yes..and if I would use that spider cage in blender, I would also be able to twist the underlying (skeleton) edges without actually distoring the mesh other than have it follow the edge deformation, I could add twisting to it etc, this would not be possible in lightwave modeler.

Truss will not be able to perform joined joints, you would have to do without it if scene and task allows it, or manually weld the joints...which is tedious, and once all that is done, you can not edit the edges, polychain and have the mesh follow, as you can with skin modifier, you could go with metalink in layout..but no where nere the full edit control you have in blender.
I will try and record some more of it and put up on youtube, but I think it isnīt proper to post it on newtek forums unless it is a combo with lightwave.

the skin modifier is uber cool, you can whip up base mesh ala zbrush in no time and keep it all editable, you can select individual vertices and ctrl a scale joints or any part vertices where you split the mesh, same with edges, you can extrude the edges/skelegon and have the mesh follow instantly, and yesterday I also learned how o perform a bridge with it, simpley select two vertices and make edge/face, and the skin modifier creates a bridge..and you can at anytime split the edges with subdivide, or ctrl bevel to smooth round a straight edge, or use subdiv surface modifier to smooth the edge, and all this with the skin modifier active in real time, and how dense the mesh is can be controlled with a subdiv surface modifer.

You need to learn to make the skelegon/edge wire visible and perhaps set the color edit wireframe to some strong color so you will be able to see it properly, in preferences tab, and you can see the UI changes directly with an active object..so that is great.
also great that the mesh result can be shown in opengl with a matcap material, as well as ambien occusion, especilly good when sculpting.

Previously I had a bit of too little knowledge on how to work with..and create vertices or edges in blender, thus I often made them in lightwave first then to blender for skinning, but know I have learned most of that so I may be able to work it out directly in blender, I would probably still use lightwave to render stuff out though.


note the tiny green wire edges, those are editable at any time with various tools, move, splitting, dividing, use subdiv surface divisions, smoothing vertices, extending them, bridging them by creating a line between two vertices and a resulting mesh bridge from that.

after you are satisfied, save it out as editable blender file so you can continue to work with it and re- edit, then just go on to apply the modifier so it becomes available for proper sculpting on it if thatīs what you want to do to finnish of with some coolness.

Note..any edges or even skelegon and even genoma rigs can be exported to blender and have the skin modifier created around it, and sent back without a need to pose the genoma rig to a mesh that otherwise is diffent in itīs posing state.

Im gonna make more room on my harddrive, then record something later..maybe tonight.



http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=134147&d=1471958640

erikals
08-23-2016, 09:03 AM
looks cool alright   :)

not sure what i would use it for, but probably some alien / organic stuff  (?)

e Questionar... can one export obj from app X, import it into Blender, run Skin Modifier ?

prometheus
08-23-2016, 10:05 AM
looks cool alright   :)

not sure what i would use it for, but probably some alien / organic stuff  (?)

e Questionar... can one export obj from app X, import it into Blender, run Skin Modifier ?

yes..Lightwave obj at least, and most likely any other with proper obj export, or use lightwave import.
You could for instance create lsystems in houdini and export out only the wire and apply skin modifier, though it is highly questionable why you would wanīt that..since you simply can skin lsystem in houdini.
But for instance hair fibres perhaps in zbrush etc.

What is cool that with one of the point recorder or particle recorder plugins that exist for lightwave, you could either trace an objects vertices that yields a polychain path based on any object spinning and rotating or just moving in layout, convert it to a polychain in lightwave, then export to obj or lwo for skinning it all in blender, so a wireframe trussing based on particle motions or vertices in lightwave can be performed...

Note.. you can shrink wrap polychain or even dp tree stuff on to other objects, or dynamicly deform match polychains in lightwave to an object, then send to blender for skinning to get roots, or snakey stuff wrapped around a body, or just twisted forms to print out as lamps or vase etc on your table.

And to note, itīs super easy to copy any edge, like in symmetry mode in lightwave on a flat grid, to extract a figure skeleton then paste back and delete the polygons, then send as obj or lighwave file and skin mesh it in blender, or simply use skelegons or genoma rigs.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC_CWqtFPaE&list=PLdaQ-nxd0g2dM40IQ-J3c1Or4Cm6i1t8F



And hereīs a playlist of skin modifier and combo with lightwave, however I need to update with some more stuff that I described earlier, skin scaling per vertice or edge, and bridging vertices to performa skin bridge.
Thereīs some old stuff with lightwave metaedges in there..which isnīt unpar with blenders skin modifier obviously, You could also just search blender stuff for skin modifier, I think blender guru has some some too.

Playlist skin modifier with lightwave edges..
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLdaQ-nxd0g2dM40IQ-J3c1Or4Cm6i1t8F

prometheus
08-23-2016, 10:25 AM
Using line pen in ligthwave and then obj export to blender and skin modifier for skinning, though you could much easier just copy edges from a grid.
And when proefficient in blender, you could simply add a point and extend that or copy edges from objects in blender directly and delete faces and skin the edges you got there.
To note is that you can extend from the same vertice several times to get multibranch or lims like fingers from the same origin point.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mIA297z_jw&list=PLdaQ-nxd0g2dM40IQ-J3c1Or4Cm6i1t8F&index=5

erikals
08-23-2016, 11:13 AM
Cool   :)

safetyman
08-24-2016, 05:12 AM
Try the wireframe modifier in Blender -- basically gives all edges a thickness and can have its own color separate from the model itself... and it's non-destructive.

I always like that LW "hack", but it frustrated me that it was only a render time deal.

prometheus
08-24-2016, 06:17 AM
Try the wireframe modifier in Blender -- basically gives all edges a thickness and can have its own color separate from the model itself... and it's non-destructive.

I always like that LW "hack", but it frustrated me that it was only a render time deal.

wireframe is for trussing of object edges, skin is for edges, polychains, really no need to use wireframe, in fact it may be harder to use if you have arrayed multi objects, and I donīt think you can go in and edit the same way you can with skin modifier on edges.
I would say it is probably better to simply copy edges of an object(or use strandmaker to get the edges) and only use that instead of the full mesh, depends on maybe, with wireframe and object you could do face modeling operation in edit mode (but not seeing the wireframe?) and then switch back to object mode an see the wireframe update...weird you can not see the wireframe in edit mode, or I may be wrong?

What is cool though, is that you can switch to sculpt mode, use drag and push the wireframe structure only ..so the mesh only follow the deformation of the wireframe, or skin if you use that, and brushs sculpt isnīt deforming directly on the mesh, so you maintain mesh topology, until you apply the wireframe deformer and remove it from the stack, then you can choose to sculpt directly on the actuall mesh.

Michael

safetyman
08-25-2016, 05:23 AM
You can see the wireframe in edit mode.
134161

And if you use a vertex group with it you can get some cool effects like this:

134162

prometheus
08-25-2016, 08:02 AM
You can see the wireframe in edit mode.
134161

And if you use a vertex group with it you can get some cool effects like this:

134162

Yes it is powerful, especially since you can either scale the actual edge, or go in to ctrl- a while in edit and in either edge or vertex mode and use scale skin (ctrl-a)
I also noted it can perform multi bridge, like if you pick one vertex and then another one for a one bridge skin, but you can select many more in one go and perform a multibridge at once.
What I do have issues with though with skin modifier, it doesnīt seem to work with extender when usin the standard mesh options x mirror, editing for move works, but not extender.
If you on the other hand use a mirror modifier, extender will work..it simply duplicates it all to the other side, but then you will have a problem if you have a straight spine edge in the middle, since that will be duplicate mirror as well, so you would have a double middle section.