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seghier
05-26-2015, 08:02 AM
Hello
i added fiberfx to an object and cloned it ; than i used different texture density and changed settings
but when i save the scene and reload it all settings of hair reseted !
i tried to save ffs file for each hair style but the same problem

Snosrap
05-26-2015, 09:00 AM
Hair is now saved with objects, so save your objects.

seghier
05-26-2015, 09:13 AM
save objects after creating hair ?

seghier
05-26-2015, 09:31 AM
thanks ; that work
i hope they change this option in the next update

Greenlaw
05-26-2015, 09:55 AM
Actually, Lightwave saving FiberFX Vmap data with the object is the improvement from the 'old' days (I thnk this happened in 11.5?) when FiberFX used to save this data with the scene file, which created a lot of problems when working with multiple. For one thing, it bloated your .lws file like crazy. It also made it difficult to transfer the guides to another scene and it made it nearly impossible to use them reliably with multiple characters.

Trust me, having the FiberFX vmap data embedded with the .lwo file is much better. Just think of it as the same as editing surfaces and morph targets in Layout--you need to save that data with the object file too.

BTW, other FiberFX data is saved with the .lws. You'll want to save out FiberFX settings file for each instance of FiberFX if you want to share that data between scene files. You can also use Load Items from Scene to transfer the whole thing but I *think* loading settings is more reliable. (I should check that with the latest version--this might have been improved.)

G.

seghier
05-26-2015, 10:36 AM
thanks for explanation
i saved always ffs for different fiber but they don't made any change when i load them
i hope that fiberfx saved with objects automaticly without need save each object separately

Greenlaw
05-26-2015, 12:04 PM
Sure.

Just to be clear, what's saved in the .lwo is the vmap, which is any style you've created/editing to the native guides using Edit Guides. Render and shading properties do get saved with the scene but it's just a good idea to also save a separate settings file--just in case you mess up a nice 'look' and want to go back to an earlier version you liked better, or as a backup against scene corruption, or when you want to reuse the Fiber setting for other parts of the character or transfer settings to another character that shares somewhat similar scale and topology.

G.

seghier
05-26-2015, 12:24 PM
thank you thats good
the problem now when i render fiber always layout crashed ; i don't understand why

128372

rdolishny
06-10-2015, 07:17 PM
I'm having the exact same problem. I spent all day texturing and sculpting, and came back to it today and it crashes on render.

In one instance it says 'out of memory' although I didn't see that all day yesterday. Aside from that one memory popup, it just crashes on F9.

seghier
06-10-2015, 08:39 PM
Hi rdolishny
i found that it crashed when i set number of fibers +1000
if i use for examlpe 3 layers : 400 + 300 + 300 it crashed
i don't know why maybe fiberfx need more gpu memory

Every4thPixel
06-11-2015, 02:36 AM
Your GPU doesn't have anything to do with fiberFX, so that can't be it.

seghier
06-11-2015, 03:18 AM
we speak about crash when rendering ; and we can see the memory used for render

Greenlaw
06-11-2015, 05:16 PM
Every4thPixel is correct, FiberFX does not use the GPU for setup or rendering--in fact, native Lightwave does not use GPU at all. Some third party exceptions would be plug-ins like Turbulence FD and Octane.

Not sure why you're running into the memory error but I have a few suggestions to think about.

With any FiberFX error, the first thing I usually suspect is the existence of config files from older versions of Lightwave. However, Lightwave should have created new config files when you installed 2015.2, so that's probably not the problem.

What's the fiber count in the render panel? If it crashes before you can see it, what's the count in the FiberFX panel for the object? How much RAM do you have in your computer? (Actual computer memory, not the memory on your graphics card.) When rendering, open task manager and watch the RAM usage--that might give you some idea of what's causing the error.

FWIW, I just ran a quick test on my tablet computer with 16GB of RAM and it rendered 500,000 texture mapped fibers on a deforming mesh without breaking a sweat. But I think this same test would run into memory problems on my old tablet PC which only had 4GB of RAM. I don't know how meaningful this info is but it might give you some idea of what to expect.

You might consider optimizing or otherwise simplifying the fiber render. There are some tips in the Brudders thread in the link below. For example, you can use fewer guides and wider clusters, or fewer fibers and thicken them by increasing the width. Keep in mind that some of the info in that thread is dated because the 'B2' project was last worked on using 11.5.1, and a lot has happened since then. (I'm still catching up myself.)

You might also try using Light Exclusion to limit the number of lights affecting your fibers--this may require less RAM and render faster. I tend to keep my Fiber FX lighting to two, which accounts for key light and fill. Very rarely will I use three or more for hair because it increases render time without significantly improving the quality. Having too many lights affecting the fibers can even introduce artifacts. (This is not specifically a FiberFX consideration--I typically limited my fiber lighting even way back when I was using Sasquatch to render hair and fur for commercials and video game cinematics.) Also consider using Distant lights, as FiberFX renders faster with with Distant lights and can still create soft shadows. (That said, I'm using Dome lights for fur in 'B2'--this is because I need the soft cast shadows for the musical instruments as well as the characters limbs. But most of the time, you should be able to get away with Ray Trace lights.)

Hope this info helps. Sorry I don't have a whole lot more info to offer. I started working on 'B2' again a few weeks ago, using Lightwave 2015.2, but I'm still spending less time on it than I like. I'll start updating that thread once I'm fully back into this project again.

When I get home tonight, I'll open up one of the Brudders files and let you know how many fibers are being rendered. Back when I set up FiberFX for these characters (over two years ago,) I was pretty much hitting the max number of fibers for my workstation, which has only 9GB of RAM. This is the main reason why the fibers are not super dense on these characters, but I thought it was dense enough for my purposes.

G.

seghier
06-12-2015, 11:53 AM
Thanks Greenlaw
i have hp 8770w with k4000m and ram 32 go
as i sayed the problem happend when i set the number of fibers to 1000
i uninstalled and reinstall lightwave but i got the same problem ; ii the screenshot memory used 35967.5 M but i have 32 gb !! why ?
for this reason i thinked it use gpu because gpu memory limited to 4 go

Greenlaw
06-12-2015, 02:24 PM
35967.5 MB is actually over 35 GB, so it does sound like you're exceeding your available RAM. In any case, neither Lightwave or FiberFX uses the graphics card RAM for rendering.

I think you may need to optimize your fur settings as described above. After optimization, I'm having no trouble rendering hair and fur for three animated characters the 'B2' (https://vimeo.com/68543424) scenes on my old HP Pavilion, which had only 9 GB RAM. (FYI, the graphics card in this computer is an old GTX 460 with maybe 1 GB RAM, possibly 1.5 GB at most. That's besides the point though, since Lightwave does not use the graphics card memory for rendering anyway, only for display.)

Other thoughts:

You mentioned reinstalling Lightwave. Did you remove the configs before doing that? Otherwise, you're probably using the same configuration as before the reinstallation. I would back up your current configs, delete them, and then launch Layout and Modeler to generate new configs. You'll probably want to rescan your plugins, and reset your default menus/keyboards, just to be safe before quitting to save the new configs.

One more thing to be aware of: if you tend to scan the entire Lightwave folder for plugins, make sure you remove or delete the Rollback folder first. This folder may contain different versions of plugins from previous installs that may conflict with the current plugins. (IMO, just get rid of it...keeping the folder is not particularly useful. If you need to do a re-install, it's safer to do it clean.)

Hope this helps.

G.

Greenlaw
06-12-2015, 02:35 PM
What puzzles me, however, is that you say you only have 1000 fibers. 1000 fibers should be trivial to render. That you're exceeding memory with such a small amount of fibers does sound very strange.

Sorry, I didn't get a chance to look up how many fibers the cats in B2 have. It's certainly far more than 1000 though, especially with three characters in many of the scenes. I think 'Sister' alone may have up to 100,000 fibers. (I need to check that to be sure though...it's probably a lot less than 100k but certainly far more than 1000.) The cats must have a lot more since the fibers cover their entire body.

G.

Greenlaw
06-12-2015, 02:48 PM
Oh, wait. I just realized that what I wrote above is a little inaccurate because I'm rendering each character in separate passes. Even so, each character has a lot more fibers than 1000.

Are you sure you're not confusing the number of fibers with the number of guides? If your cluster setting is putting a lot of fibers around each guide, you may have a lot more fibers in the scene that you think. For example, the test I ran on my tablet yesterday has only 100 guides but the scene renders 500,000 fibers. This is because the number of fibers in my cluster setting gets multiplied with each guide.

Also pay attention to your Smooth setting--this affects the amount of geometry being used to create the guides, so setting Smooth too high can generate very complicated fibers that may take up far more RAM than simpler fibers of the same quantity.

G.

seghier
06-12-2015, 02:50 PM
sorry it's error of typing :D
it's : 3567.5 M

Greenlaw
06-12-2015, 02:52 PM
Ah, okay. But the mystery deepens. :)

seghier
06-12-2015, 02:53 PM
yes i remove all files after reinstalling lightwave
i will check the scene again and post screenshots ; i think you know i am new in lightwave :D so i can't remember all terms
thanks alot for your help

Greenlaw
06-12-2015, 05:13 PM
No problem. We were all beginners here once. Hope we can get this working for you. :)

seghier
06-12-2015, 05:51 PM
Thank you :) i will post screenshots

JamesCurtis
06-13-2015, 11:50 PM
I put together a new PC machine a little while ago, a Six Core i7, [5820, I think] with 32 gig of ram and a 4GB Nvidia graphics card. Running Windows 8.1 64bit.

Anyhow, I have also experienced crashes during renders with the FiberFX sample scenes in LW 2015.2 too. Crash may not be during the first render, but maybe after a few renders. also seem to notice it when I close out a scene and load another. F9 renders BTW at each scene's default settings and resolution. No issues with other programs - only LW.

Greenlaw
06-14-2015, 12:54 AM
The two computers I mainly work with for personal projects are: 1.) an old HP Pavilion workstation with i7 Quad Core (930), 2.8 GHz, 9 GB RAM, and a GTX 460, running under Windows 7 Pro (pretty modest by today's standards); and 2.) a new Wacom Cintiq Companion 2 Enhanced with i7 3.4 GHz, 16 GB, Windows 8.1.

Sigh! I really do need a new workstation; many of the specs for this little tablet computer are so much higher. :p

Anyway, the cg 'Brudders' work done to date was set up and rendered on the old workstation. I have to admit, some of the shots for 'B2' were really pushing this computer's limits, but this computer (with the help of a small render farm with slightly faster CPUs and slightly less RAM per computer,) was able to render about a minute and a half of HD footage with three 'FiberFX' characters without crashing. That was using Lightwave 11.5.1 about two years ago.

TBH, I haven't used FiberFX so heavily since that time, but I'm been getting back into using FiberFX now using Lightwave 2015.2.

So far, I'm not seeing any crashing in my tests with 2015.2. But I know there's a big difference between testing and using software in production. I'll let you know if I run into problems when I start working with actual 'B2' production scenes in 2015.2 tomorrow.

In the meantime, I highly recommend sending to LW3DG the Lightwave scene content that consistently crashes for you. Include screenshots with detailed step-by-steps for producing the problem, along with your computer specs. Be sure to use the bug report system on your user page. (The old Fogbugz system was shut down quite some time ago.)

I can't guarantee anything but sending in detailed reports is what I do, and in recent years LW3DG has fixed and improved a ton of stuff I've asked about, including FiberFX.

G.