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View Full Version : Can a tablet and stylus be used like a WACOM setup?



shrox
09-05-2014, 07:02 PM
I've had a few WACOMs, and the action of drawing one place and looking some place else is difficult for me. I know WACOM has an art tablet with a video screen, I am wondering if a Kindle or Ipad has a was of being used in like manner?

BigHache
09-05-2014, 09:59 PM
Even if there was a way to software link say an iPad to Photoshop (which I don't think there is), you still have the issue of pressure sensitivity. There's nothing on tablets that I'm aware of that reads pressure, it's just either on or off.

Andy Webb
09-06-2014, 04:36 AM
There was someone on here who got it to work.

Basically the iPad displayed the computer screen, so you are using your pad to move the mouse pointer on your desktop.

There is an App that you can use for this, I think it's called Splashtop Streamer, I think you will need to setup an ad-hock network on your PC.

I did try getting it to work but I didn't want to mess with my network setup so I never got to try it.

I suspect it would show some lag between pad and computer, so might not work to well with graphic applications.

KurtF
09-06-2014, 10:52 AM
Monoprice has some products that compete directly with Wacom:

http://www.monoprice.com/Product?c_id=113&cp_id=11314&cs_id=1131401&p_id=10707&seq=1&format=2

Don't know about the build quality or the responsiveness, but they have been out for a few years now. For the price, worth a look.

Greenlaw
09-06-2014, 03:03 PM
This info probably won't help but here's what I know:

You can have pressure sensitivity with an Android or iPad tablet, but this pressure functionality comes from the pen, not the tablet. Currently, my favorite device is the Wacom Intuos Creative Stylus (http://www.wacom.com/en/us/creative/intuos-creative-stylus), which has 2048 levels of pressure. This bluetooth pen is fantastic on iPad with Procreate (http://procreate.si/), which has become my preferred way to draw concept art for work.

In the past I've used the Ja Ja and Pogo pressure sensitive styli. The Ja Ja uses high frequency sound (which my daughter can hear and finds annoying, btw,) which is a novel idea but doesn't work so well in a noisy room. The Pogo uses bluetooth and is much more reliable, but I don't find is nearly as dependable or accurate as the Wacom Intuos Creative Stylus.

A while back I used a Nexus 7 Android tablet for about a year. It's a good media player but I didn't really like it much as a drawing device. There are some really good software on Android but there was a bad latency issue with the Nexus 7, which doesn't exist for iPad. To be fair, I'm referring to the older Nexus 7--the newer models are supposed to be better.

I just placed a pre-order with Wacom for the new Intuos Creative Stylus 2 (http://www.wacom.com/en/us/creative/intuos-creative-stylus-2)coming out later next month which features a significantly smaller, firmer tip that improves drawing visibility and accuracy.

I also helped fund a Kickstarter campaign for new stylus coming soon from the developer of the Ja Ja. This one uses bluetooth like the Wacom and Pogo, but it features 4096 levels of pressure sensitivity!

(Yes, I'm a stylus junkie. I have many other tablet styli I could talk about but I'll try to restrain myself.)

As for compatibility with a desktop, there is one option I'm aware of but it's pricey: The Wacom Companion Hybrid. This is basically an Android tablet with genuine Wacom technology, but it can also be plugged into a Windows or Mac desktop and used like a Cintiq. It's a pretty cool idea, especially if you like working with Android based software when away from your desktop. Naturally, since it's a Wacom device, you have full pressure sensitivity available.i

For me personally, I'm saving up for the Cintiq Companion, which is a cross between a Cintiq and a Windows tablet. It's pretty expensive but I'm hoping it will be a good replacement for my aging HP tm2 tablet PC, which is what I still do most of my work on. (The tm2 uses both Wacom touch and penabled tech--it's dated but it still works well for me.)

For a while, I was interested in the Surface Pro 3 but not so much anymore, mainly because of the lack of 'express keys' and Microsoft's decision to switch to nTrig for tablet support. Also, the glossy screen makes it less desirable when drawing outdoors. (Both models of the Wacom Cintiq Companion have a glare resistant matte finish screen.)

I'm not sure you can use the SP3 as a tablet for another computer like the Companion Hybrid, but I'm not sure the Win 8 Companion can be used this way either.

Hope this info is somewhat helpful.

G.

Greenlaw
09-06-2014, 03:14 PM
You can also use a tablet computer as an alternative input device for desktop computers. Some people run apps that allow them to use the tablet to simulate existing game controllers or for completely customized button layouts and controls.

One of the more interesting uses I've seen is Cinco (http://www.painterartist.com/us/product/companion-app/?pid=prod4950071), a controller app for Corel Painter, which maps out your hand on an iPad screen to control certain features in Painter on a desktop computer. You still need a regular digital tablet or Cintiq for drawing with though--the tool described here is meant to be used as an additional controller device.

G.

shrox
09-06-2014, 03:36 PM
Monoprice has some products that compete directly with Wacom:

http://www.monoprice.com/Product?c_id=113&cp_id=11314&cs_id=1131401&p_id=10707&seq=1&format=2

Don't know about the build quality or the responsiveness, but they have been out for a few years now. For the price, worth a look.

That one does look pretty nice, I like the larger size. I wonder how it would do if one tried to hold it like a sketch pad.

Greenlaw
09-06-2014, 03:54 PM
Wow, the Monoprice display tablet looks pretty cool and the price seems really cheap compared to a Cintiq. I noticed the resolution isn't very high but it's higher than what I have with my 'smallish' Cintiq 12WX. I still like my old Cintiq but I really wish I had gotten the bigger version. The one advantage with the 12WX is that I can pick it up and draw on my lap--but it's still tethered to the desktop so I can't go in the living room and draw on the sofa with it. (That's where the tm2 and iPad come in.)

G.

shrox
09-06-2014, 04:16 PM
Has anyone any experience with the Microsoft Surface?

Greenlaw
09-06-2014, 04:44 PM
I was really interested in the Microsoft SP3 for a while and I won't say I won't reconsider it after more comparative reviews come out. Since I haven't actually used one I'm not fully qualified to answer, but I have talked to a few users who have one and there are few comparative reviews online by professional artists. Anyway, here's what I've been told or read elsewhere:

It sounds like, despite having only 256 levels of pressure, some artists are finding the nTrig stylus input works quite well for them. Some early testers complained about latency issues with Photoshop but MS was supposed to fix that before they went into full production.

One thing that bothers me about the SP3 is the lack of external buttons and sliders like on an Intuos, Cintiq or the Companions. The lack of buttons is the one thing I dislike about my tm2, and to work around this issue I had to add onscreen 'soft buttons' and gesture based commands, but this is not as convenient or as effective as the physical Express Keys on a professional Wacom device. The SP3 also gets around the lack of buttons the same way, and based on reviews I've read, other artists who had previously used Wacom professional devices don't care for the 'soft buttons' much either.

Nowadays I use a bluetooth mini-keyboard with my tm2 for my modifier and function keys. This works okay but having all these extra devices sort of defeats having a mobile computer. (Imagine balancing a tablet, mouse and keyboard on your lap.) :)

Of course as more developers adapt their software so that it didn't have to rely on a physical keypad/board and mouse for input, these complaints might go away.

(This is one of the reasons I really like Procreate on the iPad--the interface is heavily gesture based and that makes it powerful and very efficient with minimal on-screen buttons.)

G.

Greenlaw
09-06-2014, 04:57 PM
In the end, I think it depends on what you want to do with the device and how much you want to spend.

There's a similar discussion going on now at the Anime Studio forums, and some users there sound very satisfied with running ASP on their SP3 tablets. I'm not sure they'd say the same if they tried to run Lightwave on it.

IMO, neither device will probably be ideal for heavy duty 3D work. While I do a lot of 3D work on my tm2 tablet PC, that's mainly general modeling and animation, and some sculpting and texturing. I prefer to leave complex lighting, final rendering, and very heavy modeling and animation for a real desktop to handle. I suspect when I trade up to either the SP3 or Wacom Cintiq Companion, what I can do with it will be more or less the same.

As for cost, the SP3 can be bought a lot cheaper than the Wacom Cintiq Companion (Win 8 version.) But a fully loaded SP3 does begin to approach the cost of the Wacom Cintiq Companion device, and at some point you may wonder why you shouldn't just get the Wacom instead. But if you don't want to spend nearly that much, there are more lower cost choices for SP3.

Well, that's about all I know. Hopefully, somebody with actual experience with the SP3 and Wacom Win 8 tablets will post some real and useful information. :p

G.

shrox
09-06-2014, 06:09 PM
I am just exploring options, I can only use my hands for about 10 minutes before they start sparking, smoking and making gear noises...well, muscle spasms actually from that neuro thing, but sparking sounds better.

jwiede
09-06-2014, 06:17 PM
Has anyone any experience with the Microsoft Surface?

Just to be perfectly clear about this, I am a Microsoft employee, and while I have not worked directly on any Surface product, after the last re-org my group is now in the same division where Surfaces are produced. Unless explicitly stated otherwise, I do not ever speak on Microsoft's behalf, nor do they speak for me, yadda yadda yadda.

I had a Surface Pro (1) and now have a Surface Pro 3*. If you have specific questions, shoot. Overall, I was very happy with my S Pro (1), and am very happy with my S Pro 3, for drawing and graphics uses. I'm not really comfortable getting into discussions of comparisons with other products. I also suspect Greenlaw's (for example) usage pattern is much "heavier" than my own, so my view isn't likely relevant for a heavier / pro-type art-focused user.

All that said, as for S Pro (1) vs S Pro 3, although the lesser configurability of the Ntrig hw is a minor annoyance (hopefully fixed shortly, as they announced they are releasing a pressure curve editor "soon"), I honestly don't notice much difference in the day-to-day drawing experience between the two, _on average_. What I mean by that is that both have what I consider minor pros and cons in use, and the lists differ between the two, but the two lists basically average out to the same (quite good) level for each. OTOH, I've only had the S Pro 3 for a few weeks so far, which isn't really long enough for minor irritations to become bedsores,as it were, so I might feel differently in a few months.

Again, ask for any specifics?

*: i5 build, 8GB RAM, 256GB SSD. Looked at the i7 build, but the added CPU power wasn't worth the reduced battery life, for my needs.

(edit) OOH, one thing I forgot to mention that I _love_ about the S Pro 3 is the new kickstand: It lets you put the device at a ~20deg-off-flat angle while sitting on a flat surface that I find works much better for drawing. I always had to find something to awkwardly "prop up" the S Pro (1), the new kickstand is much better for that.

shrox
09-06-2014, 06:58 PM
I would say I am looking for something to draw texture maps with. I tend to cut and paste existing maps I already have made or got somewhere, but it's always been kind of difficult to draw with a mouse anyway, regards of physical problems. The Wacoms I had didn't have the display, and drawing other than where I am looking is just weird for me.

BokadCastle
09-06-2014, 07:44 PM
Has anyone any experience with the Microsoft Surface?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3gG8TlUVyU


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgfzm1g3lv4

jwiede
09-06-2014, 09:38 PM
About the "custom buttons" issue, one solution repeatedly suggested at r/Surface (Reddit Surface area) is: http://forum.tabletpcreview.com/software/63014-toolbar-creator.html

I haven't had much of a chance to play with it yet, but so far it does look quite flexible and customizable. Having the src provided is a nice plus, as well.

akademus
09-06-2014, 11:45 PM
http://www.wacom.com/en/de/creative/intuos-creative-stylus-2

For some hundred bucks you get the pen, two buttons, and pressure sensitivity and use it on your ipad.

shrox
09-06-2014, 11:57 PM
http://www.wacom.com/en/de/creative/intuos-creative-stylus-2

For some hundred bucks you get the pen, two buttons, and pressure sensitivity and use it on your ipad.

I find the Ipad a bit too small for my tastes, yet I have a Kindle I like to show stuff on that's smaller than the Ipad. The Surface might be something, I guess I'll be googling it.

akademus
09-07-2014, 12:30 AM
Shame this things doesn't work on surface. I guess they'll have it at some point in future.

Greenlaw
09-07-2014, 01:07 AM
About the "custom buttons" issue, one solution repeatedly suggested at r/Surface (Reddit Surface area) is: http://forum.tabletpcreview.com/software/63014-toolbar-creator.html

I haven't had much of a chance to play with it yet, but so far it does look quite flexible and customizable. Having the src provided is a nice plus, as well.

Thanks for the tip! I'll have to try that with my tm2. What I had been using for years is Modlock for my modifier keys and gMote for pen gestures. This combo still works well for many programs but I'm finding some newer x64 programs (Toon Boom Storyboard Pro 4.1, for example,) are not recognizing my pen gesture. I'm currently trying out two other pen gesture programs but my guess is that the newer graphics programs are optimized for Win 8's tablet input, and that's overriding some of the older gesture based tech for Win 7. Having the bluetooth mini-keyboard solves many of the problems I was running into but I'd prefer not to have the extra hardware device if I can help it.

G

jwiede
09-07-2014, 01:57 AM
Thanks for the tip! I'll have to try that with my tm2. What I had been using for years is Modlock for my modifier keys and gMote for pen gestures. This combo still works well for many programs but I'm finding some newer x64 programs (Toon Boom Storyboard Pro 4.1, for example,) are not recognizing my pen gesture. I'm currently trying out two other pen gesture programs but my guess is that the newer graphics programs are optimized for Win 8's tablet input, and that's overriding some of the older gesture based tech for Win 7.

If you find any Win8.x-compatible pen gesture utilities akin to gMote, please let me know. I haven't had much luck finding any, either.

ianr
09-08-2014, 11:28 AM
Slightly OffTop,But here Lightwave11.6 on The Surface enjoying Lattice Deforms


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_sU7HrtuMY

Spool to 1.48 min