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jaxtone
02-08-2016, 07:28 AM
Anyone know how come the Sea Shell tool doesnīt work in Lightwave 11.6?

MonroePoteet
02-08-2016, 08:36 AM
It seems to work fine for me in V11.6.3. Do you have some geometry created for it to work with? Seashell is an "Extend" type plug-in, so it needs some base geometry to work with, like a downward-facing disc in Layer 1.

mTp

prometheus
02-08-2016, 08:41 AM
yep...it is a multiply tool, so make curve or polys and run it, but..it wonīt start directly, you have to enter the numeric tab and drop down menu and activate, silly we have those, why not a simply checkbox, on and off, and also on or off by default to check..easy as a pie :)

tested on modeler 11.6.2 32 bit.

must add...better to use polychain or geometry than curves, it will otherwise cap the geometry based on a closed curve, which will probably cause overlapping polys.

Michael

jaxtone
02-08-2016, 10:36 AM
Hi all!

Well it seems like itīs one of the crappiest tools I ever experienced in Lightwave. You are definetely right Promotheus... it creates a hell lot of extra polys that would take a lifetime to edit :)

Wonder why it is still in the software as an internal feature when it more looks like a joke. I guess it wouldnīt take a lifetime for any software developers at Newtek to create something better than this!

I donīt know about the tips and tricks you just mentioned but it would probably take a lot less time to figure that out than edit that insane seashell!

Jack

Thomas Leitner
02-08-2016, 11:55 AM
Hi all!

Well it seems like itīs one of the crappiest tools I ever experienced in Lightwave. You are definetely right Promotheus... it creates a hell lot of extra polys that would take a lifetime to edit :)

Wonder why it is still in the software as an internal feature when it more looks like a joke. I guess it wouldnīt take a lifetime for any software developers at Newtek to create something better than this!

I donīt know about the tips and tricks you just mentioned but it would probably take a lot less time to figure that out than edit that insane seashell!

Jack

Hi Jack,
you must understand how the tool works. You cannot start with a centered polygon. Because the polygon is turned around an axis and extruded, the seashell tool will create unwanded polygons. Start with a polygon aligned to to - X axis.

To use "Make UVs" in the sea shell tool you have to create a UV map for your poly first (this is so for many modeler tools).

ciao
Thomas

prometheus
02-08-2016, 12:10 PM
Hi Jack,
you must understand how the tool works. You cannot start with a centered polygon. Because the polygon is turned around an axis and extruded, the seashell tool will create unwanded polygons. Start with a polygon aligned to to - X axis.

To use "Make UVs" in the sea shell tool you have to create a UV map for your poly first (this is so for many modeler tools).

ciao
Thomas

True...

hereīs a simple one..attached lwo template on the first layer, the second layer is finished...after deleting ngons, and then thickened.

and to Jack...I only said it creates unwanted geometry with curves, not if you position original geometry correctly as Thomas pointed out, and after running the command, one just need to open the numeric panel and select ngons and delete, doesnīt take a lifetime, only two seconds maybe.

http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=132304&d=1454958555
132304

jeric_synergy
02-08-2016, 12:22 PM
I >>DO<< wish there was a "New UV" option in the Numeric Panel, as there are in two(?) other places, one being "New Image", which actually opens a file dialog, where such functionality has been included. (There's another place where you can create an entity but I'm disremembering it.)

Seems pretty obvious Low Hanging Fruit. Having to go back and create a new UV map when just about to model is a repeating theme here.

In short: Adding "Make New UV" to the MAKE UV functionality would be Good.

jeric_synergy
02-08-2016, 12:29 PM
Whipped this up in about 5 seconds: I think you seriously underestimate this tool.
132305

OTOH: why are only integers allowed in SHIFT PER LOOP???? :devil:

@^@ I think TORUS2 by ArtW might be the way to go here.

jaxtone
02-08-2016, 04:58 PM
Damn, you are good, all of you! I put myself on the shame shelf and try to understand how you managed to use this tool so good!

Maybe this was my big mistake. I followed a tutorial from the web where the guy used the y-direction when he started the process! (could I have missed that he twisted the whole plane before he started the tutorial?)

Thomas! Sometimes the egg of Columbo is relevant nowadays as well! The X-factor made it clear! Thanks!
Promotheus! Thanks for the shell to study. It looks great! But in some way I find it hard to get rid of ngons and to create a volume, or as you said thicken it!
Jeric! I confess! I underestimated this tool big time! But the UV-map thing I just donīt get... yet! Thanks!

prometheus
02-08-2016, 07:45 PM
Damn, you are good, all of you! I put myself on the shame shelf and try to understand how you managed to use this tool so good!

Maybe this was my big mistake. I followed a tutorial from the web where the guy used the y-direction when he started the process! (could I have missed that he twisted the whole plane before he started the tutorial?)

Thomas! Sometimes the egg of Columbo is relevant nowadays as well! The X-factor made it clear! Thanks!
Promotheus! Thanks for the shell to study. It looks great! But in some way I find it hard to get rid of ngons and to create a volume, or as you said thicken it!


Jeric! I confess! I underestimated this tool big time! But the UV-map thing I just donīt get... yet! Thanks!


Itīs not hard for me, simply have your polygon statistics panel open "w" or have it always open.
stand in polygon mode and look at the statistics panel at those numbers presented with an " >" before the number, in this case you can se there are 2 of those > 4 vertices, just click on itīs + to select it and delete, as you can see me have selected with the statistics panel, and hightlighted are the start shape and end shape that is ngons, easy to delete.

thicken with normal mode and with positive values, either before or after subpatch, thatīs it.


http://forums.newtek.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=132315&d=1454985903
132315

jeric_synergy
02-08-2016, 09:02 PM
Jeric! I confess! I underestimated this tool big time! But the UV-map thing I just donīt get... yet! Thanks!
You certainly had some points, and I swung a bit more to your way of thinking (only integers in Shift Per Loop???? wtf???). But, it does what it does.

The UV-map thing, which I think is a HUGE P.I.T.A. for several 'extension'-type tools (LATHE and EXTRUDE for two-- frankly, I thought more??) is something that should have been addressed long ago, since LWG has a model for the UI already IN THE PROGRAM (i.e., "(new)" in the maps dropdown, "(load image)" in the image dropdowns). :devil: grrrrrr. So you certainly were correct there.

Prom is very clever with the shape he chooses to "Seashell" (it's a verb now, get over it). It would be interesting to see if what other shapes create interesting effects, and have such samples in the documentation *cough*open source!*cough*.

jaxtone
02-09-2016, 08:27 AM
I get it all better now and have created a lot of fun stuff... but the snail shell had to wait!

Just wonder one thing about the thickening... how the heck did you manage that when the shell was activated?

Please see attached image... it has a null size thickness!

Jack

prometheus
02-09-2016, 02:42 PM
I get it all better now and have created a lot of fun stuff... but the snail shell had to wait!

Just wonder one thing about the thickening... how the heck did you manage that when the shell was activated?

Please see attached image... it has a null size thickness!

Jack


what do you mean?
I donīt think anyone ever showcased thickening at the same time as having the seashell tool active, thickening is done after the extrusion is done with the shell tool...thereīs not thicken mode within the seashell tool, so its just run the seashell, open poly statistics panel, delete nogons, then use thicken.

prometheus
02-09-2016, 03:40 PM
nipponites might be of interest too, itīs a bit slow, and be careful with divisions, 10-20 might be enought or it may be very slow...also static in the way that you can only control it within the numeric panel..but it has nice ribbing effects.

http://www.artssphere.com/plugins/nipponitesmirabilis.php
http://www.artssphere.com/plugins.php

jaxtone
02-09-2016, 04:30 PM
Promotheus!

Oh! You misunderstood what I meant! I wondered if you could show me how to thicken the shell :)

No big deal if you feel like not, but it sure would have been gorgeous, kind, swell and a lot of other grateful expressions!

Jack

P.S. I will try the slow plug as well to get some horny effects to...

prometheus
02-10-2016, 01:00 PM
Promotheus!

Oh! You misunderstood what I meant! I wondered if you could show me how to thicken the shell :)

No big deal if you feel like not, but it sure would have been gorgeous, kind, swell and a lot of other grateful expressions!

Jack

P.S. I will try the slow plug as well to get some horny effects to...


pretty simple, just thicken away :)

But here you go, nevermind the end, was spinning off somewhere when going for changing subdiv levels, also noticed that I in previous model session disabled show polygons in the perspective viewport, so that is why you canīt see the selected ngons..when I choose them in the statistics panel for deletion.

Horny effects? :) well not sure if that plugin is capable of that, sure would be interesting to something like that..but I think it is capable of horn offects :)

Would be very sweet if someone could make this seashell tool have the same banding/ribbon effect that nipponites have, and if art also could implement it on the bridge tool..will suggest it to him after I donate a bit.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZ1LxJ0FmNg

JoePoe
02-10-2016, 03:27 PM
Over in this thread (http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?149663-Looking-for-help-on-how-to-make-a-coiled-guitar-cable) we've been playing with the helix tool and other spirals.

If you've got a nice spline going you can use Art's Extrude+ (https://www.lightwave3d.com/assets/plugins/entry/extrude/) to get some funky variations, twisting, tapering and ribbing going.

132360

jaxtone
02-10-2016, 04:02 PM
Wow... thankīs Promotheus!

I really appreciate it and feel a little ashamed again. Thicken.. just like that :)

jaxtone
02-10-2016, 04:44 PM
JoePoe!

The only thing that appears when using Extrude+ is a message telling me that:

"Line 598, illegal division by zero detected!"

Donīt know what that means do you?

JoePoe
02-10-2016, 09:46 PM
Yeah, I get that too. I'm not sure what parameter is causing it.
I just ignored it. Everything seems to be fine. I ended up with all quads.... nothing illegal as a result. Have fun!

jaxtone
02-10-2016, 10:54 PM
JoePoe!

Well... I wish I would get that result. Here nothing happens at all... but it might be because I do not know how to make things work. It seems like I do exactly as they do in the video, but still... no result!

JoePoe
02-11-2016, 04:03 PM
Well that's kind of weird. When I get that error message the only option I get is an "OK" button. And I get a result after clicking.

Try selecting Same Layer in the plug interface. With that selected I don't get an error message at all... no matter how crazy I get with all the different settings.

prometheus
02-11-2016, 10:35 PM
another tool one can use..
cm_loft, create a poly profile, then rail clone it to a nice helix curve or your own made perfect fibonacci spiral, then select edge loops of the cross sections, select ring. chamfer and convert to polys, then multishift or smooth shift, ..unfortunatly the chamfer process is broken in 2015, at least it behaves differently so you can not convert to polys directly after.

https://www.lightwave3d.com/assets/plugins/entry/cm_loft/

jaxtone
02-12-2016, 02:12 AM
Will try that as well!