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Tony3d
11-27-2014, 08:02 AM
Hi All, Just got a job that is really got me stumped. I'm modeling a steel cable that gets extruded though a form which ends up putting little flats along the strands high point around the diameter of the cable ( see Attachment). They gave me a cross-section that has this flat drawn into the outside strands. Problem is each strand group has 6 wire that get twisted around their center point. When you do this you loose the flat edge. There are 12 groups of these strands around the outside of the cable. If each individual group was not twisted around itself, and just the major diameter was twisted it would work fine. So it seems to me the only way to put the flats on would be after the cable is built. Trouble is Boolean does not seem to work very well. Leaves tons of issues. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

JoePoe
11-27-2014, 09:36 AM
Hey Tony,

Are you subD? And, are you on an axis?

If so, delete all but one of the twelve. Run a Bandsaw (of two cuts) down the poly strips that face out at (something like) 10 and 90. That will flatten those outside strips of faces. Then do a radial array to duplicate back to twelve.

Tony3d
11-28-2014, 08:38 AM
HI Joe, That worked great till I screwed something up. Not sure why, but it was working wonderful for a while. What I would go is select two side by side poly's, run band glue, then run bandsaw pro. It worked great on the twisted strands. The flat was on the outside just what I wanted, then I ran router to round the edges of the faces, and now the first segment does not bandsaw after I run band glue. The band glue works fine, but when I run bandsaw pro it starts one segment in. See my attachment. What happened?

Tony3d
11-28-2014, 09:50 AM
Anybody?

JoePoe
11-28-2014, 10:09 AM
Ah, so you're not subD. In that case you really don't need the bandsaw step. The band glue alone should give you a flat section.

But to answer the question anyway.... Bandsaw works on quads. Check for extra points on the end caps.

jeric_synergy
11-28-2014, 10:37 AM
Tony3d, rather than actually rounding the geometry, look into DP's edge shader, ummmm "Bevel"??? It simulates a soft edge w/o adding geometry.

Also: what is 'Router'? I'm unfamiliar w/this tool in a LW context.

Tony3d
11-28-2014, 10:40 AM
Tony3d, rather than actually rounding the geometry, look into DP's edge shader, ummmm "Bevel"??? It simulates a soft edge w/o adding geometry.

Also: what is 'Router'? I'm unfamiliar w/this tool in a LW context.

Hi Jeric, Router is found under the Multiply, More tab. I use it when nothing else will round an edge.

Tony3d
11-28-2014, 10:42 AM
Ah, so you're not subD. In that case you really don't need the bandsaw step. The band glue alone should give you a flat section.

But to answer the question anyway.... Bandsaw works on quads. Check for extra points on the end caps.


Thanks Joe, That is the problem. I was using SubD's, but had to many points on the end cap.I think I may just use your second option, and not use SubD's.

JoePoe
11-28-2014, 11:36 AM
Killing these three points down the entire length should give you a nice flat section. Or glueing the four polys together.... No subDs, cuz your endcaps are still ngons.

125731

jeric_synergy
11-28-2014, 11:54 AM
BTW, it may be possible to save a fair number of polys if the center cable is never visible, or just the ends.

XswampyX
11-28-2014, 12:56 PM
I think you need to deform your 1st twisted (6) core cable, before you make 12 and twist them together.

http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr16/xXswampyXx/Spun_Cable_zps08f7d752.jpg (http://s465.photobucket.com/user/xXswampyXx/media/Spun_Cable_zps08f7d752.jpg.html)

This was with the boolean tool, used after making the 6 core cable, but before cloning it 12 times and then twisting it around....

Tony3d
11-28-2014, 01:09 PM
I think you need to deform your 1st twisted (6) core cable, before you make 12 and twist them together.

http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr16/xXswampyXx/Spun_Cable_zps08f7d752.jpg (http://s465.photobucket.com/user/xXswampyXx/media/Spun_Cable_zps08f7d752.jpg.html)

This was with the boolean tool, used after making the 6 core cable, but before cloning it 12 times and then twisting it around....

That is exactly what I'm after. Can you explain the steps. I tried booleaning the 6 strands in a tube, but that left a bunch of stray poly's. I take it this is not sub patched correct? If you could share the details that would be great! Did you just make a rectangle lay it on top, and run boolean after twisting the 6?

XswampyX
11-28-2014, 02:52 PM
It goes something like this :-

http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr16/xXswampyXx/Make_Wire_zpsquuvs8fx.gif (http://s465.photobucket.com/user/xXswampyXx/media/Make_Wire_zpsquuvs8fx.gif.html)

I use 3rd Powers boolean : http://www.3rdpowers.com/index_store.html

But the idea should work with the native boolean.

Edit :- No subpatch... Cut out the flattened polys and then paste them back in again. Then use surface smooth. :D

jeric_synergy
11-28-2014, 03:18 PM
Related question: if one wants to capture an animated GIF out of a browser, to look at the individual frames, how does one do that?

Like I COPIED swampy's GIF (I assume) above, pasted it into PShop, but how do I look at the individual frames???

tnx

XswampyX
11-28-2014, 03:24 PM
Don't use PShop, but in GIMP each frame has it's own layer!

http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr16/xXswampyXx/Gif_zpsa659a499.jpg (http://s465.photobucket.com/user/xXswampyXx/media/Gif_zpsa659a499.jpg.html)

Look at the top right of the screen grab.

jeric_synergy
11-28-2014, 03:43 PM
Thanks, buddy! :thumbsup:

spherical
11-28-2014, 03:46 PM
I opened it in Ps5.5 and all of the frames came in as layers. Perhaps it is the "copied" method that tripped things up. I think that "Save Image As..." would work better. Wouldn't be three ways to do something with an image in the menu if they were all the same.

I first tried saving the image and it would not open in Ps. I have GIF animation turned off in my browser, due to the annoyance level, so only the first frame is really available. So, I right-click on the image in FireFox and choose "View Image Info". This loads the entire file and animates it. (This isn't your issue, as you said that you could see the animation. Just outlining for others.) Then saved the file from that panel. It now is 174KB, where it was only 80KB prior. Once I had the full file, Ps loaded it and all of the layers are there.

jeric_synergy
11-28-2014, 05:14 PM
Spherical, that sounded logical, so I took your rmb SAVE AS route in FFox, and got an 80K file that PShop couldn't parse. :gnash:

Then I reread your post, and saved it from the VIEW IMAGE INFO dialog, ---same thing, looks like this:



125732

Pretty durn annoying. --Still stuck at 80K also.

XswampyX
11-28-2014, 05:20 PM
In firefox right click on the image and select view image, then save it.... TaDa!

spherical
11-28-2014, 05:45 PM
Spherical, that sounded logical, so I took your rmb SAVE AS route in FFox, and got an 80K file that PShop couldn't parse. :gnash:

Then I reread your post, and saved it from the VIEW IMAGE INFO dialog, ---same thing, looks like this:



125732

Pretty durn annoying. --Still stuck at 80K also.

Did you let it animate in the View Image Info panel?

jeric_synergy
11-28-2014, 05:46 PM
Did you let it animate in the View Image Info panel?
Yup.

Swampy must be getting exhausted from being correct all the time: as he suggested, using VIEW IMAGE (not view image info) and then saving it from that page worked fine. Note that this is even though it was already animating in the forum page AND the View Image Info pages.

Loaded, as expected, into PShop CC2014 as six layers.

:sigh: Code. Gotta hate it.

Thanks fellas..... what were we talkin' about??? ;)

spherical
11-28-2014, 05:48 PM
Yup.

OK, how about a Shift-Reload of the page. Could be stuck in your cache somehow. My full 174KB image is now in my cache and I can't get a save to come in at 80K.

jeric_synergy
11-28-2014, 05:51 PM
OK, how about a Shift-Reload of the page. Could be stuck in your cache somehow. My full 174KB image is now in my cache and I can't get a save to come in at 80K.

::cross poste:: Remember, it WAS animating in all its incarnations.

XswampyX
11-28-2014, 06:25 PM
Yup.

Swampy must be getting exhausted from being correct all the time: ...

We all have our cross to bear....

If it's any consolation, in the real world, my life's a mess! ;D

spherical
11-28-2014, 07:30 PM
::cross poste:: Remember, it WAS animating in all its incarnations.

Well then, I have no clue why mine works and yours doesn't.

Tony3d
12-02-2014, 06:33 AM
Tried using the Boolean, but can't get a clean result no matter what I due. Anyother suggestions? The subpatch method is looking more promising at the moment.

JoePoe
12-02-2014, 11:55 AM
@ Jeric. Was the GIF problem a saving thing or a viewing thing. If viewing... you can also open in Quicktime and use the arrow buttons to scroll through the frames at your leisure.

@ Tony. What exactly is holding you up? Did you merge after the Boolean? Is it the endcaps on SubD?? )BTW Do they ultimately need to be in a shot?) Can you post an image of the unacceptable result instead of pre flat-edge and twisted geometry? (oh, and yes, twist the group of six(7 including center) first before twisting group of 12.

Nice Boolean Swamp!

Tony3d
12-02-2014, 01:06 PM
Yes, the entire 10" length of the cable will be in the shot. It definitely needs to be done after the cables outer strands are finished to show the sheered flats in the correct spots. When I Boolean I just get a lot of torn polygons, and left over pieces.
I'm not home right now, so I can't show you a shot. Maybe I should try to triple non SubD poly's then try the Boolean.

XswampyX
12-02-2014, 01:29 PM
Here's a test model.

Open it in modeler, select the 4th layer, select the 3rd layer as the background layer.

Goto Construct -> boolean -> intersect....

Tada!

JoePoe
12-02-2014, 01:32 PM
.... and, FYI, this boolean is never going to be subD friendly. I assume that's what's happening with the "tearing". Turn off all subD when doing this!


.... I went subD route myself.

125816

XswampyX
12-02-2014, 01:54 PM
Looks good JoePoe!

http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr16/xXswampyXx/Make_Twist_Wire_zpssbvpb6rb.gif (http://s465.photobucket.com/user/xXswampyXx/media/Make_Twist_Wire_zpssbvpb6rb.gif.html)

Tony3d
12-02-2014, 05:48 PM
This is what it has to look like. Only the outer edge can have the flats. See attachment. The strands are also somewhat pie shaped. Trouble is if you model that in, when you twist it, everything will be lost. If the six didn't need twisting, and just the outer 12, modeling it in would work fine. Really appreciate your guys help by the way. I just don't see how this can be done.

jeric_synergy
12-02-2014, 06:11 PM
Didn't Swampy do the Boolean using 3rdPowers boolean? Mayhaps it works better.

XswampyX
12-02-2014, 06:26 PM
Didn't Swampy do the Boolean using 3rdPowers boolean? Mayhaps it works better.

I did! and that's an understatement! :D

6 wires, twisted and then boolean, then clone 6 times, twisted and boolean again!

Not a stray poly....


http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr16/xXswampyXx/Wire_Spun_II_zps8f09306b.jpg (http://s465.photobucket.com/user/xXswampyXx/media/Wire_Spun_II_zps8f09306b.jpg.html)

JoePoe
12-02-2014, 07:01 PM
.... don't you dare hit tab on that thing :D

That last Tony posted image really is a horse of a different color.
So it looks like the twisted bundle of twisted bundles is squished just on the outsides.... not necessarily following the twists at all.
Is there such as thing as an outward heat shrink?

spherical
12-02-2014, 07:06 PM
Now you've got the problem at hand. Only the outside of the bundle, as a cylinder, should be flatter.

Tony3d
12-02-2014, 07:44 PM
Exactly! Tough right. Wonder if it's worth getting that plugin, because Lightwave's Boolean won't work.

Tony3d
12-02-2014, 07:47 PM
Don't understand how that sample was made. It looks like it was modeled right in if you look at the radiuses around the pie shaped wires. So what happens when you twist them? How did they keep those flats just on the outside?

spherical
12-02-2014, 08:04 PM
I'm thinking a Dual Rail Extrude of a round-cornered/squashed poly that began as a circle and ends up looking like a guitar pick would get this done. Get the splines into the helix required, Rail Extrude, radial clone into the cable. This will leave a cavity in the center which could be filled with a small disk at each end.

jeric_synergy
12-02-2014, 09:42 PM
OK, just throwing this out there: Weight Map Falloff, with Scale.

Model the whole thing w/all strands round,
assign a w.map w/100% restricted to the outer circumference,
blur map slightly
Scale/Size down slightly with Weight Map Falloff.


Perhaps knowing how the RW object was created would give us some ideas too.

JoePoe
12-02-2014, 10:09 PM
I'm thinking a Dual Rail Extrude of a round-cornered/squashed poly that began as a circle and ends up looking like a guitar pick would get this done. Get the splines into the helix required, Rail Extrude, radial clone into the cable. This will leave a cavity in the center which could be filled with a small disk at each end.

Not sure I follow. Care to show an example of that flow?


OK, just throwing this out there: Weight Map Falloff, with Scale.

Model the whole thing w/all strands round,
assign a w.map w/100% restricted to the outer circumference,
blur map slightly
Scale/Size down slightly with Weight Map Falloff.


IMHO...getting there.... and, in the end, a very simple solution. Not sure how the w map would look :stumped:. I am considering a slight riff on that flow.
Instead of weight, just a simple radial falloff..... or a simple squash of a group of six before the radial array to 12.

spherical
12-02-2014, 10:26 PM
Make a poly that is the cross section of the discreet cable wire, as ground by whatever process creates the flattened exterior diameter of the IRL completed twisted cable.

Rail Extrude that poly, with Orientation on, along a helix spline that follows the cable path (probably best to do this as a straight cylinder --not undulating) and remains inside the target cable diameter.

Once the Rail Extrude is complete, clone it with rotation along the long axis to produce the other five wires that form the cable.

JoePoe
12-02-2014, 10:52 PM
Make a poly that is the cross section of the discreet cable wire, as ground by whatever process creates the flattened exterior diameter of the IRL completed twisted cable.

Rail Extrude that poly, with Orientation on, along a helix spline that follows the cable path (probably best to do this as a straight cylinder --not undulating) and remains inside the target cable diameter.

Once the Rail Extrude is complete, clone it with rotation along the long axis to produce the other five wires that form the cable.

Yes... I meant SEE an example :) (if u want/have time to, of course...)

I took a quick jump at it. Could stand a bunch of fine (and not so fine :D) tuning....
... and I'm still not sure if I've got a bead on the right shape.... hard to get a real feel without knowing revolutions etc.



125824 125825

jeric_synergy
12-02-2014, 11:23 PM
SIDE NOTE:
So, playing around w/this and: there's no interactive, in the way that MIRROR is interactive, RADIAL ARRAY-type tool, right? That would let me set up almost a kaleidescope-type thingy to interactively place multiple copies in a radial array?

Seems very old-fashioned to have to nail it, or to sneak up on it.

nahhh, there MUST be, right?????? I'm just forgetting it....

EDIT: ::clickaclickaclickaclickaclicka:: Man, this is JUST one of those situations where LOCAL ACTION CENTER would come in handy....

spherical
12-02-2014, 11:28 PM
Yes... I meant SEE an example :) (if u want/have time to, of course...)

I know. Don't have time. Description is the best I can do at this point, and I try to make it as unambiguous as possible to get the principle across. Maybe later, but we are in the middle of the Holiday Season Rush and our Solar System Ornament sets just went viral, so way behind the curve at this point.

jeric_synergy
12-02-2014, 11:38 PM
...... and our Solar System Ornament sets just went viral, so way behind the curve at this point.
!!! I think someone just posted that on my FB page! Good job! Make cash!

+++++++++++
EDIT: I was actually surprised the 11.6.3 Boolean Intersection did such a good job! OTOH, the flat areas have no extrusion subdivisions, so, that's not so good...

spherical
12-03-2014, 12:29 AM
!!! I think someone just posted that on my FB page! Good job! Make cash!

Thanks! Between our Planet Ornaments (http://glasssculpture.org/artglass/holiday/planet-ornaments.html) and our Police Box Refrigerator (http://glasssculpture.org/artglass/holiday/police-box.html), we're kept going for quite a while. When they go viral at times like this, it becomes a bit overwhelming but we'll definitely take it! Having these helps me to take time out later to learn more of the many 3D applications that we have in our arsenal and get to a point where we can make something half as good as Wanderers.

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 01:05 AM
Wow! All these great ideas. Joe that looks really good, and I'm sure they would accept that, but little old Tony is not quite sure how to execute this. See, I have not yet used a lot of functions in Lightwave, so I need a bit more visualization step by step kinda thingy. Sometimes I feel so inferior, and down right embarrassed to show my face here. Really! You guys are so much above my expertise it's down right scary! I'm going to need a bit more step by step to make this a reality. God I hope none of my clients see this post LOL!

djwaterman
12-03-2014, 02:57 AM
Yes Joe, you can't just flash up the goods and not outline in detail the process, you're obligated to reveal all the steps now.

jboudreau
12-03-2014, 05:50 AM
Hi Guys, Tony

I'm working on a video to show you a quick way of accomplishing this. It uses a free plugin that I will provide a link to. It's extremely powerful and I think many are unaware of the power of this very simple plugin. To answer your question Jeric_synergy there is a way to get a somewhat interactive radial array. It's interactive and you can adjust it even after the model has been created. Very Powerful. I'll be posting soon

Thanks,
Jason

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 06:01 AM
Jason. Thanks much. I am on a Mac Pro Desktop, so more thank likely the plugin may not run on a Mac unless it's an Lscript. Everything's against me with this project. LOL!

JoePoe
12-03-2014, 07:05 AM
Yes Joe, you can't just flash up the goods and not outline in detail the process, you're obligated to reveal all the steps now.

:D you know me.... I always do. Or at least try to. (sometimes I think I confuse things more than I illuminate)

That was a quick mash up of previous tries thrown together at 1:00 a.m.
Maybe it was the late hour, but I didn't really consider it worthy of breakdown..... I believe I can get much closer.
THAT I will post!

@ jboudreau: I'm interested to see the interactive array too, because YES Jeric, total pain to have to sneak up on it :compbeati.

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 07:31 AM
Jason, What plugin are you referring to?

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 08:23 AM
:D you know me.... I always do. Or at least try to. (sometimes I think I confuse things more than I illuminate)

That was a quick mash up of previous tries thrown together at 1:00 a.m.
Maybe it was the late hour, but I didn't really consider it worthy of breakdown..... I believe I can get much closer.
THAT I will post!

@ jboudreau: I'm interested to see the interactive array too, because YES Jeric, total pain to have to sneak up on it :compbeati.

Thanks Joe Looking forward to it.

JoePoe
12-03-2014, 12:45 PM
Okay, so this is my final stab at it.
First of all, looking back at the thread, the image in the original post and the last example in post #32 look like different animals to me.
C'est la vie. I went with #32.

If this is close(r) to what you want, I can break it down with images: Fair warning....It is SubD.
(but first.... I gotta eat some lunch. Starving here :eek:)

125830 125831

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 01:20 PM
Look's great! I just lost my eye glasses on the Mummy ride at Universal. Do you believe this? What else can happen. If you have time please provide some steps to help me out. Going to have to pick up some reading glasses I guess. Crap!

JoePoe
12-03-2014, 04:20 PM
Here's a slight variation. Probably a lot more real world, but also a bigger pain to make. See if you can tell the difference.

(while you're looking at these, I'll put together the walkthrough)

125833 125834 125835

JoePoe
12-03-2014, 05:16 PM
Okay. Really nothing too fancy here. Just a lot of polys and some brute force.

OPTION A:

1) I started with your layout in the background :). I just divided the ends into SubD friendly geometry. 125836

2) Radial array of the outside shape (BTW, this is where you determine how tightly everything will fit together. I think I made these elements a tiny bit too close together. At this tightness I could almost get away with just a Normal Map) and then Extruded (I think I have too many sections on the extrude.... could've saved a bunch here ;D) 125837

3) simple twist 125838

4) So we have one group of seven. I know we need twelve of these. And from the reference pic they are kinda mashed together AND there's a flat top.
So with a reference "pie" shape in the background, I used the stretch tool with limited linear falloff to distort the tube to fit the pie shape. When you do this pay particular attention to the radii on the "corners" as that is a big part of the character of the wire as a whole. 125839

At this point basically we're done.

5) Array the whole bunch to get twelve 125840

6) Twist again ("like we did last summer" :D sorry Chubby Checker possessed me for a second) 125841

Done

OPTION B:

So on option A the "flat" follows each group of seven as it twists around (Step 6 above). In the real world I think the "flat" goes straight down the length and the twists pass through them.

With that in mind, instead of adding in the flat top in step #4 Above, I only did the sides. 125842 arrayed that to twelve 125843 twisted 125844.

NOW put the flats in as the last step, kind of a pain cuz you're sorta working blind (should be right up your alley with lost glasses :D)... a lot of wires in the way... should have used hidden line.
I just trusted in the Numerics panel...did this stretch maneuver twelve times with a 30 rotation in between each stretch (360/12=30) 125845.

So in the end the flats run straight down the length regardless of twists. You can see the dodecagon (yes I had to look it up :)) more clearly in the top view here 125846

It's a subtle difference, but I think it gives it that extra edge of real worldness.

Good Luck :thumbsup:

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 05:31 PM
Hi joe, I won't be home for another few hours, but I will have a good look at this then. Thanks so much. If I have any questions I'll post here, probably not before tomorrow morning. Thanks again for all your help. This looks great. They provided a cross-section so I should have all the reference I need to make this happen.

jeric_synergy
12-03-2014, 06:31 PM
@ jboudreau: I'm interested to see the interactive array too, because YES Jeric, total pain to have to sneak up on it :compbeati.
To tell you the truth, I'm a little surprised we haven't had one for years. Forever, really. WUWT?

It's just a more elaborate MIRROR. I can see where it might bog down w/higher point counts, but decimation preview should take care of that.

("decimation preview" - copyright 2014 jeric_synergy)

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 08:05 PM
Ok, Not sure how your using the Stretch tool. Can't deform it like your example. I have it set for linear Falloff. I have one strand twisted. Whats that disc you have in the background?

JoePoe
12-03-2014, 08:34 PM
2nd question first:
Don't worry too much about that background disc. It's just there to help define the space that the geometry needs to be pushed into.
Inside the green lines here 125847. That way the arrayed sections fit nice and tight.

1st question:
So, do you know about drawing out your falloff constraints with the right mouse button? If yes, look at this image again 125848.

See how small the area is? This image specifically shows the top area being stretched flat. I did the same on the sides. You can get the same result with the same falloff using the move tool.

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 08:48 PM
I did this with the magnet tool. With a little work I can tweak it. Oh now I see how you did it.

JoePoe
12-03-2014, 08:53 PM
Good!!

Let that geometry know who's boss!!!!!! :)

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 10:15 PM
HI Joe, Thanks again for all your help! You have pulled me out of a lot of different situations, and I really appreciate it! I'll post what I feel will be accepted soon.

Tony3d
12-03-2014, 11:30 PM
Well Here's what I came up with. I think they will take this.

Surrealist.
12-03-2014, 11:59 PM
Looking awesome!

Nice to see you coming along with your modeling.

Tony3d
12-04-2014, 12:21 AM
Could never do it without all the help I get from this really great community of people! This was such an easy fix for this, I can't believe I couldn't think of it.

spherical
12-04-2014, 01:17 AM
Looks great to me.

djwaterman
12-04-2014, 01:32 AM
So after all these years of using the stretch tool, and I use it a lot, it never even occurred to me that it had numeric options and fall off control. Yippy! Always learning.

jeric_synergy
12-04-2014, 01:40 AM
....... It never even occurred to me that it had numeric options and fall off control. Yippy! Always learning.
What!? :screwy:

Maybe we should add to the noobie thread, "ALWAYS check out the Numeric Panel."

spherical
12-04-2014, 01:52 AM
So after all these years of using the stretch tool, and I use it a lot, it never even occurred to me that it had numeric options and fall off control. Yippy! Always learning.

I use its numeric panel a lot when I am matching up geometry. Sometimes set it to 1 mil or smaller and increment up to the exact position I need. Haven't used the falloff as yet.

gerry_g
12-04-2014, 04:15 AM
nudging stuff incrementally in the numerics panel with low values of say .1 or .01 os common practice and we all do it but more and more I find myself using LW Cad's Move,Rotate or Scale Snap to march things up, it's kind of why take ten minutes to be almost accurate when you be much quicker and totally accurate

Surrealist.
12-04-2014, 04:41 AM
Actually a lot of the Modify tools are the same. For example open the numeric panel. With it open click on the various tools, Rotate and Vortex, Stretch and Taper, two examples. And you'll see that they are made of the same base tool with different fall of settings. So in effect there are a lot of tools that are basically redundant in the interface. Drag tool and Dragnet I think are two others off the top of my head.

probiner
12-04-2014, 05:58 AM
nudging stuff incrementally in the numerics panel with low values of say .1 or .01 os common practice and we all do it but more and more I find myself using LW Cad's Move,Rotate or Scale Snap to march things up, it's kind of why take ten minutes to be almost accurate when you be much quicker and totally accurate

This...

Tony3d
12-04-2014, 06:25 AM
In all honesty., I actually didn't use the stretch tool to match up the geometry to the cross-section they provided. I just used the magnet tool. It was really simple practically one pull down from the top edge to perfectly match up. What I can't believe, is why after using Lightwave for many years, I didn't think of this in the first place. It could have something to do with the fact that I turned 60 four months ago! Yes, and I do play Diablo 3, and WOW! I actually have a Wizard in Diablo who is wheeling over 2 million DPS! Yes, Snots actually lives! Again, you guys have helped an old man save another job, and I thanks you.

jboudreau
12-04-2014, 08:13 AM
Hi Guys

Sorry for the late post, I got extremely busy yesterday and didn't get a chance to post the video. Great job Tony3D and the lightwave community.

I had some time today to make some videos, I'm after compressing them at the moment they should be up on my youtube channel shortly. I will post a link in here to the new open thread I will be opening up Advvanced Non Destructive Modeling Using the Power of Weight Maps.

It will cover

- Interactive Array
- Interactive Radial Array
- non destructive modeling (where you can go back to your model and make changes even after the model has been made and manipulated

I will be posting more video later using advanced weight mapping techniques.

Thanks,
Jason

probiner
12-04-2014, 08:37 AM
Hi Guys

Sorry for the late post, I got extremely busy yesterday and didn't get a chance to post the video. Great job Tony3D and the lightwave community.

I had some time today to make some videos, I'm after compressing them at the moment they should be up on my youtube channel shortly. I will post a link in here to the new open thread I will be opening up Advvanced Non Destructive Modeling Using the Power of Weight Maps.

It will cover

- Interactive Array
- Interactive Radial Array
- non destructive modeling (where you can go back to your model and make changes even after the model has been made and manipulated

I will be posting more video later using advanced weight mapping techniques.

Thanks,
Jason

There's some of that in this thread: http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?142328-Video-Tut-Quick-and-Easy-Animated-Lathe-Natively-in-LW&p=1389623&viewfull=1#post1389623

jboudreau
12-04-2014, 08:44 AM
There's some of that in this thread: http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?142328-Video-Tut-Quick-and-Easy-Animated-Lathe-Natively-in-LW&p=1389623&viewfull=1#post1389623

Hi

I don't mean layout I mean modeler. Can you send me the video you are referring too. I don't want to repost something that has already been done.

Thanks,
Jason

probiner
12-04-2014, 09:55 AM
Not been covered in a video, sorry, but there were some shares by me and slartibartfest. But no in-depth tut, no. I also think vertex maps and the node editor are a great way to get a procedural aproach to deformations that would be more trial and error in modeler. Though most times I applied them I invested quite the time in the setup, so there's pros and cons, especially given it's a work around. But certainly something that is valuable to share.

Cheers

Tony3d
12-04-2014, 10:08 AM
Hi Guys

Sorry for the late post, I got extremely busy yesterday and didn't get a chance to post the video. Great job Tony3D and the lightwave community.

I had some time today to make some videos, I'm after compressing them at the moment they should be up on my youtube channel shortly. I will post a link in here to the new open thread I will be opening up Advvanced Non Destructive Modeling Using the Power of Weight Maps.

It will cover

- Interactive Array
- Interactive Radial Array
- non destructive modeling (where you can go back to your model and make changes even after the model has been made and manipulated

I will be posting more video later using advanced weight mapping techniques.

Thanks,
Jason

Thanks Jason. I'm going to have a look tonight.

JoePoe
12-04-2014, 10:09 AM
Good job Tony!

Yeah... I think somewhere I mentioned that the same "stretching" could be done with the move tool and falloff. Magnet?... Sure! Why not?? :)

Another example is... in the tute I said "twist", but what I really did was rotate with a falloff (=twist right? ;))

Every step of the walkthrough should have this disclaimer:
*Get your geometry into "this shape" by any means or with any tools you want to use... I just happened to use X in this case.*


------

Happy Birthday :bday:

jboudreau
12-04-2014, 05:19 PM
Hi Guys

Sorry for the late post, I got extremely busy yesterday and didn't get a chance to post the video. Great job Tony3D and the lightwave community.

I had some time today to make some videos, I'm after compressing them at the moment they should be up on my youtube channel shortly. I will post a link in here to the new open thread I will be opening up Advanced Non Destructive Modeling Using the Power of Weight Maps.

It will cover

- Interactive Array
- Interactive Radial Array
- non destructive modeling (where you can go back to your model and make changes even after the model has been made and manipulated

I will be posting more video later using advanced weight mapping techniques.

Thanks,
Jason

Hi Guys

Here is the link to the thread I said I was going to open up above

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?144725-Advvanced-Non-Destructive-Modeling-Using-the-Power-of-Weight-Maps&p=1412457#post1412457

Thanks,
Jason

Surrealist.
12-04-2014, 10:51 PM
Good job Tony!

Yeah... I think somewhere I mentioned that the same "stretching" could be done with the move tool and falloff. Magnet?... Sure! Why not?? :)

Another example is... in the tute I said "twist", but what I really did was rotate with a falloff (=twist right? ;))

Every step of the walkthrough should have this disclaimer:
*Get your geometry into "this shape" by any means or with any tools you want to use... I just happened to use X in this case.*


True. The main reason I mention the way these tools work is that it was a huge eye opener to me when I figured it out. That the main difference between those tools is the fall off setting.

Using falloffs in Modeler opens up so much possibility it is worth it to fully grasp all of the options and how they work with the various tools. I think that was the path I was going down when I figured it out. It sure helped me to mentally group a large number of tools ( of all the tools there are in Modeler) into three categories: Scale Rotate and Move. And I think especially for new people or people less familiar with Modeler, it is helpful to point this out.