View Full Version : 2D billboard tree alpha not working

06-02-2015, 09:07 PM
Self explanatory. What's wrong?


06-02-2015, 09:48 PM
All we see here is a 3D view.

A) do you have transparency enabled in display options Open GL (shading method=multitexture)

B) But more importantly.... how does it render?

06-02-2015, 09:53 PM
1: 128440

2: 128441

06-02-2015, 09:56 PM
The open gl is interesting.....

But, invert your Alpha image in transparency channel, and the render should be fine.

06-02-2015, 10:02 PM
Why's it interesting? Running on default preferences.

How exactly would I do that? I have a .png with the checkered background ie: alpha and then the colored in section. I am a complete newbie to anything textures.

Here's the file: http://i.imgur.com/F67P63l.jpg

EDIT: Did that, inverted the alpha image in the channel. It renders the exact same.

06-02-2015, 10:13 PM
Okay, so you said you have a png with transparency, but you posted a jpg so there isn't much I can do with that.... no alpha.

But.... with your png (assuming the alpha is valid.... and it sounds like it is), it should be as simple as this a 2D image node.... 128445

.... 3D view, 128446... I'm getting the transparency in open GL. That's why I said it was interesting that you weren't.

06-02-2015, 10:20 PM
Ah, you're right. Imgur saves as .jpg it seems. I am 100% sure the file is .png, and the checkers show up in GIMP and Paint.net.



Something's fucky. 128447

10/10 for Imgur NOW saving as .png.

06-02-2015, 10:29 PM
Right on :thumbsup:.

Same recipe.... invert the alpha into transparency. 128448

(it was my bad on my last post. I had the transparency done out in the layers section and didn't show it. Here it's all in nodes. Better this way anyway.)

edit: the invert node is under Math>Scalar>Invert

06-02-2015, 10:36 PM
Now it's just showing a completely black render.

Could you send me that scene and object so I can take a look?

EDIT: Did you know you can search for nodes? Guess how I found the invert node.

EDIT 2: In fact, here's the object and images.

It's 7:54AM in Finland and I've been doing 3D for like 10 - 13 hours today, like the past few days in a row. I'm getting some sleep.


06-02-2015, 11:03 PM
EDIT: Did you know you can search for nodes? Guess how I found the invert node.

Certainly :D.
Here ya go. I set it up in nodes... and layers. Layers uses a clone of the png set to "alpha only" in image editor.

I'm having trouble including the png in the zip file for some reason. When loading scene, on prompt, just use the png you have.

06-02-2015, 11:12 PM
I'm getting some sleep....

I've gotta do the same.

But first.... very simple fix for the "Broken" rar. 128452

06-03-2015, 08:06 AM
Good morning (for me literally, for you figuratively :))

Just a quick note to say... You might want to consider using the alpha on the clip channel. If going to transparency, you might have to contend with spec channel in addition.

06-03-2015, 10:18 AM
Did both. Inverted, then tried to put into clip channel. ****'s not working, son!

I'm starting to think it might be a problem with my GPU, but that's far fetched as cardboard trees do work in games.


It seems to be on my end. Maybe drivers, maybe Lightwave...

06-03-2015, 10:28 AM
You're still in Modeler.... and I realize you want it to work in Open GL too (in Modeler try GLSLShading?).

128475 128476

But a render still isn't working??
(that png was acting a bit squirrelly for me too. Try a different png as a test?)

I don't think it's drivers/gpu..... just a bit of growing pains maybe ;)

06-03-2015, 12:17 PM
Render doesn't work.



Also tried another .png, just got different colored background artifacts for another tree.

06-03-2015, 12:35 PM
Okay..... I think we're just slightly missing each other in how to solve this. If you can get a knockout one way you can get the reverse.
Zip up your scene (scene, object, and images) and post it here. I'll make the change and send it back. Or I'll make a vid of me making changes.....

06-03-2015, 12:51 PM
A video or pictures of what you do from step 1 to the last step would be ideal, and would solve it for other people, too.


EDIT: Step 1 being opening modeler.

06-03-2015, 01:02 PM
It's the same fix in Modeler or Layout if you're using layers surfacing.

Step one: I opened your Scene (or open object in Modeler) went to surface editor transparency T button..... 128491

Step two: Clicked Invert Layer... 128492

06-03-2015, 01:13 PM


06-03-2015, 01:17 PM
Let's just keep it in Layout.

You should still be able to render it successfully!!
Try it. (or switch to Viper for a sec).

I will post the open GL screen shots.

06-03-2015, 01:20 PM
Ooh, render works! This is progress at least. Now to get it to work in modeler.

Thanks to now. Hard to find good help these days, with all the BS on the internet.

Any idea why it's not working in modeler tho?

06-03-2015, 01:29 PM
Ooh, render works! This is progress at least. Now to get it to work in modeler.

Thanks to now. Hard to find good help these days, with all the BS on the internet.

Any idea why it's not working in modeler tho?


EDIT: From your second pic in post #15 GLSL is WORKING for you!!!

I really wouldn't be overly concerned with seeing texturing in Modeler. Eventually when you get into nodes, you won't see anything there.
I'd be more concerned with seeing it in Layout.
But for right now.....

I get the same as you with these display settings (multitextureShaders) 128494

Transparency comes back with ticking the one box, Transparency Channel 128495
(but I see that you have that on.... hmm)

Using GLSL shading.... it just works. 128496

In layout, play with those combinations and you will be fine.

Edit: A couple layout screen grabs....

Same as you... 128498

A couple fixes.... 128499 128500

06-03-2015, 02:03 PM
This is what it looks like in Modeler. Good expect get some kind of weird transparency effect.


This is what it looks like in render.


It seems I can either get it to work in OpenGL with only two polygons, but get that weird effect when making an X tree with four but rendering the white bg in both.

Or I can make a screwed up GL tree which looks weird in modeler, but screwed up in the render in terms of transparency but renders colors and bg fine, except for overlap weirdness.


06-03-2015, 02:39 PM
I feel like I'm in the Wizard of Oz.... "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!!"
Pay no attention to what things look like in Modeler!! :D (well, to a certain extent. Certainly in this situation).

Assign your surfaces in Modeler..... but do all your Surfacing in Layout.

Looks to me that you lost your Alpha.
And the left side in the render is in shadow.

Have you saved the object in Modeler, maybe it's just not updated in layout.
Reassign the Alpha......... IN LAYOUT!! :)

edit: the second render looks weird. You might have to post resources again.

06-03-2015, 02:46 PM
Yeah, it was the alpha, had to set it in layout. Now it seems to render fine for me. Lighting a bit to the left from center on X axis.

OpenGL is still ****** up but whatever, I don't care, who uses OpenGL in games these days anyway? How it renders here and ingame matters... It's most likely due to modeler's omni-existing lighting, coming from the camera, or just a problem with OpenGL.


Here's the render and OpenGL in layout. It seems to work in render, so for now, problem has been solved. Will report back if I find anything. Thanks a lot.

EDIT: Found this. It seems to be an OpenGL option, might or might not be supported in LW.

So not on my side. Technically everything works 100%.


06-04-2015, 09:18 AM
Yeah, the OGL really doesn't like the criss-crossing alphas does it.

But I think you might have another issue.
Will the gaming engine (I'm no expert) accept single sided polys?
Well, it'll "accept" them, but, even if they're set to double sided in LW the non-normal sides will probably be transparent in game yes? Test it.

You might have to create your tree element with a front and back facing poly separated by a teeny tiny space (and duplicate that for the X).
(If you do have to do that, remember that the image/UV will need to be flipped on the opposite poly to match the front)

06-04-2015, 03:12 PM
I know, that is what I have done for double sided polies. Game engine does not support "double sided" in LW, so you need to copy the poly over.