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fineartist
11-03-2015, 10:28 PM
Evening folks,

Just when I thought I seen everything, I am working on my character in 3D Coat texturing him. I export out and bring into Modeler. Now, when I hit tab, the whole thing goes weird on me (see both the tabbed and untabbed) I tried merge uv to see if there was a issue, but nope. Any ideas what could cause this? I'm not sure if this is a 3D Coat thing or Lightwave.

As usual, help will be greatly appreciated

Thanks

jim

130756130757

meshpig
11-03-2015, 11:21 PM
You have a shedload of double-sided polys like you have copied and pasted the object on itself. Hit m for merge then Shift I and or look for 2 pt polys in the info pane to delete. No big problem :)

jeric_synergy
11-03-2015, 11:47 PM
What meshpig said, BUT: that's kinda a cool look.

Coincident polys are a curse, and even when you know about them can be puzzling. Anytime you see subd weirdness check for coincident polys, unMerged points, and 1&2 pt polys.

meshpig
11-03-2015, 11:52 PM
Indeed, you can do a test by copying two balls into the same place and merging points. When you subdivide the surface you can see the "coincident" geometry not conforming to the curve.

130758

jeric_synergy
11-03-2015, 11:56 PM
Huh. Why is that if everything is getting patched?

meshpig
11-03-2015, 11:58 PM
The other THING is, when you have so many non-planar polys the edges go darker, like spooky.

meshpig
11-04-2015, 12:48 AM
Huh. Why is that if everything is getting patched?

Riemann curves. 2 surfaces from one set of vertices.

fineartist
11-04-2015, 12:26 PM
Well, this is bizarre. I checked the different things all of you suggested, and nada. No duplicate polys, points, nothing. So, I hit M to merge everything, says no points merged. THEN, I change to Catmull Clark, hit tab and see just the bottom of the legs weren't right. I untab, then hit M, merge points and 176 points merged. If I keep it in Catmull mode, everything looks correct, but not subpatched. And there are only 3 and 4 point polys in the model.


Weirdddddd. So, I have a work around for the moment, but would still want to find out why this happened. I will try doing some changes in 3D Coat and see if there is some sort of way it's jacking up the file (it's probably me that's hosing things out but don't know how)

BUT, I want to thank you guys for all your help and time to give me things to not only try but to have knowledge about if this happens again. THA

- - - Updated - - -

THANKS!!! :)

DrStrik9
11-04-2015, 12:57 PM
I've noticed in 2015.3 that merging points and/or unifying polys doesn't always correct duplicate polys. Not sure why, or what is happening. I just end up taking things apart, hiding polys, etc., until I find the offending duplicate poly.

jboudreau
11-04-2015, 01:24 PM
Upload your model so we can have a look to see what's happening?

Thanks
Jason

fineartist
11-04-2015, 01:52 PM
Here is the Model I created YEARSSSSS ago, it doesn't have the textures included because I am at work and don't have the file with me, but maybe one of you can see something I missed? I also included a early render before I finished the texturing just to give you a idea what he's going to look like, what the heck ...lol


I am working on my submission for the Doritos commercial with him and of course the deadline is next weekend so if anyone can figure it out, it would make that part of the project alot easier to deal with. I'll post the link to the clip if I get it done. :)

JoePoe
11-04-2015, 02:07 PM
Perhaps you brought back a Vertex Normal Map from 3D coat?
Turn it off.

jboudreau
11-04-2015, 02:18 PM
Here is the Model I created YEARSSSSS ago, it doesn't have the textures included because I am at work and don't have the file with me, but maybe one of you can see something I missed? I also included a early render before I finished the texturing just to give you a idea what he's going to look like, what the heck ...lol


I am working on my submission for the Doritos commercial with him and of course the deadline is next weekend so if anyone can figure it out, it would make that part of the project alot easier to deal with. I'll post the link to the clip if I get it done. :)

I just downloaded the model you provided, and pressed the tab key to sub patch. Everything looks great on my end, I'm not seeing anything like you posted. What's the problem that you are having. Is it with this exactl model you uploaded or another one?

UPDATE: This happens in lightwave 11.6.3 but not in 2015 - 2015.1 - 2015.3 - Im Looking into why it's happening in 11.6.3 and not in 2015, I'll keep you posted with what I find out

Thanks,
Jason

fineartist
11-04-2015, 04:26 PM
Yep, it's the exact model. So weird that it is happening to you in a different version of Lightwave and not this one. When I get home, I can try it in 11 on my end and see if there is the same problem.

jboudreau
11-05-2015, 08:19 AM
Yep, it's the exact model. So weird that it is happening to you in a different version of Lightwave and not this one. When I get home, I can try it in 11 on my end and see if there is the same problem.

Okay figured out the issue, but it's a strange one. It looks like there is a very strange bug when it comes to subpatching, Not only is your object showing that crazy display when sub patching but it's actually not sub pathching at all. I will make a video to show you the bug

Here are a couple of videos showing the bug and some workarounds to fix it

Video 1 - This demonstrates the bug and a solution on how to fix it


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNaVYa6u-IU

Hope this helps

Thanks,
Jason

jboudreau
11-05-2015, 09:51 AM
Here is another video demonstrating a strange issue regarding this bug. Depending on which order you load in your models you get the bug or you don't

If you load in a model that sub patching works and then load in the problem model then the problem model doesn't have the issue anymore. But if you load in the model with the problem first and then load in the model that didn't have the problem, then it now has the issue. The video below will demonstrate

Video 2


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zHda7sTTww

Hope this helps. Also hope the lightwave Team can shed some light on what is happening here regarding subpatching

Thanks,
Jason

jeric_synergy
11-05-2015, 09:51 AM
?? It appears you're just saving and reloading?

jboudreau
11-05-2015, 09:54 AM
?? It appears you're just saving and reloading?

No not at all, did you watch the first video then the second video?

Try it download the model, open up a fresh modeler, open up the lightwave model that was provided here and hit the tab key, the issue is there. now close the object and open it up again, hit the tab key the issue is still there.

Thanks,
Jason

fineartist
11-05-2015, 11:08 AM
Thanks jboudreau! That is so bizarre, but it got me up and running again. Thank you so much! I wonder if the passing between 3D Coat and Lightwave broke it somehow, glad it wasn't just me that sees it happening though, I thought I was going crazy...lol

JoePoe
11-05-2015, 11:20 AM
Well that explains why I wasn't getting the error! I already had other subD models loaded.
Nice detective work!

Crazy weird.

jboudreau
11-05-2015, 12:06 PM
Thanks jboudreau! That is so bizarre, but it got me up and running again. Thank you so much! I wonder if the passing between 3D Coat and Lightwave broke it somehow, glad it wasn't just me that sees it happening though, I thought I was going crazy...lol

Yes it is very bizarre. In 3Dcoat what did you export the model out as?

Thanks,
Jason

jboudreau
11-05-2015, 12:31 PM
Well that explains why I wasn't getting the error! I already had other subD models loaded.
Nice detective work!

Crazy weird.

Thanks JoePoe, Yes crazy weird is right

Glad I could help

Thanks,
Jason

jeric_synergy
11-05-2015, 01:11 PM
No not at all, did you watch the first video then the second video?
Ah, got it.

fineartist
11-05-2015, 04:41 PM
Yes it is very bizarre. In 3Dcoat what did you export the model out as?

Thanks,
Jason

Just straight .lwo with color and normal map, everything else turned off.

gerry_g
11-05-2015, 05:26 PM
ons sub patch algorithm is not the same as anthem sub patch algorithm, turning subs off and on again usually fixes it, whether it will in this case I don't know you'll have to try, never export with subs on happens to me if I go Modo to LW or ZBrush to Modo, just because it's an lwo. means squat it's the exporting programs native implementation that is at fault not LW