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View Full Version : Simple Rig question on gimbal lock



Chernoby
07-25-2014, 11:39 AM
Genoma is great but really complex (there's like 300 control points in the objects list after converting a rig which makes selecting something to move difficult). It takes me more time to get things set up with it than to build rigs the old way. I read it makes its own weight maps too and I don't know if it is true but the deformations are not quite right initially. I have no idea how to fix that. Even when I apply my own weight maps to the bones. And the rigs seem to slow down my gui and lag a lot and I even put in a new graphics card. Setting sub d to zero and putting on bounding box mode and tinkering with the display settings helps but I like things to feel way more in-real-time when I animate.

Rhiggit looks completely awesome but I'm wary to buy anymore rigging solutions when older rigging methods seem to get the job done.

Can anyone tell me how to get just the shoulder "bones within a bone" (or thigh bones) setup that prevents gimbal lock? Parenting doesn't work. I can't find any tuts on this one specific thing.

RebelHill
07-25-2014, 12:20 PM
There's no auto weightmap generation... but LW doesnt (strictly) require weights to deform a mesh... however, you pretty much always need to create maps to weed out por areas of deformation, or do extra work to get added control over them. Ive no idea what the "bone within a bone" you're talking about is... but there's no way to prevent gimbal lock, only different modifications you can "build in" to circumnavigate it. You can either add an offset item at the specific joint, which gives you another controller to operate, when the axis on the main item is gimbal locked... you can apply quaternion booster to an item, which'll let you rotate it on local axis, and resolve to "flipped" channels that don't slide during interpolation (an effect that needs to be baked and filtered out if the jumping axis cant be used further down the line).

Otherwise, there's plenty info on a lot of topics here... https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTds3QePYrWEWipwKkLmyNT4Tf_JTigM2

Chernoby
07-25-2014, 03:28 PM
Dang. Thought it might have been an easy answer I was just missing. "Bone within a bone" might not be correct term. I just saw a small bone in a longer bone of the biceps on the bi-ped preset of Genoma and thought somehow one bone was controlling an original axis and when gimbal lock occurred it was the second bone's axis coordinates "taking over" preventing gimbal lock.

Holy Lord. You have created the rigging Bible in video form on youtube. Don't know how I missed that considering I've seen some of your videos... didn't even know about all these.

Thanks RebelHill

RebelHill
07-25-2014, 04:37 PM
I just saw a small bone in a longer bone of the biceps on the bi-ped preset of Genoma and thought somehow one bone was controlling an original axis and when gimbal lock occurred it was the second bone's axis coordinates "taking over" preventing gimbal lock.

Nope... that bone is there because when an organic character (such as a human) twists their upper arm, the twist doesnt occur "on point". Since there's no modifier to distribute a twist deformation "down" the length of a bone, this second shorter bone can be used to "back twist" the upper portion of the upper arm. That's the idea at least, in practice its a horrid method that only candy wraps your geometry making your deformations look even worse.