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photoguy1278
10-05-2014, 09:52 PM
I'm having trouble achieving the effects done on the "Lightwave 3D CG Water" walkthrough on Youtube. I am going one effect at a time in the Node Image Filter and so far I'm stuck on the DOF effect. I seems to be blurring everything no matter where I put the focal distance.

124771124771

Best,

josh

photoguy1278
10-05-2014, 10:31 PM
Question, does the size/resolution of the render affect the amount of the effect? I had been rendering at 1080 but at 25% and the blur was everywhere. Now at 100% and I don't see the blur much of anywhere.

jeric_synergy
10-05-2014, 10:39 PM
If that's an issue, and render time is an issue, do a Limited Region slice to judge the effect.

dpont
10-06-2014, 12:30 AM
Can't find the lwo object with your scene,
I can just see that Depth Buffer isn't enabled in the Image Filter node editor panel.

Amount of DOF effect is proportionaly identical,
whatever the image resolution including Limited Region.

Denis.

photoguy1278
10-06-2014, 08:22 PM
okay, I found the depth buffer. Two questions.
1. How do I make sure the LWO is in the scene file i attach in the future.
2. Is there a way to see my updated Node changes with out having to re render the same frame?

Sorry about the uber-noobery.

dpont
10-06-2014, 11:44 PM
1. How do I make sure the LWO is in the scene file i attach in the future.

You need to post both files or package them.



2. Is there a way to see my updated Node changes with out having to re render the same frame?

In DP Filter the node editors have a Viper preview, just re-rendering the post-processing effect.


Denis.

photoguy1278
10-07-2014, 07:47 AM
I seem to be making some sort of progress in the DOF but its still all blurred. I'm following the settings I see in the CG Water walkthrough on YouTube. Ive tried different focal lengths on the DOF and different blur amounts but it doesn't get much better. 124818124819

dpont
10-07-2014, 08:02 AM
I seem to be making some sort of progress in the DOF but its still all blurred. I'm following the settings I see in the CG Water walkthrough on YouTube. Ive tried different focal lengths on the DOF and different blur amounts but it doesn't get much better. 124818124819

Do you know what is a 'Norm. Depth Buffer'?..
This is a normalized depth buffer with distance exclusively going from zero to one meter,
of course you need the pure Depth Buffer for DOF,
I can't comment all this node setup,
but if I just add a DOF node in your scene with you Focus Null as target,
I get your Logo in focus and blurred ocean.

Denis.

photoguy1278
10-07-2014, 08:36 PM
Will you send me the scene or a screenshot of your settings please? I deleted everything but the Buffer with Pure Depth, DOF, and the Image filter with Depth checked. This is what i got. Blackness on either end of the text. Is there anything else i need checked on the image filte other than depth maybe? Also I'm not sure I see much blur so what setting would increase that? 124825

dpont
10-07-2014, 11:49 PM
Will you send me the scene or a screenshot of your settings please? I deleted everything but the Buffer with Pure Depth, DOF, and the Image filter with Depth checked. This is what i got. Blackness on either end of the text. Is there anything else i need checked on the image filte other than depth maybe? Also I'm not sure I see much blur so what setting would increase that? 124825

I did'nt change anything in the node editor settings,
except the Depth input,
DOF settings are common to this kind of effect,
FStop is the main setting for changing depth of field
or amount of blur for unfocused surfaces.

Denis.

photoguy1278
10-10-2014, 03:47 PM
I've tried changing the f stop and i still get varying degree of blackness. The blackness is in two bands, one in front of and one behind the focal point. The larger the f-stop value, the more area of blackness bands in the water. If I set the f-stop to 4 or below it begins to warp the edges of the frame and blackens the edges of objects. Any way to get rid of the blackness?

spherical
10-10-2014, 06:49 PM
Hmm. This intrigued me, so I gt the scene/object and worked with it for a while. Turning off all but Bloom and swapping out Norm. Depth for Depth, setting f-stop up and down from 8 to 64, I get no black.

dpont
10-11-2014, 12:02 AM
I've tried changing the f stop and i still get varying degree of blackness. The blackness is in two bands, one in front of and one behind the focal point. The larger the f-stop value, the more area of blackness bands in the water. If I set the f-stop to 4 or below it begins to warp the edges of the frame and blackens the edges of objects. Any way to get rid of the blackness?

Can't reproduce, may be something corrupted or your config.
Don't waste your time,
beginning with advanced setup may be confusing
remove the IFNE,
restart from scratch,
try basics, DOF node only.

Denis.

photoguy1278
10-11-2014, 10:32 AM
What settings are y'all using? Use camera lens or not? Diaphragm sides and aspect, focal distance, and f stop? Enable Nodal Preview?

I deleted the Image Filter node Editor and started over with just a buffer, DOF and image filter. I used pure depth, checked depth in the image filter node, but i'm still seeing the bands of blackness in varying degrees. Can anyone send me an image of it working for you? tell me your settings.

photoguy1278
10-11-2014, 11:13 AM
I changed the aspect ratio and it has an effect on reducing the blackness. 4 and above I don't see the blackness but i think it may be affecting the edges of my object. theres a black edge around the objects, the higher the aspect ratio is set. I am finally seeing the blur in foreground and background. Downside is that the object is getting black edges.

Also note that back leaking filter has to be on or else another black band shows up in the water.

Heres what i have so far. notice the edges of the Z.

124933

Heres with aspect of 1.0
124934

photoguy1278
10-11-2014, 11:48 AM
Back leaking filter must be on or a band of black will appear.

spherical
10-11-2014, 05:48 PM
What settings are y'all using? Use camera lens or not? Diaphragm sides and aspect, focal distance, and f stop? Enable Nodal Preview?

I deleted the Image Filter node Editor and started over with just a buffer, DOF and image filter. I used pure depth, checked depth in the image filter node, but i'm still seeing the bands of blackness in varying degrees. Can anyone send me an image of it working for you? tell me your settings.

124941 124942

photoguy1278
10-11-2014, 06:20 PM
I wonder if it has something to do with the glass surface i have on the text

spherical
10-11-2014, 08:24 PM
I didn't change anything there. Just reconnected Depth, where Norm. Depth was, turned off Use Camera Lens, selected FOCUS NULL and adjusted f-stop.

photoguy1278
10-11-2014, 08:50 PM
124943

Maybe its the glass surface. See if its in this file?

photoguy1278
10-11-2014, 08:53 PM
Is it because I have a glass surface on my text and you all don't?

If this file doesn't have the glass surface on the text, then something is wrong. I just had glass with high amounts of luminosity. Maybe thats throwing off the DOF?

124944

spherical
10-12-2014, 02:29 AM
I used your original files attached to post #7.

Glass surface on the text? You posted a new scene file. Surfaces are stored in the objects. The "TEXT Apple Li Gothic" surface, in the only object I have, has zero luminosity.

I don't see how any material luminosity would "throw off" DOF. Two completely different concepts.

photoguy1278
10-12-2014, 09:02 AM
LOL, i'm such a noob, I'm sorry. So as I see it, your DOF is working fine and mine isn't. The only difference I see, other than our machines, are the text surfaces.

1) I don't know why yours isn't glass and I don't know how to send it to you properly. I didn't make the glass in modeler, I made it as you see it in modeler and then changed it to glass and saved it in layout scene. Maybe you could enlighten me on how I could save and share it properly.
2) ok, maybe its not luminosity, maybe its the transparency or something else in my texture causing a glitch. If you wouldn't mind helping me, I'd like to rule out the surface, just for my own noob peace of mind.
3) Unless you can think of something else because i've tried your settings and get a ton of blackness issues in the water using DOF.

photoguy1278
10-12-2014, 06:56 PM
I guess I have a corruption that only my computer can't handle. Maybe i have to start all over from scratch. but I have tried these DOF settings on every incremental save I made going back weeks before my water was even finished and no text existed. Still has dark banding. I'm not sure why.

spherical
10-12-2014, 08:55 PM
1) I don't know why yours isn't glass and I don't know how to send it to you properly.

When in Surface Editor, hit "s" key. That will store a preset, usually in your user Workspace.


I didn't make the glass in modeler, I made it as you see it in modeler and then changed it to glass and saved it in layout scene. Maybe you could enlighten me on how I could save and share it properly.

Unless you are using TrueArt Global Materials or DB&W Shadermeister, it doesn't work that way. All surface attributes are stored/saved in the object. A scene just loads objects. So, if you created the text in modeler with the yellow surface that I see. That is what you get in the render. If you change the surface to glass in Layout, it will be glass for that session, but if you don't also have Modeler open and save the model with those changes, the change won't stick after you close Layout.


2) ok, maybe its not luminosity, maybe its the transparency or something else in my texture causing a glitch. If you wouldn't mind helping me, I'd like to rule out the surface, just for my own noob peace of mind.

Taking your cue that the logo is semitransparent glass (missed that in the images you posted earlier), I changed my model and replicated your look as best I could:

124958

jeric_synergy
10-12-2014, 09:14 PM
To clarify, you CAN also save OBJECTS from Layout, and they will get the current surface. Anytime you save in either app, the other one is supposed to pick up on that fact and update itself.

When Layout asks you if you want to SAVE ALL when it quits, it's asking "Do you want to save the Scene AND the Objects?"

Anyway, if you EXPORT/PACKAGE, your Objects will be saved as current, to a new Directory. This is how you get stuff to us on the forum, since a package has ONLY the elements used in that scene, ie it's small as possible. I usually then ZIP the entire folder before attaching it. Easy-peasy.

spherical
10-12-2014, 11:00 PM
Yes, you CAN, but I've found it problematical frequently enough that I just plain don't go there anymore, period... ever. Go to Modeler, know what you are saving and why. Heck, there are enough times that Layout THINKS that some object needs to be saved. Ummmm.... no. Didn't change anything. Not going to step on that land mine, thankyouverymuch.

However, this is not the case with the situation at hand. The user thought that changes made in Layout would automatically stick. When we got the scene and model, those changes were not in there. Bit of a difference.

jeric_synergy
10-13-2014, 01:47 PM
Just adding clarity to the SAVE ALL? auto-question.

I'm pretty sure that was added because of the continuing confusion among new users about Surfaces. And well it should: how many people have to screw themselves over before a problem is addressed? Apparently, "lots" is the answer for some people.

spherical
10-13-2014, 06:40 PM
True but, then it should be a bit more bulletproof, yes? I was working with OnlineRender's Presets project just yesterday and never touched the Surfaces or anything that would trigger Layout to think that the model had changed. When I hit s to save the scene, the stupid thing said: "Some models are out of date, Save?" (or whatever the darn dialogue string is). Going to check on that just now, I made a PURPOSEFUL change to a surface, closed Layout and it blithely DIDN'T ASK. Modeler, however DID know and put up an * to let me know that I have the option to save the change. No thanks, I'll stick with that which is far more certain. My work time is too valuable to risk it all on what some coder thinks works most of the time.