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sadkkf
10-07-2014, 12:48 PM
Hi--

I'm looking for a method to scatter rocks on a landscape, very similar to Vue's ecosystem. I own Vue Complete, but it doesn't allow much interaction with LW and there's no way I can afford xStream or Infinite right now.

Worst case scenario, I guess, would be to model and place a bunch of rocks by hand, but I'm hoping there's a better method because I'd like to finish this scene before I die. :)

Any ideas?

Sensei
10-07-2014, 12:52 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaGwI93Kw18

or

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6p-Cm_PFyc

Kevbarnes
10-07-2014, 12:55 PM
Soon we hope, waiting for this

http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?140702-Advanced-Placement-for-LW-11-6-2

ernpchan
10-07-2014, 12:58 PM
Make a bunch of rocks in Modeler, then do a quick Bullet sim to drop them around your environment, then do a Save Transformed?
Same idea as this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yqScLmRcXhk

bazsa73
10-07-2014, 01:08 PM
Instancing? You can do miracles with instances. A few source objects scaled and rotated will do the trick.

prometheus
10-07-2014, 01:50 PM
yeah as kevbarnes mentioned, the tools from hurley will probably rock ..but not finished yet...heres the youtube site showcasing it ...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yaBZVr-s80#t=54

his got another video somewhere else on these forum that I think should be showcased a bit more too, but I canīt find it.

otherwise...using senseis autoimage loader and painting a density image map, works too, you donīt need his tool to create it..but it will surely help out the smooth workflow.

thereīs also a weight paint tool third party free plugin for layout that might work, if you set the instance weight distribution up first with a dedicated gradient, so it should be possible to paint with that tool and the instances should update.
there are also options to use procedural textures and tweak those in the weight density, and you can also use particles, or copy points from a modeled geometry.

you can find the weight paint tool for layout here in itīs in this thread...but itīs only for 32 bit I think, which might be a downer if you need a lot of instances...
http://forums.newtek.com/showthread.php?143901-Creating-weightmaps-in-Layout!&p=1403263#post1403263

sadkkf
10-07-2014, 01:54 PM
Thanks everyone! I had no idea what great solutions were available for this. I love the idea of using physics for this so the rocks can fall into a natural resting state.

I'm still learning to use instances. Does it allow me to scale and rotate them or will I need to create different base objects rotated and scaled how I want?

prometheus
10-07-2014, 02:05 PM
Thanks everyone! I had no idea what great solutions were available for this. I love the idea of using physics for this so the rocks can fall into a natural resting state.

I'm still learning to use instances. Does it allow me to scale and rotate them or will I need to create different base objects rotated and scaled how I want?

instances can be scaled randomly and rotated, stretched or offset randomly, and you specify that by selecting random mode for scale or rotation or whatever, and set a minimum or maximum rotation angle, or use animated envelopes, or use a texture map or procedural texture to drive the rotation or scale..itīs in the instances "t" button...there are also more advanced way by using nodes too..but thatīs another story.

You can also individually go to items, clone instance...so you can manually move and rotate objects that themself just are an instance of the original object, clone that instance..and continuously clone those..preferably by using
a good shortcut key for clone instances.

The original object should by default be at origin and not moved or scaled, and I would recommend go to scene editor and make it invisible, the instances will show anyway.
if you want instances on low walley or high peaks, you set up the weight density to have a gradient based on distance to objects etc, or you can use slope gradients too..but thatīs a bit different.

sadkkf
10-07-2014, 02:13 PM
Very nice. Thanks. This will take some experimentation to get it right, but I think it'll work fine.

prometheus
10-07-2014, 02:22 PM
Thanks everyone! I had no idea what great solutions were available for this. I love the idea of using physics for this so the rocks can fall into a natural resting state.



yes..that is something that is very interesting, I really donīt think vue has that to react dynamicly and give a natural resting state...I will keep an eye on his release, but I really need lightwave itself to boost up on the outside world creation tools..and that means getting something similar to ogo taiki but improved as a volumetric environment, and I want lightwave itself to have brush sculpt tools in Layout..and also some better handling of high dense meshes and displacements, preferably some algorithm to
remesh..dynamesh or something similar to pixar open subdiv...to improve on displacements with high strength area displacements, and also micropolygon displacement, after that..it might actually be possible to completly skip looking at
vue.

sadkkf
10-07-2014, 02:32 PM
yes..that is something that is very interesting, I really donīt think vue has that to react dynamicly and give a natural resting state...I will keep an eye on his release, but I really need lightwave itself to boost up on the outside world creation tools..and that means getting something similar to ogo taiki but improved as a volumetric environment, and I want lightwave itself to have brush sculpt tools in Layout..and also some better handling of high dense meshes and displacements, preferably some algorithm to
remesh..dynamesh or something similar to pixar open subdiv...to improve on displacements with high strength area displacements, and also micropolygon displacement, after that..it might actually be possible to completly skip looking at
vue.

Vue's ecosystem is pretty advanced, but has some very visible flaws. One thing I've noticed and really hate are the rocks. It generates instances of rocks and places the lowest point of the rock on the ground. That means, the rock can be facing in an unnatural position. If some physics were applied to them they would fall to the ground and rest naturally, but that kind of thing requires many more render cows than I have.

prometheus
10-07-2014, 02:43 PM
One thing though, not sure...but I donīt think he is using instances for dynamic reaction, so that means it might be limited for large amount of objects...but I am not sure here.

Dan_Ritchie
10-07-2014, 03:03 PM
Creating instances in erodes areas. The idea is that stuff would settle down in those crevasses.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zE9ygSeN5lA


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zE9ygSeN5lA